KickStarter Skyshine's BEDLAM: REDUX!

[eXalted]

Well, ran out of fuel and died.

I was a backer. The game has nice premise and cool art but would have to play it a couple more times to decide if it's good or not.

 

[Nekot-The-Brave]

It was very intriguing until the combat materialized.

 

[eXalted]

Kickstarter Update

We have been receiving feedback from many different groups, customers, backers, friends and family and of course press. Our press reviews have been really quite good, but some of the online retail reviews from customers have created some challenges for us that we are taking very seriously. We are working very hard addressing some of our critics concerns while still maintaining our vision. Some of these changes are pretty massive and will require a lot of testing, so please excuse our dust for a few days while we make sure everything is perfect for our next update.

Some big changes are coming.

 

[Trash]

Shame. Game is fine as it is. Balance the difficulty curve for a bit and voila.

And I actually like the lack of pre-battle deployment. Battles are supposed to be quick and deadly. Letting the player put his pieces in play already changes that drastically by eliminating a lot of the danger. I like how you have to adapt and make due. And those whining about the two actions per turns? Fucking casuals, mang.

But what about all the mixed reviews? Well... One of the top rated reviews is just one long whine about the ending not being nice to you. Most of the others got no more than an hour of playtime. Guess the entitlement helicopter parented generation just wants to press A for awesome. Another example?

It's difficulty level is artifically inflated by having randomness that deeply impacts the player's ability to progress in any meaningful way, wrapping it in the guise of 'You're going to lose some troops along the way'. That's fine. I lost troops along the way in X-Com, but at no point did I feel it was outside of my ability to claw it back. In Bedlam, one unlucky turn spells the end of your team of veterans and you're left halfway through the game with nothing but a squad of rookies who are going to simply get 1-shot.

How about alternating your fighting team so you got a wider spread of experienced soldiers to fight? What, too taxing? And this is the general gist of the reviews I've read so far. Whining, stupidity and demanding that the game becomes something it is not. Player input is valuable but trying to please everyone will not create a masterpiece. I hope they won't dillute this game to become slower, more plodding, forgiving and ultimately, pedestrain.

 

[SausageInYourFace]

I am not familiar with Bedlam and it might very well be that the balancing is a bit off atm, but I notice a pattern with the last few game releases I'd like to address.

Very often a 'retro' or 'hardcore game' (or whatever you may want to call it) is released to moderate success, a ton of casuals chime in and start complaining about stupid shit - and mostly about the difficulty. You'd think that these games are designed for a certain 'hardcore audience' (lets just call it that for the lack of a better word) but even more niche games seem to attract a bunch of people who do not seem too well accustomed to more 'hardcore' game features. This is particularly annoying in games which are actually designed and marketed with a higher-than-usual game difficulty in mind.

Normally, I couldn't care less about what filthy casuals think about the difficulty in 'hardcore games' but it becomes a problem when they start writing badly informed shitty steam reviews and such, which can become a serious problem, particularly for indie developers. As a result they have to account for these people and casualize their games or at the very least the game difficulty to avoid further backlash. Next time around they might design the whole game with that casual audience in mind.

Thus the seed for new decline is already sown in the very beginning of the recent incline. Its troublesome.

 

[prodigydancer]

As a result they have to account for these people and casualize their games or at the very least the game difficulty to avoid further backlash.

The solution is really simple: you keep your current difficulty level as-is and call it "Insane". And then you add lower difficulties. To avoid putting too much effort in it yet again keep it simple: -25% enemy damage on Hard, -50% on Normal, -75% on Easy. Problem solved, everyone's happy.

 

[eXalted]

Whining, stupidity and demanding that the game becomes something it is not. Player input is valuable but trying to please everyone will not create a masterpiece. I hope they won't dillute this game to become slower, more plodding, forgiving and ultimately, pedestrain.

I'm with you there. Started enjoying the game.

 

[GrainWetski]

The solution is really simple: you keep your current difficulty level as-is and call it "Insane". And then you add lower difficulties. To avoid putting too much effort in it yet again keep it simple: -25% enemy damage on Hard, -50% on Normal, -75% on Easy. Problem solved, everyone's happy.

Or you make a new difficulty called "I'm a retard and I'm playing the wrong game".

 

[eXalted]

Or you make a new difficulty called "I'm a steam player and I'm playing the wrong game".

Fixed that for you.

 

[eXalted]

We're working on getting this update ready and out very soon, but here's the rough notes at this point. We'll give you a more detailed run-down of patch notes once we get things finalized from our team and QA. We're aiming for an early week patch, but we'll see how it does in QA.

• All battle boards are now 16x16 tils. We had some odd sized boards that didn’t work very well with our combat mechanics- the result should be drastically reduced ambush style kills at the outset of combat.
• Remove all ambush battle boards- these are now specific maps that are larger to give players some breathing room. We like these boards but they are getting a more custom treatment.
• Fix spawns no enemy within 8 tiles. This gives players at least one turn to move their units before being fired upon.
• Bug fixes- numerous bug fixes related to gameplay, graphics, and general performance issues.
• Added visual representation of tiles on the battle board to show boundaries of combat map
• You can now use power cells that you pick up during battle. So if you are low on power cells you can pick up some power during combat.

We have read and heard a lot of comments about our two turn or two AP system. We would really like you folks to leave us feedback about the two turn game mechanic at this thread so we can all work together to get it where it needs to be.
Official Thread = http://steamcommunity.com/app/367600/discussions/0/517142253869229943/

 

[Trash]

Well, there it is. Starting to mess with their two actions per turn combat because the filthy casuals find it hard. And to make matters worse, they even removed content by getting rid of the ambush maps. What boggles me is how people couldn't tell the boundaries of a combat map. Guess they're even willing to dilute their own artistic style because of steam retards.

 

[Excidium II]

Two actions shared by all characters is some disgusting gamey shit.

 

[toro]

Well, there it is. Starting to mess with their two actions per turn combat because the filthy casuals find it hard. And to make matters worse, they even removed content by getting rid of the ambush maps. What boggles me is how people couldn't tell the boundaries of a combat map. Guess they're even willing to dilute their own artistic style because of steam retards.

The combat system is bad:
- there is no tactical positioning before fights therefore the game will select the most stupid positions for your squad and you cannot do shit about it,
- you cannot really use more than 4 fighters because one of them will voluntarily take one for the team,
- melee units are kind of useless - minimal damage and they fail to tank opponents,
- sharpshooters die in 1 hit from any other type of fighter which makes them especially hard to protect,
- two actions combat and no initiative queuing is retarded - there are fight in which you basically win by using only one fighter,
- the targeting system is limited - you can only hit at a special range (not closer and no further).

But to be fair, I did not play so much so that I can take advantage of elite fighters and equalizers.

It seems that they took Banner Saga's combat system and they made it worse just for the sake of it. In this case some balancing is welcomed.

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

The combat system is bad:
- there is no tactical positioning before fights therefore the game will select the most stupid positions for your squad and you cannot do shit about it,

I haven't found this to be a big issue. It's been rare that I lose troops right at the start of a battle, and re-positioning the crew is part of the game.

- you cannot really use more than 4 fighters because one of them will voluntarily take one for the team,

I've found this to be true. The only time I've found having 5-6 guys was a good thing was when sacrifices had to be made.

- melee units are kind of useless - minimal damage and they fail to tank opponents,

They're best used for picking up items and taking down snipers (deadeyes). However, if you focus on turning a crew member into an elite (3 kills) then continue to level them (4 kills per level) then damage increases by 1 per level with no cap (highest damage I've had so far was 85). If you wanted to, you could easily make a frontliner into a fast moving tank-y 1-hit-ko monster (would be incredibly handy for beating elite enemies).

- sharpshooters die in 1 hit from any other type of fighter which makes them especially hard to protect,

Agreed. I don't find deadeyes that useful and hardly use them.

- two actions combat and no initiative queuing is retarded - there are fight in which you basically win by using only one fighter,

This is true, but I find it is best to bring at least three crew members to help strategically position enemies where I want them.

- the targeting system is limited - you can only hit at a special range (not closer and no further).

I think it's good as is. If ranges were increased I think it would ruin unit positioning, making all the units too similar, and that would ruin strategic positioning.

But to be fair, I did not play so much so that I can take advantage of elite fighters and equalizers.

Elite fighters are way overpowered because of their much larger hp pools. These guys take a beating and there are no enemies in the game that can dish the kind of damage that would be necessary to take an elite down.

Equalizers kill challenge also. I've found that once I've fully upgraded the dozer and collected 200+ energy, I can use equalizers as much as necessary to dominate in any 'difficult' battle, and get around 50 energy back upon defeating the enemy because I only use three crew (x2 energy bonus). Equalizers can heal your guys and shield them, reducing damage, as well as do a bunch of other things.

I'm finding normal difficulty way too easy, and think the combat system is fine but needs certain aspects balanced (a damage cap, elites should have less hp, only be able to use dozer weapons once a turn and equalizers twice a turn).

 

[Pope Amole II]

Man, these changes are totally retarded. The game is already extremely easy - now it's what, effortless?

ED: to clarify it extremely simply - those people whould ask to fix the rock-paper-scissors because what the fuck? Their beloved scissors can do nothing against the rock, they fail each time - what the fuck, how is that fair? The scissors need to be able to beat the rock or your game is shit!

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

It's looking that way.

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

Here's a couple pics from my current run:

Spoiler

Here I've reached the end game, where I have to head back to Bysantine. I reached Aztec City with 3030 passengers (note that the passenger counter beside 'Boneshaker' at the top goes blank when you deliver them). It's day 778, I have a shitload of crude and plenty of energy for battles. I had literally almost traveled all the paths on the map prior to reaching Aztec City.

Spoiler

Here's Abe Hellistor, an elite Gunslinger. He's level 79 at the moment. Kills: 468. Check out the damage. I like Gunslingers. They have decent movement and range, allowing them to deal with nearly any situation you might find them in.

Edit: There's only 2-3 enemies that I know of that Abe's damage won't outright kill, which is why I've leveled him so much.

 

[Jimmious]

So, assuming I'm someone that enjoyed both FTL and Banner Saga, would this be something I'd love? I'm getting mixed messages all over the place

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

I think it's more like FTL than Banner Saga. The only thing I'm not sure about at this point is the game's longevity, but I'm enjoying it and would recommend picking it up on special if you can wait. If not and you have the money, then jump straight in.

 

[Reapa]

any unlocked dosers yet?

 

[Jimmious]

I think it's more like FTL than Banner Saga. The only thing I'm not sure about at this point is the game's longevity, but I'm enjoying it and would recommend picking it up on special if you can wait. If not and you have the money, then jump straight in.

Good, I guess I'll wait for a sale and pick it up. It'll get some polish until then also, which is never bad

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

any unlocked dosers yet?

I unlocked Gargantox, Detrigore and Imperatron on my current run. It took a fair bit of time picking up the necessary items and/or getting the right events.

 

[Reapa]

I unlocked Gargantox, Detrigore and Imperatron on my current run. It took a fair bit of time picking up the necessary items and/or getting the right events.

what were the items?

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

I backed the kickstarter at tier 7, I think, and got an in-game item, the mutant bobblehead, which granted me audience with the mutant king So-Kraytz, and that's the event that precedes the encounter with Gargantox, which happened in another territory. Edit: It's possible to gain audience with So-Kraytz without the mutant bobblehead, can't remember how though.

There was a yellow/golden pyramid item (that or a bluish color, there're two pyramid shaped items...) which I randomly found and that was used to activate Imperatron. I found Imperatron in a Rogue A.I. territory.

I'm not sure there was an item for Detrigore. I just remember there being an encounter where I was forewarned about cyborgs with a big machine.

All of these dozer encounters involved two fights that have to be won.

 

[Transfiguring Roar]

For those interested, a map of Bedlam showing almost all the paths:

Spoiler