Editorial RPG Codex Report: A Codexian Visit to inXile Entertainment

[Kalin]

You guys won't say who did the interview?

His request.

Ha-HA! Now we know it's not a girl!

Not a man either.

 

[Infinitron]

That includes the investors and customers of Wasteland 2, which is what inXile worked on during those two years.

Just go ahead and admit it, folks - Torment should not have been Kickstarted in 2013 in the first place.

inXile-as-ponzi-scheme people will say they needed to do that to fund Wasteland 2 through 2014.

Yeah well, that's silly.

In an alternate universe, Torment is Kickstarted shortly before PoE's release and production begins right away using its finished engine. (Or in other words, they make it like Tyranny.)

 

[DramaticPopcorn]

I'm quite skeptical about the whole premise of the article, as I don't think the opportunity for the interview came from a genuine place, maybe it's the tone of the summary that set me up so.
Either way, I'm still in the process of reading it, but this segment filled me with unironic rage and resentment:

Why did InXile decide to pursue a sequel to Planescape: Torment, which didn’t sell very well, without the Planescape setting, the Planescape: Torment license, or perhaps most importantly, Chris Avellone as lead designer?

Brian: We knew we wanted to kick off another project, so I thought there was this really unique moment in time during which Colin was available, Adam was available, Monte Cook had just done the Numenera setting – we couldn’t get the Planescape license, we tried, they said no – but the guy who helped invent Planescape had invented another world which we thought was kind of unique. We hoped we could get Chris Avellone involved, and we ended up doing so. I thought it was a one-time opportunity to give that creative team another shot at building a product which was similar – and by similar I mean a game that relied on reading and which was strange and otherworldly, and to give them an opportunity to create a game that was very different from your standard RPG experience.

Is this seriously ALL that Fargo sees in Planscape? I can't help but feel this exact simplified, clueless and directionless perception of "classics" is the reason why W2 turned out so insultingly mediocre, by-the-numbers, generic and uninspired.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Ha-HA! Now we know it's not a girl!

Wow, you really narrowed it down brother.

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

I'm quite skeptical about the whole premise of the article, as I don't think the opportunity for the interview came from a genuine place, maybe it's the tone of the summary that set me up so.
Either way, I'm still in the process of reading it, but this segment filled me with unironic rage and resentment:

Why did InXile decide to pursue a sequel to Planescape: Torment, which didn’t sell very well, without the Planescape setting, the Planescape: Torment license, or perhaps most importantly, Chris Avellone as lead designer?

Brian: We knew we wanted to kick off another project, so I thought there was this really unique moment in time during which Colin was available, Adam was available, Monte Cook had just done the Numenera setting – we couldn’t get the Planescape license, we tried, they said no – but the guy who helped invent Planescape had invented another world which we thought was kind of unique. We hoped we could get Chris Avellone involved, and we ended up doing so. I thought it was a one-time opportunity to give that creative team another shot at building a product which was similar – and by similar I mean a game that relied on reading and which was strange and otherworldly, and to give them an opportunity to create a game that was very different from your standard RPG experience.

Is this seriously ALL that Fargo sees in Planscape? I can't help but feel this exact simplified, clueless and directionless perception of "classics" is the reason why W2 turned out so insultingly mediocre, by-the-numbers, generic and uninspired.

He wasn't asked to write a deep analysis on why Planescape became the cult classic it is. There's is nothing wrong in his short comment though. Yes, Planescape is famous for being different and otherworldly, and its wordiness and novel-like "gameplay" has been brought up by both fans and detractors as one of its defining characteristics.

 

[TT1]

Nice interview, Codex. Congrats!

I think Codex should take the opportunity and really reconcile with Inxile. In the end, Brian apologized and is doing his part. It does not make sense for Codex, as a portal of content and news, to be away from one of the companies that produces the games that are the theme of the site. Seize the opportunity and move on.

Bethesda and BioWare claim they're also doing cRPGs - should we reconcile with them as well?

Hey, I'm new here and I do not know if there was any Codex relationship problem with Bethesda and Bioware.

At the end of the day, it's people producing bad games that you can hate and speak badly, it does not matter. But it's just games and the company owner is not spitting in your face or cursing your mother. There is no reason not to reconcile with these companies if they are willing to shake hands.

InXile is doing the part of it and has taken a step in the right direction.

 

[Elwro]

Do you guys think Avellone thinks that his PS:T:EE makes more people interested in Torment and so inXile should be grateful to him? Just a thought. Possibly retarded, sorry

 

[Grotesque]

I did not red the article but I have just one question. If Numenera was a smashing success the invitation would've existed? My bet is that no.

 

[Israfael]

At first I was like NO REGRETS NO SURRENDER, but then I read a paragraph, then next one, then i was like

 

[GloomFrost]

LOL the work of Brain Mitozda, one of the best writers in the industry never even made it in the final release.

Did you play Dead State?

Yes and the writing and characters were by far the best things about it. Havent played it much though, tons of slow, monotones and boring combat and glitches killed the game for me.

 

[KyivAfter12am]

Comparing games based on word count is like comparing paintings based on litres of paint used. 600000 should have been the upper limit, not the baseline to beat.

Managers in software development projects have finally stopped measuring progress by lines of code written. It is now popular to refer to lines of code spent. I would be happy to see the same approach applied to writing in games.

 

[KyivAfter12am]

As for the interview itself, I really enjoyed it, as it seems the Inxile guys were quite honest. It is regrettable that the sales of the game are disappointing. I do think it is more because of unfortunate timing (Horizon Zero Dawn, Mass Effect etc.) and the whole kickstarter goals scandal than because of the actual quality of the game.

 

[Darkzone]

By the way, why does the interviewer want to be anonymous?

Because he or she doesn't want to be called Faggot, Retarded, Cockold or etc.

What kind of assfuckery is this?
"Secret agent?" What happened to transparency and the balls to be yourself, say your piece? Here of all places, not like anyone's disallowed to express their opinion, is it. Some special faggot is too sensitive, so O.K.? Anonymously? Are we gonna be like SHIT sites, where "guest writers" shill or write at their whim? No consequences? What the fuck is this guys? We are like, so not like that.
I understand why you'd all want this article up in the front page, why you wouldn't wish to let such an opportunity slip by the Codex. With you; but we do things a certain way here. This is a bad kind of a first. Men have names and the balls to stand by their words.
DarkUnderlord Boss sorry for tagging you but for the love of God, don't let them do this again. It's a slippery slope and content/context depending, it can lead to even more assfuckery.
edit: because someone's bound to mention this. Yes, i know it's our questions. It's setting the precedent that bugs me. And come to think of it, since it's our questions, not the guest writer's, why would this sensitive faggot feel the need to post anonymously and why would we allow it? After all he's just a "representative", right?

And thank you for validating my point above.

Why giving a fuck in the first place who made the interview? Take it and respect others wish for fuck sake and restrain your false sense of self entitlement.

 

[Kem0sabe]

As for the interview itself, I really enjoyed it, as it seems the Inxile guys were quite honest. It is regrettable that the sales of the game are disappointing. I do think it is more because of unfortunate timing (Horizon Zero Dawn, Mass Effect etc.) and the whole kickstarter goals scandal than because of the actual quality of the game.

The majority of sales were on pc, so console centric AAA releases would have little effect on it... i doubt the type of player who buys a game like Numanuma on PC overlaps very much with those who also own a PS4.

The sales were impacted by their anti-consumer tactics and ultimately their mediocre game.

 

[StaticSpine]

Thanks for the great interview!

Also I like this more neutral/positive atmosphere in this thread compared to TToN one.

 

[Darkzone]

I think the uncomfortable truth is that T:ToN's poor sales have little to do with the Steam reviews or angry Codexians and more to do with broader trends. I don't expect future isometric RPGs to sell much beyond their backer numbers, as Obsidian is likely to discover next year.

I think PoE2 and DoS2 will sell reasonably; the failure of T:TON was due to more specific elements of the game's design. For example, there has been a trend towards more of a focus on gameplay (vs. story) over the last ~5 years, and T:TON doesn't fit in

I do think that you are somehow correct on this matter, despite the influence of groups like RPG Codex and preview experience provided by Youtube and etc.
Btw i think that story should be played, and the gameplay itself should make the story, but if there are no sufficient funds then it should at least be told with usefull means that fit into the setting.

 

[Elwro]

I hope Torment is offered via Playstation Plus sometime soon [Well, a true classic like Demon's Souls was!]

 

[CryptRat]

Is this seriously ALL that Fargo sees in Planscape? I can't help but feel this exact simplified, clueless and directionless perception of "classics" is the reason why W2 turned out so insultingly mediocre, by-the-numbers, generic and uninspired.

You know, one thing I like in the interview is that when they talk about Wasteland 3, Torment and Bard's Tale 4 you see that they know they're 3 different kinds of games, with different approaches.
I think Diablo, Witcher and other actions games focused on combat and dialog with some stats and quests are basically all shit (I know it's subjective), and that's what the biggest part of industry consider exactly as the only thing an RPG is.
In the other hand I like a lot of kind of RPGs and it's really refreshing to read some people from a relatively big studio talking about and working on these different kinds of games I like.

 

[Irenaeus]

Anyway, nice of InXile to let the Codex talk to their PR manager. I laughed at the way he was trying to win the Codex over with "You guys really are tier 1!" bullshit - they can't possibly think such a stupid ploy would work, can they? But looking at some of the responses here it seems it did, so hats off to them.

Agree... Reading people saying "Brian has shown his true heart to us!" is embarrassing. Didn't he announce his retirement anyway?

 

[Irenaeus]

Has Chris Avellone really regressed to the mentality of a teenager, or am I reading too much into this?

He's just more open to shitting on Obsidian. If anything, the mentality of a teenager is being afraid to speak your mind.

 

[Sizzle]

It is regrettable that the sales of the game are disappointing. I do think it is more because of unfortunate timing (Horizon Zero Dawn, Mass Effect etc.) and the whole kickstarter goals scandal than because of the actual quality of the game.

The probability of this game being a hit (over 1 million sold units) was always low. TB combat, text-heavy, "weird" setting - it's a pretty niche product.

So, with their potential buyer base being so low, I sincerely believe that they screwed themselves over with:

1) Trying to appeal to a wider public that couldn't give two shits about this kind of game. I mean, really, how many people could have bought this on the PS4?

2) Keeping vital info from their backers (you know - the people who actually paid for most of the development of this game), and, when caught with their pants down - instead of owning up to their mistakes and maybe scoring some sympathy points that way - going into pathetic damage control mode that resembled something a huge developer like Ubisoft might have tried to pull.

3) Ultimately, with such a limited fanbase - word of mouth is everything. I know I personally discouraged several people who were thinking of buying this (and who weren't paying any attention to its development and didn't even know about the cut content drama) by posting my negative impressions on some other forums and FB gaming groups.

Say what you want about Obsidian, but at least with PoE they were forthcoming with all the development info, and they - for better or worse - included all of their promised stretchgoals.

The worst thing about this is that inXile still hasn't understood just how much they fucked it up here. Either they're honestly convinced they made a great game with some flaws, or they're trying to convince themselves that it is us, the majority of the fans, who are wrong, because they got a few glowing reviews from some totally legit and awesomely knowledgeable gaming journalists. Which very well could be, just look at that answer about the portraits - they're completely oblivious to how the new ones are clearly inferior.

In conclusion, I would counsel inXile to try elements of the VD approach to design. Namely, the "interacting with your fans and mining them for ideas and opinions" bit. I know that reading a place like the Codex can sometimes be difficult for a designer (many retards and try-hard edgy trolls stalk these cyber hallways), but you also won't find a more informative and sincere source on RPGs anywhere else. So yes, even though it may hurt your feelings and bruise your egos, pay more attention to what is being discussed here, than some random shrieking YT-er you sent a free copy singing your praises.

 

[Junmarko]

Has Chris Avellone really regressed to the mentality of a teenager, or am I reading too much into this?

He's just more open to shitting on Obsidian. If anything, the mentality of a teenager is being afraid to speak your mind.

How? He's not wrong. Many wouldn't. Half of them are upset in the way Steam handles user reviews for fucks sake - the "unfair": "Yes" or "No" system....

 

[Darkzone]

Am I the only one who thinks it is mainly because of the Numenera setting that it failed? Wasn't it a flop? I remember people I knew being very excited to try out the pen and paper game, and ending up finding it too absurd, pretentious and simplistic and giving up on it.Nobody except those who made it like Numenera. Are there seriously still people making regular campaigns of Numenera continuously, that have lasted for years, like is the case for countless other settings like D&D, Cthulhu or GURPS? I know guys who basically played the same Cthulhu or GURPS campaign for ten years.
The second reason why it failed IMO echoes the comment someone made in another thread about the gaming industry: game developers nowadays are game nerds who have few life experiences and have no frame of reference or ability to create good culture.
Millennials have lived very sheltered, controlled lives in safe environments, and due to growing up on the Internet, they haven't gone outside that much and had the experiences required to draw from and create good content. They also read useless web pages, Facebook posts, Twitter videos... whereas for those of us who knew life pre-Internet, we had to read classic novels and comics or films.

The premise for the setting is good, but it fails on rules of engagement department in storywise and combatwise. Monte wanted a system that is free for storytelling, but he has forgotten the basic build up premise: Restrain everything and then create free spaces for story and combat activities. David Wesely gave freedom only with in the story and setting, and punished hard everything that was not within ( the first major lore for any Game Master), and if he didn't then the game was meh.
On the second thing: WTF? This T:ToN was made by Veterans from the Generation X and not Millennials with participation ribbons.

 

[Infinitron]

The closest thing to a "Millenial" on Torment's writing team might actually be MRY.

 

[Sherry]

Hi.

gosh that was so much information and great questions thank-you very much for talking a day off work to do this it is nice to meet you.

The first portion of the interview happened a little before I joined the site and I did not know anything about what a Tide or Numenera was until then but educated myself reading the topics here and got in the know right? so as a new contributing member I only saw the wave of what came after the cancelled interview and followed the release of the game and read the review posted here about it so that is where I come from as an observer and not a Numenera player yet.

okay it was a really good interview., Genuine and sincere responses from the game maker truly put information offered on a whole new level because you can go read other interviews about the game right and it is not as open and it is like every interview before this one just keep on asking the same questions. Maybe some companies will give a list of topics they are willing to discuss to gaming sites and magazines but this interview comes off as an ask us anything and we'll be upfront about it. A lot also has to do with asking questions that are not the same as all the questions asked before by other gaming sites and magazines and did that really well.

Just do your best and listen and learn from the communities to make your products better and do not hide behind a wall until it is too late even if I have never played a game by inXile they do want to become better at making games and being open to the communities that support them.

Thanks,
Sherry