Tacticular Cancer: We'll have your balls

  1. Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.
    Dismiss Notice

Review RPG Codex Review: Torment: Tides of Numenera

Discussion in 'RPG News & Content' started by felipepepe, Mar 12, 2017.

  1. Lurker King Arcane The Real Fanboy

    Lurker King
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2015
    Parrots:
    1,864,923
    Click here and disable ads!
    You mean these reviews?

    "Good work environment, poorly organized"
    Former Employee - Anonymous Employee in Newport Beach, CA

    Recommends
    Neutral Outlook
    No opinion of CEO

    I worked at InXile Entertainment full-time (More than a year)

    Pros

    Very positive atmosphere, great location, producers are encouraged to get feedback on design choices from everyone. Willing to promote from within, which is rare for the industry. This is not a good place if you're looking long-term, but as a 1-2 year position, it's worth it.

    Cons

    Disorganized in how they execute their projects. Very large communication gap between upper management and the engineers/artists, which sometimes translated into offhanded comments turning into week-long or even month-long blind alleys distracting important team members from the primary project. There was also a philosophical clash between the Leads' expectations of team members and HRs' expectations of team members and HRs' expectations of team members which could result in a pat on the back from a Lead turning into a negative review from management.

    Advice to Management

    The main thing that I hope has been learned is that having focused, clear project goals is vital to keeping everyone on the same page during development. Especially once you get toward feature-lock and engineers are pushing hard for their pet feature to get included, having a solid design bible at hand can save the project from grinding to a halt.

    "Good luck to inXile - don't touch with ten foot pole"


    Former Employee - Senior Artist in Newport Beach, CA
    Doesn't Recommend
    Disapproves of CEO


    Pros

    -While I was there, there were many talented people that I was proud to work with.
    -Good location, right next to the beach.
    -Pay was pretty good for the industry.

    Cons

    -Company had a hiring frenzy, by placing more cooks in the kitchen and crossed their fingers.
    -You have to pick up slack of other people.
    -Very visual game company, gameplay second or third.
    -No backend, and management doesn't understand technology and limitations.
    -Laid off everyone that was competent, and left behind the muses.
    -No one left to make games, only management.


    Advice to Management

    Be more involved with design decisions. Don't come in at the end of development and wonder what's going on! Don't leave your trusted few to do the work, be involved for success! It such a small company, talk to your own workers! Corporation mentality doesn't work anymore, you don't have hundreds or thousands of employee like the Interplay days.


    "Blind leading a sight seeing dog"
    Former Employee - Anonymous Employee in Newport Beach, CA

    Doesn't Recommend
    Disapproves of CEO



    Pros

    Pay is generally higher than surrounding studios

    Cons

    "Upside down cake" studio.
    Higher ups have no clue why things are failing. They refuse to talk to their own workers to acknowledge and fix their problems.

    Advice to Management

    Please google the following:
    Peter's Principle and Dunning Kruger Effect. They both apply so perfectly to the studio.



    "meh"
    Former Employee - Anonymous Employee

    Doesn't Recommend
    Disapproves of CEO

    Pros

    all about the location, there

    Cons

    no vision, no funding, no shoes, no shirt, no service

    Advice to Management
    meh
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2017
    • Informative x 22
    • Funny x 8
    • Brofist x 5
    • Old x 4
    • retadred x 2
    • Agree x 1
    • Despair x 1
    ^ Top  
  2. Junmarko Arcane Patron

    Junmarko
    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
    Parrots:
    1,048
    Location:
    Australia
    Bubbles In Memoria Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    It does. Technical flaws aside, the Shadowrun series has a good balance of Strategy-Story+C&C - throughout. The fact that they were able to achieve it, using a game engine essentially neutered by tablets, makes inXile look hopeless.
     
    • Agree Agree x 15
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    • Despair Despair x 1
    ^ Top  
  3. commie The Last Marxist Patron

    commie
    Joined:
    May 12, 2010
    Parrots:
    1,864,652
    Location:
    Where one can weep in peace
    Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Divinity: Original Sin 2

    Cool anonymous employees....sounds legit.

    Bullshit. Games are fluffy shit for commuters. Shit C&C, no strategy since you can just hire what you ain't got. Can't remember a single thing from the whole series apart from the dwarf coroner in the first game.
     
    • Disagree x 5
    • butthurt x 5
    • Agree x 3
    • retadred x 3
    • Shit x 2
    • Edgy x 1
    ^ Top  
  4. Arthandas Learned

    Arthandas
    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2015
    Parrots:
    228
    Location:
    Broland
    Man, every time I see Planescape screens I get a mental erection.
     
    • Excited! Excited! x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • Salute Salute x 1
    ^ Top  
  5. Junmarko Arcane Patron

    Junmarko
    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
    Parrots:
    1,048
    Location:
    Australia
    Bubbles In Memoria Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    I understand where you're coming from. But, while catered for commuters, it was good as any CRPG could've been with such restrictive hardware.

    Yet, it's still more consistent and engaging, than a game made with the PoE engine - over four years...

    Shameful.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
    • Agree Agree x 1
    ^ Top  
  6. t Arcane Patron

    t
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2008
    Parrots:
    1,288
    Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    Honestly, I'd love to have at least 10x more Rogueys at the Codex.
     
    • Friendly x 7
    • Agree x 4
    • Funny x 2
    • Love! x 2
    • [citation needed] x 1
    • Fabulously Optimistic x 1
    • WTF am I reading x 1
    ^ Top  
  7. loveblanket Barely Literate

    loveblanket
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2017
    Parrots:
    5
    Thank you for this review. I wish it had come out before I wasted my money. This is one of the worst games I've played in years, especially for the price. It isn't really even a game, it's simply an interactive fiction, a choose your own adventure novel where you can't really make a bad decision or die. Obstacles aren't obstacles, they are just choices. If there is a tree in the road you need to get around you can use your axe to chop it up, you can use your dexterity to jump over it, you can use your strength to lift it, you can use your intelligence to just walk around it, etc. The problem is, as the review points out, that most, or all of those options are available to you and they all lead to the other side of the log. All that changes is some descriptive text. There is no game here, just some bland choices. The characters aren't interesting, the locations are mostly bland and the story is unfulfilling at best. InXile is a strange company. Wasteland 2 was decent, but I never finished it and I consider myself a rabid completionist, this game is awful and the recent gameplay they've shown for Bard's Tale 4 was laughably bad. I make an effort to never base my thoughts or ideas on nostalgia. I grew up with and loved the Ultima series. I went back and played through them again and they were basically garbage. There were some good story concepts there, but the games themselves, with the possible exception of Ultima 7, are not worth playing today and I'm honest with myself about that. They were great at the time and not so much anymore. InXile seems to peddle pure nostalgia. Their desire to recapture the past only exposes the flaws of that way of thinking. If they had approached Torment as it's own game instead of trying to pretend it was a continuation of Planescape, they would have been better off, but would they have gotten the 5 million to make it? Would the bland and kind of boring Wasteland 2 have gotten made if it weren't playing on nostalgia for what was at best an uneven original game now remembered by many to be way better than it was? By trying to prove these games could still be made and be commercially viable, they've instead proven why people and the industry moved on from these types of games a long time ago. So disappointing.
     
    • Salute x 4
    • Brofist x 2
    • Agree x 2
    • Despair x 2
    • Disagree x 1
    • Informative x 1
    • Shit x 1
    ^ Top  
  8. Prime Junta Arcane

    Prime Junta
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2006
    Parrots:
    3,406
    Only mental? Bugger off, poser.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    ^ Top  
  9. Tao Educated

    Tao
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2015
    Parrots:
    80
    This is the first time I fully agree with a review of yours Prime Junta .

    Nice Job, and thanks
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 5
    • Despair Despair x 1
    • Salute Salute x 1
    ^ Top  
  10. Abu Antar Arcane Patron

    Abu Antar
    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2014
    Parrots:
    3,317
    Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    I beat the game yesterday. It took me 35 hours.

    -There were a lot of environments that I liked, The Bloom especially comes to mind. There are also some smaller areas that looked good. Unfortunately, maps were generally very small and you couldn't get lost even if you wanted to. Locations like the Valley of dead Heroes looked terrible all around, imo. The inconsistency hurts the game.
    -Several quests can be completed in different ways and it can have consequences later on, which is nice. On the other hand, some quests that you got, you could complete them very quickly because what you needed was like 20 feet away. One quest in the Blooms especially comes to mind.
    -Erritis, Matkina and Rhin. I liked these characters and had them with me for as long as I could, the others, I tried to avoid like the plague. I didn't even do the quest for Callistege.
    - At points, the writing showed some real quality. Some quests and characters were really well done. My favorite NPC would have to be Inifire. There were other characters that were potentially interesting, but nothing ever happens. Several of these NPCs could have been developed more, give the player quests related to them or even have them join your company. They end up as cool concepts, but nothing more.
    -I didn't like the combat, but the crisis system was cool in a few instances, when it let you solve a situation without actually fighting. Examples: stop a fight or steal an object. That you could do that showed that there are people at this company that do care and don't just want to phone it in. Unfortunately, there are many encounters where you get to fight an abundance of enemies and I had to wait for so long that I alt+tabbed to do others stuff in the meantime. That's just bad design. I agree with the review that an encounter in the very late game was very silly.
    -Cyphers were a cool idea. A lot of them felt worthless, but some of them became very useful later in the game, thanks to one of your companions. Items were boring in general, but you'll find a couple that you will be happy to acquire.
    -I haven't followed the Numenera rule set that closely, but what we got in the game wasn't really exciting. The way you develop you characters in tiers just wasn't my thing. On several level ups, I felt like there wasn't anything useful that I could pick. That's a bit of a shame. Mind reading seemed exciting, but it wasn't used as much as I had hoped. made Erritis more interesting and it was usable in some instances.
    -Non-combat skills were a bit of a joke. It reminds me of Tyranny in this regard. You had a decent amount but you could almost never fail them, because you could choose whoever you wanted from your party. You had the pools of all 4 active characters at your disposal. I don't remember if Prime Junta had it as a complaint in the Tyranny review, but if he didn't complain about non-combat skills in the Tyranny review, he has no right to complain here. (I'm lazy and don't feel like going back and checking.)
    -I do think that the general atmosphere and mood of the game was good. The soundtrack had some decent to good songs, imo. The problem with the whole mood and atmosphere thing is that you have a lot of descriptive text that shouldn't be there. They tell you about stuff that is in front of you. I don't need the game to tell me about it in 123 paragraphs. In the end, I started skimming or even skipping some of it, just reading dialog text. The descriptive text might also be a good excuse for them to have stuff happen in text so that they don't have to animate things.
    -In general, I didn't mind the story, but it gets less good as you go on. It doesn't help that what happens in the game never shocks me. There was one part of the main story where I was genuinely surprised. I assume there was another point earlier in the main story, where they also tried to surprise the player. I didn't see that twist coming from a mile, I saw it come from 20 miles.
    -There were 2 or 3 meres that were well written, the others, I just got through them quickly. It's a shame these didn't have much of an effect on the actual game world.

    There's more I can say, probably, but these are the things that popped out in my head. I still think that overall, this is a solid game and nowhere near a piece of turd. There's a lot of squandered greatness here. Some genuinely good stuff mixed with some mediocrity and some below average stuff. They should have done better with the talent and budget they got. I'd really like to read an honest post-mortem and see what they have to say about the development. I want to know how so many stretch goals that seemed to be an integral part of the game got cut and the reasons. I understand if people are upset about these cuts. but I am not anymore. I am disappointed that they tried to sweep it under the rug, though.

    I think Prime Junta's review is overly harsh and it makes the game sound like the next coming of Satan. It is not, in my opinion.
     
    • Brofist x 21
    • Informative x 5
    • Fabulously Optimistic x 3
    • Agree x 2
    • Acknowledge this user's Agenda x 1
    • hopw roewur ne x 1
    • decline x 1
    • Thanks! x 1
    • WTF am I reading x 1
    ^ Top  
  11. Prime Junta Arcane

    Prime Junta
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2006
    Parrots:
    3,406
    I'm fairly certain Satan would be a lot less boring.
     
    • Funny x 7
    • Agree x 3
    • Brofist x 1
    • Acknowledge this user's Agenda x 1
    • Edgy x 1
    • Friendly x 1
    • Build the Wall! x 1
    ^ Top  
  12. Schizophrenic monolog Learned

    Schizophrenic monolog
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Parrots:
    206
    Location:
    Inside your mind
    It's really weird that people here judge a game by its production time and its budget or what doesn't included in it.

    Why?!

    A game should be judged from a gaming point of view, And not by a function of quality per time/money spend.

    When i play a game, I don't care about how much time it was on pre-production, how much money the company spend on special-effects and so on...

    I think the review was mostly based on the writer personal emotions towards InXile.

    Which we all know about them... :)

    And as someone who's playing TTON alongside with PS:T, I can definitely see the semilarity between the two.

    I've played PS:T a few times before.
    And even though PS:T is one of my favorite games, it's still a game.
    And therefore it's not perfect.

    What I'm trying to say is that PS:T nostalgic value is much higher than the game itself.

    It's an amazing game, but it's still have bugs, dull moments, shit journal, shit combat and lots of minor fucks.

    And I think people here want to hate TTON not because it's shit.
    But, because it was made by InXile.
    Because it took long time to make.
    Because it cost lots of money (according to some codexers)
    And Because all those broken promises.

    I said it before, TTON is an amazing experience and a pretty rare one.
    I really like the game so far, and it's really similar to PS:T.

    And if you don't agree, install PS:T and play alongside with TTON and you'll see the resemblance (quests format, background music, weird-mysterious settings, personal story, shitty combat :) etc...).
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
    • Disagree x 8
    • hopw roewur ne x 5
    • WTF am I reading x 5
    • Agree x 2
    • retadred x 2
    • Old x 1
    ^ Top  
  13. jewboy Savant

    jewboy
    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2012
    Parrots:
    505
    Location:
    Gliese 581
    Dunning Kruger? Ouch. Inxile's got some seriously disgruntled ex-employees. The Glassdoor comments would explain a lot though, wouldn't they? Maybe Brian is just getting old. Hell half the team is getting a bit long in the tooth. It happens.

    I especially like this comment:
     
    • Funny x 6
    • Brofist x 1
    • Agree x 1
    • Informative x 1
    • Doggy x 1
    ^ Top  
  14. Mortmal Arcane

    Mortmal
    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2009
    Parrots:
    4,015
    Good review, unexpected, you are not even licking the dev's arse, guess no bribe nor goodies today. Although i disagree with one of the sentence, "they had the bugdet they had the talents" . 5 millions for 4 years developpement time,its really nothing you are not going to pay many people with that. As for the talent , i guess too many cooks spoil the meal, or the real work was done by beginners with few inputs from the celebrities.I am done with half of the game, not really entertained , and never seen the spark of genius i usually find in classic top rpgs.
    There's some lack of care, even the french translation is botched, found quite a few typos, and the backer content on the graves for example is not even translated.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    ^ Top  
  15. Tao Educated

    Tao
    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2015
    Parrots:
    80
    Those were exceptions instead of norm. That's why i though the game was better than PoE at the start. But by the time you're ending, all that reactivity in Sagus goes, since the moment you leave the HUB, from anecdotal to nonexistence. And then they give you the Mass Effect ending...
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
    • Despair Despair x 1
    ^ Top  
  16. Prime Junta Arcane

    Prime Junta
    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2006
    Parrots:
    3,406
    Indeed.

    Or, as I put it, T:ToN apes the forms of PS:T without understanding their substance.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 4
    • Despair Despair x 2
    • [citation needed] [citation needed] x 1
    ^ Top  
  17. Crolug Educated

    Crolug
    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2007
    Parrots:
    96
    Location:
    Panamá
    I haven't been monitoring Numenara production so I wasn't aware of all those cuts. Quite an impressive list I might say. I have a word for it - CROWDFRAUDING
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Despair Despair x 1
    ^ Top  
  18. l3loodAngel Proud INTJ Patron

    l3loodAngel
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2010
    Parrots:
    1,325
    Because the empty pot rings the loudest?
     
    ^ Top  
  19. Bohrain Educated

    Bohrain
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2016
    Parrots:
    196
    I believe the word is fraudfunding.
     
    • Funny Funny x 5
    • Creative Creative x 3
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    • Salute Salute x 1
    ^ Top  
  20. ga♥ Educated

    ga♥
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2017
    Parrots:
    136

    I can't brofist so take that :incline:

    And yeah , Alas, one of the possible reason of this fiasco is the crowfunding system.

    PST combat was VERY OK if you take the game as a whole, and it was pretty rewarding and shit.
    While POE combat gave me so much cancer that when I went to my doctor and he said there was a cure I just begged him to let me die.

    The game is bad sadly, so prepare yourself to be disappointed.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
    • Despair Despair x 2
    • retadred retadred x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • Fabulously Optimistic Fabulously Optimistic x 1
    ^ Top  
  21. Konjad High on potatoes Patron

    Konjad
    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2007
    Parrots:
    13,189
    Location:
    ur mom
    Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    The game did not disappoint me. I expected it to be shit.
     
    • Funny x 14
    • Brofist x 2
    • Agree x 1
    • Despair x 1
    • Salute x 1
    • Informative x 1
    • Smug x 1
    ^ Top  
  22. Zeriel Arcane

    Zeriel
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2012
    Parrots:
    4,815
    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]


    Hello tile guy.
     
    • Funny x 7
    • WTF am I reading x 7
    • hopw roewur ne x 1
    • Racist x 1
    • WTF!? x 1
    ^ Top  
  23. Schizophrenic monolog Learned

    Schizophrenic monolog
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2013
    Parrots:
    206
    Location:
    Inside your mind
    And I think this is the most important question (how good TTON mimics the things that made PS:T so great).

    But, unlike you, I think InXile did a GREAT job.

    Maybe it's the joints or the alcohol
    But the bottom line is that I'm having a great time with both games.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
    • decline x 4
    • Disagree x 2
    • WTF am I reading x 2
    • Acknowledge this user's Agenda x 1
    • Agree x 1
    • Fabulously Optimistic x 1
    • :M x 1
    ^ Top  
  24. an Administrator Arcane

    an Administrator
    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2015
    Parrots:
    4,106
    Location:
    Grotesqueistan
    I think the reviewer has been affected by nostalgia. I personally find TToN's music much more memorable and beautiful than PS:T's.
     
    • Shit x 3
    • Acknowledge this user's Agenda x 1
    • Disagree x 1
    • meh x 1
    • Creative x 1
    • retadred x 1
    • Disgusting! x 1
    • You're Fired! x 1
    ^ Top  
  25. ESh Prophet

    ESh
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Parrots:
    685
    Post a single track from Numenera more memorable and beautiful than this:

     
    • Brofist x 13
    • Agree x 1
    • Thanks! x 1
    • Friendly x 1
    • Fabulously Optimistic x 1
    • Yes! x 1
    ^ Top  

(buying stuff via the above buttons helps us pay the hosting bills, thanks!)