Tacticular Cancer: We'll have your balls

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Game News Tim Cain and Leonard Boyarsky's new game at Obsidian is being published by Take-Two Interactive

Discussion in 'RPG News & Content' started by Infinitron, Dec 14, 2017.

  1. Kyl Von Kull Magister

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    I really wonder about this. Could Todd Howard’s insecurity truly be overpowering his colossal greed? Does Zenimax care about his insecurity??

    I think we haven’t gotten any third party Fallout spinoffs yet because they’re still milking 4—just released the GOTY edition (I wonder how hard they had to dig to find someone that named it game of the year) and the VR version.

    I have a sneaking suspicion that Bethesda truly believes 3 and 4 are better than New Vegas because they don’t particularly enjoy RPG elements and care so much more about the hiking simulator aspect and cinematic storytelling. I bet when they played F:NV they thought to themselves: “walking around the desert is so boring and where are all the cutscenes?”

    The other reason might be that, other than Obsidian, which has been busy with its own IPs, who else could they get to make it? How many mid tier RPG developers are left? You think they’d trust InXile? Maybe they only want a pseudo RPG developer and go with the guys who made Horizon Zero Dawn, which would be entirely the wrong direction (although the lead writer from F:NV works for them now), but also seems like a very Bethesda decision.

    Here’s an idea: when Deadfire is done, Obsidian should offer to make another Sawyer Fallout spinoff, but as a $50 or $60 Bethesda creation club DLC for Fallout 4. Todd would probably go for that.
     
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  2. Make America Great Again Roguey Arcane Sawyerite Sawyerist Sawyer's Bride No Fun Allowed

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    Loose-lipped Jason Schreier spilled the beans (and then deleted when he realized he shouldn't have).

    [​IMG]
     
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  3. Kyl Von Kull Magister

    Kyl Von Kull
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    I totally believe this (although I also think they’re perplexed by the situation because they truly do not understand why people like RPGs), but how much discretion do the Bethesda guys have? If ZeniMax says, “New Vegas made us a lot of money, have someone make us another spinoff,” Todd Howard has to say, “yes, master.” I’m just not sure whether ZeniMax cares about the details.
     
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  4. Make America Great Again Infinitron I post news Patron

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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    I've heard this rumor myself. That Fallout: New Vegas is the "game-that-shall-not-be-mentioned" within Bethesda.

    I'm sure the suits don't care about Todd's jealousy, but they do care about letting a company they don't own or control establish a kind of "brand ownership" over their IP. In fact to a large extent this has already happened.

    Also in general, despite initiatives like Private Division here, there's been a movement away from publishers working with independent studios - they prefer doing things in-house as a rule.
     
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  5. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

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    lol, fucking Bethesda.

    But it's normal I guess, those who can't will always hate those who can.
     
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  6. sser Arcane Cuck

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    Fuck that, New Vegas, you're taking everything we worked for motherfucker. I'mma review bomb yourrrrrr fucking ass.
     
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  7. Goral Arcane Patron The Real Fanboy

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    http://www.bethesda.sucks/
     
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  8. Make America Great Again Blaine Cis-Het Oppressor

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    Although it won't put them out of business anytime soon, it's extraordinarily satisfying to know that Bethesda are aware they're nothing more than a digital McDonald's serving the computer game equivalent of greasy, salty, cutter-grade beef to people with no taste (or more specifically, totally unrefined palates).

    Disdaining people is one of my favorite hobbies, but I don't disdain the American poor, who often eat fast food for 1-2 meals nearly every day; nor do I disdain the average clueless gamer who only plays shovelware. They're ignorant and don't know any better.

    My disdain is reserved for people who know that what they're doing is awful, but forge ahead anyway just to make a buck. I promise you that in their shoes I'd move into a box beneath a bridge before I sold out my dignity and resigned myself to a career as a hack. The truly sad thing is that not all of them are hacks—but they're required to shelve their good ideas and dumb down their work in order to produce games for morons. How do I know? I know because the linear corridor level design in Skyrim is much too cleverly disguised to have been designed by anyone except highly skilled and experienced level designers. A novice or a hack could design shitty linear corridors, but they wouldn't be able to hide them at all.

    Even years ago, Howard went on record essentially saying that Bethesda's developers are entrenched in their existing development tools and engine and are scared to try anything different (not in those words, of course, but that's what they meant). This is a classic sign of hacks: someone who gains enough familiarity to get by in a mediocre fashion, and then refuses to change unless absolutely forced to by circumstances beyond their control.

    I feel sorry for some of the developers over there, but knowing that the senior development staff are aware that they're useless trash gets my little dinky hard.
     
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  9. Brayko Self-Ejected

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    There's a flip to that, McDonalds is one of the easiest places to work full time so developers who want a check for nothing go to Bethesda.
     
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  10. I'm With Her Metro for prison Arcane Beg Auditor

    Metro
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    Where is the 'total psychopath' emoji vote button?
     
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  11. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

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    Meh, I don't think they know they're trash. I think they're just envious when people like something that's not done by them. Which is a sign of malicious stupidity rather than self-awareness.
     
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  12. Make America Great Again Blaine Cis-Het Oppressor

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    I assure you that they know exactly what they're doing, Howard especially. He (and others) embraced the decline for the sake of money. Keep in mind that once upon a time he worked to develop games that were actually good.

    He has his money, and so does Zenimax. Zenimax doesn't give a fuck what they're selling, just so long as it sells and doesn't create PR issues, but Toddikins knows exactly where he stands. Laughing all the way to the bank is all well and good for the first year or two, but once financial comfort becomes the norm, then what? He can't simply stop caring, like the corporate suits don't. His ultimate legacy will be the praise and admiration of a bunch of morons, although frankly I don't think they really stick around long once they move on to the next shit game. That's a very unsatisfying situation to be in for someone who knows he could do much better.

    McDonald's hires real, talented chefs to design novelty menu items at their research facilities, but do you think those chefs care what the masses think of their burger? Fuck no. When they return to the restaurant biz, they'll hope to impress people of taste with fresh, excellent food. That's the legacy they'll seek, not how effectively they were able to slop the hogs.
     
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  13. I'm With Her Metro for prison Arcane Beg Auditor

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  14. Kyl Von Kull Magister

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    Hold up, “games that were actually good”? Howard didn’t run the show with Daggerfall. I’ll spot him Morrowind even though I found it really boring (and I think you can see the seeds there of a great deal of what was terrible about Oblivion and Skyrim and F3/F4). But that’s just one game people with taste consider good. Maybe he got lucky, maybe the positive aspects were all Ken Rolston or someone else who left. He certainly hasn’t been able to do it again.

    With Bethesda, you need to remember Hanlon’s law: never attribute to malice that which can be attributed to pure stupidity. Todd’s great at selling games to casuals because he is one, not because he’s an evil genius.
     
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  15. Make America Great Again Blaine Cis-Het Oppressor

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    I never said he ran the show. I said he "worked to develop" games that were actually good.

    Even if he isn't a good game developer, he certainly THINKS he is, and he at least knows enough to realize where he stands.

    If you just want to believe he's just a moron, be my guest. People have been parroting "never attribute to malice etc." quite a lot this year. It seems to be the hip, fresh, cool thing to parrot just now for people who have no other argument apart from aphorisms.
     
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  16. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

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    Well, I think the's both evil and stupid. :happytrollboy:
     
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  17. Brayko Self-Ejected

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    Honestly there's probably more evil and malice on the Codex than Bethesda lol doesn't mean Bethesda makes great games or anything just be careful of contradictions.
     
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  18. Iskramor Educated Possibly Retarded

    Iskramor
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    People like mrmattyplaysa re the biggest anti-rpg cancer why avelone gave interview with him is beyond me...
     
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  19. IHaveHugeNick Arcane

    IHaveHugeNick
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    The first rule of the corporate world is to cover your ass. F:NV continues to resonate within the fanbase to such an extent that it's damaging to Bethesda's brand. That's a time bomb on your hands if you're an executive.
     
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  20. Make America Great Again Blaine Cis-Het Oppressor

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    I've realized that I've been behaving quite abrasively in this thread, so from this point onward, I'll be providing parallel embeds of the insanely cheerful music employed by American marketing firms to sell their products to people under the emotional age of 10.

     
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  21. Davaris Arcane

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    When I played F3 up until the A-bomb town, I was convinced they made it that bad to piss people off. So perhaps they aren't selling any games at all, and its part of a Sooper Sekret Conspiracy to dumb the world down. In reality hardly anyone is buying these games, and most are going into land fill.

    There's only one thing Beth can do to save their ass, and keep the Sooper Sekret Conspiracy on track. Buy Obsidian immediately and EA them.
     
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  22. Kyl Von Kull Magister

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    Sadly, I don’t think they feel the need to do any ass covering whatsoever. As much love as F:NV gets on certain corners of the web, F4 racked up $750 million in sales on day one—more than New Vegas made in its first five years. F4 has now sold more copies than Skyrim. (https://www.google.com/amp/www.tech...s-now-bethesdas-most-successful-game-ever.htm)

    Who cares if it was a critical disappointment with those numbers? Far from covering their asses the guys at Bethesda are probably jumping all over themselves to take as much credit as possible internally.

    Still, there’s no sound business reason not to give Obsidian another crack. No way are they worried about anyone stealing the brand away from them in the minds of consumers because of a few online forums.

    They’re not doing it out of some combination spite, jealousy, short-sightedness, poor judgment and bad taste in games. That and, if they do decide on a spin-off, it makes more economic sense to give it to one of Zenimax’s other divisions, even if that results in a much worse game.
     
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  23. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

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    Yeah, I really doubt Bethesda feels threatened in any way by Obsidian. They'd probably die of laughter at that one. If anything, they're afraid Obsidian won't sell nearly as much as they can and they'll devalue the franchise so why give it to them in the first place?
     
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  24. Make America Great Again Infinitron I post news Patron

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    That's Fallout 4, which is what caused the backlash against Bethesda and increased nostalgia for FO:NV in the first place. The question is what happens with Fallout 5. Or what happens when this game comes out.

    For years now, people from Obsidian have been going around doing interviews, saying "We're the Fallout guys, we created Fallout, we know all about Fallout". Over time this can become a threat to Bethesda, and I'm sure it's pissing off people there.
     
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  25. Fenix Liturgist Vatnik

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    Absurdly stupid law, that don't take into account intentional harm, disguised as "Oh we were so stupid, pardon us!". Hanlon was a dumb fuck.
     
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