Actually I am also looking for Triss in order to show her the crystal (I dont like giving it to Yen, it has 0 consequences). I remember that after the lighthouse sex scene she said she is going somewhere in Novigrad (not the witchers keep, I think) with the intention to further help Geralt. I have no idea where she is. Any leads? If I misread and she is in Kaer Morhen, where is she in that huge and empty keep. And where is Keira Metz (that I sent to the keep also) for that matter? I must mention that I am not finished with the game, I am still not transforming the ugly creature so I can finish the dealings I still have around the world before some point of no return.
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Story spoiler thread.
- Thread starter Perkel
- Start date
Actually I am also looking for Triss in order to show her the crystal (I dont like giving it to Yen, it has 0 consequences). I remember that after the lighthouse sex scene she said she is going somewhere in Novigrad (not the witchers keep, I think) with the intention to further help Geralt. I have no idea where she is. Any leads? If I misread and she is in Kaer Morhen, where is she in that huge and empty keep. And where is Keira Metz (that I sent to the keep also) for that matter? I must mention that I am not finished with the game, I am still not transforming the ugly creature so I can finish the dealings I still have around the world before some point of no return.
Off to Kovir with my favorite redhead. Living a live of luxury and maybe collect a medal from Roche.
Cromwell
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She will be there no matter what you do. If she doesnt come for you yennefer will ask her, I did not fuck any of the two since my "lets try again", kissing her at the ball and not doing anything with yeneffer I did not have to do apparantly wasnt enough to warm her heart.
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Yes, she was at Kaer Morhen (same for every playthrough regardless of choice, I believe), but Geralt never really had a proper conversation with her. There was a great moment where Geralt arrives with Ciri, and Yen kisses Geralt - and the look on Triss' face is really rather great. But then, nothing. And of course, she's there at Skellige, but again, no chance to have a conversation. I didn't end things badly with her. We had a good time at the party, but then when she got on the boat I let her go because I wanted Geralt to end up with Yen (made more sense given the lore).
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I agree with much of what you say, but I do like Ciri. Maybe, in some way she scratches an itch I've had since the end of Buffy. A strong female heroine, who might do stupid things, and there is lots about her that doesn't make sense, but she's still cool and isn't in the game as a cocktease.
I got a different ending, where Geralt and Ciri don't actually part ways. I am pleased to hear the ending you got was as fulfilling for you as mine was for me. BioWare have a lot to learn from CDProjekt, most of all how to write a good game ending (or three).
I agree with you about the Wild Hunt. There was an excellent quest with Avallac'h where you actually go to their home world and learn a little bit more about them, but it didn't really seem to matter much because as soon you meet Eredin, you just kill him and can't really do anything else. I get it, he's not Letho, but couldn't I at least hear the guy out before the necessary unavoidable fight?
The Letho quest was outstanding, and what I loved most about it was that I genuinely happened across it by accident. My mouth dropped open when he was revealed in the barn. A really nice bit of reactivity. I had hopes other characters from W1/2 like Kalkstein, Siegfried etc would appear like that too, but sadly not. I think the BROche stuff made up for it though.
And yeah, getting to spend some time at Kaer Morhen made me very happy. It was a big thing missing from W2 as far as I was concerned.
Perkel
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It has 3 endings for Ciri/Geralt and several different worldstates but not much. Mostly because most of outcomes come in time of game not after it and often they are presented with slide (which i didn't like like in TW1).
Also game uses a lot quest consequence without exactly showing you ending. To see it you need most of the time to meet again those characters again.
For example that dude in WO who you save with Nilgardian. If you steer conversation so that he will stay on farm you can actually go later and see that he actually stays on farm and works field. He probably also have different ending in games ending as WO there is different depending on world state like "dat Ass" Herbalist for WO for example is hunted by witch hunters.
As for ending i think they did amazing job with post ending. It really drives ending from meh to fuck yeah precisely because you can play those 10-30 minutes finishing up story.
She never had this power.
First time she did that she used fire power and shortly after that she renounced all magic. From that point she can't use actual magic and she doesn't do that in TW3 either. She lost ability to cast spells completely (or draw power ?)
Second time when she saved Geralt was done via Unicorn. "She touched its horn and her eyes glowed like sun" points that it was not completely her doing.
So CDPR stayed true to books.
Though i wonder why they didn't use unicorn/s. Probably because it would be cheesy as hell (wors part of books imo)
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Not sure what you mean by this, Perkel bro. 'Post ending', I just see as 'ending'. Epilogue, maybe. The post ending stuff for me is being able to run around the world at will once the main quests are done with. That is what I am doing now - exploring Skellige and completing all treasure hunts. The 'finishing up story' was meeting Ciri in the inn for me.
Perkel
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Epilogue then.
Whisky
The Solution
I really regret killing Letho. Him showing up in that barn sounds awesome.
Tigranes
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As someone who played the whole trilogy but has never read the books, and is just about to finish TW3, I have to say the one persistent and clear problem with TW is how bad it is at handling the "existing lore" stuff. Every game, you finish it without a clear understanding of important aspects of the story, and you have to just give up on questioning why some of the things are the way they are. The player has to simulate a knowledge he does not have, and just presume that the big holes and gaps are covered by the books. This is bad - and I think TW3 is more egregious here than TW2.
For instance, if the player knows nothing, then they get literally 0.5 mentions of Ithilenne's Prophecy until you reach Kaer Morhen and Yennefer uses the megascope, etc. Sure, you find the Prophecy book at notable points in the main plot, and a couple of dialogue references to 'the prophecy', but that's completely inadequate. Geralt and Yennefer are supposed to know about Ciri. So why is the player never told, in many natural ways that would have been easily possible, what is going on? You are not told of Ciri's powers' relation to the Prophecy. You do not know who the Wild Hunt are, why they pursue Ciri, or why they need the Prophetic powers. In fact, the Wild Hunt are the main antagonists here and also feature in TW2 but you learn basically nothing about them. You also don't learn why and how Ciri was in Geralt's care as a child, when and why they were separated, whether she is even the biological child of Emhyr. Literally all you get is tiny little pieces: Geralt's quip to Emhyr in their first meeting that he didn't give a shit about Ciri before, for example. Geralt even quips near endgame "when I rode with the Wild Hunt", which threw me for a loop. In short, you just have to say, I have no idea who this girl is or why we are pursuing her but I suppose I'll find out - and you do, after 50 hours, though only in the most basic sense. This is ridiculous, and severely hurts the story.
This is a chronic issue in all TWs, but is much more prominent in TW3. In TW2, it was easy to work out the lines of international tension in the politics of the North. You had no idea what Nilfgaard was or what they wanted, but they weren't important to your experience early on, and you gradually were shown more about them. You don't need to know exactly what the Lodge is, etc. to get to grips with the story unfolding in front of you. You have a good grasp of why and how the nations are in conflict, how Foltest, Radovid, etc. differ in their outlook, why the sorceresses might be the object of hate and jealousy, why Radovid blinds Philippa Eilhart, etc.
Even apart from this lore-handling issue, TW3 story is weak and too epiclulz. The Wild Hunt are never compelling. Even aside from the fact that I know nothing about them, their aesthetics just scream "NAMELESS EVIL ROAR WE ARE SAURONS MEN". The generally good quality of the writing is punctured by a singularly cringy line near the end - "Humans, so impractical", when Vesemir is in danger. Seriously? You might as well just make them into Orcs, or into Pokemon's Team Rocket (or whatever they were called). You also spend far too long in the game not having a clue what the fuck Ciri is doing or what is happening. I thought the final discovery of Ciri was really well done, and the fact that you find her so near the end works well, but the political plot of the North against Nilfgaard and Novigrad's persecution of nonhumans should have become more dynamic. I expected something to happen in the war front and for Geralt to have some involvement, but basically nothing happens aside from Dijkstra's plot (you can't actually participate in the mission, right?), and Radovid is reduced to a questgiver hanging about for your report, as is Emhyr. The Triss / mages sequence and subsequent persecution is done well, at least.
The really strong parts of it, as others have pointed out, are the side characters. The Bloody Baron questline is probably the high point of the entire game - wonderfully done, with great writing and pacing throughout. Dandelion's quests can be annoying, but I liked the bit of lightness it brought (as a Dandelion questline should), including the little theatre acting, and it also brought the various storylines and characters in Novigrad together very well. Triss again was good thematically for reasons stated above. The an Craite / Skellige succession sequence was also a really good way to bed the player into Skellige, both its human civilisation and its specific kinds of legends and monsters. There are also a number of sidequests or little moments that stand out and give the unique TW vibe - such as the Leshen contract in Skellige where you have to choose between killing a marked villager girl (& support the less savoury villagers) or side with a likeable elder & perpetuate the fear of monsters.
I skipped quite a bit of content to leave it for an immediate second playthrough, but do you need to use a TW2 save (or pretend it) to find Letho?
For instance, if the player knows nothing, then they get literally 0.5 mentions of Ithilenne's Prophecy until you reach Kaer Morhen and Yennefer uses the megascope, etc. Sure, you find the Prophecy book at notable points in the main plot, and a couple of dialogue references to 'the prophecy', but that's completely inadequate. Geralt and Yennefer are supposed to know about Ciri. So why is the player never told, in many natural ways that would have been easily possible, what is going on? You are not told of Ciri's powers' relation to the Prophecy. You do not know who the Wild Hunt are, why they pursue Ciri, or why they need the Prophetic powers. In fact, the Wild Hunt are the main antagonists here and also feature in TW2 but you learn basically nothing about them. You also don't learn why and how Ciri was in Geralt's care as a child, when and why they were separated, whether she is even the biological child of Emhyr. Literally all you get is tiny little pieces: Geralt's quip to Emhyr in their first meeting that he didn't give a shit about Ciri before, for example. Geralt even quips near endgame "when I rode with the Wild Hunt", which threw me for a loop. In short, you just have to say, I have no idea who this girl is or why we are pursuing her but I suppose I'll find out - and you do, after 50 hours, though only in the most basic sense. This is ridiculous, and severely hurts the story.
This is a chronic issue in all TWs, but is much more prominent in TW3. In TW2, it was easy to work out the lines of international tension in the politics of the North. You had no idea what Nilfgaard was or what they wanted, but they weren't important to your experience early on, and you gradually were shown more about them. You don't need to know exactly what the Lodge is, etc. to get to grips with the story unfolding in front of you. You have a good grasp of why and how the nations are in conflict, how Foltest, Radovid, etc. differ in their outlook, why the sorceresses might be the object of hate and jealousy, why Radovid blinds Philippa Eilhart, etc.
Even apart from this lore-handling issue, TW3 story is weak and too epiclulz. The Wild Hunt are never compelling. Even aside from the fact that I know nothing about them, their aesthetics just scream "NAMELESS EVIL ROAR WE ARE SAURONS MEN". The generally good quality of the writing is punctured by a singularly cringy line near the end - "Humans, so impractical", when Vesemir is in danger. Seriously? You might as well just make them into Orcs, or into Pokemon's Team Rocket (or whatever they were called). You also spend far too long in the game not having a clue what the fuck Ciri is doing or what is happening. I thought the final discovery of Ciri was really well done, and the fact that you find her so near the end works well, but the political plot of the North against Nilfgaard and Novigrad's persecution of nonhumans should have become more dynamic. I expected something to happen in the war front and for Geralt to have some involvement, but basically nothing happens aside from Dijkstra's plot (you can't actually participate in the mission, right?), and Radovid is reduced to a questgiver hanging about for your report, as is Emhyr. The Triss / mages sequence and subsequent persecution is done well, at least.
The really strong parts of it, as others have pointed out, are the side characters. The Bloody Baron questline is probably the high point of the entire game - wonderfully done, with great writing and pacing throughout. Dandelion's quests can be annoying, but I liked the bit of lightness it brought (as a Dandelion questline should), including the little theatre acting, and it also brought the various storylines and characters in Novigrad together very well. Triss again was good thematically for reasons stated above. The an Craite / Skellige succession sequence was also a really good way to bed the player into Skellige, both its human civilisation and its specific kinds of legends and monsters. There are also a number of sidequests or little moments that stand out and give the unique TW vibe - such as the Leshen contract in Skellige where you have to choose between killing a marked villager girl (& support the less savoury villagers) or side with a likeable elder & perpetuate the fear of monsters.
I skipped quite a bit of content to leave it for an immediate second playthrough, but do you need to use a TW2 save (or pretend it) to find Letho?
Deleted member 7219
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I let him go because he was such an excellent villain and treated Geralt with respect in Loc Muinne. Also, Geralt had no real reason to kill him, not really. Maybe for abducting Triss, but he didn't really hurt her, and maybe for fucking up the School of the Viper by getting other Witchers involved in his bullshit. But Emhyr, Phillipa and Sile were really the ones to blame.
Letting him go was my way of tipping my hat to the writers and it was nice to see him back in Witcher 3. It didn't progress his own story much but provided a nod to Witcher 2 and put another cool fighter in the Kaer Morhen sequence.
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Are you sure you are at the end? It sounds to me like you are wrapping up Act 2, and there's still Act 3 left, which consists of more mandatory quests than Act 2. A few of these quests at least address (to an extent) some of the points you have raised.
To specifically chime in regarding a few points:
I have not read all the books, and I was quite surprised myself to find out that Emhyr was Duny (Ciri's father). It's referenced in lore books that you can find in a few places (Triss's ransacked house, I think). There's also a sequence with the Dreamer in Novigrad where Geralt more or less summarizes his early relationship with Ciri -- I thought that was actually a novel way to familiarize non-book readers with their relationship. But I do agree that W3 is the most reliant of the three games on the book material, and it feels almost mandatory to be familiar with the books to understand those significant details that could and should have been laid out through the Glossary or character interactions in the game, but aren't. For instance, Perkel clarified the extent of Ciri's powers from the last novel -- knowledge that I would have preferred knowing before finishing the game.
Dijkstra's plot can continue in Act 3 again as long as you don't mess up a blatant choice that is presented then. Doesn't seem like you are there yet, but I was left wondering the same during my initial playthrough before the quest continued.
Finally, the Wild Hunt is explored a bit in Act 3, and one gets to know more about their nature and whatnot. I do agree that they could have done with far more screen time and fleshing out. On the other hand, when I played Witcher 1 way back in 2007 without any knowledge about the series, I found the Wild Hunt to be far more menacing as antagonists before I learnt more about them in W2 and W3.
Can't really agree on that. Ithlinne's Prophecy is something you literally hear within the first minute of the first act of the first game and regularly pops up later on, finding out more about the nature of the Wild Hunt is a subplot that continues throughout TW2, and the relationship between Ciri and Geralt, as well as the nature of Ciri's powers, are explained in the dialogue with Corinne Tilly and numerous other conversations throughout the game. TW3 even manages to handle most of its info dumps in a natural way through interactions between characters, without cramming a ton of stuff into the journal like TW2 did. I suppose some of this stuff may be a bit vague if one only plays TW3 without touching the previous two games at all, but I think the game trilogy manages to stand on its own two feet quite well.
Yeah, one thing that kind of bothered me about the ending was that the other major events of the game world didn't really play any part in it, it was all centered around Geralt and Ciri. In both of the first two games Geralt got waist-deep into the battles of other people, which I thought was one of the best things about them, yet in TW3 the war (which the whole second game was building up to) is almost purely a backdrop. I was expecting an epilogue of sorts where you'd still have to conclude your business with Nilfgaard after dealing with the Wild Hunt, perhaps in a way that would incorporate the Radovid subplot somehow, or even the sorceresses and Avallac'h. Instead, the game deals with all of this in one swift stroke, which does give some value to your previous choices but just doesn't create a similar climax to what we got in the first two games.
Nope, you can choose whether if he's dead or alive if you choose "Simulate TW2 save" when you start the game.
Deleted member 7219
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So bros, I was running and swimming around Ard Skellig and finally found that dowager Queen who got sentenced to death by being chained to a rock and left to die. I had wondered where they had put her.
Is there an alternative way to solve that quest, where she still lives? What happens if you go charging out with the guy, I understand he becomes King instead of his sister, but anything else?
I had actually been considering helping the dowager but I can't remember if I was given the choice. I ended up helping the woman instead, can't remember her name.
Is there an alternative way to solve that quest, where she still lives? What happens if you go charging out with the guy, I understand he becomes King instead of his sister, but anything else?
I had actually been considering helping the dowager but I can't remember if I was given the choice. I ended up helping the woman instead, can't remember her name.
Tigranes
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Actually, yeah. Maybe I am not at the end? I just took down Imlerith and reached Dandelion's Inn to speak to the sorceresses. The whole "ISLE OF MISTS NO MORE SIDEQUESTS" warning made me think I was nearly there. So if there's stuff I'm still missing that's just my stupidity, sorry.
I did appreciate the Dreamer sequences, yes. I forgot to give credit there. But I think it's indicative that Perkel's post - most of that was entirely new to me, and it should not be after going through most, or at least 2/3, of the game.
Carrion I knew about the Prophecy from TW1, yes, but as far as I remember, Ciri is basically a "who?" person for TW1 and TW2 mostly, and there's nothing within the games strictly that teaches you to connect Ciri and the Wild Hunt and the Prophecy properly. I only keyed in when I kept finding the Prophecy book in certain places, but all the world-jumping stuff... *shrug*
I'll come back and eat some hat depending on how I feel once I'm actually done. But I do think that for the most part, the uninitiated player goes through the majority of TW3 only knowing: "Ciri is some girl Geralt raised for a time at Kaer Morhen, she disappeared one day for some reason, now she's fleeing from this mysterious Sauron Horde for some reason, Ciri has special powers due to some special heritage and she can't control them very well, she must not be caught and she has some Chosen One specialness." That's kind of lame.
I did appreciate the Dreamer sequences, yes. I forgot to give credit there. But I think it's indicative that Perkel's post - most of that was entirely new to me, and it should not be after going through most, or at least 2/3, of the game.
Carrion I knew about the Prophecy from TW1, yes, but as far as I remember, Ciri is basically a "who?" person for TW1 and TW2 mostly, and there's nothing within the games strictly that teaches you to connect Ciri and the Wild Hunt and the Prophecy properly. I only keyed in when I kept finding the Prophecy book in certain places, but all the world-jumping stuff... *shrug*
I'll come back and eat some hat depending on how I feel once I'm actually done. But I do think that for the most part, the uninitiated player goes through the majority of TW3 only knowing: "Ciri is some girl Geralt raised for a time at Kaer Morhen, she disappeared one day for some reason, now she's fleeing from this mysterious Sauron Horde for some reason, Ciri has special powers due to some special heritage and she can't control them very well, she must not be caught and she has some Chosen One specialness." That's kind of lame.
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I also really liked the portrayal of the Wild Hunt in W1. I'm guessing the wraithy stuff was just magic they wielded. In W1 they seemed far more powerful and content to simply manipulate rather than get their hands dirty. Why did they even bother killing people in Witcher 3?
Hang on, you thought the game was over? I don't quite understand how you could think that. The main quest keeps tugging at your sleeve until you see the end credits. The 'main quest' stuff in the journal is a bit of a clue.
The Isle of Mists only cuts out sidequests relating to those who go to Kaer Morhen, and the Radovid plot. All other sidequests are still available I believe. Others may be able to confirm if the quests to do with the Skellig succession can be done in Act 3 or not.
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Finding Birna chained to that rock was great attention to detail. If you don't aid the siblings, her son, Svanrige, becomes the ruler. It even changes the quest you need to do in Act 3 to get the Sunstone.
Speaking of attention to detail, I came across a notice in Crow's Perch (I think) that made a lighthearted encounter quite grim. That idiot Ronvid who challenges you to a duel to defend Maid Bilberry's honour -- I decapitated the fool since I had forgotten to equip my Axii mind control. Later on in Crow's Perch I came across a notice that said "Baby Bilberry had passed away" or something to that effect. I wonder if Ronvid was a relative, a father or brother perhaps, and Bilberry's passing had driven him mad.
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That sounds terrific. Wow.
I can't remember what I did to Ronvid, I can't remember what I did to the guy who follows you around trying to kill you either. Might have been the same guy.
Tigranes
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Matt7895 When I heard NPCs talk about the Kaer Morhen showdown to me it sounded like the typical point at which endgame arrives - especially since the game was long already. Then I got the "NO MORE SIDEQUESTS!!!!" warning at Isle of Mists and figured that was it. I was surprised when it kept going and going afterwards, but I quit just after reaching Dandelion's Inn last night, thinking surely this was just an extended endgame. Of course I didn't think the game was 'over'.
I was actually rushing to finish just to restart. Now that I know Act 3 is actually substantial, I may go ahead and restart, put it up to Death March, and so on.
I was actually rushing to finish just to restart. Now that I know Act 3 is actually substantial, I may go ahead and restart, put it up to Death March, and so on.
I just wish they had more flashbacks to Ciri's past with Geralt to develop it further. I don't feel like I'm chasing after someone important at all throughout the game, totally not sharing Geralt's opinion on this whole hunt.
And yes, Triss being under-developed past Novigrad arc is a valid complaint. She didn't even sit down with the rest of the guys for Kaer Morhen. What the fuck?!
CDPR seems to think she is the secondary romance option and should not get much screentime past act 2 - which is a bit strange considering the 'video game canon' didn't even gave Yen much of a role at all until near the end of 2nd game.
And yes, Triss being under-developed past Novigrad arc is a valid complaint. She didn't even sit down with the rest of the guys for Kaer Morhen. What the fuck?!
CDPR seems to think she is the secondary romance option and should not get much screentime past act 2 - which is a bit strange considering the 'video game canon' didn't even gave Yen much of a role at all until near the end of 2nd game.
Perkel
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Sorry but it is simply "read the books" answer. Either you accept that ton of things you will miss or you need to read actual books because you can't put 7 books of knowledge into game.
The exact same happens when you romance Triss instead of Yennefer. Not even a proper dialogue for the rest of the game. Pretty weak.
It kind of sucks that the ending ignores almost all of the secondary characters from the game. Dandelion, Zoltan, Yennefer/Triss (whichever you didn't pick), Roche/Ves/Dijkstra/Thaler (whoever are left alive), the Bloody Baron and his family, Priscilla, Philippa... You don't directly get to hear about what happened to the major locations after the war either. Considering that all these secondary characters and stories are just as important to the game as the main story is, it's weird that they didn't offer any real closure in this regard. At least the characters that have been around in every game should've been handled better. If you get friendzoned by Triss, the shadow of that awkward last conversation kind of just hangs above you for the rest of the game and is never properly lifted, even though it's otherwise a rather fitting ending for her and Geralt's story (compare this to Shani in TW1, who gets fucking pissed at you if dumped her but will still offer you a chance for "redemption" in Act V, eventually parting on friendly terms). Zoltan is apparently just left hanging around with no great plans or anything, although earlier in the series he's been involved in a lot, even getting a chance for happy famiily life at one point before his wedding plans fell apart. Dandelion's got his brothel cabaret, but does anyone believe he'd just settle down like that considering his nature?
Wouldn't be surprised if there was a patch later on that added better ending slides, though.
Wouldn't be surprised if there was a patch later on that added better ending slides, though.
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