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Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

IHaveHugeNick

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PoE and Tyranny were new IPs. Torment is probably the most recognizable brand to come out of Kickstarter yet, even if it's not technically the same brand. The launch window is good, they have a pretty agressive marketing from Techland, they have tens of thousands of backers to generate hype. It should easily make substantial profit, as long as the game itself is decent.

And what is even a point of obsessing about the fact that they cut content? Wake the fuck up, every game cuts content, including original PS:T, believe it or not.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
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Messages
97,435
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
PoE and Tyranny were new IPs. Torment is probably the most recognizable brand to come out of Kickstarter yet, even if it's not technically the same brand. The launch window is good, they have a pretty agressive marketing from Techland, they have tens of thousands of backers to generate hype. It should easily make substantial profit, as long as the game itself is decent.

And what is even a point of obsessing about the fact that they cut content? Wake the fuck up, every game cuts content, including original PS:T, believe it or not.

It's considered bad form to cut stretch goal content because in theory people were encouraged to pay more money specifically to see it implemented.
 
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Lurker King

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Huge nick, you need to take in consideration that Techland will eat into their profits. They invest money, pay the bills, but take the profits. that's how publishers work.
 

Prime Junta

Guest
And what is even a point of obsessing about the fact that they cut content? Wake the fuck up, every game cuts content, including original PS:T, believe it or not.

It's dishonest to fish for Kickstarter contributions by dangling stretch goals, and then go "lol jk" when it's time to release. That's just a dick move.
 
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Lurker King

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Yeah, but they do these things because they can get away with it. Do you remember D:OS? If players held developers accountable for their promises, they wouldn't cut content. Besides, that is the problem you have with the kickstart model. it enourages developers to make promises they can't keep to receive a money that won't be enough.
 
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FeelTheRads

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And what is even a point of obsessing about the fact that they cut content? Wake the fuck up, every game cuts content, including original PS:T, believe it or not.

It's dishonest to fish for Kickstarter contributions by dangling stretch goals, and then go "lol jk" when it's time to release. That's just a dick move.

This. And the least they could do is come out and say it if it's the case. I don't really care about whatever bullshit reasons they come up with, but at the moment they fail to answer anything which really is the behavior you'd expect from AAA or, inXile's case, wannabe AAA company.
 
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Lurker King

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I think inXile is in financial troubles and desperately needs money. Fargo is a smart guy. No way he would place short term gains above the long term gains and destroy his biggest asset - good will of the backers.

That is pure whishful thinking on your part. He is not destroying anything. Most backers don't care about this. In fact, most codexers are going to back InXile again as if nothing had happened. The backers are just a stepstone. they back the games -> the game press talk about you -> you made a deal with a publisher, etc.
 
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Agreed, and the WL3 campaign shows people are less willing to give them money, but if the game is successful, investors will be happy.

To be successful game needs to sell a lot. There is one demographic which buys those kinds of games and part of this demographic are kickstarter backers. They are the most enthusiastic and eager to spread the world to friends about the game group of supporters. Pissing your most loyal supporters will divide the demographic and weaken its core. Trying to move away from them is self destructive or at the least very risky. You cannot attract many casuals with those kinds of games, especially without the big marketing budget.

Cannot imagine inXile to not understand this.
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/01/torment-tides-of-numenera-preview/

Torment: Tides of Numenera is pustulant, putrid, and mucousy—in a good way
18 years after Planescape, we journey into an otherworldly predatory organism.

torment-980x613.jpg


Not everyone can make a city of meat.

To build something like this, the weirdness cannot just be an accoutrement, an accessory to a more familiar structure. The idiosyncrasies of biological life must be considered, the fact that we are, underneath our skin, a venous clockwork of offal twitching wetly in its varied cavities. More importantly, there needs to be an understanding of why this terrifies us, and how those fears intersect with our trepidations about urban life.

Luckily, inXile Entertainment are experts.

Let’s rewind a bit, though. I had the opportunity recently to get a hands-on with inXile Entertainment’s upcoming RPG Torment: Tides of Numenera, the spiritual sequel to the iconic Planescape: Torment. Like its predecessor, Tides of Numenera diverges from the traditional monomyth. You are not a “chosen one” here, a trope that creative lead Colin McComb has admitted fatigue with. If anything, really, you are the reverse.

As the Last Castoff, you are literally the detritus of an entity known as the Changing God, no more important than the hundreds of iterations that came before you. You do, however, have a quest to fulfil, and even that is atypical of RPGs.

Personal survival.

That is your driving motivation. Not the survival of your kingdom. Not the survival of your family. Nothing so noble as that. Instead, it is the animal instinct for self-preservation. Something called the Sorrow is hunting you and every castoff that came before. Only the Changing God has answers. You hope, at least.

While the full game will permit players to explore the Ninth World, our London demo had a more restricted scope. Instead of the universe, we had the Bloom, an immense predatory organism that also happens to be a transdimensional settlement.

Pustulant, putrid, and mucus-slick, the Bloom is a triumph in architectural grotesquerie. The streets are jagged with cartilage and small bones. They writhe around pits of exposed marrow, oozing abscesses, puckered orifices of suspicious purpose. The skyline is latticed with veins and ligament, and every building is a tumour, lumps of meat studded with mouths and boils.

To put it another way, the Bloom is to traditional city hubs what John Carpenter’s The Thing was to Star Trek’s uninspired alien design.

I loved all of it. Clearly. The two hours or so that I had with the game, I spent all of it wandering the Bloom’s fetid corridors, talking to anyone who had more than a throwaway line to spare. When a giant boil (yes, a man-sized blister) presented dialogue options, I poked at the thing, both literally and metaphorically, over and over until it burst. (Let’s not talk about the wet, glistening thing that rose from that mess of pus and broken membrane.)

There’s indubitably combat in the mix somewhere. Certainly, an encounter between some cultists and an alien scientist suggested the possibility. But I never got around to engaging in eldritch fisticuffs. There was too much conversation to be had.

Torment: Tides of Numenera is built on a spine of over a million words. It is difficult to say if every word was perfectly chosen, but I’m cautiously optimistic. For one thing, a number of Planescape: Torment’s original team is working on the game. (If you’ve played the seminal title, you’ll likely be familiar with its depth. If you haven’t, you really, really should.)

For another, the characters that I met were, well. To break it down briefly, we have experience-addicts lurking for the next hit of someone’s past; killing-machines desperate to be devoured by the Bloom; the digested spirit of the entity’s earlier sovereign; psychic avians that lobotomise slaves for use as translators; cultists who guzzle the Bloom’s juices and rewrite its scripture whenever whim decrees.

And what makes them work is not their individual peculiarities, but how they suture together, creating a vivid sense of place. Everyone you meet is affected by the Bloom. Everyone you encounter has, in some way, been influenced by the miasmic negativity that fills the vast abomination. Some rail against its influences. Some embrace its divinity. Others, like a guide you encounter early on, even become enamoured of the Bloom, treating it as some primal thing to be loved and indulged—even if it does cost them two legs, their sense of taste, and the capacity to feel fear.

Now, here’s the other thing:

Torment’s overarching question has always been, “What does one life matter?” And in the Bloom, the answer’s simple: not at all. All these small events cohere to create the impression that your character is infinitesimally small, meaningless save for its value as sustenance, and so very powerless. By the end of the demo, I remember feeling genuinely sorry for a group of castaways. Not curious as to how they’d contribute to the intricate narrative. But genuinely sorry for what will inevitably happen to them because I’ve seen the outcome for everyone else. I know what is going to happen.

Cosmic horror is a familiar canvas for many creatives. Even Gavin Jurgen-Fyhrie, a writer on the team (and coincidentally, the lead writer for Wasteland 3), joked about defaulting to the genre. Not many get it right. But Torment does.

They get a lot of things right, really. The universe is richly diverse, a fact that is never commented upon, and simply accepted. Gender is no restriction in the pursuit of power. Women can be as virtuous and villainous as their male counterparts. There are as many brown-skinned people as there are anyone else. Most importantly, none of the alien races feel like they’ve been codified as one real-world ethnicity or another, a constant issue in the entertainment industry.

Will this be a paragon of CRPGs, worthy of inheriting the accolades visited on its predecessor? Who knows. But Torment is setting itself up to be a genuine classic, an amazingly topical game for this day and age. Even if unintended by the creators, it’s hard not to draw parallels between Torment’s musings about the value of a single life in a ravenous universe, and our own place in this dystopian world. This, as intimated in earlier paragraphs, is especially true in the Bloom, where it is spectacularly easy to simply accept the status quo and press on.

But which player character does that? When trapped in the belly of the beast, the only sensible course of action is to rise up. (And possibly out through the membranous walls that separate you from the world outside.)
 
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FeelTheRads

Arcane
Joined
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Messages
13,716
Not everyone can make a city of meat.

To build something like this, the weirdness cannot just be an accoutrement, an accessory to a more familiar structure. The idiosyncrasies of biological life must be considered, the fact that we are, underneath our skin, a venous clockwork of offal twitching wetly in its varied cavities. More importantly, there needs to be an understanding of why this terrifies us, and how those fears intersect with our trepidations about urban life.

Who the hell writes this garbage?

Luckily, inXile Entertainment are experts.

At what? At varied wet cavities?

Edit: Who else read "venous cock" in that quote?
 
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ushas

Savant
Joined
Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
http://wccftech.com/tides-of-numenera-worthy-planescape/

inXile: Tides of Numenera Is “Worthy Companion” to Planescape: Torment, Should Last 45-50 Hours
...
At a recent preview event, we were given the opportunity to sit down with Colin McComb and Gavin Jurgens-Fyhrie, two writers on inXile’s Torment: Tides of Numenera. Check out our interview to hear the latest on inXile’s experiences with Early Access, their stance on DLC and more.


eg, the DLC answer:
Do you expect to release additional content after launch? If so, will it be paid or free?
Colin: The answer is no. We don’t expect to provide additional material necessarily, but if we do it will be free. It is one of the things that as a company inXile are pretty against paid DLC.
Gavin: We patch.
Colin: Depending on how well the game does, we may look into adding more content but that will be in the form of support as opposed to, ‘hey guys, come buy some new shoes for The Last Castoff. $49.95!’.

Probably nothing new there?
 
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ushas

Savant
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Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
A nickname?:)

They also posted hands-on preview:
http://wccftech.com/torment-tides-of-numenera-hands-on-preview/

...
As I’ve stated several times now, the setup for this preview event of Torment: Tides of Numenera was less than ideal; however, the game’s positive qualities shined through despite the awkward introduction. The premise for Torment’s story was enough to make me want to play the game. Already I can tell that the story in this game is unlike most games on the market, and that isn’t taking to account any of the reactivity in the game where your decisions shape the story. There’s a reason why this game took over four years to create – if you take a look at Torment’s Kickstarter page you’ll see just how many stretch goals the developers had to reach.

My play session of Torment took place on an Xbox One. The game’s framerate seemed to fluctuate between 60FPS and 30FPS (sometimes lower) depending on the scene. Of course, all of this is subject to change as this was an early build of the game. Torment is first and foremost a PC game which has very obviously been designed with a keyboard and mouse in mind. The controls for the Xbox controller worked well enough, and thankfully you can also use a controller on the PC version of the game. If you are sensitive to framerate changes, I would recommend picking up the PC version over the two console ports. While I did not get to try the PC version, I spotted the game ran at a flawless/stable 60FPS.

So, does Torment live up to the incredibly high standards of its predecessor? Unfortunately, I cannot verify this as I have never played Planescape: Torment (to be fair, I had only just turned six years old when it was released). This is almost certainly going to be the case for most people who haven’t already backed the game on Kickstarter. Let’s be completely honest, if you are even remotely interested in CRPGs then you’ll have heard of this game by now considering who is making it.

I came away disappointed with my time with Torment as everything seemed too complicated for me to understand in less than an hour. It doesn’t help things that I was dropped roughly sixty percent of the way through the game (again, I’m using the book analogy here). The difference between Torment and any typical bad game is that I still wanted to play it, except this time I would start it from the very beginning. I can’t personally recommend Torment based off of what I played, but if you like the sound of the premise or if you are familiar with CRPGs then you will probably love the full game once it becomes available.
 

Brancaleone

Liturgist
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
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Location
Norcia
Not everyone can make a city of meat.

To build something like this, the weirdness cannot just be an accoutrement, an accessory to a more familiar structure. The idiosyncrasies of biological life must be considered, the fact that we are, underneath our skin, a venous clockwork of offal twitching wetly in its varied cavities. More importantly, there needs to be an understanding of why this terrifies us, and how those fears intersect with our trepidations about urban life.

Who the hell writes this garbage?

One more example of what Darth Roxor was talking about, that is, shitty videogame writers and shitty videogame journalists typically being cut from the same cloth.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,435
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
How the tides have turned - sea's old arch-enemy previews a game he worked on: http://www.zam.com/article/1317/torment-tides-of-numenera-preview

Torment: Tides of Numenera Preview
by Rowan Kaiser

The new Torment game mixes fantasy with sci-fi, and combat with nonviolent gameplay, in a way that seems really fresh and interesting.

Torment: Tides of Numenera has a big hill to climb. As a pseudo-sequel to Planescape: Torment, it’s benefited from the association with a game widely considered one of the best, most creative, and most philosophically dense role-playing games of all time. Anything less than that standard would likely be a disappointment--especially for the huge fans who gave Tides a record-breaking Kickstarter.

The problem is that the 1999 original Torment is pretty resistant to having a sequel for several reasons, most overtly, that it had an Advanced Dungeons & Dragons license to use the “Planescape” setting that its sequel doesn’t. Planescape: Torment’s bigger difficulty: it’s kind of a mess. All that storytelling creativity is there, yes, but it’s with an AD&D ruleset that didn’t really agree with it, a combat engine that couldn’t support it, and a structure that frontloaded all the best ideas and conversations. Making a sequel to a beloved mess involves the difficult process of fixing the mess while also including what made the game so beloved.

The solution, for Tides of Numenera, is this: take the removal of the AD&D license and make it an advantage. There are mechanical benefits to this, and I’ll talk about them soon, but the thing that struck me most about it initially was what it did with the setting. Planescape was built on the convergence of all the different magical “planes” of various other AD&D settings. This made it wild and varied, with different bizarre gods and wizards and demons all interacting— but it was still, at its core, fantasy.

Tides of Numenera, on the other hand, gleefully adds science fiction to the mix of fantastical intersecting realities. Now, I don’t mean giant starship battles and space marines, but rather that the mix of influences in Tides includes collisions of technology in addition to collisions of magic. Time travel, AI, religious cults, techno-magical items? Whatever fits the moment fits the game.

For example, in the preview section I played from the middle of the game, I needed something from a crashed spaceship in the middle of of organic beast called the “Bloom” that people lived inside of. In order to acquire it, I had to convince the ship’s AI, which was keeping memories of the dead passengers alive as a monument to its failure and a record for their families. One resolution there is to integrate the AI and its memories into your character’s mind--one of your powers in Tides. And then you can find an organic gateway to another world--a “Maw” in the Bloom--that opens when fed on guilt, and give to it the AI, resolving a different quest.

Torment_thebloom.jpg


You don’t have to do it that way— you can brute force the Maw, with consequences, or find a guilty someone more deserving of being devoured for your benefit. I didn’t even find out about all these different options until I talked to a developer afterward, and he asked what I’d chosen to do. This leads to the thing that impressed me most about Tides in both the Early Access version available and the different preview section: the pacing fits the game.

An RPG is a difficult balancing act. Almost all modern RPGs are combinations of multiple systems: combat, dialogue, inventory, downtime, etc. Too much of any of these can be a problem; The Witcher 3 has great exploration and a great story, but can stall out if you explore too much and are forced to do several plot missions in a row. Planescape: Torment starts in a densely-packed city filled with quests, factions, and dialogue, but occasionally veers off into puzzle or combat-focused dungeons, taking you away from what made it so special initially.

In my admittedly few hours with Tides, its systems never felt like they were colliding in a bad way. Instead, everywhere I went, I consistently found something interesting to do, and often a quest chain to follow. Most of those quests tended to resolve themselves relatively naturally as I poked around, spoke to people, and learned the shape of the world. In other words, if I just took the world of Tides as it came, I progressed through the game, making interesting choices in the way that it wanted me to. I wasn’t facing choice paralysis, or being confused by essential game systems, I was just...playing. That’s an exciting feeling in any RPG.

Torment_spaceshit.jpg


Tides reinforces this by veering away from Advanced Dungeons & Dragons and normal role-playing conventions with a simple, effective system to focus on the sort of combat-light, dialogue and setting-heavy game that it is. Your character’s three core stats are Might, Speed, and Intellect, which you can improve over the course of the game.

Most importantly, these core stats serve as currency pools for skill checks. If you run into a belligerent thug that you need to get past, and decide to try to strangle him, your Might may only give you a 45% chance of beating him. But if you pay two might points, that becomes an 85% chance, so your five Might drops to three, but you succeed in the encounter. They come back when you rest or use items for healing, but turning core stats into currency that can be gambled with is a really smart way to keep dialogue as the focus of the game.

Here’s the kicker: I didn’t actually fight any battles in the preview event section of the game and still felt this way. I did have a Crisis or two— scenes where groups confront one another in ways that could end in violence, forcing you to tactically work to resolve them. But I was able to tactically resolve these Crises by engaging in dialogue, although I could have picked combat instead.

Torment_goldhoard.jpg


I’m not one of those RPGs-don’t-need-combat types, either; I usually think fighting is an essential component of pacing for video game RPGs until they can come up with skill and dialogue systems that can fill the same role. My time with Tides is limited enough that I’m not ready to guarantee that this is that game. But after playing Torment: Tides of Numenera I’m starting to believe that it’s plausible— and its late February release is worth getting truly excited about.
 

Jarpie

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Oct 30, 2009
Messages
6,609
Codex 2012 MCA
I hate the two portraits made for the player, someone better make better looking alternatives.

I can't be the only one.
 

FeelTheRads

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2008
Messages
13,716
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StaticSpine

Arcane
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Location
Moscow
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
I just looked at his profile and found this... :lol:

imweasel said:
Hello there, Mr. McCuck. We have been bathing in your liberal tears. It is wonderful. :D

Which pairs with that time when Bester (iirc) called Heine a degenerate cuck or something like that. Yeah, can't guess why they don't post here anymore. :M
On the one hand - Bester sure doesn't know how to behave in a polite society. On the other - 'dex isn't a polite society. But still I felt kinda bad for Heine, McComb was (and still is) a more appropriate target.

Late to the party, but I looked at their current lead writer's LinkedIn, and it's a total disaster. Blizzard miscellaneous writing and editing Wildstar MMO are among his main achievements, oh, and also this.
"Freelance Writer
Cracked
August 2007 – January 2010 (2 years 6 months)Home
Wrote comedy articles for Cracked.com on a freelance basis. They are available through the link in the "Projects" section below."

So now at least I have an explanation for this gem:
It’s while I’m asking about the process of writing that world in such granular detail that McComb and lead writer Gavin Jurgens-Fhyrie get to talking about the Genital Naming system, or GNS. “We didn't want any characters to feel the same,” says Jurgens-Fhyrie. “You'll feel the same way once you play through this game, you'll see that a lot of the characters are unique and odd.”

“One character [in particular], his line, I think it was, ‘Grim and weathered visage - it looks like he has lots of tales to tell’. I was like, ‘Colin, I think I'm gonna have to tell a lot of tales in this one’. He tells a lot of damn tales. So we started talking, and as we do when we talk, we inevitably skew dirty. So started on/talking about his ‘grim, weathered pecker’.

“So we were like, ‘Is he really a pecker talker?’” says McComb. “Then we realised: wait a second. If he calls it his pecker, what does his companion call his dick? The way one talks about their genitalia, the pair realised, is a real window into the psyche.
[src]


The dude also writes for Horizon: Zero Dawn.
 

ushas

Savant
Joined
Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
https://forums.inxile-entertainment...0818e102cef245b4a5f542bcd7fc&start=40#p179267

sear said:
Hi guys,

The companion roster has been slightly reduced from our initial plans. Throughout development on Torment, our philosophy has always emphasized depth and reactivity in our storyline and in our characters. We know you would not be satisfied with anything else. During development, we found that the more far reaching and reactive our companions were, the better they felt and the more justice it did to the original Planescape: Torment. This trade-off meant we were able to add more companion conversations, banter, voice-over, quests, and story endings. We did not want to leave some companions feeling shallow, with storylines that felt incomplete, or be forced to shove them into the late game.

That said, we certainly haven't shut the door on Torment’s development. We still have a lot of early work done on other companions and are open to continuing to work on the game. We can say that any DLCs or expansions that we put out will always be free to our backers of that game, so there is no need to worry about paying for any additional content in Torment.
 

FeelTheRads

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2008
Messages
13,716
Cat's out of the bag, folks.
Voice acting does its job again. And that is the main thing that should be understood from that load of corporate bullshit.

Edit: inb4 Techland solves that problem with free DLC and everyone will have to pay for it
 

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