Stellaris - Paradox new sci-fi grand strategy game

[coldcrow]

True. I didn't think about what I wrote.

 

[Norfleet]

Honestly, Stellaris doesn't need anything special to have "Tactical" combat, all they have to do is remove the behavior where ships stop responding to orders to move when combat starts. They're already just fighting an RTS battle on the same map you're playing on anyway. All that really needs changing to make it "tacticool" is for the ships to still obey instructions to GO THAT WAY when fighting, either to move AWAY from the fighting and thus stop fighting eventually if the enemy is not able or willing to pursue, or to DRIVE ME CLOSER, I WANT TO HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD.

Literally nothing else in the underlying mechanics needs to change for this. Everything about the actual combat is ALREADY THERE.

 

[Jimmious]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.
What the game does need is fucking AI that can keep up.
How many times can this be said to be heard??

 

[ilitarist]

Actually, you have a pretty good idea where your enemy is most of the time, because it's basically impossible to hide in space. Any spaceship drive will stand out like a burning thousand-K beacon against the cold backdrop of space. If someone lit off a fusion torch drive, we'd see that out by Alpha Centauri using current technology. You're not doing anything anything sneakylike in space. Just sustaining a 300K Earth-habitable environment for your crew announces your presence to everyone in the solar system with current levels of technology. Lighting off a torch drive will announce your presence to everyone within the nearest few lightyears. Using antimatter SCREAMS "LOOK AT ME!!!111" for hundreds if not thousands of light years, as the radiation signature of this is completely unmistakeable as anything else that normally occurs.

I like the idea of space combat being similar to submarines. There's a problem of active scanning. With supposedly lightspeed weapons (if we get lasers like that) and instant reaction any active scan will bring back result "found a bad guy" 1 second before you get a laser "why are you scanning me" barrage from the said guy. And passive scanning like trying to get some radiation from engine may be imprecise and hard to process and, more importantly, it can theoretically be shielded or hidden among similar noise. Combat planes can do that today, no reason to think future spaceships couldn't drop some sort of device that will smudge their radiation all over the place.

Of course with big distances everyone can be moving all the time so it's useless to send laser back to where the scan had arrived, there's no one there anymore. Thus it becomes about fleet coordination and relativistic evaluations. Like "we know where they were 15 seconds ago, we have to guess where they're now and shoot in the direction of them being 15 seconds now". And all of that assuming you have a worthy lightspeed capable weapon and there's no reason to think we'll ever have that.

 

[Jason Liang]

Implementing the ability to fake "phantom" fleets to confuse planetary sensors and the like would be awesome and probably too crazy for a 4X space game... the only strategy game I know that had something like that was the Game of Thrones game.

 

[ThisNameIsFree]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.
What the game does need is fucking AI that can keep up.
How many times can this be said to be heard??

Actually Glavius mod improves expansion and economic ai https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1140543652 , so i suppose improvements will follow after devs discover this mod.

 

[Jimmious]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.
What the game does need is fucking AI that can keep up.
How many times can this be said to be heard??

Actually Glavius mod improves expansion and economic ai https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1140543652 , so i suppose improvements will follow after devs discover this mod.

I use both Glavius and Enhanced AI. They certainly make the AI better especially economically but still.. Needs work

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

does anyone know mods for traits and civics lists' heights? having tens of both it becomes a nightmare to navigate them, even worse for the civics for whose the more you pick the less space you have to pick more. i found only one for each, for the traits the mod is incompatible with almost everything, for the civics the mod is an empty file.
i hoped i could have been saved by the oh so praised, oh so loved "dark ui", only to find out it's a fucking change in colour, just that.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

Now that's we're talking about space combat... any game ever made it so that space combat is decided not by ship-to-ship combat, but by ground combat between crews of spaceships boarding each other and such?

Its one hell of an weird idea that I saw once on Rocketpunk Manifesto blog. Author of the concept did highlight that it would need a good reason why everyone is avoiding ship-to-ship combat, and he gave the idea that FTL is powered by what he called "Demon in a Bottle" technology, which means any sort of ship-to-ship combat is too risky, because it gets the "Demon" out.

Hell, that could even open up the idea of a weird hybrid 4X/Tactical Combat game.

 

[Beowulf]

Implementing the ability to fake "phantom" fleets to confuse planetary sensors and the like would be awesome and probably too crazy for a 4X space game... the only strategy game I know that had something like that was the Game of Thrones game.

Space Empires 4x, the board game, have something like that.
Proves that good ideas don't need next gen hardware.

 

[chuft]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.

I want to be the kind of empire leader that Alexander, Caesar, Hannibal, Napoleon, William the Conqueror, Richard Lionheart etc were - they also commanded the main battle force (armies in their case, but would be fleets in a space scenario) directly in combat, in the most hands-on way imaginable.

Sadly I can't think of any real epic space wars in film or literature that compare to a 4X game, other than say the final battle at the end of Episode VI, where of course the Emperor is in personal command of the new Death Star.

Playing the tutorial for Age of Wonders III. Since I have spent a lot of time playing Age of Wonders II, and Shadow Magic, much is familiar and it seems very cool, though I have to wonder if it's really any different than what I've already played. I avoided it for a long time due to fake news that it was going to be a RTS. Was glad to discover that it isn't. And sad to discover that Stellaris was.

 

[whatevername]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.

I want to be the kind of empire leader that Alexander, Caesar, Hannibal, Napoleon, William the Conqueror, Richard Lionheart etc were - they also commanded the main battle force (armies in their case, but would be fleets in a space scenario) directly in combat, in the most hands-on way imaginable.

Sadly I can't think of any real epic space wars in film or literature that compare to a 4X game, other than say the final battle at the end of Episode VI, where of course the Emperor is in personal command of the new Death Star.

Playing the tutorial for Age of Wonders III. Since I have spent a lot of time playing Age of Wonders II, and Shadow Magic, much is familiar and it seems very cool, though I have to wonder if it's really any different than what I've already played. I avoided it for a long time due to fake news that it was going to be a RTS. Was glad to discover that it isn't. And sad to discover that Stellaris was.

Babylon 5 - Minbari rulers always lead the fleet.
Farscape - Scarran emperor and Peacekeeper whore also directly command their fleets.

Implementing the ability to fake "phantom" fleets to confuse planetary sensors and the like would be awesome and probably too crazy for a 4X space game... the only strategy game I know that had something like that was the Game of Thrones game.

You can build really cheap frigates in Stars! with only 1 engine and 1 gun. They're called "chaff" and they're used as decoys for your battleships/dreadnoughts, in combat only though. High tech missiles and torpedoes cost much more than those cheap ships so they are basically wasted when, for example, a missile does 9001 damage and that ship has 87 hp.

 

[trais]

If someone lit off a fusion torch drive, we'd see that out by Alpha Centauri using current technology.

Considering that Alpha Centauri is 4.367 light years away, we would be able to see it, but good couple of years after it had occurred. Makes targeting a bit tricky.

 

[Sranchammer]

Now that's we're talking about space combat... any game ever made it so that space combat is decided not by ship-to-ship combat, but by ground combat between crews of spaceships boarding each other and such?

Its one hell of an weird idea that I saw once on Rocketpunk Manifesto blog. Author of the concept did highlight that it would need a good reason why everyone is avoiding ship-to-ship combat, and he gave the idea that FTL is powered by what he called "Demon in a Bottle" technology, which means any sort of ship-to-ship combat is too risky, because it gets the "Demon" out.

Hell, that could even open up the idea of a weird hybrid 4X/Tactical Combat game.

If there's any setting that could be attempted it would be Dune.


TBH, Stellaris would be improved by removing space combat in exchange for fleshing out ground combat and occupation.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

working with stuff we already have, the game could need just little tweaks to improve a lot.
-remove transport ship, make troops into aux slots. fuse generals into admirals category as ship scientists are into the same category of research scientists. add some aux slots. all this because of the following step:
-stations become habitats, stations upgrades become buildings. stations need to be conquered to make them stop firing (or completely bombarded and depopulated).
--if you're even lazier, make stations work like the enigmatic fortress. you have the code in place already.
-ground troops stay as ground troops, and fire back at bombarding ships. or at least give me a structure who shoots them. it has to hurt ships. a lot. dammit, rogue one made half a movie about a planetary shield and some defense turrets.

there are already mods which do most of this stuff. these are tiny changes which could be done in an afternoon by whoever owns the game code.

why would this improve the game in my opinion? it makes assaults more fluid, you can still have troop fleet without being forced to make them sit on their thumbs in a system nearby (and you could also jistufy the addition of some sort of boarding mechanics. another thing mods already do, even if it's very barebone), it's all stuff we expect from sci-fi and which stellaris lacks, it gives ground troop traits a reason to exist because as is they could and will be bombed to oblivion without saying a word and being conquered by a single squad is not fun for anyone. stellaris ain't albania.

then add a little variety to troops. i don't need moo3 kind of variety but at least troops/tanks/planes/buff-debuffer, with more powerful versions specific to ethics, civics and stuff.

as i said, this all within already existing code and rules. i'm not asking for magic or rocket science here, it's perfectly reasonable stuff.

 

[Jimmious]

I'm fine with the abstract combat of Stellaris, I don't need more control.
After all I'm leading an empire, I'm not a general.

I want to be the kind of empire leader that Alexander, Caesar, Hannibal, Napoleon, William the Conqueror, Richard Lionheart etc were - they also commanded the main battle force (armies in their case, but would be fleets in a space scenario) directly in combat, in the most hands-on way imaginable.

Sadly I can't think of any real epic space wars in film or literature that compare to a 4X game, other than say the final battle at the end of Episode VI, where of course the Emperor is in personal command of the new Death Star.

Playing the tutorial for Age of Wonders III. Since I have spent a lot of time playing Age of Wonders II, and Shadow Magic, much is familiar and it seems very cool, though I have to wonder if it's really any different than what I've already played. I avoided it for a long time due to fake news that it was going to be a RTS. Was glad to discover that it isn't. And sad to discover that Stellaris was.

Babylon 5 - Minbari rulers always lead the fleet.
Farscape - Scarran emperor and Peacekeeper whore also directly command their fleets.

I'm not saying that controlling the combat is bad or that it doesn't fit the game. I'm saying that it's by far the least of my concerns regarding things to improve.
AI, diplomacy, trade, espionage come first to mind.

 

[Anthedon]

Started a new game recently, I haven't touched Stellaris since release. Is there some obvious way to deal with pirates that I'm missing? With the changes to FTL travel hunting them is pure whack-a-mole busywork.

 

[chuft]

My first way of dealing with them was building a new fleet near where they appeared, since that was faster than flying an existing fleet there.

Ultimately, my solution was to stop playing Stellaris. The pirates trouble me no longer, so it worked.

 

[Anthedon]

I'm about ready to call it quits too. The general slowing down of everything brought about by the FTL changes saps all my willpower to continue. And I'm only playing on a small map, bigger galaxies must be an absolute nightmare now.

 

[MilesBeyond]

I even kind of like the slowing down in theory - the game used to revolve way too much around doomstack vs doomstack combat, and the fact that it's now impossible to defend your entire empire with only one fleet mitigates that. But in practice it's such a tedious pain in the ass.

 

[chuft]

The time scales seem way off. The fleets moving and fighting is incredibly slow, yet the other stuff is incredibly fast.

A number of times I was watching a fleet battle - not participating in it, mind you, since it won't let you, but at least watching it - and it kept getting interrupted by blurbs about research being done, systems being surveyed, anomalies being found, anomalies being researched or failed, mines being built, buildings being completed etc. It seemed like a thousand year battle, and entire civilizations rose and fell between salvos of torpedoes. In theory I could wait until after the battle was done before issuing new orders to all the units involved in the blurbs, but in practice, since this is a real time game, that would mean researchers/ships/whatevers would be sitting idle, wasting time.

Imagine Palpatine trying to watch the Death Star firing on Rebel cruisers, and he keeps getting interrupted "Which social research should we continue with?" "The farm is complete, should be build any other buildings anywhere?" "The survey is done on that remote system, nothing interesting, where should they go next?" "Will you stop interrupting me! I am trying to watch this battle! It took hours of real time just to set it up!"

 

[Average Manatee]

I'm playing Aurora right now and it's quite fun how it goes the exact opposite direction. Meet an alien, get in a fight. Turns out their missiles travel at 50km/s and my point defense is only effective up to around 35 km/s. Oops. Time to research and manufacture better turrets? Like 1-2 years. Battle length? 10 minutes. Time to do some running.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

The time scales seem way off. The fleets moving and fighting is incredibly slow, yet the other stuff is incredibly fast.

A number of times I was watching a fleet battle - not participating in it, mind you, since it won't let you, but at least watching it - and it kept getting interrupted by blurbs about research being done, systems being surveyed, anomalies being found, anomalies being researched or failed, mines being built, buildings being completed etc. It seemed like a thousand year battle, and entire civilizations rose and fell between salvos of torpedoes. In theory I could wait until after the battle was done before issuing new orders to all the units involved in the blurbs, but in practice, since this is a real time game, that would mean researchers/ships/whatevers would be sitting idle, wasting time.

Imagine Palpatine trying to watch the Death Star firing on Rebel cruisers, and he keeps getting interrupted "Which social research should we continue with?" "The farm is complete, should be build any other buildings anywhere?" "The survey is done on that remote system, nothing interesting, where should they go next?" "Will you stop interrupting me! I am trying to watch this battle! It took hours of real time just to set it up!"

i understand bashing paradox because it's national sport here, but why making things up? if there's one thing players complain about stellaris battles is that they're way too fast and there's plenty of mods who lenghten them, going as far as +500% hp for ships.
nigga please, get the fuck out.

 

[chuft]

The time scales seem way off. The fleets moving and fighting is incredibly slow, yet the other stuff is incredibly fast.

A number of times I was watching a fleet battle - not participating in it, mind you, since it won't let you, but at least watching it - and it kept getting interrupted by blurbs about research being done, systems being surveyed, anomalies being found, anomalies being researched or failed, mines being built, buildings being completed etc.

i understand bashing paradox because it's national sport here, but why making things up? if there's one thing players complain about stellaris battles is that they're way too fast and there's plenty of mods who lenghten them, going as far as +500% hp for ships.
nigga please, get the fuck out.

I am reporting what I experienced. I have no idea WTF you are talking about.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Stellaris used to be way too fast. Especially since you had no range/fuel limits. So there is no mystery to the galaxy because even a huge map gets completely surveyed in less than a century, unless a hostile alien empire blocks you at some point. The galaxy is also really crowded because most AIs also expand fairly rapidly.