4X Stardock's Elemental: Sorcerer King War of Fallen Legendary Heroes

[mastroego]

Everything that could be said about Stardock and its signature blandness has been said.

BUT, Legendary Heroes + the massive XtraDeconstruct mod is enjoyable.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

I liked having a customizable sovereign that actually fights on the field, dunno of many 4x games where I can do that other than AoW.

 

[ArchAngel]

By this time Stardock has become the Spiderweb Software of strategy games.

Exactly , and it will be the "best" release this year by complete lack of competition.

I think Planar Conquest still beats this game.

 

[ArchAngel]

I liked having a customizable sovereign that actually fights on the field, dunno of many 4x games where I can do that other than AoW.

Endless Legend had hero characters with their own perk trees and their customizable gear. And unlike FE:LH they were balanced properly to be both useful and not OP.

 

[DeepOcean]

Stardock is evident proof that talent is less available than money.

 

[anus_pounder]

I guess the Campaign is really the tutorial, but I still have to ask why its the same fucking map with the same events placed in the same location each time. And every single time you start off in the same location. If you choose the new dorf or undead ruler, you still start off in the same location except the city is now magically frost people/undead instead of plain ol' humans.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Campaign is tutorial.
And SK is shit. It is basically 1vsuper buffed AI because other factions do jack shit in the game. And other faction troop that joins you do not grow as they level making them utter shit. Worse stardock game ever.

 

[anus_pounder]

Refunded. That'll teach me to d1p shit games. Wonder what to buy now though. Civilization VI maybe...

 

[sser]

It is impressive how much mileage they got out of Elemental despite being seemingly unable to design anything that really hooks a player.

 

[ArchAngel]

It is impressive how much mileage they got out of Elemental despite being seemingly unable to design anything that really hooks a player.

One can say the same about Dragon Age and Mass Effect series :D (I don't consider unwashed masses players).

 

[DeepOcean]

It is impressive how much mileage they got out of Elemental despite being seemingly unable to design anything that really hooks a player.

One can say the same about Dragon Age and Mass Effect series :D (I don't consider unwashed masses players).

Mass effect wanted to be a popamole shooter and it achieved that, Elemental wanted to be a 4X só hard and failed as hard. One is dumb design by choice, another dumb design by sheer incompetence from Stardock.

 

[ArchAngel]

It is impressive how much mileage they got out of Elemental despite being seemingly unable to design anything that really hooks a player.

One can say the same about Dragon Age and Mass Effect series :D (I don't consider unwashed masses players).

Mass effect wanted to be a popamole shooter and it achieved that, Elemental wanted to be a 4X só hard and failed as hard. One is dumb design by choice, another dumb design by sheer incompetence from Stardock.

You missed my point.

 

[Old One]

I've been playing FE:LH with the XtraDeconstruct mod for a couple of weeks now, and while I find it enjoyable enough, it's also very frustrating. The core mechanics of this game actually have a lot of potential, but the implementation (including some of the bugginess) and some of the choices Stardock made...it's too bad.

An "Ultimate" version of a game including several complete DLC packs should not be this buggy, first of all.

The AI is poor. I notice there's no let's-make-the-AI-decent DLC.

It's kept me playing so far, but...I don't know. It seems like there comes a point in every game where something annoying happens that sucks out my motivation to continue.

As a MoM fan, I can't help but compare it to MoM. Like most MoM-inspired games, most of the "improvements" actually make it worse than MoM, not better.

I'm not sorry I bought it, but it doesn't inspire me to buy Sorcerer King. Not at all. Fix this game first, then we'll talk about the next one.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

FELH is an old game. The ultimate 2.0 patch was some sort of last hurrah patch that fixes a lot with the game flaws along with some bugs. It is honestly decent with Xtradeconstruct mod, but the lack of polish is clearly apparent. For me, with the mod, FELH is one of the more entertaining modern fantasy 4X that is not named Endless Legend.

Whether you like FELH or not though is no reason at all to buy SK. SK is a piece of turd that is not even a proper 4X. Every mechanics from FELH is streamlined. AI is braindead (even the SK one). The only good thing about it was light C&C in the quest system where you can gain status (wise, diplomatic, etc) depending on your choices which is used for skill checks on other quests.

 

[Trash]

Noone ever did MOM better than MOM. Get a fanpatch and play that one. Noone ever even came close to the brilliance of that title.

 

[Old One]

Oh, I still fire up MoM from time to time, believe me.

I think my experience with FELH impacts my attitude toward Sorcerer King because FELH Ultimate is probably the worst-performing "ultimate" edition of any game I own. I'm not saying it's horrible; but the level of finish is unacceptable for a product that's had as much development time as this one. Stardock had the time and resources to release multiple DLC packs for it, but not the time to make sure everything was working properly. I assume that's what I would get with Sorcerer King as well.

I agree that FELH with XtraDeconstruct is decent. It reminds me of the Fall From Heaven mod for Civ4 in some ways.

EDIT: You're free give this post whatever rating you like, but in this case a "Negative" reaction doesn't mean much without some explanation. I have no idea what it is you're reacting to.

 

[MoLAoS]

Noone ever did MOM better than MOM. Get a fanpatch and play that one. Noone ever even came close to the brilliance of that title.

With all reasonable attempts made to shatter nostalgia goggles, what was so great about MoM?

 

[Mortmal]

Noone ever did MOM better than MOM. Get a fanpatch and play that one. Noone ever even came close to the brilliance of that title.

With all reasonable attempts made to shatter nostalgia goggles, what was so great about MoM?

Pretty much everything, from the artstyle to the game mechanisms,crafting absolutely overpowered and unbalanced armies and artefacts a real feeling to be a powerful wizard ruling a realm. It was a good ego trip .
Closest to that is dominion 4.

 

[Old One]

I agree that everything about MoM just "works" somehow, but what it boils down to is that, as you play the game, it creates a story in your mind. Before I played MoM I never even realized a 4x game could do that, and I never realized that it was the real goal every 4x game should have. Your empire has a character, and every game is different.

There's also the fact that there are many different ways to win, and most of them feel distinct from one another. Lots of games claim to have that, or try to have it, but MoM actually pulls it off. There are also plenty of ways of playing that are extremely poor choices, and will make the game much, much harder.

It's not nostalgia for me, because I never even knew MoM existed until five or six years ago. I got it as part of some package deal from GOG.com, and I was blown away.

 

[MoLAoS]

I agree that everything about MoM just "works" somehow, but what it boils down to is that, as you play the game, it creates a story in your mind. Before I played MoM I never even realized a 4x game could do that, and I never realized that it was the real goal every 4x game should have. Your empire has a character, and every game is different.

There's also the fact that there are many different ways to win, and most of them feel distinct from one another. Lots of games claim to have that, or try to have it, but MoM actually pulls it off. There are also plenty of ways of playing that are extremely poor choices, and will make the game much, much harder.

It's not nostalgia for me, because I never even knew MoM existed until five or six years ago. I got it as part of some package deal from GOG.com, and I was blown away.

Can you give more detail on that, how is it different every game, what are the many ways to win and why are they authentically unique?

 

[kyrub]

There are many ways, many different tactics to become an overpowered bastard in MoM and run with the game.


You can start as a famous wizard and attract big heroes early, breed them into unstoppable monsters through earned experience.
Or you start as unknown but beline research for the powerful Summon champion spell or even the Incarnation, which gives you the messianic warrior. (But will he beat those early beefed-up heroes? That's the question.)

You can forge terrifying artifacts for heroes, which takes years but it gives you an overwhelming advantage. You can find those artifacts even through conquest, if you dare to take over the magic locations in tough and challenging encounters with magic creatures.

You can become a master in one of magic realms, getting ridiculously low casting costs. You can summon a horde of Hell hounds to quickly take over neutral cities on your continent, giving you an early and decisive edge. You can start as a Death mage, summon couple of early Wights and sip the life out of the world. You can start as a Life mage, capable of boosting simple Spearmen into invincible monsters. You can turn your territory and cities into virtual paradise, as a Green mage, a slow but very nice way to victory.

You can combine deadly spells like Invisibility with some damage dealing processual spell. You can win battles against most unfavourable odds with Confusing opponent monsters to attack themselves.

You can become an economic magnate, producing a lot of cash in cities and turning coffers of gold into pools of mana with expert Alchemy...

You can start a gambit, you can start without any wizard quality and get 1 rare spell instead. Which gives you fantastic winning possibilites, if well chosen, and it is probably the single most OP tactic in the game.

You can start alone on Myrror, the "other side", the wild magic plane with bigger enemies and higher stakes... which gives you time to build-up against your opponents.

You can race in research to cast the Spell of Mastery (but you almost never make it to the point, because you win in another way). You can use your race advantage, your race specific warrior, mass-produce halflings' slingers or long-bowmen or Stug beetles spitting fire for an aggressive conquest, Civ-like... which honestly is one of the most boring ways to win in MoM.



Last, the most important thing: if you really want to try MoM, I suggest you DO NOT read all the easy way guides and spoilers. And try to find yourself through playing, as this is the most fun.

 

[ArchAngel]

All my MoM victories was through getting a band of heroes, leveling them up and giving them cool items and then letting them loose on all my enemies (which meant I would beeline for enemy capital and take out enemy wizard leaders). And yes I would sometimes summon Torin to lead that group

 

[Mortmal]

I agree that everything about MoM just "works" somehow, but what it boils down to is that, as you play the game, it creates a story in your mind.

Thats also for the same reason CK2 , EU4 , or even HOI4 are great. While stellaris does not work for me.

 

[Arrowgrab]

There are many ways, many different tactics to become an overpowered bastard in MoM and run with the game.


You can ***SNIP***

And you can also be a Warlord Life mage with Hobbits and mercilessly crush the multiverse with your hordes of Warlord + Crusade + don'trememberwhat Hobbit slingers, who are the the single most damaging unit in the entire game. Dark White Lord Sam Gamgee.

 

[Old One]

Can you give more detail on that, how is it different every game, what are the many ways to win and why are they authentically unique?

What kyrub said, essentially.

One other thing about MoM that often gets overlooked is that there can be significant differences in the map from game to game. For example, there are two different types of magical metal in MoM: mithril and adamantium. Usually you can find some of each if you spend time searching. However, I've had games with no mithril at all, or no adamantium at all, and that can change your strategy.

I've also often had games where one or more of MoM's races simply didn't exist in the randomly generated world. You choose your own starting race, of course, but there's no guarantee what the rest of the world will look like. There's no attempt to balance these kinds of things, so you never know just how any particular game is going to play out.

I once played as the Draconian race, and it just so happened that I was alone on my plane (there are two planes in MoM, Arcanus and Myrror) and every neutral city there was also draconian. None of the other races native to the same plane as draconians existed in that game. There were no dwarves, trolls, beastmen, or dark elves at all. I soon had a huge empire, but I had no way of knowing that's how it would be when I started.