SMAC 444 - AI patch updated [p]

[Irenaeus]

Finally beat the game (setting : iron man, random large map, few ocean and tech stagnation with an ini edit to slow tech progress even more) playing Morgan.
So :
1. start in a good spot (awesome is not required)
2.blob like a retard, zero army. You should almost always secure enough land to develop.
3.act like a coward and gave everything the others ask even if it hurts (you will catch on them latter...hopefully)
4.help massively and early enough to be helpful any faction that begin to have a disadvantage by giving tech in order not to create a rival superpower faction
5.spam borehole as much as you can with supply crawler units.
6.prey everything work, that nobody attack you and not a truly superpower faction has been created meanwhile
6.win by tech/monopoly

Edit : tech progression is still way too fast toward the middle end (the last third of the game) despite my setting hugely lowering it. However decreasing it even more will make the 1/3 of the game way too slow (it's already borderline right now).
Any way to change the rate of tech progression in order to slow it in the last third without making it a crawl at the beginning ?

Yeah, I'd like that too, but I fear it can't be done unless you increase the cost of later techs. No idea how to do it.

 

[lemon-lime]

Since a few months I've been playing with this patch. It made the game so much better. It forced me to play better, take more care. Thank you very much!

But I noticed that I could catch mindworms as the Peacekeepers, even before I had even researched the Green economy setting. Is that normal or maybe a bug?
I can't remember that happening before (except when playing as Gaians, of course.) With this patch it happend in two games, and in one of those my zero Planet rating Peacekeepers had a very high catch rate (6 out of 10, or so), even higher than I'm used to with Green Gaians.
I understand that random stuff is random, but 6/10 smells buggy for a Planet value of zero.

Also one little cosmetic thingie: The sound settings don't get recognized before a game is started/loaded, which makes the main menu annoyingly loud just after startup. Would it be possible to change that?

 

[Silva]

Just started a SMAX game with latest Yitzi patch (3.4, which incorporates Scient, Kyrub and Pracx interface improvements). I'm still at the beginning of a Thinker campaign and I noticed the same as lemon-lime above: my scouts are capturing mind-worms with an easiness that mimics Deirdre in vanilla. Don't know if its correct or not, bit Id rather have vanilla behavior in this.

Now, what difficulty level are these AI patches supposed to function better ? In my early game as the Angels I managed to take the point in the blob race and for a moment thought the AI was dumber. But then I realized thats not the case at all, and as soon as the borders were settled the AI rushed past me and now I'm among the worst factios in the graphs. I think the AI utilizes its resources toward research and infrastructure much better now. I'm even starting to think that Thinker is too tough for me, as Im not a min-maxer and like to have a more easier and relaxing game.

 

[Nevill]

Yitzi's patch does not incorporate kyrub's. kyrub only did work on SMAC, and it didn't get ported to SMAX properly.

The stuff about mind-worms is a bug, you should probably report it to Yitzi. Check your territory for Manifold Nexus, though - it adds +1 PLANET.

kyrub's patch also has its own bugs, like the retooling penalty applying incorrectly, which we recently discovered in a PBEM.

 

[Silva]

Nevill, I happen to have the Manifold Nexus inside my territory. Thanks.

About Yitzi's patch:

Yitzi's patch is an unofficial patch for SMAX


, building on Kyrub's AI enhancement patch and Scient's patch. As of version 3.4, it also includes Guv'nor and Googly Boogly's text file fixes and PlotinusRedux's PRACX improvement to graphics.

Well, the description says it uses Kyrub and Scient's patches.

Edit:
Oh, and according to the change log, the bug you cited was also corrected:

• in Kyrub's patch, changing production, even to the same item, would cause the mineral gain from that turn to be cancelled. This has been fixed as of version 2.4.

 

[Nevill]

"building on Kyrub's AI enhancement" does not mean that it contains kyrub's patch.

Also Yitzii claims that he merged all your work into his SMAX patch, that most people use.

He's merged only what I translated into SMAX myself, e.g. 10%. I tried to negotiate a coding "truce" and co-work in a hybrid SMACX, but it never came to the point.

The general rule is - you want a (marginally?) better AI, you play SMAC with kyrub's. You want a somewhat bug-free experience and many moddable features, you play SMAX with Yitzi's.

Since I prefer multiplayer and don't find AI challenging either way, I just do the latter.

 

[lemon-lime]

Regarding the mindworm capturing bug: I believe, that I identified the reason for the strange behaviour. My hypothesis:

Sometimes, when a new game is started the chosen faction's default social policies seem to not go into effect. Instead they seem to be whatever was last active in the last game.

I noticed that, because sometimes, when I started a new game with the Spartans, I didn't get the 10% production cost penalty. The mineral rows on the building screen were still 10 instead of 11 wide. (IIRC once they were even much lower than 10. I must have played Hive/Planned/Wealth in the game before, or something similar.)
I strongly suspect, that was the same bug, that triggered the strange mindworm capturing behaviour. (I had probably played as Gaians/Green in the game before I played the mindworm capturing Peacekeepers.)

So far that's just random anecdotes, I haven't done any deliberate testing of my hypothesis, yet.

 

[Nevill]

Sometimes, when a new game is started the chosen faction's default social policies seem to not go into effect. Instead they seem to be whatever was last active in the last game.

Never heard of that one.

I noticed that, because sometimes, when I started a new game with the Spartans, I didn't get the 10% production cost penalty. The mineral rows on the building screen were still 10 instead of 11 wide.

Check the map size. Tiny and Small maps have 2 and 1 less minerals in a row, respectively. Meaning Spartans on a small map would get 10 minerals in a row and everyone else would get 9.

Anyway, the faction starting bonuses are kept in a save file. Next time it happens, upload a save, and if there is indeed a bug perhaps Yitzi could have a look at it.

 

[Silva]

On my side, I restarted my Data Angel campaign 4 times and that behaviour didnt repeat, which leads me to believe the cause was indeed the manifold nexus on my territory.