flyingjohn
Arcane
- Joined
- May 14, 2012
- Messages
- 2,961
If you don't know the language you want to translate it into,don't bother.
Machine translation is horrible and Asian languages are not possible o directly translate except some menus.
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Want to translate a PSP or a PC game? Here's how you begin (with links to all of relevant utilities)
- Thread starter aweigh
- Start date
Machine translation is horrible and Asian languages are not possible o directly translate except some menus.
newtmonkey
Arcane
I have worked as a professional JPN-ENG translator for the past 5-6 years. I have had many requests from clients to do games, anime, manga, and I always refuse because it is simply not worth it. Anyone who is translating that stuff (either amateur or professional) is doing it because they love it.
A project is not typically billed by sentence, but by source characters. The average rate for J-E translation outside certain specialized fields (basically patents and legal work) is 7-10 yen per character.
I can tell you that, other than EXTREME cases like the Legend of Heroes games on PSP, these games are all translated by humans. You will get the same results via machine translation for menus and item names, cuz they are single (or at most two or three) words. Once you get grammar involved, machine translations between JPN and ENG become garbage.
The reason why translations of JPN games into ENG are often awful is likely for one of several reasons
1) They are translated into ENG by Japanese people.
2) They are outsourced to talented amateurs. That is why you get tons of errors, inconsistencies, etc.
3) The translators are weebs who are obsessed with Japanese culture, and are so used to how Japanese people speak, that they will translate into English that just sounds like Japanese.
4) The project manager/client is Japanese, and they have already decided on a bunch of rules/terms that the translator absolutely has to follow, and have final say on edits, etc.
5) Game scripts are often sent to translators with zero context. They are basically a bunch of text snippets extracted from the game, with some codes attached to indicate (to the client) where the text goes.
All of these things can come together to create an awful translation that, probably to most people, sounds like Google Translate, but trust me, the difference between Google translate and even a shitty translator, is night and day.
[EDIT]
I am not trying to sound down on efforts by aweigh to translate these games using a mixture of machine translation plus what you have learned about Japanese. First, the games will not get translated any other way. Second, machine translation is acceptable for some applications, and I would argue that the majority of text in a Wiz game fits that bill. If a machine translation of a Wiz game gets more people playing it, that's awesome.
A project is not typically billed by sentence, but by source characters. The average rate for J-E translation outside certain specialized fields (basically patents and legal work) is 7-10 yen per character.
I can tell you that, other than EXTREME cases like the Legend of Heroes games on PSP, these games are all translated by humans. You will get the same results via machine translation for menus and item names, cuz they are single (or at most two or three) words. Once you get grammar involved, machine translations between JPN and ENG become garbage.
The reason why translations of JPN games into ENG are often awful is likely for one of several reasons
1) They are translated into ENG by Japanese people.
2) They are outsourced to talented amateurs. That is why you get tons of errors, inconsistencies, etc.
3) The translators are weebs who are obsessed with Japanese culture, and are so used to how Japanese people speak, that they will translate into English that just sounds like Japanese.
4) The project manager/client is Japanese, and they have already decided on a bunch of rules/terms that the translator absolutely has to follow, and have final say on edits, etc.
5) Game scripts are often sent to translators with zero context. They are basically a bunch of text snippets extracted from the game, with some codes attached to indicate (to the client) where the text goes.
All of these things can come together to create an awful translation that, probably to most people, sounds like Google Translate, but trust me, the difference between Google translate and even a shitty translator, is night and day.
[EDIT]
I am not trying to sound down on efforts by aweigh to translate these games using a mixture of machine translation plus what you have learned about Japanese. First, the games will not get translated any other way. Second, machine translation is acceptable for some applications, and I would argue that the majority of text in a Wiz game fits that bill. If a machine translation of a Wiz game gets more people playing it, that's awesome.
Last edited:
newtmonkey
Oh, this thread is very old. LOL.
Yeah man, as you can imagine I quickly realized that machine-translation of NPC dialog, even if it is something as simple as:
"Hello! Welcome to this dangerous underground society."
will get spit out as:
"Greetings! Carefully navigate my maze."
........................yeah, as you say in your post, I realized machine-translation is only good for anything that's not actual dialog. Thankfully Wiz/Elminage games feature much, much, much less dialog in comparison to other types of RPGs, which means it is feasable.
Also they're types of games/RPGs that do not require (nor are designed around) conversing with NPCs for the player to get enjoyment from the game, quite the opposite instead, which means translating "everything BUT the dialog" can result in a 100% playable/enjoyable translation of a jap-dungeon crawler.
I know I already PM'd you this but you should check out MrRichard999 and Helly 's translated games:
- Wiz Empire 2: Legacy of the Princess
- Wiz Gaiden 4: Throb of the Demon's Heart
- Wiz Empire 1 & 2 (Game Boy versions, unrelated to PS1/PC series of Empire games)
- Wiz Chronicle: Recapture the Holy Land
- Wiz Gaiden 1-3 (Game Boy games, the 4th one was the first Wiz Gaiden to come out on something else i.e. SNES in that game's case)
Plus other games they've done that I haven't personally played so can/t comment on.
CUE OBLIGATORY ASK:
Mind translating a bit of Wiz Empire 1 NPC dialog? Helly already did the NPC dialog for the ones inside dungeons, i.e. the only ones that are important, but the "Town NPCs" have some dialog too, and a few even have expository dialog related to game events/story.
C'mon, you knew someone would ask you this the second you typed your post, lol.
EDIT: btw, what you say about the translators not having context, and/or knowledge of the subject matter is I dare say equally as important as their actual fluency.
Due to my Wizardry knowledge I know that if Google translates an Elminage enemy's name as "AUGER", I can immediately know that it's an "OGRE", and it is translating using i guess phonetics?? It's actually funny to me now when I notice translations that I know were made either by a machine or by translators with zero knowledge of what they were working on, like:
- in the game Stranger of Sword City the main dungeons are called "Mausoleums" when they are in actuality NOT, and it's obvious as they all have 'themes'. I have no idea WHY they went with that word but I am 100% certain the reason is because whoever translated SoSC's text dump has no idea wtf the game was, looked like, etc.
The jap. text probably referred to them as forgotten areas or areas previously full of spirit life, who the fuck knows.
Oh, this thread is very old. LOL.
Yeah man, as you can imagine I quickly realized that machine-translation of NPC dialog, even if it is something as simple as:
"Hello! Welcome to this dangerous underground society."
will get spit out as:
"Greetings! Carefully navigate my maze."
........................yeah, as you say in your post, I realized machine-translation is only good for anything that's not actual dialog. Thankfully Wiz/Elminage games feature much, much, much less dialog in comparison to other types of RPGs, which means it is feasable.
Also they're types of games/RPGs that do not require (nor are designed around) conversing with NPCs for the player to get enjoyment from the game, quite the opposite instead, which means translating "everything BUT the dialog" can result in a 100% playable/enjoyable translation of a jap-dungeon crawler.
I know I already PM'd you this but you should check out MrRichard999 and Helly 's translated games:
- Wiz Empire 2: Legacy of the Princess
- Wiz Gaiden 4: Throb of the Demon's Heart
- Wiz Empire 1 & 2 (Game Boy versions, unrelated to PS1/PC series of Empire games)
- Wiz Chronicle: Recapture the Holy Land
- Wiz Gaiden 1-3 (Game Boy games, the 4th one was the first Wiz Gaiden to come out on something else i.e. SNES in that game's case)
Plus other games they've done that I haven't personally played so can/t comment on.
CUE OBLIGATORY ASK:
Mind translating a bit of Wiz Empire 1 NPC dialog? Helly already did the NPC dialog for the ones inside dungeons, i.e. the only ones that are important, but the "Town NPCs" have some dialog too, and a few even have expository dialog related to game events/story.
C'mon, you knew someone would ask you this the second you typed your post, lol.
EDIT: btw, what you say about the translators not having context, and/or knowledge of the subject matter is I dare say equally as important as their actual fluency.
Due to my Wizardry knowledge I know that if Google translates an Elminage enemy's name as "AUGER", I can immediately know that it's an "OGRE", and it is translating using i guess phonetics?? It's actually funny to me now when I notice translations that I know were made either by a machine or by translators with zero knowledge of what they were working on, like:
- in the game Stranger of Sword City the main dungeons are called "Mausoleums" when they are in actuality NOT, and it's obvious as they all have 'themes'. I have no idea WHY they went with that word but I am 100% certain the reason is because whoever translated SoSC's text dump has no idea wtf the game was, looked like, etc.
The jap. text probably referred to them as forgotten areas or areas previously full of spirit life, who the fuck knows.
Last edited:
newtmonkey
Also on this topic, the other main reason you see "bad translations", especially of SNES-era games and PS1 too:
- Font width.
Any time you see an abbreviation in the english translation for something like menu commands, say "CMMD" instead of command in that battle menu or whatever, it is because the translators didn't have access to the game code.
They were unable (for various reasons, but not having game code and/or being ONLY translation team with NO coders) they can only fit the English letters that will fit into the pre-programmed "space" that the japanese characters occupy.
i.e. They were unable to do the following (from above example):
- Be able to EXPAND THAT MENU BOX so that the ENGLISH LETTERS all fit and don't run off and outside of the menu box.
- And way more importantly, they were not able to modifiy the game's font drawing procedures, as all japanese games are programmed using FIXED WIDTH whereas English uses VARIABLE WIDTH.
This is why I am way forgiving of simple abbreviations than anything else. It doesn't mean they did a bad translations, it simply means they had to make the best use of the limited amount of characters the game would accept in English letters.
Sometimes limitations like this actually help cultivate a more ideal translation of the symbolical japanese characters as the limited space forces, let's say... extremely creative and thought out translation of every piece of text that results in a much better translation.
Also on this topic, the other main reason you see "bad translations", especially of SNES-era games and PS1 too:
- Font width.
Any time you see an abbreviation in the english translation for something like menu commands, say "CMMD" instead of command in that battle menu or whatever, it is because the translators didn't have access to the game code.
They were unable (for various reasons, but not having game code and/or being ONLY translation team with NO coders) they can only fit the English letters that will fit into the pre-programmed "space" that the japanese characters occupy.
i.e. They were unable to do the following (from above example):
- Be able to EXPAND THAT MENU BOX so that the ENGLISH LETTERS all fit and don't run off and outside of the menu box.
- And way more importantly, they were not able to modifiy the game's font drawing procedures, as all japanese games are programmed using FIXED WIDTH whereas English uses VARIABLE WIDTH.
This is why I am way forgiving of simple abbreviations than anything else. It doesn't mean they did a bad translations, it simply means they had to make the best use of the limited amount of characters the game would accept in English letters.
Sometimes limitations like this actually help cultivate a more ideal translation of the symbolical japanese characters as the limited space forces, let's say... extremely creative and thought out translation of every piece of text that results in a much better translation.
newtmonkey
Arcane
aweigh
Good points indeed on font width and (also for carts) cart size. Like you, I don't fault the use of abbreviations, and I think having to keep things short can actually benefit the script, as Japanese writing in games tends to be full of not only exposition, but multiple characters explaining the same thing over and over, and extremely obvious stuff no one needs spelled out for unless they are retarded. That picture a long while back comparing the literal translation of some dialog in a town in some JRPG vs the translation we actually got (where the Japanese was like "Welcome to Winter Town, the town of winter") is not just a lolworthy exception, but pretty much the rule in my experience.
I also agree that, if any game is a nice fit for "massaged" machine translation, it's Wiz and Wizlike games (the exception being those with puzzles or more story text than normal).
Your example of Auger and Ogre is definitely a result of a translator who had no experience with fantasy games or books or whatever. I assume the translator just put that in google translate and took the first word he/she was familiar with. A huge issue with translating games especially is that character names, place names, many items, monsters, etc. etc. are typically all spelled out in katakana, so without context you pretty much have to guess what it means. It's even worse when the scriptwriters just make up words and use katakana to "spell" them out.
I am actually playing through Wiz Gaiden 1 now, but I haven't checked the translation out. It does a great job of capturing the Wiz feel considering the hardware, imo.
I'm happy to translate bits and pieces, but to be honest with you, the end/beginning of the year tends to be one of the busiest times of the year, and what little time I am not spending translating I would rather spend actually playing games! Unfortunately, doing bits and pieces also means I would probably lack much context for dialog and stuff, and then we are back at square one haha.
Good points indeed on font width and (also for carts) cart size. Like you, I don't fault the use of abbreviations, and I think having to keep things short can actually benefit the script, as Japanese writing in games tends to be full of not only exposition, but multiple characters explaining the same thing over and over, and extremely obvious stuff no one needs spelled out for unless they are retarded. That picture a long while back comparing the literal translation of some dialog in a town in some JRPG vs the translation we actually got (where the Japanese was like "Welcome to Winter Town, the town of winter") is not just a lolworthy exception, but pretty much the rule in my experience.
I also agree that, if any game is a nice fit for "massaged" machine translation, it's Wiz and Wizlike games (the exception being those with puzzles or more story text than normal).
Your example of Auger and Ogre is definitely a result of a translator who had no experience with fantasy games or books or whatever. I assume the translator just put that in google translate and took the first word he/she was familiar with. A huge issue with translating games especially is that character names, place names, many items, monsters, etc. etc. are typically all spelled out in katakana, so without context you pretty much have to guess what it means. It's even worse when the scriptwriters just make up words and use katakana to "spell" them out.
I am actually playing through Wiz Gaiden 1 now, but I haven't checked the translation out. It does a great job of capturing the Wiz feel considering the hardware, imo.
I'm happy to translate bits and pieces, but to be honest with you, the end/beginning of the year tends to be one of the busiest times of the year, and what little time I am not spending translating I would rather spend actually playing games! Unfortunately, doing bits and pieces also means I would probably lack much context for dialog and stuff, and then we are back at square one haha.
i only asked half-jokingly. obv. i'll send u a .doc if you want, though. Elminage 2 game script is only 4mb's!
in comparison elminage Original (elminage 1) game script is 1.7mb.
Elminage GOTHIC game script (all elmi games conveniently have the entire game's text in 1 file) is 0.6mb only !!! Further proof E: Gothic is just that more hard-core, kekeke.
in comparison elminage Original (elminage 1) game script is 1.7mb.
Elminage GOTHIC game script (all elmi games conveniently have the entire game's text in 1 file) is 0.6mb only !!! Further proof E: Gothic is just that more hard-core, kekeke.
neonet1
Barely Literate
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2017
- Messages
- 2
Yo, I stumbled upon this thread while googling "How to translate psp games" and I have some questions, naturally.
First and foremost, let me tell you what I wish to do. There is this game in the Shin Megami Tensei series titled "SMT: Devil Summoner". This game was never released in english on the Saturn relesase or on the PSP remake, but a translation was made. However, it was a script translation that was never made into a patch. Now, it has been 3 years since the translation surfaced, and no patch has been developed. There is one person that is supposedly trying, but there hasn't been an update in a while since the person has been "too busy". I personally want to give it a shot, mostly because I have way too much free time on my hands. I have already extracted the ISO from my UMD, and have acquired almost all the necessary tools and knowledge to continue with this project. The only thing I have an issue with is the quickbms scripts. I am no programmer (yet), so I am at a loss. I want to know if A) learning the required programming knowledge can be done in a reasonable amount of time or B) you would be willing to help in the making of these scripts. No fine tuned translation will be necessary since it already exists, all that is required is a way to extract the .bin files so I can start the hexadecimal editing process. I really want to see this a reality, and most of the SMT fanbase would too. Thanks in advance.
First and foremost, let me tell you what I wish to do. There is this game in the Shin Megami Tensei series titled "SMT: Devil Summoner". This game was never released in english on the Saturn relesase or on the PSP remake, but a translation was made. However, it was a script translation that was never made into a patch. Now, it has been 3 years since the translation surfaced, and no patch has been developed. There is one person that is supposedly trying, but there hasn't been an update in a while since the person has been "too busy". I personally want to give it a shot, mostly because I have way too much free time on my hands. I have already extracted the ISO from my UMD, and have acquired almost all the necessary tools and knowledge to continue with this project. The only thing I have an issue with is the quickbms scripts. I am no programmer (yet), so I am at a loss. I want to know if A) learning the required programming knowledge can be done in a reasonable amount of time or B) you would be willing to help in the making of these scripts. No fine tuned translation will be necessary since it already exists, all that is required is a way to extract the .bin files so I can start the hexadecimal editing process. I really want to see this a reality, and most of the SMT fanbase would too. Thanks in advance.
Kusanagi-no-Tsurugi
Barely Literate
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2020
- Messages
- 1
Hello, I'm trying to look for steps on how to translate PSP games and this is one of the first results Google gives me.
I have downloaded the softwares as instructed, but I can't follow because the image links are broken. Photobucket has this terrible tendency of erasing pictures after a while.
So if the OP would be so kind as to reupload the illustrative images (and the video too, which seems to have been taken down for a reason or another) for the benefit of those who find this thread, I would be very grateful.
I have downloaded the softwares as instructed, but I can't follow because the image links are broken. Photobucket has this terrible tendency of erasing pictures after a while.
So if the OP would be so kind as to reupload the illustrative images (and the video too, which seems to have been taken down for a reason or another) for the benefit of those who find this thread, I would be very grateful.
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