Decline Sword Coast Legends Pre-Release Thread

[Xenich]

5th edition is pretty much a straight upgrade over both 2nd and 3rd ed rules though, so I can't see any reason to go back. The only thing 5E is lacking is more customization options, and that's not suprising since only the basic rulebooks are out so far.
I'd kill for a proper 4E turn based crpg though. I'm sad it will almost certainly never happen.

You like the spell system in 5e? It reminds me of an MMO system that wreaks of streamlining rather than a feature rich innovation.

Where's the MMO? The 5E spell system is pretty much exactly the system used by 2/3 ed sorcerers, now extended to every spellcasting class. The flexibility it brings goes a long way to keeping spellcasters fun to play even as 5E has taken the power level of most spells down a notch.

Sorcerers were a spam class built for impatient players who want to have something to do every around. Making all classes like them is why current gaming today is considered "popamole".

That said, my point about MMOs was the progression and use of spells between slots.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

Codexian pessimism cannot be checked. It is oozing through cracks in the masonry and penetrating the innermost sanctum of the faithful.

I just saw some comments on a forum well known by the RPG community. They are saying it isn't a true D&D 5E game and have already declared SCL to be a (crappy) RTwP Diablo clone, because it is only "inspired by D&D 5E", has cooldowns, multiplayer co-op, etc. They are also saying that the existance of spells like Ray of Frost II, Mordenkainen's Sword II, Whirlwind Attack II, Deathstrike II, etc. indicates that the game definitely doesn't use D&D style spell progression.
It is way too early to come to such a conclusion IMO, but there you have it.

I'm guessing RPGCodex?

Correct.

 

[Infinitron]

Codexian pessimism cannot be checked. It is oozing through cracks in the masonry and penetrating the innermost sanctum of the faithful.

I just saw some comments on a forum well known by the RPG community. They are saying it isn't a true D&D 5E game and have already declared SCL to be a (crappy) RTwP Diablo clone, because it is only "inspired by D&D 5E", has cooldowns, multiplayer co-op, etc. They are also saying that the existance of spells like Ray of Frost II, Mordenkainen's Sword II, Whirlwind Attack II, Deathstrike II, etc. indicates that the game definitely doesn't use D&D style spell progression.
It is way too early to come to such a conclusion IMO, but there you have it.

I'm guessing RPGCodex?

Correct.

First, about "RTwP Diablo clone" thing. It's definitely a rushed conclusion, and Diablo is not a RTwP, Diablo is an "action rpg". RTwP could be great games like neverwinter nights series.

 

[Grunker]

As Sawyer has pointed out recently, even though OGL "allows" it, it's still pretty risky. http://www.pathguy.com/ddnext.htm just had a character creator.



The Witcher disagrees.

Not rats, and it's not very unreasonable for a monster hunter game to have quests about hunting monsters. What's their excuse?

 

[Athelas]

Codexian pessimism cannot be checked. It is oozing through cracks in the masonry and penetrating the innermost sanctum of the faithful.

I just saw some comments on a forum well known by the RPG community. They are saying it isn't a true D&D 5E game and have already declared SCL to be a (crappy) RTwP Diablo clone, because it is only "inspired by D&D 5E", has cooldowns, multiplayer co-op, etc. They are also saying that the existance of spells like Ray of Frost II, Mordenkainen's Sword II, Whirlwind Attack II, Deathstrike II, etc. indicates that the game definitely doesn't use D&D style spell progression.
It is way too early to come to such a conclusion IMO, but there you have it.

I'm guessing RPGCodex?

Correct.

First, about "RTwP Diablo clone" thing. It's definitely a rushed conclusion, and Diablo is not a RTwP, Diablo is an "action rpg". RTwP could be great games like neverwinter nights series.

He's among us as we speak:

And about the rpgcodex forum, I went there and read really toxic posts, one of them quoting my statement that neverwinter nights series are indeed good games, and laughing at it. I tried to reply this very coward person, but I had "insufficient privileges to reply".

 

[Darth Roxor]

check your privilege asshole

 

[Shannow]

Gotta love these codex 'discussions'

The thing is, (if you mean Gunker and me) we weren't having a discussion
Just a sharing of perspectives, where Grunker has trouble accepting non-Grunker perspectives. And I have trouble not poking him because of it.

Seriously though, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a developer to prove themselves before writing off their new game as shit. Especially when the announcement is as slap-dash as this one feels to me. This reeks of a cash-grab on the publisher side of things. Just look at those pre-order tiers and you'll find sufficient evidence to infer that this project is about milking that nostalgia teat for all it's worth.

Sure. But who here has so far fundamentally disagreed with that?
I'm not going back to ckeck, but I only remember one unconditionally positive comment. (And that might be the one that was redacted a short while later.)

Does that necessarily mean it will be bad? No, absolutely not. Plenty of 'slam-dunks' have turned out to be pretty decent games (although I'm pressed to think of a single-one that I'd label a GREAT game). But it does entirely warrant skepticism about the developer's capabilities and intentions.

Amen.

 

[Jaesun]

Codexian pessimism cannot be checked. It is oozing through cracks in the masonry and penetrating the innermost sanctum of the faithful.

I just saw some comments on a forum well known by the RPG community. They are saying it isn't a true D&D 5E game and have already declared SCL to be a (crappy) RTwP Diablo clone, because it is only "inspired by D&D 5E", has cooldowns, multiplayer co-op, etc. They are also saying that the existance of spells like Ray of Frost II, Mordenkainen's Sword II, Whirlwind Attack II, Deathstrike II, etc. indicates that the game definitely doesn't use D&D style spell progression.
It is way too early to come to such a conclusion IMO, but there you have it.

That sad thing is, this is probably what it will be.

 

[Shannow]

Hey, Neverwinter-guy. Before you manage to register, you might want to read this and see if it's really worth it:
http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/why-all-the-nwn-2-hate.96686/

 

[Roguey]

Not rats, and it's not very unreasonable for a monster hunter game to have quests about hunting monsters. What's their excuse?

These are oozes, not rats, as well.

It's not unreasonable for a group of adventurers to accept a task that involves killing monsters in return for payment. Planescape Torment had a sidequest where you hand a guy 10 rat rails in exchange for money and a chance to kill a bigger rat in his basement.

 

[Grunker]

^ you're working under the assumption that this is just a one-off as in most of your cited examples. Then why show it off like that? If it indeed it isn't a representative example.

Speculation, sure, but that's all we got.

So Roguey, you optimistic about this? If som why?

 

[Athelas]

These are oozes, not rats, as well.

It's not unreasonable for a group of adventurers to accept a task that involves killing monsters in return for payment. Planescape Torment had a sidequest where you hand a guy 10 rat rails in exchange for money and a chance to kill a bigger rat in his basement.

That's more tolerable when the rats in question are a hyper-intelligent hive mind.

 

[Zed]

Make no mistake, there's an audience for this kind of quasi-MMO shit:
http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/neverwinter-new-pics-oh-gawd-itz-heavan.75654/

 

[Grunker]

Aren't you the resident WoW-fag?

 

[Zed]

Aren't you the resident WoW-fag?

I play a month or so every expansion nowadays.

I don't mind MMORPGs. They can be a ton of fun. I just don't want them disguised as spiritual successors to my favorite singleplayer games.
And I don't like "MMORPG lites" like Guild Wars and Neverwinter. They lack the persistant qualities of proper MMORPGs, and they lack the hooks and very often the gameplay qualities of singleplayer games.

 

[Grunker]

I play a month or so every expansion nowadays.

I don't mind MMORPGs. They can be a ton of fun. I just don't want them disguised as spiritual successors to my favorite singleplayer games.

I understand. I have the exact same qualms about this game. But Neverwinter wasn't "disguised" as anything. It was pretty clear from the start what it was.

 

[Roguey]

^ you're working under the assumption that this is just a one-off as in most of your cited examples. Then why show it off like that? If it indeed it isn't a representative example.

All the other quest examples don't look like that. I doubt they put much thought into it.

So Roguey, you optimistic about this? If som why?

No. http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...ith-optional-co-op.96970/page-14#post-3749221

It might end up okay. Looks like even more of a low-budget DA:O than PoE, and D:OS proves that something created for co-op isn't an automatic disaster.

That skillbar looks oh-so-bad though. Even DA:O had a better-looking skill bar. And the space between the bar and the edge of the screen really make me think they want/intend to port this to consoles later.

 

[Bonerbill]

Codexian pessimism cannot be checked. It is oozing through cracks in the masonry and penetrating the innermost sanctum of the faithful.

I just saw some comments on a forum well known by the RPG community. They are saying it isn't a true D&D 5E game and have already declared SCL to be a (crappy) RTwP Diablo clone, because it is only "inspired by D&D 5E", has cooldowns, multiplayer co-op, etc. They are also saying that the existance of spells like Ray of Frost II, Mordenkainen's Sword II, Whirlwind Attack II, Deathstrike II, etc. indicates that the game definitely doesn't use D&D style spell progression.
It is way too early to come to such a conclusion IMO, but there you have it.

I'm guessing RPGCodex?

Correct.

First, about "RTwP Diablo clone" thing. It's definitely a rushed conclusion, and Diablo is not a RTwP, Diablo is an "action rpg". RTwP could be great games like neverwinter nights series.

I'm not that guy from the forums, nevertheless, just because you people a bunch of BG2 fanboys with bad taste in games, doesn't mean the NWN games had a bad RTwP system. You faggots can go ahead can keep flaunting your crappy opinions.

 

[TheGreatOne]

So Roguey, you optimistic about this? If som why?

It'll make PoE look good in comparison.

 

[Mortmal]

The 3rd edition rules are freely available under the OGL, so anyone can make a game using them, that's what Knights of the Chalice did. For other editions you'll need to licence them from WotC, and I doubt they would allow it, if there is to be a proper D&D game they'll want it to use the latest rules.

As Sawyer has pointed out recently, even though OGL "allows" it, it's still pretty risky. http://www.pathguy.com/ddnext.htm just had a character creator.

When you have an epic and great story to tell, you dont fill it with kill 10 rats kind of quests.

The Witcher disagrees.

It's simple and easy content to include for people who cry when RPGs aren't x amount of hours long.

Witcher is a fun popamole but not a full fledged rpg , its action with some rpgs elements, very good game but not a rpg for the "hardcore". Now when it comes to true rpgs, theres the paragon of virtue i name Divinity original sin. Here's the quest list , no kill 10 rats : http://divinity.wikia.com/wiki/Divinity:_Original_Sin_Quests
The top three rpg of 2014 dont have those kind of filler quests either.

Thats not pessimism, its realistic, when you are filling your game with world of warcraft like quests that means you are not even trying to make anything good and just trying to make quick buck with a well known IP.

RPGs can be X hours long without including that kind of filler content, again look at top 3 of 2014, or 2000's baldurs gate.

 

[Lhynn]

I'm not that guy from the forums, nevertheless, just because you people a bunch of BG2 fanboys with bad taste in games, doesn't mean the NWN games had a bad RTwP system. You faggots can go ahead can keep flaunting your crappy opinions.

Look, i love nwn THIS MUCH, but it had a bad RTwP system filled with obvious flaws. To such a degree that the first one was best played without pausing and the second one was a game that you had to suffer trough to experience MotB. If you are unwilling to accept this, then you are not worth listening or talking to.

 

[Minttunator]

I'm not that guy from the forums, nevertheless, just because you people a bunch of BG2 fanboys with bad taste in games, doesn't mean the NWN games had a bad RTwP system. You faggots can go ahead can keep flaunting your crappy opinions.

 

[Seari]

I'm not that guy from the forums, nevertheless, just because you people a bunch of BG2 fanboys with bad taste in games, doesn't mean the NWN games had a bad RTwP system. You faggots can go ahead can keep flaunting your crappy opinions.

Nice b8 m8

 

[Metro]

All RTwP games are bad.

 

[Shin]

RTwP games are bad and turn-based games are bad because of trash mobs. LARPing is too fucking retarded, playing tabletop fucking sucks because it requires friends, reading books strains my left fucking eye

thank god for masturbation