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Shadowrun Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut

Jaesun

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OK Finished "Trial Run"..... that sure ended with a BANG..... :M

And I wasn't sure what to say to Lucas, but ultimately I decided I didn't want to be a mindless goon for them, and that fails the "Test". I wonder what other missions I will miss out because of that?

And seriously, TWO Karma for that mission? Fuck you (granted I took the easy way out). I wonder if fighting your way out gives you more?
 

Lujo

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And seriously, TWO Karma for that mission? Fuck you (granted I took the easy way out). I wonder if fighting your way out gives you more?

I actually have a bit of a conceptual problem with the new mission design, karma rewards and very hard dificulty. Namely, without karma to burn on random stuff to unlock options you reduce the ammount of things you can really do in a run. Getting yourself to not miss a lot also takes a decent karma investment, and being unable to do stuff other than fiight ussually means you end up having to fight your way out of situations more often, requiring you to spend more karma on fighting skill, further reducing your options.

The content per run is ussually pretty damned low in these circumstances unless you use the console to give yourself options, not in order to cheeze but in order to just get to see stuff. I'm getting a feeling that the system has a bit of a conceptual problem here.

I think tieing all the ettiquettes to charisma, while also having charisma be a "raw" way into various options was a bit of a mistake. And Elf guy who gets better in fights based on Charisma is at a distinct advantage when it comes to experiencing the game content (and it looks like it certainly affects difficulty, will have to try it once).
 

DeepOcean

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And seriously, TWO Karma for that mission? Fuck you (granted I took the easy way out). I wonder if fighting your way out gives you more?
No, tried that and got the same 2 karma.
Avoided messing with the security console and attacked the guards on the ground floor, after the alarm activated, the building had alot more guards than before. Had to fight my way in to reach both apartments and had to fight alot of guards on the way out. Now imagine playing with a melee street samurai, forgetting to change his loadout and getting there with just one medkit for the whole group after the elf died, that dwarf saved my ass with her taser so many times. Now thinking what Glory could do with that psycho dwarf taser from the Pharma Clean up mission...
 

Zetor

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Okay, one of the new endings is very much "that just happened".


I think people who were complaining about not being able to join the winning team near the end should be satisfied...
... and realize why they were completely wrong to think it could end well. The extended (playable) epilogue is pretty much ~15 minutes of rubbing it in. :smug:
 

dryan

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And seriously, TWO Karma for that mission? Fuck you (granted I took the easy way out). I wonder if fighting your way out gives you more?
No, tried that and got the same 2 karma.
Avoided messing with the security console and attacked the guards on the ground floor, after the alarm activated, the building had alot more guards than before. Had to fight my way in to reach both apartments and had to fight alot of guards on the way out. Now imagine playing with a melee street samurai, forgetting to change his loadout and getting there with just one medkit for the whole group after the elf died, that dwarf saved my ass with her taser so many times. Now thinking what Glory could do with that psycho dwarf taser from the Pharma Clean up mission...

I tried that with my wimpy decker and died a lot of times. I had to take the easy way out.
 

Blaine

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
Either they really upped the difficulty or you're extraordinarily bad because that mission was a breeze (though my PC died in the first post-cyberzombie fight, using up a trauma patch). Cyberzombie is OP as hell, I was killing multiple persons per round with his giant axe.

They really upped the difficulty. If you use all three of the Cyberzombie's AP axing one person, you have a good chance of killing that person (especially if you've marked him), but it's not guaranteed. Only very rarely will you manage to kill even two people per round with him, including when using Cleave on a small group, or the chaingun. I actually doubt you can kill two with the axe unless one or both are at half health. Mages are a bit more vulnerable, but you still almost certainly won't kill two in a single turn on VH.

Obviously some other people ITT have played through that mission. If they play on VH, they can confirm this.

This is further reinforced by people on the official forums mentioning killing "2-4 enemies per turn" in vanilla Dragonfall on that mission, even if they were playing on Normal. Upping it to VH would have reduced that to 1-2 enemies per turn, which is still a lot more than in Dragonfall VH where it's extremely rare Eiger can kill even one enemy all by herself in a turn, haste, drugs and buffs notwithstanding (though the +aim% or +damage totem might help).

You might want to play the actual game at some point and see for yourself instead of making a fool of yourself trying to insult my skill based on old and outdated information, especially when pretty much everyone agrees that the overall difficulty in DC is markedly increased.
 
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Lujo

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Obviously some other people ITT have played through that mission. If they play on VH, they can confirm this.

Absolutely true, the prototype troll can kill about one person per round, possibly 2 under rare circumstances. And since almost every group has at least one guy trying to control him, the first turn or so for the troll is ussually spent charging into the enemy and gunning for that guy. There are 2 who can control him in one group, too, and I lost control of him for a round in almost every fight. The troll is a killer, it's true, he's really, really, really strong, but I played that mission last (did both aztec missions, and everything else before doing it) and it was stil sorta tricky.

The very hard difficulty has increased substantialy. After having finished the game, I think playing it on very hard is just an excercise in frustration and that regardless of the difference between it and hard, hard is the way to go.




Also, there's a rather major bug which hit me where I can't use spelly on Eiger. From one point on you just can use anything on her, and I suspect it's because on of her level-up abilities decreases her essence low enough that the game starts treating her as a robot or something. Considering how important the accuracy buff is in-game this is a major pain in the ass.




Okay, one of the new endings is very much "that just happened".

I think people who were complaining about not being able to join the winning team near the end should be satisfied...
... and realize why they were completely wrong to think it could end well. The extended (playable) epilogue is pretty much ~15 minutes of rubbing it in. :smug:

What are you talking about exactly? The conversation with Lofwyr on the tram?





Also, anyone know what the deal is with the last fight? I did it without hacking, so I'm unusre what hacking that terminal even does?
 

Gord

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Also, anyone know what the deal is with the last fight? I did it without hacking, so I'm unusre what hacking that terminal even does?

Unless they changed it in the DC, it only buys you some time, I think. Probably not worth it if you down Audran fast enough.
 

Roguey

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You might want to play the actual game at some point and see for yourself instead of making a fool of yourself trying to insult my skill based on old and outdated information, especially when pretty much everyone agrees that the overall difficulty in DC is markedly increased.
I already played it months ago, I'm not going to do it again so soon.

Anyway, I didn't make a test level, but I did the-next-best thing and ran through the first battle on the first mission of Dragonfall: Original Cut with the same character on all four difficulty modes by killing the guy to the south then ending the turn so the two to the north can show up in the same spots. Here are the results:

Very Hard: 69% 51%
Hard: 79% 58%
Normal and Easy: 92% 67%

I opened up the level in the editor and saw that both enemies had a 3 in quickness, which verifies my claim that the baseline difficulty is Very Hard and then it subtracts from every stat except body and charisma. Since you can't have a stat of 0, easy ends up with the same accuracy as normal for that particular fight. I sincerely doubt HBS would suddenly reverse this for Dragonfall: DC.

Additionally, while testing this I found out that HBS never fixed the bug where saving and loading while in combat results in your getting a penalty to your accuracy (but it looks like they finally did it with the first DC patch). So my earlier accuracy stats were inaccurate, Dietrich actually gets a 22% and 32% chance to hit those two guys instead of 17% and 23%. Regardless, I finished the game just fine with even less-accuracy than what DF:DC gives you according to Blaine's screenshot, so Roguey Was Right and Blaine Was Wrong.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Additionally, while testing this I found out that HBS never fixed the bug where saving and loading while in combat results in your getting a penalty to your accuracy

Ah, I knew I wasn't imagining this.

Do you think this might be related to difficulty, btw? (ie, the game applying the difficulty malus twice, by mistake)

Might be interesting to see if it happens on all difficulty levels.
 

Roguey

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Additionally, while testing this I found out that HBS never fixed the bug where saving and loading while in combat results in your getting a penalty to your accuracy

Ah, I knew I wasn't imagining this.

Do you think this might be related to difficulty, btw? (ie, the game applying the difficulty malus twice, by mistake)

Might be interesting to see if it happens on all difficulty levels.
Well as I said http://steamcommunity.com/games/300550/announcements/detail/233382525093590072

Fixed an issue that caused the Difficulty scaling to be applied multiple times after loading a mid-mission save.

You could have done that a bit sooner, HBS. ^_^
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Roguey What I'm saying is, if the game was balanced for Very Hard as you say, wouldn't the scaling not be applied when you're on Very Hard? Since that's actually the default difficulty of the level.
 

Roguey

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Roguey What I'm saying is, if the game was balanced for Very Hard as you say, wouldn't the scaling not be applied when you're on Very Hard? Since that's actually the default difficulty of the level.
Strange bug logic. I say if easy were the base then you'd have greater accuracy values than normal instead of the same (and that probably would be the case with a 4 quickness enemy, and I probably will inevitably go through my rewinds until I find one to test it out).

Edit: Tried it with the boss level which has enemies with 4 and 5 quickness: normal and easy accuracy remained the same, which I find puzzling. It doesn't affect hp, accuracy, or crit chance so what does it change????????? Undocumented changes ftl.

So I tested out the scaling bug. Fresh from the autosave? 99% and 79%. After saving and loading? 99% and 79%.
:rage:
Roguey Was Wrong, HBS lied, turns out normal really is balanced (lol) and hard and very hard add additional penalties. Carry on with your hard playthrough, Blainey.
 
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Zetor

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Also, there's a rather major bug which hit me where I can't use spelly on Eiger. From one point on you just can use anything on her, and I suspect it's because on of her level-up abilities decreases her essence low enough that the game starts treating her as a robot or something. Considering how important the accuracy buff is in-game this is a major pain in the ass.
Sounds like a bug. I'm in the last combat of the game right now, and I can definitely buff Eiger (though Glory is more important to buff with accuracy imo).

Okay, one of the new endings is very much "that just happened".

I think people who were complaining about not being able to join the winning team near the end should be satisfied...
... and realize why they were completely wrong to think it could end well. The extended (playable) epilogue is pretty much ~15 minutes of rubbing it in. :smug:

What are you talking about exactly? The conversation with Lofwyr on the tram?
I'm talking about joining forces with the endboss, which is a new option added with DC. A few posters here were complaining about the lack of this option before... well, you got your wish. Enjoy!
 

Blaine

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Roguey
Might be hidden cheats that change, such as the Man In A Suit with 6+ medkits I ran into, more/better/secretly buffed grenades, secretly buffed weapon damage, or really devious stuff such as friendly attacks that should hit sometimes missing, or enemy attacks that shouldn't hit sometimes hitting. That would make a lot of sense to me, actually.

It makes even more sense when you consider that because this game has an editor but that non-developers can't really be expected to balance for every difficulty, a lot of the actual difficulty adjustments might be done behind the scenes.
 

Lujo

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Also, there's a rather major bug which hit me where I can't use spelly on Eiger. From one point on you just can use anything on her, and I suspect it's because on of her level-up abilities decreases her essence low enough that the game starts treating her as a robot or something. Considering how important the accuracy buff is in-game this is a major pain in the ass.
Sounds like a bug. I'm in the last combat of the game right now, and I can definitely buff Eiger (though Glory is more important to buff with accuracy imo).

Yeah, I couldn't buff her or heal her, and while I'll deffinitely buff Glory, Eiger has a bit of an easier time picking targets (especially after her mission) and if she could hit anything dependably she could take out annoying stuff more easily because she doesn't have to move to much. Not being able to recieve aim and heals is annoying on Very Hard.

Also, they still haven't fixed (or I'm an idiot) the problem that you can't give stuff you find during a mission to your crew, so on the final long mission the crates of healing and greanade went to waste as my main character had a full inventory and had to statsh all the stuff, while there was room on the other guys. Or am I wrong?
 

WhiteGuts

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Just a quick question : does improving skills actually *improves* said skill or does it just unlock special abilities ? The game is kinda vague about it.
 
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Gord

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I think improving some skills really improves the associated rating, e.g. ranged combat will improve to-hit, melee weapons will increase the chance for bonus-damage and so on.
 

Zetor

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Also, there's a rather major bug which hit me where I can't use spelly on Eiger. From one point on you just can use anything on her, and I suspect it's because on of her level-up abilities decreases her essence low enough that the game starts treating her as a robot or something. Considering how important the accuracy buff is in-game this is a major pain in the ass.
Sounds like a bug. I'm in the last combat of the game right now, and I can definitely buff Eiger (though Glory is more important to buff with accuracy imo).

Yeah, I couldn't buff her or heal her, and while I'll deffinitely buff Glory, Eiger has a bit of an easier time picking targets (especially after her mission) and if she could hit anything dependably she could take out annoying stuff more easily because she doesn't have to move to much. Not being able to recieve aim and heals is annoying on Very Hard.

Also, they still haven't fixed (or I'm an idiot) the problem that you can't give stuff you find during a mission to your crew, so on the final long mission the crates of healing and greanade went to waste as my main character had a full inventory and had to statsh all the stuff, while there was room on the other guys. Or am I wrong?
Yep, sounds like a bug. Did you take the Huntress upgrade for her? (the reflexes cyberware)

As for giving stuff you find on a mission to the crew: if you pick up a medkit (etc) on any non-main character, it'll go into their inventory instead of the MC. You can go into turn-based mode by clicking on a jackpoint if you want to do this.

Also, there is a medkit dispenser right before the final battle that gives an advanced medkit to everyone on your team.
 

DeepOcean

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Just a quick question : does improving skills acutally *improves* said skill or does it just unlock special abilities ? The game is kinda vague about it.
Weapon skills improve critical hit chance, ranged combat, spellcasting, conjuring, decking, close combat and the attributes improve the to hit chance. Strengh being the only attribute that improves damage and only for unarmed and melee.
 

Lujo

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Yep, sounds like a bug. Did you take the Huntress upgrade for her? (the reflexes cyberware)

As for giving stuff you find on a mission to the crew: if you pick up a medkit (etc) on any non-main character, it'll go into their inventory instead of the MC. You can go into turn-based mode by clicking on a jackpoint if you want to do this.

Also, there is a medkit dispenser right before the final battle that gives an advanced medkit to everyone on your team.

Yeah, I took the reflex cyberware I think (the one which makes her dodge stuff) - this not only made me unable to target her w spells, it also ment that her own reload-all-weapons thing didn't work, and she said the new gun could designate targets but that ability never showed up either. Another annyoance when you can't buff her w spells is that you can't haste her, which is also rather annoying.

Yeah, I've been picking up stuff with other guys whenever I could go into combat mode, but I think there's a bunch of stuff that doesn't have a jackpoint nearby, so if it takes jacking in and backtracking it's really annoying.
 

Shadowfang

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Anyone has any insight on what does the platelet factory cyberware do?
The description is kinda vague. I googled it and only got about tabletop rules.

Edit: It seems it works like a heal spell, but i havent checked it personally yet.
 
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WhiteGuts

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Escape during the False Flag mission seems really tricky, or maybe I'm not strong enough for it. Think I'll rewind and try the other mission first.
 

DeepOcean

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Played a bit more with my adept and it's made of rape. Get one bottle of Cram before each run(+3AP, +2Movement) , before tough fight, use the cram. Walk from one side of the screen to the other side with Stride(+2 movement passive and +4 when active), hit two to three enemies with chi focus(100% critical chance) and on round 1, two to three enemies are pratically dead and stunned. Magic resistance and martial defense spell + decent armor = you don't need to care being on the open.
 

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