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The Random Adventure Game News Thread

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
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5,716
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California
Which raises two problems: either he knows the flaws yet was himself too incompetent or lazy to fix them.... or worse, he's harping on these sins because he's unable to identify problems that are even worse.
A more generous explanation, with regard to his older games, is that as he got more experienced and older, he realized the mistakes he was making. God knows that's true of me, even with respect to Primordia, where my work is relatively recent.

they weren't making *enough* of a profit
Agreed.

love Primorida, but it still feels short compared to The Secret of Monkey Island. It has less and worse voice acting than the talkie Lucas Arts games. And this one hurts the most to say--while the art is good, it's not quite on par with the VGA stage of Lucas Arts either. I bet if you had the art, voice acting, and marketing of say The Longest Journey (popular enough to "earn" a sequel with action elements and other assorted "fun"), Primordia would have sold much better
Agreed (except that I wouldn't use TLJ as a standard to aspire to, despite some interesting concepts). Hell, Primordia would've sold much better if, like, I hadn't put in the 99 problems line, we'd had another month of testing (such that, for example, the Clarity vs. Scraper scene had audio . . . seriously, WTF?), I'd relented on various annoying puzzles (most of which are now fixed), and we'd thrown one or two more rooms in. I'm in the process of doing one more pass through the game for a final patch, and while I'm pleasantly surprised by a lot of stuff (the variety of puzzle solutions, the custom quips for a huge variety of a random actions), other stuff stands out as really mediocre. The voice acting, which I remembered as very strong, is actually surprisingly weak, particularly in the smaller parts, but even with Logan's line readings, he often lisps and slurs words. I think the art is very, very strong, but has two significant problems: (1) Vic needed to do a handful more animations for mundane things, like picking up items at different heights. Almost every time two characters interact, and most times when a character interacts with the environment, they don't quite line up right, and it is jarring. (2) Vic's use of perspective is off in many of the scenes, which causes terrible scaling issues -- such as doors that characters are too tall to walk through, or bloated sprites. This is especially true in the UNNIIC interior rooms but crops up from time to time elsewhere. Other than that, I think the art is probably the best part of the game.

The problem wasn't cost - adventure games are a LOT cheaper to make than COD clones.
I mean, this is an empirical issue, and I'm probably wrong -- I'm just speculating without any data. But I think you're slipping eras here. The point at which adventure games were wilting was when FPS games weren't cinematic CODs, they were, like, pre-Half-Life stuff like Hexen. I think The Dig, Grim Fandango, those games were all pretty pricey to make.
 

Darth Roxor

Royal Dongsmith
Staff Member
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Stop wasting time posting and get back to working on another game, slacker.

Unless you want to become another vapourware developer devoted solely to posting in threads about Russia, like Vault Dweller :rpgcodex:
 

Maiandros

Learned
Possibly Retarded
Joined
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296
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Infinite Space
while i can see other factors being determinate, far as i am concerned the primary reason was company fault.

- adventure games got to be less and less about creative, imaginative and qualitative
[and more and more about harder (in often a illogical/unintuitive manner) because keep the player playing for longer, and pwettier]

they clogged their own market, slowly alienated it and eventually saturated it. Nothing to do with budgets, or the new kids on the block selling bigger. Just.. the equivalent of Herves doing the decision making, and the equivalent of morons creating them. Can well recall what i -then- thought of as the 'new' generation of adventures, such a distinct difference..
i remember a lot of years back purchasing some Sherlock Holmes adventure (one of the first, in Greece at least, to ship on CDs, all i can help you with) and thinking how the fuck is this an adventure? Just..head bashing..i remember Bethesda trying its hand, that big debut it did with a detective (to be series, they flopped and ended with just one of them) (i think) that was all surface and no depth. Could name so many more. Ah, yes, to name one last from Sierra this time, remember that one where you are being hunted, gotta run all the time? They spent an insane amount of time doing the camera work (holywood stuff) and...nothing else...souless

i know that's why i stopped bothering for a loong time, and i know i am not alone :)

and typically giving fuck all about who gets offended or not, my deepest regrets, but most of the current incline bearers have yet to convince me i am wrong. In terms of why this has remained niche. It's not "thinking iz teh hard" You want to tell yourselves that, but if that was so, chess would probably be extinct as a game by now. No.
In their case, it is entirely different a thing. I fail to "care", i fail to manage to get drawn in. In some titles, the developers' lack of education serves for poor ways of delivering content that in the hands of others could have been gold. In yet others, the gap in mentality/thinking between their (newer) generation and mine is very prominent, resulting in either mixed signals, or loss of coherence/empathy. In yet some more (by far the number one culpit), the lack of research is more than evident when attempting to face puzzles, or think of solutions that i may happen to be familiar with due to real life habbits/practice.

That too has nothing to do with budgets. Just, learning, and approaching things critically. What qualities derive from these aspects are the core of what can make an adventure game. Just think of Have No Mouth, how is that for a perfect example?
With the necessary disclaimer that as i get older, i am obviously in a position to be a lot more critical..can't be helped that i think.
 

Sceptic

Arcane
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Joined
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Messages
10,872
Divinity: Original Sin
It's kinda hard to address any of your points when the most specific you can get is "that Sierra game where you run".

The bit about adventure games getting harder did make me laugh out loud though. I can see why you have this tag.
 

Maiandros

Learned
Possibly Retarded
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Messages
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Infinite Space
your opinion will have weight and meaning when you get to say the very same thing to my face. RL
from the safety of your chair (sweaty or otherwise), you may feel free to post aaaaanything you fancy :)
 

tuluse

Arcane
Joined
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Messages
11,400
Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Hell, Primordia would've sold much better if, like, I hadn't put in the 99 problems line, we'd had another month of testing (such that, for example, the Clarity vs. Scraper scene had audio . . . seriously, WTF?), I'd relented on various annoying puzzles (most of which are now fixed), and we'd thrown one or two more rooms in. I'm in the process of doing one more pass through the game for a final patch, and while I'm pleasantly surprised by a lot of stuff (the variety of puzzle solutions, the custom quips for a huge variety of a random actions), other stuff stands out as really mediocre. The voice acting, which I remembered as very strong, is actually surprisingly weak, particularly in the smaller parts, but even with Logan's line readings, he often lisps and slurs words. I think the art is very, very strong, but has two significant problems: (1) Vic needed to do a handful more animations for mundane things, like picking up items at different heights. Almost every time two characters interact, and most times when a character interacts with the environment, they don't quite line up right, and it is jarring. (2) Vic's use of perspective is off in many of the scenes, which causes terrible scaling issues -- such as doors that characters are too tall to walk through, or bloated sprites. This is especially true in the UNNIIC interior rooms but crops up from time to time elsewhere. Other than that, I think the art is probably the best part of the game.
Primordia is one of my favorite adventure games in several years. I think it has many strong points, including art. I just think it is slightly less strong than a few games I consider among the best of all time.

BTW aren't you supposed to be announcing your next project like 10 years ago now :rpgcodex:
 

MRY

Wormwood Studios
Developer
Joined
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Messages
5,716
Location
California
So, there have been three "next projects": (1) Star Captain, a space game in the vein of Weird Worlds, FTL, etc., which was abandoned -- at Vic's behest -- in favor of; (2) Cloudscape, a more open-ended P&C adventure that was abandoned when Vic decided he wanted to focus on mural painting; leading to (3) the current next project, Fallen Gods, which is probably best described as a mash up of Barbarian Prince and FTL, but with longer, more involved CYOA vignettes. FG seems the most plausible of the three to actually get done, though I hope to return to the others later. (I'm going to post a retrospective on Cloudscape once I have something to show on FG.) I am very pleased with the pair of artists I'm working with on FG, a Hungarian doctor and a fellow Californian pixel artist who shares my penchant for researching. Whether my side of the game will hold up to their quality is harder to say -- I've elected to go with a writing style that could well be a turn off. It is indisputably purple and overwrought, wholly self-indulgent, and hard to penetrate. But it's what I feel like writing, etc.
 

Darth Roxor

Royal Dongsmith
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I've elected to go with a writing style that could well be a turn off. It is indisputably purple and overwrought, wholly self-indulgent, and hard to penetrate. But it's what I feel like writing

thats-how-i-roll-edward-comic.jpg


:thumbsup:
 

Crooked Bee

(no longer) a wide-wandering bee
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In quarantine
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire MCA Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Leigh Alexander is doing a series of short Let's Plays of early graphical text adventure games: https://www.youtube.com/user/leighalexander1/videos

Can't say I like her style of commentary, but it's worth a look out of historical curiosity alone.

The latest one is Sierra's 1980 Mystery House: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2014/08/27/lo-fi-lets-play-mystery-house/

[I've been doing a series of Let's Play videos exploring old adventures, text games and lost design forms from the 1980s Apple IIe and Commodore 64 era. In a time when young men shout over new action games, I will talk softly over strange old ones. Come along on a visitation of a different era that's one part meditations on my childhood, one part adventure game criticism, and one part preservation effort. Bonus: Everyone says the quiet talk, lo-fi handmade feel and keyboard tapping triggers ASMR responses. Please enjoy!]

In honor of Activision’s revival of the Sierra label, I decided to revisit the 1980 classic Mystery House, Ken and Roberta Williams’ first “Hi-Res Adventure,” and the first official game by the company that would become Sierra On-Line.



Mystery House is often erroneously celebrated as the “first graphical game”. While computer roleplaying and war games had graphics before this one, it’s true that this is the first adventure game with graphics. It’s fair, then, for a pioneer to have made so many mistakes. Initially, the advent of graphics did not make favorable advances on the text game format, as you’ll see in the playthrough. And that’s not just because of the crudeness and simplicity of age; early text games, like the inspirational “granddaddy” Colossal Cave (the subject of my “Gaming Made Me” here a few years back), had terse but incredibly useful prose, where generally every detail mentioned was either relevant or clearly demarcated as atmospheric.

Throughout the early 80s, many graphical text adventures struggled with how to inform the player which elements of the picture they saw were important to their interactions and which ones were merely for visual “richness”. As you’ll see in a recent Let’s Play here, just two years after Mystery House, The Curse of Crowley Manor would do a better job with this design challenge, by denoting “visible objects” in the text interface that could be used or taken whenever the player discovered them.

mystery2.JPG


And while similarly terse, Crowley had a flair for verbal pacing which made it much creepier and more atmospheric than Mystery House, which is often a bit awkward and flippant. That occasionally-silly tone gets fleshed out to positive effect in later Sierra games, of course, and you see flashes of it here. You’ll also see Mystery House forge some blunt approaches to design which would be foundational to later Sierra adventures — a certain willful obtuseness, a meanness, a constant rejection of the player’s intuition that made adventure games more frustrating and therefore last longer.

Mystery House sold unprecedentedly well for its time on release, presumably in part on the novelty of the graphics, and in part on how difficult it was to finish and the perceived value in the time spent trying to solve it. That bluntness didn’t seem to matter to the adventure gamer of the 1980s, a consumer who was satisfied with a hard game that took a long time, even if the difficulty was down to a selectively-intelligent parser and a certain lack of grace rather than to elegantly-designed puzzling and fruitful experimentation.

mystery3.JPG


On a more obscure note, a non-trivial number of games I’ve visited in my Lo-Fi Let’s Play series include shovels and graves. DIG is one of the most crucial verbs, mechanically and tonally, to classic adventures, it seems.
 

Sceptic

Arcane
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Joined
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Messages
10,872
Divinity: Original Sin
A more generous explanation, with regard to his older games, is that as he got more experienced and older, he realized the mistakes he was making. God knows that's true of me, even with respect to Primordia, where my work is relatively recent.
True, but I wasn't willing to cut him this kind of slack considering that learning from his early mistakes led him to making.... Bulletstorm.

I mean, I had fun with Bulletstorm, but a blueprint on how to push the genre forward it ain't.

I mean, this is an empirical issue, and I'm probably wrong -- I'm just speculating without any data. But I think you're slipping eras here.
Yeah I was wrong. The point I was making applies to shooters and adventures now, but you're right that the price gap was inverted back in the mid-90s, when shooters could be made with a team of less than 10 people and adventure games required larger team, lots of artists, full voice acting and so on.

Can't say I like her style of commentary, but it's worth a look out of historical curiosity alone.
Thanks for linking it. I'm always interested in commentaries that go this far back (I remember Mystery House, though I never played Curse of Crowley Manor and didn't even hear about it until much much later). I can't understand why so many such pieces are so intent on shoving condescending comments about gamers of the time though - see this part:
Mystery House sold unprecedentedly well for its time on release, presumably in part on the novelty of the graphics, and in part on how difficult it was to finish and the perceived value in the time spent trying to solve it. That bluntness didn’t seem to matter to the adventure gamer of the 1980s, a consumer who was satisfied with a hard game that took a long time, even if the difficulty was down to a selectively-intelligent parser and a certain lack of grace rather than to elegantly-designed puzzling and fruitful experimentation.
She makes it sound like were were masochists surrounded by good design in every direction who willfully chose to ignore all the good games around us so we could torture ourselves with this parser. Mystery House sold so well because there was nothing like it. People put up with its obtuse design because there wasn't any non-obtuse elegant well crafted design to compare it to - we didn't KNOW what was good and bad design. Everything was an experiment. She makes a comparison to Colossal Cave the "earlier" game but she forgets that Colossal Cave (and Zork for that matter), while older, were still restricted to mainframes. Mysery House was a game you could buy and take home to play on your personal computer. Besides, while Colossal Cave's and Zork's parsers were better, they weren't exactly great either, though Infocom's did improve a lot over the years.

It's a fun read regardless.
 

Blackthorne

Infamous Quests
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Developer
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Jun 8, 2012
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Syracuse NY
Codex 2014 Divinity: Original Sin 2
I have to catch up on the reading here, but I can say making an adventure game today is an exercise in both self-indulgence (love of the medium, really) and masochism.


Bt
 

Astral Rag

Arcane
Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
7,771
The Journey Down: Episode Two appeared on Steam:

http://store.steampowered.com/app/262850

This series looks pretty good but I cannot into episodic gaming so I force myself to wait until they release the third (=final) chapter in a year or two :(

The first episode is currently on sale for less than a euro.
 
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CyberWhale

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 26, 2013
Messages
6,070
Location
Fortress of Solitude
Paradigm



Paradigm is a surreal point-and-click adventure game for Windows, OSX and Linux set in the strange and post apocalyptic world of Krusz; a land inspired by a mix of Eastern Europe and the 70’s & 80’s.

Play as unattractive yet over-confident mutant Paradigm; who must prevail through a series of inconveniences on an adventure to overcome the insecure and tyrannical sloth antagonist, Olof!

Demo is available and they are asking for your money on Kickstarter.

Uncanny Valley



Story
You play as a security guard named Tom at a remote facility. He's in charge of the night shift, while his lazy partner Buck is in charge of the day shift. Nights are long, so Tom starts exploring the facility and finds things he shouldn't. The story plays a huge part in the game, so saying anything more would be a major spoiler.

Consequence System
Uncanny Valley's main difference from other games is a thing we like to call the consequence system. Whenever you fail at something, the game goes on, but with harsh consequences for your character that can impact both the story and the gameplay. For example - you fail at avoiding your attackers, meaning your character will move slower throughout the game, making it harder to escape future pursuers, so the player needs to be careful and more clever, which adds more tension to the game. Of course, there are a couple of sections where you can die, but we're trying to avoid that as much as possible.
Why? Because dying and repeating the same section over and over is tedious and leads to frustration. The game stops being scary if you're angry and just want to rush through it, so we think that adding such a system will still keep the tension while adding a new layer to scariness.

You can try the demo as well.
 
Self-Ejected

Bubbles

I'm forever blowing
Joined
Aug 7, 2013
Messages
7,817
And lo, though the Great Deceiver has set his snares in every nook and cranny, on every highway and byway of the digital world
To darken the path of the Faithful and to entrap the souls of those who fear themselves lost
Though the triumph of the Resurrection is mocked and perverted in modern gaming as a matter of course
And a new world order is almost upon us

Yet the true light of our Lord yet shines through the shadows
In this Spiritual sequel to Deus Ex



Episode 1 out now.


Yours in Christ,
Bubbles
 
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Jaesun

Fabulous Ex-Moderator
Patron
Joined
May 14, 2004
Messages
37,249
Location
Seattle, WA USA
MCA
Her Majesty the Queen of England kindly seeks one's assistance in this intergalactic point and click adventure game.

Her Majesty's SPIFFING is a quaint point and click adventure game following the exploits of Captain Frank Lee English and his trusted regional accented colleague, Aled, as they travel through the cosmos in search of new planets to claim for a galactic British Empire.​

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1236117571/hm-spiffing-a-comedy-3d-space-themed-adventure-gam

asking for $30,000. $10 for a digital copy.
 

Crooked Bee

(no longer) a wide-wandering bee
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Richard Cobbett has joined the bandwagon and compiled a Top 25 Adventure Games list:

http://www.pcgamer.com/the-25-best-adventure-games/

Warning: The list is not suitable for
1 Sierra fans (aside from QfG fans)
2 Myst-like fans (though the list does include Zork: Grand Inquisitor)
3 Hipster crap/Telltale haters

As I myself belong to 1, 2 and partly 3, I don't find this list particularly appealing. However, I do find it funny that, despite not liking Cobbett's taste or often judgment much, I still find him the only (mainstream) adventure game journalist worthy of being taken seriously.

Also, props for including Discworld Noir, Grand Inquisitor, and Callahan's Crosstime Saloon.
 

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