Shadowrun Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut

[DeepOcean]

Didn't the whole revenge for Monika plot relatively quickly turn into "Woah, we're actually in some deep shit ourselves here"?

Sure, revenge was always a possible motivation for you to choose from (and it stayed so throughout the game), but they strongly implied that you needed to get whoever killed Monika because otherwise they would get you, eventually.

You're right here, the logical conclusion that player's ass is on the line as well comes very quickly.

I think this your "ass is on the line" thing is way too vague to generate tension, honestly, the impression I had was more that your team was trying really hard to get "their ass on the line" in the first place. The ork evil dude shows up way too late for the party, before you gatter the 50k, the game was "Dude, if you don't do anything, they will get ya, true story." and I was "Sure game, I totally believe you... as I totally believe I can fail to stop the bad guy, as I totally believe I may fail to get on the last minute on the chamber of doom to stop the evil dudes. "

Love the setting, loved the tb combat, loved the missions and loved the aesthetics but I'm too jaded with fake urgency plots to be impressed by that stuff. The plot on Dragonfall isn't shameful but it is hardly anything inspiring. I think, on a game where you don't plan to introduce some sort of time limit and the real possibility of the bad guys making you fail the story permanently with a bad "fuck you!" ending, the "your ass is on the line" or the "the world will end on 2 hours" plotlines always feel flat and uninteresting. Urgency plots only work with fail states.

This is one of the major reasons why I hate save the world stories on video games and I hate every single Bioware and Bethesda plots, if you pussy out and really don't want to punish the player for lost time, don't go with this kind of stories. I'm not dumb, I know that my characters are totally safe and the world will totally wait for me. That is why I like Fallout 1 and MotB plots so much, you can fail permanently with no easy reloading, it is hard to fail but you can. Torment and Kotor 2 plots come to mind too because they aren't much about urgency but discovery of who your protagonist is.

 

[Athelas]

The conclusion is that the plot is not predictable and it does not have plot holes. That is already better than 99% of movies and books and 99.9% better than other computer games. Add the cool C&C into the mix and this plot is good enough to be considered one of the best ever.

 

[naossano]

It is not just about Monika, but about discovering why deckers start biting the dust and if the dragon that almost destroyed the world is about to rise again.
The actual killer of Monika isn't that important in the ultimate plot...

Spoiler

About DC ending, i can't tell since i have yet to play this version and try these endings, but i was pretty sympathetic to the antagonist in the end. I only stopped him because the plot required to and i mostly trying fighting with reasonable words than with hate. The only relatable reasons to stop him is about the destruction of Berlin, the release of a dangerous dragon and the fact you can't be totally sure that the virus only attack dragons. Otherwise, he totally convinced me about the need to get rid of dragons. The dragon hostage only appear to have some level of sympathy, AFTER you release it. Before that, you have no reason to not kill her.

 

[ArchAngel]

I

The conclusion is that the plot is not predictable and it does not have plot holes. That is already better than 99% of movies and books and 99.9% better than other computer games. Add the cool C&C into the mix and this plot is good enough to be considered one of the best ever.

You are trolling, right?

Unless you got something real to say only you can be trolling.

 

[I'm Big Into Anal]

look


bought this the other week and am seriously not going to trawl 90-odd pages to find a decent starting build.

ill take allcomers, melee and ranged or whatever

 

[naossano]

Lazyfag...

 

[Lord Andre]

look
bought this the other week and am seriously not going to trawl 90-odd pages to find a decent starting build.
ill take allcomers, melee and ranged or whatever

Assault rifle build + whatever (maybe conjuration for haste)

 

[Dreaad]

Yeah easiest is definitely assault rifle. Main etiquette's to take are gang and security.

If you want something a bit more fun than just shooting people go drone control or shaman.

 

[I'm Big Into Anal]

Assault rifle build + whatever (maybe conjuration for haste)

Yeah easiest is definitely assault rifle. Main etiquette's to take are gang and security.

If you want something a bit more fun than just shooting people go drone control or shaman.

 

[I'm Big Into Anal]

Lazyfag...

 

[ArchAngel]

Pure Arcanist is more fun with just enough points into Conjuring to get Haste 2

 

[I'm Big Into Anal]

aw hell ill probably end up doing what i normally do and try most of them until level 5 or so

 

[Jools]

Yeah easiest is definitely assault rifle. Main etiquette's to take are gang and security.

If you want something a bit more fun than just shooting people go drone control or shaman.

Shaman is totally OP, but also totally fun.

 

[Seerix]

It was pretty fun to play trough but all the companions were really getting on my nerves nearing the end game to the point I made a special save and choose the other ending just for the satisfaction of killing them all. It was actually pretty cool "bad end", by the way. Made me much more interested in the Shadowrun world.

 

[hoverdog]

anything that isn't pure melee is fun.

 

[ArchAngel]

anything that isn't pure melee is fun.

Only adept as a melee character sucks. A Katana focused character is good. You can focus into strength, dex and con and be good.

 

[DeepOcean]

That ki strike something ability that adepts have almost guarantee 100% critical, reaching level 3 on adept powers is great, after that, the powers are too expensive for the benefit.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

So, once getting confirmation that it wasn't a requirement to understand references in the sequel, I finally decided that I couldn't be bothered with finishing DMS and I started this few days ago.

Roughly half way through it (I think... I'm almost done with Alice money) I'm mostly enjoying it, far more than the previous game for sure, but playing at Very Hard I'm starting to get the feeling that my party isn't progressing and improving as much as the average enemy, and I wonder if I'm doing something wrong or it's just how that's supposed to be at this difficulty setting.

I'm playing with the a "decker+assault rifle" build, and from what I can gather you have hardly any impact on your team development, since their equipment and stats are apparently fixed and out of your control, with just few talents of dubious value once in a while.
Now, just to be clear, this is not strictly an issue about the game being "too hard" and unmanageable, since in the end I'm always making progress somehow. It's just that... It really isn't very satisfying at this point. It almost feels like my team is getting weaker rather than more experienced and well oiled.

Killing pretty much anything *still* involves a lot of misses and even more hits landed, every fight drags for what feels like forever and yeah, I'll even admit in some specific case (i.e. optional mission vs ghouls in the sewers) my whole party seems to have hardly enough fire power to down a single enemy, while the remaining ones can then proceed to easily brutalize any targeted party member with no apparent effort.

Did I miss something about ways to buff my overall damage output?

 

[Doktor Best]

Smartlink and the shaman accuracy buff are mandatory imho for the highest difficulty setting. Also buying pets for shaman helps alot, they basically just exist to buff haste/accuracy and unleash pet spawns on the enemy (run with them straight into melee battle so they dont go berserk on your ass if they break free from your control).

You can also swap equipment on your teammates, so buying new guns for them is also important.

And yes some missions are hard, as its supposed to be on the highest difficulty But in the end i made it even though i missspent alot of points (went for pistols until i realized theyre shit and switched to assault rifle pretty late in the game)

 

[DeepOcean]

I'm playing with the a "decker+assault rifle" build, and from what I can gather you have hardly any impact on your team development, since their equipment and stats are apparently fixed and out of your control, with just few talents of dubious value once in a while.
Now, just to be clear, this is not strictly an issue about the game being "too hard" and unmanageable, since in the end I'm always making progress somehow. It's just that... It really isn't very satisfying at this point. It almost feels like my team is getting weaker rather than more experienced and well oiled.

Strange, I was buttraping and calling names at the end of Dragonfall on very hard. Assault rifle in particular is just an ass raping machine on full auto. If you are doing an assault rifle/decker, are you using that marking ability deckers have? Did you grab that eye cyberware that gives accuracy? Are you using Dietritch's aim spell? Are your guns smartlinked? Are you flushing enemies out of cover with grenades that cause the unbalanced effect or Glory melee attacks? The fights with the ghouls is tough and they can kick your ass, are you using crowd control stuff to slow them down or stun them?

 

[Jason Liang]

So, once getting confirmation that it wasn't a requirement to understand references in the sequel, I finally decided that I couldn't be bothered with finishing DMS and I started this few days ago.

Roughly half way through it (I think... I'm almost done with Alice money) I'm mostly enjoying it, far more than the previous game for sure, but playing at Very Hard I'm starting to get the feeling that my party isn't progressing and improving as much as the average enemy, and I wonder if I'm doing something wrong or it's just how that's supposed to be at this difficulty setting.

I'm playing with the a "decker+assault rifle" build, and from what I can gather you have hardly any impact on your team development, since their equipment and stats are apparently fixed and out of your control, with just few talents of dubious value once in a while.
Now, just to be clear, this is not strictly an issue about the game being "too hard" and unmanageable, since in the end I'm always making progress somehow. It's just that... It really isn't very satisfying at this point. It almost feels like my team is getting weaker rather than more experienced and well oiled.

Killing pretty much anything *still* involves a lot of misses and even more hits landed, every fight drags for what feels like forever and yeah, I'll even admit in some specific case (i.e. optional mission vs ghouls in the sewers) my whole party seems to have hardly enough fire power to down a single enemy, while the remaining ones can then proceed to easily brutalize any targeted party member with no apparent effort.

Since you are the decker I assume you're leaving Blitz at home and taking Glory, Dietrich and Eiger. Eiger and Glory are your main damage dealers so you have to learn to use them effectively. Glory should never use her pistol and should always be going to melee buffed by Aim, Haste and her implant. I know some people give Glory a taser but I didn't find it useful.

Eiger should also be buffed by Aim and positioned far far away to use her Sniper Rifle (I found her optimal range to be around 1 1/2 screens away). Eiger also has a shotgun but it isn't optimal. Of course, her grenades are awesome. Use Glory to lure and knock opponents out of cover.

Dietrich basically uses most of his actions to buff, heal and occasionally summon a spirit to meat tank. He doesn't get much chance to use his fireball, and his other attacks are lousy.

Not sure what your own setup is, but the best way to leverage intellect in combat is to take 1-2 Drones along. Even if you don't max out the Drone skills, the extra attacks make combat much easier. This does pose a problem since you only get 3 weapon slots, so if you want to take your deck you need to leave out either a gun or a drone. The best solution for me was the poison gas lung cyberware. This attack doesn't take a weapon slot and doesn't even need a weapon skill so it's perfect for a decker/ rigger. Another solution would be to invest in some magic so you can attack with say flamethrower and help with the buffing/ healing. Finally you can simply invest in melee and just punch people since that frees a weapon slot.

Combat can be very easy if you are willing to min/ max your character and abuse the character system.

 

[ArchAngel]

Very hard is of course hard. Don't play on that difficulty and complain you cannot hit stuff.
And not controlling your companion stats is not new, both fallouts did it.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

Very hard is of course hard. Don't play on that difficulty and complain you cannot hit stuff.
And not controlling your companion stats is not new, both fallouts did it.

Well, thank you for the patronizing and useless reply.
Too bad I wasn't "complaining" as much as asking advice.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record there are plenty of games that manage different difficulty settings in ways that are different from "We'll gimp every single one of your stats/dice throws", no there was nothing telling me that "not hitting stuff" is "How it's supposed to be".

To everyone else: well, thank you for your suggestion but i already did most of that stuff, so I guess I'll have to accept how the game is supposed to feel.
Just for the record I was trying a new game at "Hard" while waiting for replies here and Jesus, it's almost like playing two different games for how much easier it gets.

P.S. i also managed to pass the ghoul fight in the sewers on Very Hard, but that's been... expensive in terms of consumables.

 

[Ninjerk]

Very hard is of course hard. Don't play on that difficulty and complain you cannot hit stuff.
And not controlling your companion stats is not new, both fallouts did it.

Well, thank you for the patronizing and useless reply.
Too bad I wasn't "complaining" as much as asking advice.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record there are plenty of games that manage different difficulty settings in ways that are different from "We'll gimp every single one of your stats/dice throws", no there was nothing telling me that "not hitting stuff" is "How it's supposed to be".

To everyone else: well, thank you for your suggestion but i already did most of that stuff, so I guess I'll have to accept how the game is supposed to feel.
Just for the record I was trying a new game at "Hard" while waiting for replies here and Jesus, it's almost like playing two different games for how much easier it gets.

P.S. i also managed to pass the ghoul fight in the sewers on Very Hard, but that's been... expensive in terms of consumables.

Abuse AP affecting things. The taser is p. gud, but don't be tempted by the free reload in the pistol category (it doesn't count as pistol, despite appearance).

 

[Athelas]

Very hard is of course hard. Don't play on that difficulty and complain you cannot hit stuff.
And not controlling your companion stats is not new, both fallouts did it.

Well, thank you for the patronizing and useless reply.
Too bad I wasn't "complaining" as much as asking advice.

EDIT: Oh, and for the record there are plenty of games that manage different difficulty settings in ways that are different from "We'll gimp every single one of your stats/dice throws", no there was nothing telling me that "not hitting stuff" is "How it's supposed to be".

Might I recommend another recently released turn-based cyberpunk RPG, Invisible Inc.?

It's fully deterministic. Attacks can't miss. They do kill you in one shot though.