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Stellaris - Paradox new sci-fi grand strategy game

Lone Wolf

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Well, I guess when you treat games like optimization engines, you become whatevername

Did you know you can conquer the world with Ryukyu in EUIV? Horrible game. Did you know you can solo the BG series on the hardest difficulty? Terrible. Were you taken unawares by the fact that you can remove all semblance of challenge from Fallout 2 by making a Navarro run right after Arroyo for the PA? Disgusting.

Why do you even play these games, mate? Stick to perfectly symmetrical closed loops like chess.
 

Nirvash

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This new planet managment is looking good, now they need to redo ship combat, how the expansion works (again), add some real empire internal politics/managment, remake all the research system and all the techs.

Then go overboard with the op awakened/mid-end game invasions/badevents since ai will always be shit and enemy empires will never be a fair challenge. (give up on 4x and go back to heavy scripted grand strategy)
 

IDtenT

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Divinity: Original Sin

whatevername

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Well, I guess when you treat games like optimization engines, you become whatevername

Did you know you can conquer the world with Ryukyu in EUIV? Horrible game. Did you know you can solo the BG series on the hardest difficulty? Terrible. Were you taken unawares by the fact that you can remove all semblance of challenge from Fallout 2 by making a Navarro run right after Arroyo for the PA? Disgusting.

Why do you even play these games, mate? Stick to perfectly symmetrical closed loops like chess.

Lone Wolf, well, there are people (probably like you and me), who play the game.
And then there are people, like whatevername, who game the system.

What is enjoyable about the latter? No idea.

To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women!
Bros, do you even Sun Tzu?
 

thesheeep

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thesheeep said:
And then there are people, like whatevername, who game the system.

What is enjoyable about the latter? No idea.

To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women!
Bros, do you even Sun Tzu?
Sure, but to do that, there is absolutely no need to optimize everything to the smallest detail and use every (or even any) exploit.
In Stellaris, you can just larp ahead and as long as you do nothing fundamentally wrong you can still win. Might even have more of a challenge if you don't optimize every little detail.
 

whatevername

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thesheeep said:
And then there are people, like whatevername, who game the system.

What is enjoyable about the latter? No idea.

To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women!
Bros, do you even Sun Tzu?
Sure, but to do that, there is absolutely no need to optimize everything to the smallest detail and use every (or even any) exploit.
In Stellaris, you can just larp ahead and as long as you do nothing fundamentally wrong you can still win. Might even have more of a challenge if you don't optimize every little detail.
Umm, playing with 1 planet is not an exploit, it's like a reverse exploit, sort of like shooting yourself in the foot and then running the marathon.

And then, speaking of exploits... "4X is a genre of strategy-based video and board games in which players control an empire and "EXplore, EXpand, EXploit, and EXterminate".....4X computer games are noted for their deep, complex gameplay."
Notice the "deep, complex gameplay', not "do nothing fundamentally wrong you can still win".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4X
 

Lone Wolf

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Sun Tzu didn't have exact troop ratios that would guarantee decimating the other side every time, regardless of terrain or circumstance.

He wrote down general dictums of warfare.

The point wasn't that you're exploiting the game by playing with one planet, but that your exploitation of the game allows you to win by playing with one planet.
 

Norfleet

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Sun Tzu didn't have exact troop ratios that would guarantee decimating the other side every time, regardless of terrain or circumstance.

He wrote down general dictums of warfare.
That's because he was writing a tutorial for noobs. Of course you wouldn't tell other people the fine details of your strategery. Knowledge is power. Secret knowledge is secret power.
 

thesheeep

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And then, speaking of exploits... "4X is a genre of strategy-based video and board games in which players control an empire and "EXplore, EXpand, EXploit, and EXterminate".....4X computer games are noted for their deep, complex gameplay."
Notice the "deep, complex gameplay', not "do nothing fundamentally wrong you can still win".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4X
1. It's obviously not the exploitation of game mechanics, but of resources within the game this means.
2. Do you still believe Stellaris is a 4X game?
3. Even if you just don't do anything fundamentally wrong, the game is still deep and complex when compared to most other games.
 
Joined
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Lol, "strategy" game. It's fucking visual novel. You play for a hour and not doing anything substantial aside of some quest exploration choices...
One game require 40+ hours? FFS. In MOO2 you could kill one race after 30 min already even on huge map.
I don't mind long games, but fill it with gameplay. Currently it filled only with exploration "quests" and microing. Wars, expansion, diplomacy and overall challenge level is a joke.
 

Space Satan

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DD galactic market
Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today we're going to continue talking about the 2.2 'Le Guin' update, on the topic of the Galactic Market. As said before, we're not yet ready to reveal anything about when Le Guin is coming out, only that it's a long time away and we have many more topics to cover before then. Also as said before, screenshots will contain placeholder art and interfaces and non-final numbers.

The Market
The Market is a new interface accessible from your topbar, where you can buy and sell resources. Resources are bought and sold for Energy Credits, with their prices dependent on a variety of factors such as whether the Galactic Market is founded, supply and demand, and possibly also from various events. On top of the actual price of the resource, there is also a Market Fee which has to be paid for any sale or purchase, equal to 30% of the purchase value. This Market Fee is there so that it will not be possible to make money by purchasing and then immediately re-selling resources at a higher price. Resources can be purchased either in bulk, or by setting up a monthly trade, where you for example specify that you want to sell 20 food and buy 10 minerals per month, and can set a minimum sale/maximum purchase price, if you want to ensure that major fluctuations in price do not disrupt your empire's economy too much.
index.php


Internal vs Galactic Market
At the start of the game, empires only have access to the Internal Market, which represents trading with actors inside your empire such as corporations and local governments, or in the case of Gestalt Consciousness empires, resource reprocessing. The prices on the Internal Market are set to always be higher than those on the Galactic Market, so relying too heavily on trading will be disadvantageous in the first few decades of the game. Some empires, such as Devouring Swarms, may only ever have access to the Internal Market (this is something we're still testing and balancing) and so might get better prices there. Once the game has progressed to the point where at least one empire knows about at least 50% of the other empires in the galaxy, the Galactic Market will eventually be founded. One empire that meets the criteria is picked as Market Founder, and their capital system becomes the Market Capital, spawning a special station and map marker to denote it. From then on, any empire (barring possible restrictions for Devouring Swarms and the like) that knows of the Market Capital system has access to the Galactic Market and is able to trade on it. The controller of the Market Capital get a reduction in their Market Fee and increased trade value for their trade routes (more on that in a later DD).
index.php


Prices on the Galactic Market are always lower than those on the internal market, though the actual prices will fluctuate based on supply and demand - every time Minerals are sold on the market, prices will drop, and conversely, every time they are bought prices will increase. The purchases and sales you make on the Galactic Market do not just affect your own prices but also those of other empires, so that it is possible to for example massively drive up Food prices by purchasing a huge amount of food, damaging the economy of any empire that is reliant on importing it. It isn't actually possible for a resource to 'run out' on the Market, so you will always be able to purchase critically needed resources, though the cost of doing so may be extremely prohibitive. However, some resources (such as Dark Matter and other rare strategic resources) will not be available until they are actually accessible to empires on the market in large enough quantities, and are not available on the Internal Market at all. The aim of the Galactic Market is to make it so that it is actually a viable strategy to specialize your economy, importing resources that are difficulty for your empire to produce and exporting resources that you can produce easily in large quantities.
index.php


Trader Enclaves
Since the Market has much of the same functionality as the Trader Enclaves from Leviathans, we're also changing said Enclaves for those with the Leviathans Story Pack. Instead of trading food, energy and minerals, Trader Enclaves will sell rare resources (Rare Crystals, Volatile Motes and Exotic Gases) in the form of monthly trade deals offered at advantageous prices. Each Trader Enclave will offer only one of these resources. Additionally, once you reach 50+ opinion, Trader Enclaves will sell special Governor-type leaders with unique, trade and commerce related traits. Finally, if you control the home system of a Trader Enclave AND have 50+ opinion with them, you will be able to build a special Starbase building in that system which lowers your Market Fee, allowing for cheaper trading on the Galactic Market.

Finally, just a note to say that we're ignoring the Slave Market tab of the Market screenshots on purpose - this is something that will be covered in a later DD.

That's all for today! Next week we're continuing to talk about the Le Guin update, on the topic of Sectors and Factions.
 

baturinsky

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Sun Tzu didn't have exact troop ratios that would guarantee decimating the other side every time, regardless of terrain or circumstance.
Have you read him? It was kinda main point of his book - plan so you come to fight with overwhelming advantage, or just win without having to fight.
 

Lone Wolf

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Re-read what I said, in context.

Basic military truisms =/= what I was referring to.

I can imagine the Sun Tzu version now: 'L0L, just bring 750 hvy chariots, bruh, you'll get 100:1 kill ratios, no probs, lul, God is a shit game designer'
 

Jimmious

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Stellaris Dev Diary #126 - Sectors and Factions in 2.2

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today we're going to continue talking about the 2.2 'Le Guin' update, on the topic of Sectors and Factions. As said before, we're not yet ready to reveal anything about when Le Guin is coming out, only that it's a long time away and we have many more topics to cover before then. Also as said before, screenshots will contain placeholder art and interfaces and non-final numbers.

Sector Rework
Sectors have always been a bit of a controversial feature. Even if you disregard arguments about the general level of competence of the sector AI, the fact that sectors effectively force the player to cede control over all but a few of their planets has never gone down well with certain players. In truth, the decision to force players to give planets to sectors was very much a result of the old tile system - because of the sheer amount of micromanagement that was involved in managing a large number of planets, it was decided that automation was necessary, and also to make that automation mandatory (barring mods) to effectively force players to not make themselves miserable by micromanaging the tiles of a hundred different worlds. With the planetary rework in the Le Guin update, we no longer feel that this mandatory automation is needed any longer, and so we've decided to rework the sector system entirely.

Instead of being autonomous mini-economies, sectors are now administrative units in your empire, with their layout decided by galactic geography, with each sector corresponding to a cluster of stars in the galaxy. Sectors are automatically created when you colonize a planet in a previously uncolonized cluster, and your 'core sector' is simply the cluster in which your capital is located. All interfaces that are relevant to sectors and planets (such as the outliner) are now organized by collapsible sector entries, allowing for better overview and management of a large number of planets. As before, each sector can have a governor assigned to it, but sectors now automatically send all of their production to the empire stockpile instead of having their own fully realized economy. However, since we still want players to be able to offload some of the planetary management when controlling a large number of worlds, it is still possible to allocate resources to a Governor, who will use those resources to develop the planets under their control. This of course means that there is no longer any core sector limit, and anything that previously used to give a bonus to core sector planets has either been changed into a different bonus or removed altogether.

(Note: Image is highly WIP and has missing elements)
index.php

Faction Happiness Rework
Factions are also changing in Le Guin, though not to nearly the same degree as sectors. Most of the core mechanics of factions will remain the same, but Faction Happiness is being changed into something we call Faction Approval, measuring how much a Faction approves of your empire's policies. Where previously Factions would only give influence when above a 60% happiness threshold, Factions now always give some influence, with the amount scaling linearly to their Approval, so a 10% Approval faction will give only 1/10th of the influence that a 100% Approval faction gives you (the amount they give also still scales to their share of power in your empire). Faction Approval is also no longer directly applied to Pop Happiness, but rather will affect the happiness of Pops belonging to that faction at different thresholds, with small boosts to happiness at higher levels of approval and increasingly severe penalties to happiness at low levels of approval (effectively swapping the influence threshold for various happiness thresholds).

This should mean that even small boosts to faction approval now directly translates into influence gain, and that factions almost always give *some* benefit, even if that benefit may be outweighed by the unhappiness and unrest they can cause. We're also hoping to have time to review the faction issues, tying them more directly to policies to make them easier to understand. For example, instead of demanding that all species have their rights manually set to Full Citizenship, the Xenophile faction might demand a certain empire-wide policy setting that forces the equal application of species rights across all species.
index.php


That's all for today! Next week we're continuing to talk about the Le Guin update, on the topic of Trade Value and Trade Routes.

Best news about Sectors
 

Jimmious

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Yeah this patch seems to be massively in the right direction. But it makes me completely indifferent to the current version :P
 

Norfleet

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No, you're either waiting for the new and interesting DLC to be patched so it's not bugged beyond playability, or you're waiting for the new and interesting DLC to come out.
 

Space Satan

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  • Leader cap is gone, leaders cost maintenance instead, with costs scaling to empire size.
  • You send a lump sum of energy or minerals which is converted into 'sector budget', from which the governor can build, with special scripted costs. We haven't figured out yet how we're going to solve special costs like rare resources. It's also possible that governors might get a small budget each month based on economic strength of sector even if you don't send them resources.
  • Sectors will only build if you allow them to.
  • Empire size increases leader cost.
  • Properly autonomous sector governors until Feudal Realm etc is also something that's possible with the new system.
  • For example, one idea I have for the Feudal Realm civic (but I'm not promising there will be time for) is to have governors be way more autonomous, but have a fairly large income of their own.
  • You tick a box that they autobuild (as long as you give it resources).
  • colonies will be expandable entries under sectors... Still WIP
 

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