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The Valve and Steam Platform Discussion Thread

LESS T_T

Arcane
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
13,582
Codex 2014
In today's episode of Steam Wonderland...:



ss_ab6ee7cd2aef2225a897feb56d9071d2e4111372.600x338.jpg



The year is 1944, alternative history of WW2.
The Nazis are going to commit the first combat launch of FAU-2. The USSR and the USA got a concrete intel about the position of the missile and its technical data. The weapon of hell is hidden somewhere inside a german fortress, called "The Beast".
Infiltrate the facility and find all the possible data about the missile and the unit itself to prevent the end.

Features:
-Oldschool like gameplay
-Various enemies and weapons
-Many game levels



header.jpg





More than 300 achievements for your game progress.

BS4small.png

...and for your propaganda in profile page.





Release Date: May 1, 1986
 

Unkillable Cat

LEST WE FORGET
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Codex 2014 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy
Alter Ego coming to Steam is a pleasant surprise, but the other titles LESS T_T mentioned are utter garbage waiting for Cease & Desist takedowns.
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Updated analysis: http://www.pcgamer.com/steam-sale-dates/

How long does it take games to be cheap on Steam?
We dug through years of Steam sale data to determine how quickly most games hit 33%, 50%, and 75% off.

Seven months. That's about how long it'll take for this year's biggest games to hit a 50 percent discount. Sometimes it happens faster; it took Deus Ex: Mankind Divided only about three months for a Steam sale to cut its price in half. For some games, it takes a bit longer—Grand Theft Auto 5 lasted nearly a year and a half. But if half price is your magic number for buying a new game, expect to wait about seven months for it to enter your sights.

How do we know this? By digging into the last few years of pricing data on Steam, we found a number of clear trends regarding the average time-to-discount across hundreds of games. After grouping games according to price and popularity, consistent patterns emerged, and from these we calculated a few handy rules to keep in mind next time a new release threatens to drain your Steam Wallet.

This article was originally published in 2016 and has been updated to correspond with the latest Steam Summer Sale.

What we learned
Popular big-budget AAA games get a 50% discount after an average of 7 months: expect to wait this long for your Witchers and your Fallouts.

Breakout indie games take a longer 9.2 months to hit 50%, on average: these include your Rocket Leagues and your Undertales, and typically launch at around $20.

The less popular a game is, the faster it will be discounted: for games in the $30+ category, the least commercially-successful dropped in price 60% faster than the bestsellers.

The takeaway
As we noted earlier, sub-$30 games are significantly less consistent in their discounts than $30+ games, as evidenced by the higher estimates for the low tiers of both the 50% and 75% discounts. That unpredictability leads to the counter-intuitive conclusion that more expensive games drop in price quicker than their cheaper counterparts.

Again, though, this is likely due to the lack of sales data and marketing experience of the independent developers and publishers constituting the sub-$30 category, or the decision-making processes large corporations. In practical terms, this means we can be more confident in the next Call of Duty hitting $30 around 7 months after release than the next Stardew Valley dropping to half-price after 9 months.

Popularity has a clear and consistent effect on averages for $30+ games, with the less commercially successful games dropping in price approximately 60% faster than the bestsellers. For sub-$30 games, meanwhile, the relationship between popularity and time-to-discount is weak. The combination of low price and limited audience leads to these games holding their value for longer, reflecting the different financial expectations independent developers often have compared to big AAA publishers. Couple that with the fact that smaller studios typically lack comprehensive sales and marketing data to guide their discounting strategies, and it becomes considerably harder to accurately predict their price drops. Keep that in mind if your prospective purchase falls into this category.

Given all the outcry following the removal of flash sales, it's interesting to see that, though some 2014 averages are indeed lower than 2015 and 2016, there are also some that trend much higher. Flash sales created a market of unpredictability, especialy among sub-$30 games.

From a consumer perspective, flash sales benefited only certain games released close to the Summer and Winter sales, and even then you had to be paying constant attention to not miss the brief window of opportunity to snap up a deal.

There we have it: a discount gamer's guide to Steam. The next time a new release piques your interest but your Steam wallet's a little light, you'll have a good idea of how long to hunker down in your spoiler-free bunker before the discounts hit. And hey, maybe you can use that time to chip away at that mountainous backlog we've all amassed? I mean, when else are you going to play that copy of Bad Rats?
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Messages
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
http://www.pcgamer.com/steam-review-bombing-is-working-and-chinese-players-are-a-powerful-new-voice/

Steam review bombing is working, and Chinese players are a powerful new voice
Flooding Steam reviews has become a popular form of protest, and now Chinese players are using reviews to demand localization.

In early April, just a month and a half after it released on consoles and two weeks after it launched on Steam, action-RPG Nier: Automata passed a million sales. Despite a few performance issues on PC, Nier launched to acclaim and racked up thousands of positive reviews. It was the surprise hit of the year until PlayerUnknown's Battlegrounds, and a wonderful success for quirky director Yoko Taro (whose previous few games combined likely sold less than Automata did in a month). And then, on April 28, this happened:

1,113 negative reviews slammed Nier's Steam page in a single day, essentially doubling the total number of negative reviews overnight. That's not enough to sink a game like Nier, but it is enough to drop its ‘recent reviews’ from positive to ‘mixed’ in early May. What happened? Why the sudden rush of negativity? On April 27, Square Enix released Nier: Automata in Asia—without Chinese language support. And hours after release, they doubled the price in China. It turns out that's a really, really good way to piss off thousands of players.

Review bombing isn't a new on Steam; we first saw the power of a flood of negative reviews back in 2015, when Valve briefly tried to roll out paid mods for The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim. But the reaction to Nier: Automata is indicative of changes in the power structure of the Steam community.

By users, China is now Steam's third largest country, with around 17 million, behind only the United States and Russia. But by bandwidth consumed, China is actually in second place, swallowing up nearly 10 percent of Steam's total traffic (the US accounts for 19.7 percent, Russia only 5.8 percent). It's a huge audience, and it's growing quickly. This presents PC developers a huge opportunity to sell games to millions of players they couldn't reach just a few years ago. But that opportunity comes with new risks, too.

Tried-and-true review bombing
Even without tapping into a whole new audience in China, developers in 2017 have to keep in mind the possibility that their game could be review bombed for any number of reasons. Maybe a political or social issue will draw an angry mob; maybe gamers will voice complaints about a glaring performance issue or a price they consider unfair.

We've seen two high profile cases of this in just the last month. Take a look at the recent reviews for Grand Theft Auto 5 and Crusader Kings 2.

If you've been following the news, you'll recall GTA5 publisher Take-Two decided to shut down popular mod tool OpenIV, racking up about 35,000 negative reviews in a few days. Crusader Kings 2 accrued just a few hundred negative reviews over Paradox's decision to raise the prices of its games in some regions. In both cases, Rockstar and Paradox backpedaled after an overwhelmingly negative response.

Did those negative reviews actually affect sales of either game? Hard to say for sure, but probably not—both have already sold loads of copies. "On the per-game basis, it seems that review bombing doesn't hurt short-term sales much," writes Sergey Galyonkin, creator of SteamSpy. "Payday 2 sold more in the month after the [2015 microtransaction] controversy than in the month before, but they had a pretty big discount :) And Ark sold twice as more in the month after the review bombing [over its expansion] than in the month before despite having a smaller discount during that period and no F2P event. Of course, this kind of reaction is usually because of the diminished players' trust in the game, but it's something that is hard to measure."

As Galyonkin says, damage to community goodwill is likely the bigger concern. And directly commenting on the actions of an angry fanbase is a touchy subject; unsurprisingly, the developers and publishers I reached out to for comment who have experienced Steam review bombing either declined to talk or did not respond.

For many gamers, leaving a negative Steam review is the only actionable way to make their voices heard. It's more direct, and likely more effective, than tweeting or posting on a message board. The system may be abusable, but in some cases it's working as intended: players are simply commenting on a game and giving prospective buyers valuable information. And Valve has taken steps to limit some potential issues with the system by removing reviews tied to free copies from a game's overall score.

Another change to Steam has also had a large positive impact: refunds. "Refunds are so great," says Lars Doucet, the developer of tower defense game Defender's Quest. "Now that they have refunds, if someone hates my game, they're going to ask for a refund, and usually the grumpiness that they would have directed at a review gets shouted into the refund system instead. Now I don't have an angry player, and the angry player gets their money back and isn't angry any more and probably doesn't feel like they have to post a nasty review (some will still do it, but not most). I have a separate channel for reading messages from people who wanted refunds, which is now where most of the really nasty comments go. That's fine. They can stay there. This system doesn't solve everything but it was a major plus for both developers and players in my eyes."

Doucet frequently blogs about Steam on a variety of topics, offering up some great data analysis and savvy commentary on Steam's Discovery system, reviews, the Controller, and more. Though Defender's Quest has a 97 percent positive rating on Steam, I thought Doucet would have some insight into review bombing, generally. He pointed out one issue he's written about before, with suggested improvements to how Valve sorts games based on user ratings. If Valve did improve its sorting, that could, potentially, change the visibility of some games on Steam with fewer reviews but higher positive percentages. And that could, in turn, make review bombing a more powerful tool.

I also asked if he thought review bombing was a result of the review system working as intended, or if there's a better way for players to make their voices heard.

"Obviously as a developer the idea of being flooded with a torrent of hate over something players didn't like makes me super scared, especially when it's not something 'merely' personal like your twitter feed, it's my store page which has a direct connection to my livelihood," he says. "However, it's hard for me to feel too sorry for a big AAA company that does something obviously tone deaf and anti-consumer and pays a public price for it. At the same time, if you're a small developer and you catch that storm you're fielding that red hot fire with your own face, and these mobs can get really nasty. The one limiting factor here is, unlike in a Twitter mob, the only person who has a right to leave a review is someone who's paid for your game [on Steam]."

Doucet said that there's a trade-off with that new requirement, since developers who work to build an audience outside of Steam, through a Kickstarter, for example, lose out on the value of those positive reviews. "On balance, I will make the trade—I prefer being slightly less vulnerable to random hate mobs who just happen to have bundle keys for my game over boosting my user reviews with crowdfunding keys. Others feel differently, of course. I think if they smoothed out the hard thresholds using the Wilson score method [mentioned in his article on reviews], this tension wouldn't be as sharp."

Doucet has also written about the huge opportunities for indie developers in the Chinese market, which brings us back to the original topic. On top of these concerns, which have been building on Steam over the past few years, developers now have to consider the dangers of releasing a game in China without localization.

China is now too big to ignore
In October 2016, Chinese players filed hundreds of negative reviews against Football Manager 2017 protesting the lack of a Chinese localization. Some of the anger stemmed from comments made by the studio's director five years earlier, saying more sales in China would justify a localization. More anger came from the developer's decision to make community translations part of the game's Steam Workshop (it officially supported 16 languages at launch).

Publisher Sega stepped in after the outcry and announced a Chinese translation, which was released in April. On SteamSpy's review chart, you can see the jump in positive reviews and a decrease in negative reviews as some players reversed their earlier thumb down.

Still, many of the negative reviews remained; Football Manager 2017 still has a 44 percent positive overall rating on Steam. And the negative reviews didn't just affect FM2017; on the same days it was review bombed, so was Football Manager 2016.

Several Square Enix games suffered collateral damage after Nier: Automata's pricing debacle. Chinese players also review bombed Rise of the Tomb Raider on April 28, giving it negative reviews to punish Square Enix for Automata's price change in Chinese currency. It was the only significant spike in negative reviews after Rise of the Tomb Raider's first week of release.

Even more recently, Darkest Dungeon developer Red Hook launched the Crimson Court expansion and saw a smaller wave of criticism from a Chinese playerbase tired of waiting for a localization that had been talked about as far back as 2015 and still not materialized. (Darkest Dungeon has had a community-driven Chinese localization in progress for months, but it's not yet finished).

As always, it's hard to draw any real correlation between these negative reviews and a tangible impact on sales. It's a lesson all developers will soon have to take note of: If Chinese players are promised a localization, they expect it, and Steam reviews are how they’ll let you know.

With localization, Steam's rise in China could also be a new lifeline for smaller developers.

But with localization, Steam's rise in China could also be a new lifeline for smaller developers struggling to make a profit amid the dozens of games hitting Steam each day. Getting the pricing right for the region and properly localizing a game can be a huge windfall. As Doucet wrote about releasing games in China earlier this year:

"I have never had a localization pay for itself this quickly, not to mention this unambiguously… Of all the revenue Defender's Quest has earned from China on Steam in its entire lifetime, 45% of it was earned last week. That's right, we basically doubled our lifetime sales from China almost immediately!"

Of course, it's not quite that simple—there's no guarantee every game will be a smash hit in China, and there's not even a guarantee that Steam will even remain available in China. Games are routinely banned in China, but so far Steam has escaped government regulation, possibly due to Dota 2's popularity. Megacorporation Tencent is re-launching a Steam competitor in China in July, which could massively upset the PC market there. The only real constant here is how fast things are changing.

But as long as Steam exists in China, expect the Chinese audience's influence to grow. 17 million players and counting are hard to ignore.
 

Rahdulan

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I wish English-speaking players would band together to demand localization for older ROTTK and Nobunaga's Ambition titles.
 
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Drog Black Tooth

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Feb 20, 2008
Messages
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The bullshit Chinese reviews that literally consist of only 4 characters 没有中文 (no Chinese) and a thumbs down are fucking retarded, hate them almost as much as the recent 9999 negative reviews of Skyrim that all list the upcoming "paid mods" as the somehow critical flaw of a game released back in 2011.
 

Tom Selleck

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May 6, 2013
Messages
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The bullshit Chinese reviews that literally consist of only 4 characters 没有中文 (no Chinese) and a thumbs down are fucking retarded, hate them almost as much as the recent 9999 negative reviews of Skyrim that all list the upcoming "paid mods" as the somehow critical flaw of a game released back in 2011.
 

Don Peste

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Flooding Steam reviews has become a popular form of protest, and now Chinese players are using reviews to demand localization.
Let's review bomb this!


ABOUT THIS GAME
ss_f1f839b4c9a26ab8b702dc847e0687d26f15ffd5.jpg

First of all, my English is very poor.I'm sorry.I really feel bad about that.

I'm a keyboard man. The pursuit of happiness, the escape from pain is everything to me.

There is no level at all. It's a person who is daydreaming all day and thinks the dream is pretty good.

For me, the game is my second life....

I play all kinds of games, but I'm always annoyed by the wonderful stories of some works, and I get angry even when I'm unhappy,Then in order to vent their anger began to deliberately play games, while facing the NPC and cruel scourge while thinking about if the story is my own to do good.....

Originally, I have lived such a life without doubt for myself until.....

One day I had a dream. I had a very sad love story. It was only a dream, but I felt very sad.

So I remembered the dream and thought it was a love story of the world.....

But when I saw the story again, I found that it couldn't be any more common, and why was it that I was so unhappy and annoyed?! I don't understand...

After that, it took root in my heart like a seed. The longer it grew, the more I grew unhappy......

Then I found that I regret only exist in my actor dream, when I woke up I'll no longer be a hero, so this love story will become intense darkness without light in my eyes.

Having understood all this, I began to hate myself for being so unhappy and hating myself as a keyboard player.

Finally, I opened the software, made this little game to taunt myself, and wanted it to stay on the platform that the player knew all the time,That way I can think of all this humiliation and live a happier life.

Main slot points:

[small place] [press F5 to adjust the size of the game window]

1. you are a full level of the brave, please don't use their own skills to kill the brave [] Dutch act.

2., the main line is very free, you can finish the story first, then go to the task, there is a new dialogue,
But I suggest you go or go to those towns stroll, bubble sister, buy a bottle of blood what.

3. novice tutorial maze, there are four or five treasure boxes, remember to take.

4. Elven village needs to be defeated after a BOSS and is eligible for entry,
The hidden role of the two floor of the village head needs dialogue with the head of the village before repetition occurs.

5. pub just singing diva money pit, will give you a bonus BUFF.

6., even if you buy jewelry in the jewelry store, you can not equip, because you bring the protagonist aura.

7. likewise, all the shields you gain are not equipped, because you do not hold shields.

8. please do not try to flirt with the game, otherwise you will only keep GAME OVER.

9. [important] a world chosen to change.

There are three choices for the four heavenly kings:

1. test selection is the world of testing
The world is an unfinished test phase of the world, with only one ending. Except for BUG,
All aspects are very pit father! The map has not been completed, the various plots have no follow-up, and the battle is very pit.

2., the selection of the devil becomes a formal world, please play this
The two worlds, except maps, are all different settings.
The devil's world has a more complete map, more characters and plots, and more props and treasure chests.
You can also learn all kinds of magic and skills, and the heroine's plot is more, and there are not as many as fifteen characters.
Among them, there are Raiders of cute boys and not dirty Story 0
The world's monsters are completely different from the world of testing, becoming a hit.
And the world's various scenarios are free to choose, you can first complete the task, and then pick up the task,
No matter how you play, each will have a new plot dialogue. Of course, the ending is more.
And there are hidden allies who can help you defeat the final BOSS.

3. choosing a farm is a world of real endings, but you have to get two signals to get in.
Testers, the world and the devil, choose the world to get through, will get a password.
[without testing the world of the tester] [defeating the demon world, the last BOSS can also get two signals. ]
The world will not [and] let your eyes bright, because the two world is the third.

And there are many false endings in the world!

So I hope you can make a real ending.

In the end, there will be a reversal of the hidden content of the story.
Actually, I think most of us here are keyboard men with very poor English, too. Not so sure about the "escape from pain" part. I think it's more like a downward spiral for me.
 

Fedora Master

Arcane
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Edgy
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You can expect the industry to start catering to the Chinese fleshdrones in the future. It's a huge new market full of very good (read: clueless) consumers.
 

Alienman

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
You can expect the industry to start catering to the Chinese fleshdrones in the future. It's a huge new market full of very good (read: clueless) consumers.

Already a thing in movies. I watched the latest Kong movie and it had a character that was Chinese. She contributed absolutely nothing to the movie, except of course being Chinese.
 

gaussgunner

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If localization becomes mandatory, I'm out. I'm just a guy trying to make decent rpgs and ideally sell enough to keep making them full-time. I only need to reach a niche audience. In the unlikely event I achieve huge success in the English speaking market, I could consider adding other languages, but it's a ton of work. They call it localization because it's not just translation, it's extra layers in game code and dialogue files, flexible multi-line GUI elements for every piece of text, shit like that. It ends up looking like a generic website. So that's like 10x more work, or 100x when you're translating to a language that looks like random scribbles.

Also, translators suck. If you pay by the word they give you Google Translate copypasta. If you pay by the hour they do the same, while jacking off I guess. Plus they don't know shit about the subject matter. I guess fan translation mods would be best.
 
Self-Ejected

Drog Black Tooth

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If localization becomes mandatory, I'm out. I'm just a guy trying to make decent rpgs and ideally sell enough to keep making them full-time. I only need to reach a niche audience. In the unlikely event I achieve huge success in the English speaking market, I could consider adding other languages, but it's a ton of work. They call it localization because it's not just translation, it's extra layers in game code and dialogue files, flexible multi-line GUI elements for every piece of text, shit like that. It ends up looking like a generic website. So that's like 10x more work, or 100x when you're translating to a language that looks like random scribbles.
"Flexible multi-line GUI elements" is pretty much how the proper elegant solution should be, instead of hardcoding every single line because you can't be arsed to make your game more modular. And for Chinese (or other non-Latin languages) you'd only need to add Unicode support, which should be a no brainer nowadays. Basically you add support for Unicode fonts/characters, make sure all the text is easily accessible thru XML/whatever files and that's it.

But eh, I'm not the one making tons of excuses for my own stupidity.

Also, translators suck. If you pay by the word they give you Google Translate copypasta. If you pay by the hour they do the same, while jacking off I guess. Plus they don't know shit about the subject matter. I guess fan translation mods would be best.
Pay shitty money, get shitty translators. Get butthurt and blame everyone but yourself. Oh how typical. :lol:
 

gaussgunner

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"Flexible multi-line GUI elements" is pretty much how the proper elegant solution should be
Yes, but it's not very elegant in practice. I'd like to see you try it.

Pay shitty money, get shitty translators. Get butthurt and blame everyone but yourself. Oh how typical. :lol:
Show me otherwise. On a realistic budget. In a short timeframe between QA and release.

And I'm not butthurt, I'm just saying how it is.
 
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Drog Black Tooth

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Show me otherwise. On a realistic budget. In a short timeframe between QA and release.

And I'm not butthurt, I'm just saying how it is.

I've worked as a translator myself and it's a lot of work. Literary translation is an art form, to be frank. You're basically asking somebody to rewrite everything you've got while keeping the style, finding similar jokes, puns and cultural references in the target language, etc. Of course it's going to be rather expensive.

If you really want to do it on the cheap tho, your best bet is probably first hiring somebody to do a really rough translation and then asking a few native speakers to proofread and rewrite everything, yet still you'd probably lose quite a bit of nuances in the first draft.
 

gaussgunner

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I've worked as a translator myself and it's a lot of work. Literary translation is an art form, to be frank. You're basically asking somebody to rewrite everything you've got while keeping the style, finding similar jokes, puns and cultural references in the target language, etc. Of course it's going to be rather expensive.

Ok, you're not talking shit. :salute:
That's how I'd want it done, or not at all. Not half-assed and piecemeal by hundreds of different translators, the way most software is done.
 

Unkillable Cat

LEST WE FORGET
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Codex 2014 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy
You can have it done cheap, fast, or reliable. Any two.

My experience in the field of translations? The first two options are the preferred ones.

Forget about wordplay being translated properly, forget about prose or nuances, they want it translated fast and cheap. Everything else comes secondary. If the translation is poor, they just blame the translator (that they chose and hired) and move on to the next one. Repeat.

I see no reason why the gaming industry would want to do it differently. You want it translated properly? Do it yourself.
 

Unkillable Cat

LEST WE FORGET
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Codex 2014 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy
No, it's you that's summoning the argument by making idiotic comparisons. You're not even comparing apples and oranges, you've somehow moved on to apples and walnuts. Of course DIY isn't always the answer, but in this field it is.

I've been reading people here talking about translations should be done, and then I compare it to how translations are done, and pointing out the difference.

The good translations, the ones that people are asking for in this discussion, can rarely be created by an e-mail promising monetary commission and deadline for just another job. People actually have to sit down and do research, get familiar with the topic and get themselves into the proper mindset. This can take days, weeks or even months. Then they get to work, and depending upon how much text there is it'll take even more time. Which is my most translations done this way are not ready before the original work is released. It can take several years in the worst cases.

Now try making that work in the gaming industry where games have planned release dates two to three years ahead of time, milestone achievements with mandatory quality standards, and the inevitable fact that the final text is rarely ready even 2 months before release. It won't work out unless you have the translator on retainer and ready to keep up with the most minute changes in text... a prospect any budget manager will surely tell you is a Bad Idea.

Which is why there have been such strange events such as Harry Potter fans banding together to translate the books themselves into German in a matter of days, instead of the 3-4 months it normally took to do the job properly. Each person only worked on a page or two. Fortunately Rowling's books aren't known for prose or nuances, so they didn't have to spend time on such things.

Then there's the guy who translated Planescape: Torment into Portugese back in the day. He wasn't asked to do it, he did it himself in his spare time.

These, and countless more, realized exactly what I said before: If you want a good translation of something, the best solution is to do it yourself.

Just don't expect to be ever paid for it.
 

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