Thief fan missions and campaigns

[skacky]

Levers room:

Spoiler

Look at the bookcase.

Sewer tunnels key:

Spoiler

Have you paid the burgomaster a visit? You'll have to climb on the rooftops first.

 

[JarlFrank]

Sewer tunnels key:

Spoiler

Have you paid the burgomaster a visit? You'll have to climb on the rooftops first.

Probably not, I've been

Spoiler

to the Hammerite Cardinal's home, and most of the apartments visitable from that rooftop section around there.

EDIT: Okay, found it - accidentally stumbled upon it, in fact. :D

And I've seen the differently-textured stair step Unkillable Cat mentioned. Heh.

Btw, I like how your insanely detailed hand-drawn map of the city is featured in this FM.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Been taffing around some more.

Spoiler

I'm in the home where Ramirez (or at least his critter model) is patrolling. I see a bookcase-door but I can't open it. Is it a red herring?

Also, poor wino. Poor guy just wanted a good night's sleep...

Btw, I like how your [skacky's] insanely detailed hand-drawn map of the city is featured in this FM.

It's in at least two places. Makes me think there's a small cartography shoppe is a sidestreet somewhere...

EDIT: Dat Pimp Hammerite! Looks like Carmen Sandiego! :D

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Just finished Mission 1. If you think you're near the end when you finally get into the tunnels, THINK AGAIN.

Despite all my best efforts I "only" got 74.8% of the loot.

Points of interests:

# One Fly Hammerite.
# World's creepiest painting.
# A guy trying to break into a house (listen for the sound of lockpicks).
# The stuff in the attic (look in the bed!).
# All the notices around the city (especially the frobbable ones).
# How all the guards huddle around barrel-fires because it's snowing.
# The note for the new sewer worker has "Five Nights at Freddy's" written ALL OVER IT. It does its job, namely creeping readers out.

Spoiler

# Speaking of that note, I only ever found two of the three locations mentioned (spider lair and ossuary). Can the third one be found?
# And on the topic of the ossuary, WHAT THE FUCK WERE THOSE THINGS?!?
# There's a coin stack on an outside windowsill.
# The gambler's stash.
# Melan's Disorientated chest in the Thieves' Guild.

I'm at a loss for words here how fun this was, and I still have Mission 2 left! I still think "Endless Rain" is better, but this is still top-notch stuff. I have two complaints though, but you'lll laugh at them. The first one is that I miss the zoom function, there were times when I REALLY wanted to zoom in on distant sights. The second complaint (and I'm serious here) is that the mission is too fucking dark. Really! There are so many cool and little things to see, and most of them are hidden and obscured by darkness.

I'll continue with this tomorrow, too much taffin' in one day ain't good for a man.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

I'm good as done with Mission 2 but can't finish due to needing 9 gold on the loot objective. All other objectives are completed and I've found and secured the exit. I'll probably have another go later on, but exploring the latter half of the mission is kinda dreary. TOO much verticality in that one.

Compared to Mission 1 this one is a slight letdown, though keep in mind that the fudged AI plays in my installation plays a factor. Starting in a marble-covered structure is NOT good when the slightest noise brings in guards from the upper floors that can spot hidden bodies from across the room, even in the shadows. But I perservered and eventually sent everyone off to dreamland before exploring the place proper. Didn't take long to find the "door" and I must say I was impressed by the architecture in the latter secion...but as mentioned earlier, too much verticality can be a downer.

Nevertheless this is a brilliant FM that isn't trying anything new, just going through the motions in a caring, well-crafted manner. Easily 'Thief FM of the Year' (excluding Dark Mod FMs) and well worth the hassle that it takes to get it running.

EDIT: Just remembered one thing that IS worthy of criticism in this FM, and I think it's high time this got brought up.

When playing multi-part FMs, it is the rule (not the exception) that the equipment you have at the end of the previous mission carries over into the next mission. It is one of the underlying reasons why people are taffing all over the place looking for hidden stuff to begin with! Which is why it rubs me the wrong way to play a mission to the end (especially the long ones) only to find that the fruits of my labors have been taken away from me, because *reasons*. And in this FM there are no reasons for the equipment to be taken away. Garrett isn't captured, he doesn't break all his gear (clumsy taffer) or is forced to travel "light" - all he does is pass through a bloody door!

 

[Dev_Anj]

Starting in a marble-covered structure is NOT good when the slightest noise brings in guards from the upper floors that can spot hidden bodies from across the room, even in the shadows.

The guards in the second mission are intentionally more sensitive, though they shouldn't be seeing bodies in the dark. I liked it because it meant I had to plan ahead a bit before taking out the guards and it made for a challenging mission without becoming too frustrating.

 

[JarlFrank]

Points of interests:

# World's creepiest painting.

Ooh, where/which one?

# The stuff in the attic (look in the bed!).

You mean the attic of the artifact merchant? The one you can only reach from the rooftops?

Spoiler

# And on the topic of the ossuary, WHAT THE FUCK WERE THOSE THINGS?!?

Ok, that sounds creepy. Found something

Spoiler

in the sewer tunnels that might be the ossuary. An area after a half-collapsed wall, close to that central room with the guards and the camera. The atmosphere was creepy. Then I read your "WTF WERE THOSE THINGS" and decided to nope the fuck out of there. I'm still too easily creeped out to go into an area like this :D

 

[Unkillable Cat]

For the painting:

Spoiler

Check out Fly Hammerite's pad.

The stuff in the attic - yes.

And as for "that" place - that's the one. I didn't find anything there except some loot, and nothing happens until you try to grab it. I got out on the first try because I had explored every corner and found a hiding spot.

 

[skacky]

Sewer note: You can find and even enter the last location.

The thing with TG is that it doesn't have a carry-over script, hence why your equipment doesn't carry over to the next mission. Keep in mind splitting the mission wasn't originally planned so we had to make do with what we had. It feels gamey as hell but that was the best solution. Getting Garrett captured or making him lose his stuff would've been out of character imo.
Anyway, I consider my FM a success if Unkillable Cat likes it, so I'm quite happy.

Spoiler

Dunno if you guys have read the readme file, but these missions are essentially a remake of the brothel mission from Thi4f.

 

[JarlFrank]

Spoiler

Unkillable Cat, since you finished the first mission already, how do I get out of the tunnel system? I found a mysterious key and got into a... very psychedelic area, but that doesn't lead anywhere. There's just a golden skull there and a little effect when you pick it up, that's all. And the area looks like you're on an acid trip lol. Where's the exit to the brothel? skacky

 

[skacky]

JarlFrank

Spoiler

The exit is close to the area where two guards talk about missing sewer workers. You shouldn't be able to miss it as we made it very very obvious.

 

[JarlFrank]

JarlFrank

Spoiler

The exit is close to the area where two guards talk about missing sewer workers. You shouldn't be able to miss it as we made it very very obvious.

Spoiler

Then I'm either blind/deaf/retarded or knocked the two guys out and can't remember where they were. Any hints to their location, as in landmarks close to them? I've been to the "mysterious key" drug-trip area (is that the third area mentioned in the note that mentions ossuary and spider lair?), area with a camera where the ossuary is nearby and a drop down to the water reservoir thingie, and the area where you can find the mysterious key... there's another door there I can't pick or open).

 

[skacky]

JarlFrank

Spoiler

Go back to the thieves/smugglers' area where you found the mysterious key and look around. You should find a dead guard clad in red and gold in one of the side rooms with a key next to him. Grab it and open the rusty metal door at the end of the corridor leading to the big circular room with the water basin and a patrolling thief.

Also yes, the acid trip area is the last area mentioned in the letter to the sewer worker.

 

[JarlFrank]

Thanks!

Unkillable Cat

Spoiler

For the last area, you need to find this mysterious key. Go to a place where there is a seemingly unreachable bridge overhead. Check for rope arrow spots.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Just found the area...



Haplo and his "Acid Trip" can take a running jump off a tall building now.

That got my loot count up to 89.4% but I'm still curious about the rest. I'm also curious about the apartment where "Ramirez" is patrolling, is that bookcase a door or just a bookcase?

EDIT: That this work "borrows" its idea from a particular place doesn't surprise me in the least - in fact it reminds me of an idea I pitched to skacky a while back. Seems he took the basic idea (showing that Thief is better than Thiaf) and ran off with it.

Good.

 

[JarlFrank]

skacky, what kind of DromEd magic did you have to do to make the "acid trip" room? :D
I'm playing around with DromEd and am still at the very basics, and it really interests me how people implement weird effects like that.

 

[skacky]

I did not make the room. Ask FireMage.
Unkillable Cat that bookcase can be opened. Look around.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

While browsing through the TTLG thread for the Chalice of Souls, I found this:

I'm now almost ready to move on to the second mission, but there's still a mystery (or perhaps two) I want to solve. Theres a "Hallucinatus gas" room in the sewers, but I can't open it. Reading the thread on rpgcodex suggests I need to find a "mysterious key" somewhere in the area of the sewers controlled by the thieves, but I can't find it anywhere.

Seems this little corner of the Codex is going places...

 

[Melan]

Crossposting from TTLG and the TDM forums...

The Chalice of Souls by Feuillade Industries (Firemage, skacky and Squadafroin)

Continuing from a series including Shadow Politics, Within These Dark Walls and Endless Rain, this two-part Thief Gold mission sends Garrett in search of a hidden high-class brothel hidden somewhere beneath the City's streets, then even further to find the sinister magical chalice of the month (after the Cylix of Jortul, the Grail of Regrets and various other evil cups, one would think he would learn, but apparently not). The two missions are thus in fact four: a city, a sewer system, an abandoned Keeper sanctuary converted into a brothel, and the hidden, partially flooded parts of the sanctuary. These were made by different authors, are neatly separated, and differ in both style and execution.

The city part is the strongest section of the mission. Contrary to one's initial instincts associating it with skacky, the info file says most of the work is Squadafroin, who has created something really surreal and dreamlike. It has a deceivingly small footprint (there is a high-resolution map you can print out, always a plus), but instead of spreading out, it goes up... and then up and up some more. Like impossibly high mountains of stone, the mission ranges from snow-covered streets and a frozen over canal to aeries at dizzying heights. Opening a door and coming across a view of several balconies, rooftops and chimneys spreading out below you is something magical, something quintessentially Thief. You will travel across this roofscape on various routes, breaking into places ranging from the attic of a curio collector to the penthouse apartment of a cardinal, uncovering tons of dirty laundry along the way. This is more about finding a way forward and less about dealing with AI, although there are some very challenging sneaking puzzles (the most evil including a noble lady and a guard in an almost perfectly lit environment). A weakness of the map is found in its semi-linearity: the rooftop routes, while fun, are largely uni-directional, with only a few detours on the way. It is a hell of a ride, and it would perhaps be rude to expect more... but the feeling is still there.

The sewers are well-planned, apparently being largely Firemage's work. They are inhabited by various factions of AI in an uneasy truce, and they hide a few nasty surprises as well. While building sewers is rather more technically easy than building a fantastic cityscape, it takes talent to build an enjoyable one. Sewer levels are the monotonous, reviled outcasts of computer games (Thieves Guild from Thief Gold doesn't enjoy a particularly good reputation), but not here. The mission's sub-plots are the most fascinating here, and there are not just clever and interesting exploration opportunities, but it all looks varied and cool - there are rusting bits of machinery chugging on down in the tunnels, different recognisable architectural styles, backstabbing and intrigue, and a wonderful feeling of decay and rot. More than that, this part is pleasantly non-linear - there are different paths to choose, all with their own kind of challenges and surprises.

The underground brothel, mostly skacky's work, is a reimagination of The House of Blossoms, a justly despised Thief 4 mission. Unfortunately, the curse lingers, as this section is very good-looking (a combination of gaudy richness and decay), but severely flawed to the point of unpleasantness. The brothel is set up as an interconnected set of mostly very well lit rooms, decked out in tile with occasional strips of carpet. These are known tension-building devices. Difficulty spikes and a bit of frustration are an integral part of Thief, but here, it becomes too much. Tile and metal surfaces slow player movement to a crawl, and makes navigation really frustrating. It does not help that there are several AI walking around on heavily overlapping patrol routes, so you can almost always expect someone to either be in the area to prevent you from moving (since they would hear/see you due to the generous light and the tile surfaces), or spoil your move when they come across you unexpectedly. To make it all the more infuriating, the doorways are covered by heavy red curtains, which look good, but obstruct your vision while letting the AI look through them. So, here is the list:

• tile and lots of tile
• light
• interlocking patrols
• open layout
• obstructed vision

I know there are gameplay wizards who can deal with that, but it made me resentful and displeased in the end. Additionally, while nice to look at, I feel that the story is the weakest here.

The final segment (also by skacky) is an increasingly grandiose underground Keeper library, reconstructing the feel and iconic locations of some of the Thief games' Keeper-related cutscenes and environments (it is very interesting to compare it to Ink and Dust and Calendra's Legacy, both of which try something similar). This is again mostly exploration-focused, maybe just a little too empty, and maybe getting the final object is a little bit anti-climactic, since it is just "there" somewhere. But after the brothel, it is a welcome change of pace and difficulty, and it looks very, very good..

Judging a contest mission is always tricky due to the time pressure (and sometimes special rules) involved. This is much more than your regular contest mission; in fact, it is extremely ambitious even as a standalone entry. You will find some of Thief's most breathtaking things here, especially in the city section (which inevitably raises your expectations to physical and other heights it and its followups cannot realistically match), and I wonder how Thief's designers would react if they saw it in motion. But sometimes, it is too ambitious and tries just a bit too hard.

 

[skacky]

Thorough and fair review. Like I said on TTLG, the brothel was made pretty damn hard on purpose so this is no surprise the reception seems to be mixed. While it is based on the way-too-easy brothel mission from Thi4f, the mission layout is entirely different. Some of the things are pretty close (like the secret passage in the Madame's office, the glyphs and the towers in the caverns) but other than that it's completely different. The fact that it's a bit underwhelming is mostly because of contest time limit and general burn out (we had been working on it for a month straight).

And yeah Squadafroin is a damn talented builder. He's been working with me for more than a year on various missions and his stuff is minblowing, even better than what's in the city bit in this mission. He builds some of the darkest, most rundown cityscapes that could make Sperry jealous (while I usually do more posh city bits). Seeing our two styles in the same city section is definitely interesting.

Here, just for fun. Can you guess which part is mine and which part is his?
http://imgur.com/a/VFh6A

 

[Dev_Anj]

Here, just for fun. Can you guess which part is mine and which part is his?
http://imgur.com/a/VFh6A

From your description of his building style, the bottom one is his and the top one is yours. The bottom one seems more stoic and darker than the top one.

 

[Melan]

That would be my tip as well, although there are other signs which point in your direction: the arch styles in the top shot are all yours, andalong with a few more texture choices, the trim texture on the leftmost bridge is mine (it was originally intended to be some kind of recess, but it makes for a nice, visually satisfying parapet). However, if I was told these were both screenshots from your new mission, I wouldn't blink an eye.

Has Squadafroin released a mission before?

 

[JarlFrank]

Currently at the brothel, and finding it a little frustrating at times, too, especially since I seem to have a similar issue as Unkillable Cat: knocked out bodies in a dark area in a corner are somehow visible to the AI, it seems. Either that, or they just notice that NPCs who should be there are missing? I knock out some bodies close to the beginning area, put them into a shadowy corner, and everyone seems to notice.

 

[DrKubiac]

Has Squadafroin released a mission before?

None that I'm aware of. He's been around the french community for years, maybe tried a couple things with dromed, but never released a mission by himself. He started actively working on dromed with Skacky I think, he lacks experience and makes a few beginner's mistakes, but he does have good ideas overall.

When I betatested the mission, the brothel was even more frustrating, skacky fixed a couple issues but it's still very hard. I wonder how a ghoster would handle it. However the whole thing still is excellent.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

I wonder how a ghoster would handle it.