Shadowrun Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut

[roshan]

Wow, another patch for this is on the way:
http://steamcommunity.com/games/300550/announcements/detail/160219938146427343

These guys are incredible in their commitment and professionalism.

 

[kazgar]

Wow, another patch for this is on the way:
http://steamcommunity.com/games/300550/announcements/detail/160219938146427343

These guys are incredible in their commitment and professionalism.

I guess some of these are from working on hong kong? Or working on these also improves hong kong? Benefits of keeping engine but having new projects.

 

[Immortal]

Played it.

I got a lot of quibbles (hard mode is incredibly annoying because you get docked enough accuracy to constantly be in this horrible 60-70% CTH range where you can't plan out a turn at all, the AI automatically using grenades if you have two characters next to one another and never using them if you don't, the areas where you get stuck in a lot of fights that don't drop you out of combat mode between setpieces are way too aggravating to imagine a replay) but it finished strong. I'd play one of these a year forever.

Edit - Another huge irritation: 45 degree/diagonal flanking. why. Long War could not have made me internalize 90 degree flanking any harder

It's also cool that Shadowrun has outlasted cyberpunk more or less and now the Tolkien stuff actually kinda spruces up the cliches.

Idle thought while I was playing: Did the real Tolkien exist in the Shadowrun universe? They must have brought it up in a splatbook or something. Do you get a pass on racism if blacks didn't exist when you said bad things about them? Or is it like, "A racist society (also the rulebook) forced these Tolkienian race roles on us! 'Dwarf' is a social construct!"

I thought for sure this was a bug.. I hate when I am forced to "Turn Base" through a level with no encounters..

 

[TedNugent]

The setting is fucking idiotic (especially the stupid Cthulhu bullshit Jesus Christ)

The art and sound design are gorgeous, barring a few ugly portraits/character models (Lofwyr's giant fuckin nose wtf ).

 

[Infinitron]

Wow, another patch for this is on the way:
http://steamcommunity.com/games/300550/announcements/detail/160219938146427343

These guys are incredible in their commitment and professionalism.

I think this was just released.

 

[pippin]

I can confirm this. A new update is on my Steam queue.

 

[Sykar]

Yes just DLed a 330 MB patch. Best feature is the restored Audran dialogue for me, it was really jarring that it refused to commence the first time you went into the manor.

 

[gestalt11]

The background stuff (which mostly comes up in dialogue with Absinthe/Lofwyr) about the "Horrors". I did some reading into the setting/lore while playing, since it's new to me, and they seem like pretty textbook Lovecraft beasties; eldritch monstrosities from another dimension waiting to cross the Gate and devour humanity, the true natures of which are so horrifying that just to know too much about them drives men insane.

Yes this is true to a point. But you are being to general. Lovecraft was a genre changer (regardless of all his other flaws, this is true). What you are describing is a common trope that came out the genre change initiated by Lovecrafts (and to some extent Robert E. Howard as they actively shared their cosmology with each to some extent), but very few things actually truly capture the flavor of Lovecraft they just reuse some basic premises. You might well be complain that fireballs exists in shadowrun and that makes it bad because D&D had a fireball spell.

Secondly most of the "Horrors" stuff is actually more applicable to Earthdawn which is a related setting from thousands of years previous when magic is at its height. The prevalence of the "Horrors" is directly related to the the amount of magic in the world. In Shadowrun the "Horrors" are extremely vague, in Earthdawn they are actively being faught against and in some cases have destroyed entire cities. In fact the origin story of Harlequin is based around the manner in which some elves fight the "Horrors" and an order of knights he belongs to.

One of the hallmarks of Lovecraft stories is that they are very vague, the better to evoke a sense of horror, and Shadowrun does actually line up to this more, since magic is still new and not at its height they are a distant thing. But they are in fact much more well defined and there is a good deal of source material on them when you take Earthdawn into consideration and their conception diverges from Lovecrafts quite a lot in actuality. Although it is clearly heavily influenced by Lovecraft this simply cannot be disputed.

 

[omega21]

It's on sale on Steam now and fuck, I'm curious.

OK, tar and feather me all you want, but I'm only vaguely familiar with the Shadowrun verse and this sort of turn-based combat; will that handicap me greatly or will the game ease me into it?

 

[Ismaul]

OK, tar and feather me all you want, but I'm only vaguely familiar with the Shadowrun verse and this sort of turn-based combat; will that handicap me greatly or will the game ease me into it?

Just bend over. You'll be fine.


Might be a little painful at first, but with practice you'll feel right at home.

 

[Ninjerk]

It's on sale on Steam now and fuck, I'm curious.

OK, tar and feather me all you want, but I'm only vaguely familiar with the Shadowrun verse and this sort of turn-based combat; will that handicap me greatly or will the game ease me into it?

SRR is piss easy, DFall has a reasonable range of difficulty options IIRC and is a much better game.

 

[Alfons]

DFall has a reasonable range of difficulty options IIRC and is a much better game.

That's an understatement, it's so much better it makes DMS obsolete.

 

[Ismaul]

DFall has a reasonable range of difficulty options IIRC and is a much better game.

That's an understatement, it's so much better it makes DMS obsolete.

Actually, the noir story / ambiance of the first half of DMS hasn't been present in Dragonfall, so that's one thing where Dragonfall doesn't replace DMS.

I'd like an expansion with that atmosphere, low key, one character. Judging by the last screens, we might be getting a better atmosphere this time around.

 

[naossano]

DMS is much better for graphic whoring too.

 

[Alfons]

Actually, the noir story / ambiance of the first half of DMS hasn't been present in Dragonfall, so that's one thing where Dragonfall doesn't replace DMS.

I thought the story was rather weak in both. At least DF gave you a team which had the by-product of story being present during missions instead of the perpetual dead silence of DMS.

DMS is much better for graphic whoring too.

It's an isometric indie game, who cares.

 

[gestalt11]

Although I think Dragonfall (especially with DC) is a superior game, I find it tragic that people's desire for a Dragonfall-esque style game has impingned upon their appreciation for the really quite good "novel as game" that Deadman's Switch is.

I am not saying that there were not real problems with like saving etc. but it was really pretty decent experience and story even if it was constrained. The caveat there being that recognizing this is important even though it may be lacking in other key aspects people want.

I don't wnat to minimize freedom of choice etc. I mean goddamn I love Arcanum or playing a Malkavian in Bloodlines, but I have read so many just plain not that great novels ... and I have read 100s maybe even over 1000... that I feel its imporatant to say Deadman's Switch really was pretty solid for what it was. And would ask that people recognize this even in the face of its real problems on release (many of which were addressed by DF:DC). I won't argue about the real problems it had. I just can't. But even so I will take it without regret, at least in face face of continuing events.

For whatever its problems, DMS had some pretty good stuff in it overall. I am not telling you the glass is half full. I am not saying its the game of the year. What i am saying is it had some pretty good shit in it despite that. And honestly that is pretty rare.

 

[Ismaul]

DMS is much better for graphic whoring too.

It's an isometric indie game, who cares.

Right. Art direction and quality only matter in first and third person AAA games.

 

[naossano]

DMS is much better for graphic whoring too.

It's an isometric indie game, who cares.

It is worth caring about as the graphics are a billion better than AAA games that require you to change your hardware, and put them to shame. (and only talking about the visual/sound)

 

[Alfons]

Right. Art direction and quality only matter in first and third person AAA games.

Since when are the words graphics and art direction synonymous? There are games with shit graphics that have great art direction.

 

[Lhynn]

Right. Art direction and quality only matter in first and third person AAA games.

Since when are the words graphics and art direction synonymous? There are games with shit graphics that have great art direction.

Graphics are the way the game is represented on the screen, this includes the art, the camera and other techniques, at least thats as far as i know.

And i rather watch 6 hours of SSR graphics than 15 minutes of the best AAA 3D graphics of this generation.

 

[Alfons]

Graphics are the way the game is represented on the screen, this includes the art, the camera and other techniques, at least thats as far as i know.

I always thought the broadest term for presentation is just presentation, not graphics. Graphics govern the technical side of presentation, pixel count, polygons , texture quality etc. and art design is just that.

The sentence:" Game X came out in 98. The graphics suck by today's standards, but the game still looks great due to wonderful art design" seems semantically correct to me.

 

[roshan]

I wouldn't call DMS obsolete, I played it after DDC (but ported DMS to the DC engine) and enjoyed it quite a bit. Of course, it's totally linear, but the story and atmosphere was great, and more than that, it had lots of memorable characters. It was really easy even on max difficulty though. Still, quite a fun romp.

 

[TedNugent]

SRR OC was the first game I played, the only thing that was absolute shit about it was the class balance.

The game was extremely linear, and it was sort of painful, but forgivable considering they probably had a limited budget, they fixed it completely in Dragonfall, and the quality of the quest writing was high enough that it was at least enjoyable anyway.

Just do not build a close combat character in SRR OC. Do not do it. The only thing you need is a full quickness build with pumped assault rifle stats. I initially made a close combat character and I had to restart 25% of the way through. Restarted and pumped quickness/assault rifles and coasted through the game oneshotting everything with burst fire.

 

[Ismaul]

I always thought the broadest term for presentation is just presentation, not graphics. Graphics govern the technical side of presentation, pixel count, polygons , texture quality etc. and art design is just that.

The sentence:" Game X came out in 98. The graphics suck by today's standards, but the game still looks great due to wonderful art design" seems semantically correct to me.

Ahhh, semantics.

The confusion between 'graphics' and 'graphics technology' is something we have the journos, PR-dudes and videocard manufacturers to thank for. Either they have an interest in making you believe higher graphics technology = better visuals, so you buy a new videocard and the next iteration of the same game with "better graphics", you "keep up with the times"; or they know nothing about art direction, like most journos, and can only judge a game's visuals based on some polygon numbers or special effects middleware.

So after more than a decade of equating one with the other, it has become something taken as evident. Just like if most news medias label a particular act as "terrorist", or a protest as "illegal". People generally believe what they're told.

 

[naossano]

More polygons doesn't mean better graphics.