Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[Sceptic]

I don't know. I've never tried the SNES ports. I think the SNES ports changed some of the dungeon levels in some of the games (I remember.... I think a couple of Wiz 1 levels? from Crooked Bee's LP). IIRC the PSX version uses the originals.

 

[Gragt]

The PSX versions have PC ports, and there are language fan patches for both.

Soliton ported their Llylgamyn Saga (Wizardry 1 to 3) on PC, PSX, and Saturn. The Saturn and PSX versions are the same but the PC port is a different beast, and sadly not for the best. The interface uses an antiquated and annoying "windows within window" scheme, which is strangely reminiscent of Mordor for Windows 3.1, and the dungeon view is different and lack animation. The PSX version is fullscreen and the dungeon view is fully animated, with music and sounds. I'd even say that the interface of the PSX version mimics that of the original version, except that it is made to be controlled by a pad rather than keyboard shortcuts.

New Age of Llylgamyn (Wizardry 4 & 5) on the other hand is only available for PSX. It seems they did not bother to port it to PC this time.

To give an idea, here's a screenshot of what the PSX/Saturn version looks like (apparently unfiltered):

And here's the PC version:

Personally I recommend to stick with the PSX version if you want to use these, if only because the interface is much nicer—and as I wrote earlier in the thread all the text from the original versions is available in English with a simple change in the option menu. But if you want to use the PC version of Llylgamyn Saga, check the translation patch there: http://twpa.net/twpa/llylsaga/index.html

 

[I_am_Ian]

Every time this thread is active I get the urge to replay wiz 8 again. I was hoping that amidst all the coming incline that we would eventually get an updated Wizardry of some kind but it doesn't seem to be happening.

Grimoire is the only chance. Unless there is another game I'm missing?

 

[Sceptic]

New Age of Llylgamyn (Wizardry 4 & 5) on the other hand is only available for PSX. It seems they did not bother to port it to PC this time.l

They did, I have the ISO and the English translation patch.

Thanks for pointing out all the differences though, never realised the PC port changes so many things. I'll have to hunt down an ISO of the PSX version and try it out next time I get the urge to replay Wiz 1-5.

 

[Gragt]

Interesting, I never found any trace of that PC port. But if it's like the first one, I'd rather play the PSX version as I find it much nicer; the interface feels tigther than the PC port.

 

[Sceptic]

Interesting, I never found any trace of that PC port.

I got it from Underground Gamer, they were my source of bizarre and obscure versions of games that I didn't even know existed. I've never seen it anywhere else, and information about it is almost nonexistent, I think the SNES and the PSX versions were always more popular. It doesn't seem like you have much interest in it, but if you do send me a PM and I'll figure out some way to get you a copy.

 

[Gragt]

Ah, UG…. You are sorely missed.

 

[DraQ]

Goddamn that was an old post you revived there, DraQ.

Bwuh? Shows up as yesterday.

Uh..? Have you never experienced this? After i found out that mobs level scale in wiz8 i was usually trying to pass the route from monastery to arnika with maximally low lever party as i knew that monsters would spawn according to my level, which means a lot of trouble if you have aprox level 8 party at that point (which you usually have).
So this one time i entered Arnika at lvl 4 or something. There were savant minions (those fat furry dudes, you know) and android berserkers or what was the highest rank androids anyway. I rushed to forums to find out wtf and it appears that if you enter Arnika underleveled (game expects you to be at least 5-8 level at that point) the game gets confused and spawns the max level mobs at you from the get go. And they don't get away even after you exit/re-enter Arnika. Didn't you know that?

I don't think I've ever entered Arnika at lvl 4.
Hell, I'm not sure I ever exited monastery below lvl 5.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

I recently started playing Wiz8 for the first time. I avoided Wizardry games before because I wanted to finish JA2 first since I tried to get into it 3 times. JA2 is a good game but fighting soldiers, capturing cities, training militia, resting, ordering stuff online, carrying stuff over and over again gets repetitive with nothing to make it less bland besides fighting worms and tigers.
I rolled a Drake fighter, a Felpur samurai, a human priestess, a human gadgeteer, a Mook psionic and a Faerie mage. So far the drake is just great, he has high damage (especially when berserking) and his breath attack makes it easier to deal with groups, priestess is a rather meh first-line warrior but her spells and especially the prayer ability (free spell) are very useful, mage is nuking hard like she should. I have my doubts about psionic, right now he provided some support with his debuffs but is generally inferior to the mage, I took him mostly because I had nobody with high senses and psionics rely on senses, he also provides support with mythology and communication since they they rely on senses and inteligence and are his class abilities. Gadgeteer is meh, he provides ranges support and deals with locks but I didn't find anything that would let his engineering ability shine, I'm still in the monastery though. Now, there is Samurai. I took him mostly because it's exotic to have samurai in traditional wRPG. He's basically useless. Everything he does is standing in front row taking damage, ant dealing mediocre (compared to fighter's) damage, he didn't use his trademark lightning strike even once. Does he get better after getting spells or later? I'm thinking about starting the game with some other caster-hybrid. I'm paricularly interested with a Dwarf monk, the manual advertised him as being a great tank due to combining both dwarf's and monk's defence bonuses. Is it worth it?

You picked only two classes that I'd consider begginer-friendly (fighter and mage) and you also picked two that are among the weaker ones (psionic and priest). Other good ones are rogue, bard and valkyrie. I think fighter, rogue, valkyrie, bard, mage is the best setup for a newcomer - that gives you a front line that is extremely strong offensively and defensively, two most important spell schools (wizardry and divinity) covered, great support and utility skill character that can also be a competent meele/ranged fighter in bard and you still have sixth slot left for a more exotic class you want to try out.

That said, every class and every party in Wiz8 can become good, you just need to be patient. Few notes for samurai: if you larp him using weaboo swords then you need to savescum for them, you might also consider using shield - the wakizashi is the only offhand sword in the game and both basic and magic version of it is kinda bad and only gives an increased critical threat as the dmg is basically negligible, also, dual weapons hinders characters at the start.

 

[TigerKnee]

I was hoping that amidst all the coming incline that we would eventually get an updated Wizardry of some kind but it doesn't seem to be happening.

Grimoire is the only chance. Unless there is another game I'm missing?

I think Wiz's deep character building mechanics means it's harder to tackle for a rebirth compared to other, more simplified blobbers.

I do wish that Codex had acquired all the Stones of Arnhelm docs though. I would kill to get my hands on them.

 

[DraQ]

You picked only two classes that I'd consider begginer-friendly (fighter and mage) and you also picked two that are among the weaker ones (psionic and priest).

Blah.

Any basic caster is noob friendly.
Psionic has Haste, Insanity and Hypnotic Lure, plus a whole slew of good status and direct damage spells from the realm many things are susceptible to.
Priest doesn't shine in combat, but can survive in melee and really helps the rest of the party not die due to beginner's errors.

In terms of noob-friendliness:
(fighter == rogue == bard == any basic caster == valkyrie) > (ranger == monk == 2school bishop) > (samurai == gadgeteer) >> lord > 4school bishop > ninja.

Few notes for samurai: if you larp him using weaboo swords then you need to savescum for them, you might also consider using shield - the wakizashi is the only offhand sword in the game and both basic and magic version of it is kinda bad and only gives an increased critical threat as the dmg is basically negligible, also, dual weapons hinders characters at the start.

You can also consider staff as offhand weapon if you have points to spare. There are some neat offhand staves and you can then use Zatoichi Bo as secondary weapon to scratch your caster's back.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Psionic is not noob friendly, most frail of the classes, has no exclusive essential spells, is poor in the initial parts of the game.

Actually mage as a noob friendly class is a bit of a stretch, but I put it there because of skill point distribution, easiness of getting powercast, the fact that wizardry is the most balanced spell school and the water freezing spell that he can get quite early on is best thing since sliced bread for someone who plays this game for the first time.

 

[DraQ]

Psionic is not noob friendly, most frail of the classes, has no exclusive essential spells, is poor in the initial parts of the game.

Actually mage as a noob friendly class is a bit of a stretch, but I put it there because of skill point distribution, easiness of getting powercast, the fact that wizardry is the most balanced spell school and the water freezing spell that he can get quite early on is best thing since sliced bread for someone who plays this game for the first time.

Psionic can have stuff like mindstab or paralysis from the get-go, which can win battles with stuff like hogar that would otherwise rape party fresh out of monastery.
Psionic also gets insanity almost from the get go.
Psionic will get powercast almost as early as mage while arguably benefitting more from it because of status effects, is just as frail physically, trades mage's slight bonus resistances for mindfuck immunity, tends to have nice ini and can cast sane mind, which together is a lifesaver when your fighter gets mindfucked and starts raping partymembers.
Lastly psionic's realms point allocation is no-brainer - full mental, some air or fire if there's anything left, with mental magic also not being commonly resisted.

Bard can compensate for mage's freezing spells, and mage's essential spells are low level and can be just as well contributed by a samurai.

Meanwhile, while mage is going to impotently fire nuclear blast at highly resistant enemies (such as Rapax), psionic will just keep unleashing ever more impressive waves of mindrape.
The scant areas where psionic's mindrape is resisted are populated by stuff against which psionic's defensive spells are more than useful, those same areas also tend to make mages useless in general.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

None of the things you mentioned is exclusive for psionic (apart from 100% mental effects resistance). When talking about beginner friendliness of classes you need to stress the earlier part of the game, because later on: 1. player learns; 2. every class can become gud. Psionics have almost nothing going for them early on, they drop like flies, noone will use mental status effects on them, healing and paralysis can be handled by other classes and insanity is not as good as freezing + insanity instrument is found way earlier than freezing instruments, before psionic gets his best spell (haste) and learns to cast it on high dice you'll probably find the drums for it as well. So you can't even make an argument that works for other weak caster class, the priest, that can actually cast two most important spells on high dice earlier than you can supplement them with gadget/instrument. Then again, it's a rather academic discussion, since none of the caster classes are even remotely useful early when compared to rogue or fighter.

 

[Sinatar]

Every time this thread is active I get the urge to replay wiz 8 again. I was hoping that amidst all the coming incline that we would eventually get an updated Wizardry of some kind but it doesn't seem to be happening.

Grimoire is the only chance. Unless there is another game I'm missing?

Elminage Gothic is coming out soonish. It's very very Wizardry, though of the Wizardry 1 - 5 variety.

 

[Invictus]

I agree with DraQ; psionics are very useful for starting players especialy since the chances of hiting and the damage imput of new chars is simply pathetic till they hit at least 20 in their primary weapon skill. Using the bard's instruments (especialy good if it is a female bard with the stamina regeneration charm) gives you unlimited status effects like sleep and fear almost from the get go in the monastery and adding to this the mind spells from the psonic not only gets your out of trouble with the mobs that often try to surround you, but actualy gives your melee chars a much needed help in actualy hitting enemies.
I found offensive magic to be severly gimped in Wiz 8 at least in the beggining but the status effect spells were a godsend and the best choice for those are psonics and bards

 

[DraQ]

they drop like flies

So do mages.

noone will use mental status effects on them

Not if party get hits by an AoE one (insanity, psi blast, mind flay). Then it's good to have someone who can act instead of drooling, especially if this someone acting is all that can prevent party's fighter from sheathing Bloodlust in mage's ass.

insanity is not as good as freezing

Depends. If you have good melee and can use it then freezing is better. If you're in proverbial deep shit, then enemies cutting each other up can help a lot. Besides a lot of heavy hitters are weak to mental magic, OTOH quite a few resist water.

 

[Invictus]

One of the things I didn't like in Wiz 8 is that psonics are only for that class; in Wiz 7 you could switch to monk for a failry deadly combo. I don't recall what magic they do n Wiz 8

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

They still have the psi book.

psionics are very useful for starting players especialy since the chances of hiting and the damage imput of new chars is simply pathetic till they hit at least 20 in their primary weapon skill.

Not really, rogue or fighter will be chopping up the mobs from the get go and long before any caster learns to properly cast spells on higher dice.

 

[DraQ]

I don't recall what magic they do n Wiz 8

Umm... Psionics?

Apart from magic-deprived RFS-81 monks cast psionic spells.

Not really, rogue or fighter will be chopping up the mobs from the get go and long before any caster learns to properly cast spells on higher dice.

Rogue or fighter will be doing much better job chopping, with enchanted blades, the mobs whose one half is paralyzed, and the other insane and chopping themselves.

It's a party game, it's about classes cooperating to do much better job than they would alone, rather than competing directly, and psionics make great party members from get go.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

Nice optimal party discussion, I must say that psionic is indeed very useful ATM. Insanity usually disables about half of the brigands that keep pestering me and unlike sleep I don't have to worry about waking them up with AOE spells. The Samurai finally deicided to start being useful when getting to the city, but his magic is a bit meh right now, not very surprising since I completely disregarded his intelligence in early game. Are there more choices if I decided to keep using two-weapons but not necessarily weapoo-swords? Daggers seem to be a good choice since there obviously should be good daggers later in game for classes unable to use better weapons.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Daggers are decent for increased crit threat, but not for samurai as he can't use them (I mean the ones that are good).

Oh, and unless you cheese or overlevel then hybrid's magic will remain as a support addition only for the vast majority of the game and you shouldn't really think about it as anything else. Yo don't even need it that much for your samurai as you have a pure mage. Do not invest in int for a samurai, totally not worth it.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Just keep it up with swords. TWF isn't that big of a deal.
If you want more one hit kills, invest in critical strike.
If you want more straight up damage, invest in strength and speed and dex. Those three stats pretty much rule it all.

 

[Siveon]

Speaking of the PSX versions, I just made PSP eboots of them (except 6) that also includes a shitty homemade manual with the spell descriptions.

If anyone wants it, I'll just reply with a link.

 

[TigerKnee]

Monks still get their Psionic spellbook in Wiz8.

It's just that the Wiz8 spellcasting system really penalizes offensive spellcasting, especially for hybrid classes when compared to 6 and 7. Makes the Samurai a lot less fun.

Plus Monks have some serious MAD issues. I think the only race that has passable stats for a Monk for both fighting and casting support spells are probably just Humans.

If anyone wants it, I'll just reply with a link.

Sure, I would love to have a copy of those eBoots.