Codex Preview RPG Codex Preview: No Truce With The Furies

[Lurker King]

how do you intend to make No Truce different from "Walking Around Talking to NPCs: The Game"?

They have two audiences in mind: cRPG players and fans of artsy indie games. Kentucky Route Zero has more than 200k owners, which is a lot, but at the same time they are not the same type of audience of PS:T. Let's not forget: PS:T in some aspects is a revisionary game (you can't die, etc.), but on the other hand is a traditional game, with trash mobs, etc.

 

[Kem0sabe]

It will be a difficult sell an rpg without combat. Might as well call it an adventure game.

 

[Lurker King]

That’s my point. They should either implement more traditional mechanics on top of the narrative mechanics they already have (e.g., resource management, combat, items, character progression, etc.), or just present the game as an adventure game. That’s the only way to please both groups and avoid unwanted attention and backlash.

 

[Darth Roxor]

your replies are not helpful and/or relevant

 

[Lurker King]

because?

 

[Kasparov]

That’s my point. They should either implement more traditional mechanics on top of the narrative mechanics they already have (e.g., resource management, combat, items, character progression, etc.), or just present the game as an adventure game. That’s the only way to please both groups and avoid unwanted attention and backlash.

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

 

[Lurker King]

You missed that I managed to forget these things mentioned in the preview because I'm having fucking alzheimer's. LOL

 

[Kem0sabe]

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

So there's combat?

 

[Kasparov]

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

So there's combat?

are you actually asking or is this like that "haha, I read it as furries" line?

 

[Lurker King]

So there's combat?

Everything, including combat, happens through the dialogue interface. Skill checks are everywhere, and your skills are chatty. Much of the dialogue is internal.

​

 

[Kasparov]

I think that by now we can all agree that the "Racist"-fist should really be "Fascist", right? Right?

 

[AwesomeButton]

Combat-as-conversation won't really cut it for the majority of players. I think this is what the guys are saying, and from what I've seen from games where combat is done through conversation, they will turn out to have been right in this prediction.

Horizon of expectations and all that.

My advice is to try to make it very clear to players that combat happens with dice rolls but "moves" are executed through conversation options - pretty much in CYOA book fashion.

 

[Prime Junta]

This is the way Kurvitz explained it to me, more or less.

Most "old-school" cRPGs are figurine games. You see the little guys on a map and move them around when you do combat. Turn based, RTwP, whatever.

No Truce is a game with narrated combat. Like a tabletop RPG without figurines.

Now, imagine you're in the middle of a PnP session.

Suppose you're FashCop and that big mean kipt is giving you lip.

You: "I'm taking a slug from my hip flask."
GM: "'Left any for me?' says Jocko."
You: "I kick that fucking kipt in the face."
GM: "Make an attack roll."
You: "Haha rolled a 10."
GM: <does arithmetic> "Your kick connects, hard. The smirk is wiped off Jocko's face, which loses a couple of teeth as well. He staggers back and collapses into a heap, blood pouring from his nose and mouth. His companions turn tail and run."
You: "Haha cowards!"

The idea is that all those actions will be in the Feld Playback Experiment -- the booze is an action button, enabled if you've got the bottle equipped, and the option to attack the kipt will be there if the situation escalates to the point that violence is on the table.

Sure it's an adventure-gamey approach to combat, but as I said in the preview, if Mass Effect or The Witcher count as RPGs even though combat is all cover shooter or twitch, then I don't see how doing combat adventure-style would be a bigger departure. It's certainly closer to the roots of role-playing; most bunches I've played with don't do figurine combat as a matter of fact.

But yeah, I've no doubt the grogs will howl, but then they always do.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

So there's combat?

are you actually asking or is this like that "haha, I read it as furries" line?

So there's combat?

Everything, including combat, happens through the dialogue interface. Skill checks are everywhere, and your skills are chatty. Much of the dialogue is internal.

​

So combat is basically debate ... low energy, so sad.

 

[Lurker King]

Let’s see how people will react. We have similar things in games such as “King of the Dragon Pass”, but unfortunately most cRPG players don’t care. Since I care, it's day 1 purchase for me.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Prime Junta -- Yet here we return to the one big difference between PnP and cRPG which I mentioned earlier - the ability to load game, and failiure as sth leading to alternate options vs failure as a source of frustration. I hope they keep this in mind when designing the failure outcomes.

 

[ArchAngel]

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

So there's combat?

are you actually asking or is this like that "haha, I read it as furries" line?

So there's combat?

Everything, including combat, happens through the dialogue interface. Skill checks are everywhere, and your skills are chatty. Much of the dialogue is internal.

​

So combat is basically debate ... low energy, so sad.

More like Final Fantasy games but you don't see your guy and enemy standing on a battlefield or do stupid animations when attacking. What happens is described instead (I also hope they have some cool backgrounds and sounds to accompany the descriptions like those story book parts of POE)

 

[Kasparov]

Prime Junta -- Yet here we return to the one big difference between PnP and cRPG which I mentioned earlier - the ability to load game, and failiure as sth leading to alternate options vs failure as a source of frustration. I hope they keep this in mind when designing the failure outcomes.

I dare you to say "FURRIES" again. I DARE YOU!

 

[AwesomeButton]

Prime Junta -- Yet here we return to the one big difference between PnP and cRPG which I mentioned earlier - the ability to load game, and failiure as sth leading to alternate options vs failure as a source of frustration. I hope they keep this in mind when designing the failure outcomes.

I dare you to say "FURRIES" again. I DARE YOU!

I never did say it.

 

[Kasparov]

Prime Junta -- Yet here we return to the one big difference between PnP and cRPG which I mentioned earlier - the ability to load game, and failiure as sth leading to alternate options vs failure as a source of frustration. I hope they keep this in mind when designing the failure outcomes.

I dare you to say "FURRIES" again. I DARE YOU!

I never did say it.

Oh, sorry - I mistakenly referred to the wrong broken record.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Resource management - CHECK
Combat - ???
Items - CHECK
Character progression - CHECK

What did we miss?

So there's combat?

are you actually asking or is this like that "haha, I read it as furries" line?

So there's combat?

Everything, including combat, happens through the dialogue interface. Skill checks are everywhere, and your skills are chatty. Much of the dialogue is internal.

​

So combat is basically debate ... low energy, so sad.

More like Final Fantasy games but you don't see your guy and enemy standing on a battlefield or do stupid animations when attacking. What happens is described instead (I also hope they have some cool backgrounds and sounds to accompany the descriptions like those story book parts of POE)

Those are not negative points in an rpg. Only thing that made RPGcodex bestest rpg ever combat tolerable were those little sprites dying in horrible and exciting ways with those stupid animations. Reading that your character tried to shoot his gun but failed miserably due to a bad dye roll is something from a CYOA book.

 

[Darth Roxor]

This is the way Kurvitz explained it to me, more or less.

Most "old-school" cRPGs are figurine games. You see the little guys on a map and move them around when you do combat. Turn based, RTwP, whatever.

No Truce is a game with narrated combat. Like a tabletop RPG without figurines.

Now, imagine you're in the middle of a PnP session.

Suppose you're FashCop and that big mean kipt is giving you lip.

You: "I'm taking a slug from my hip flask."
GM: "'Left any for me?' says Jocko."
You: "I kick that fucking kipt in the face."
GM: "Make an attack roll."
You: "Haha rolled a 10."
GM: <does arithmetic> "Your kick connects, hard. The smirk is wiped off Jocko's face, which loses a couple of teeth as well. He staggers back and collapses into a heap, blood pouring from his nose and mouth. His companions turn tail and run."
You: "Haha cowards!"

The idea is that all those actions will be in the Feld Playback Experiment -- the booze is an action button, enabled if you've got the bottle equipped, and the option to attack the kipt will be there if the situation escalates to the point that violence is on the table.

Sure it's an adventure-gamey approach to combat, but as I said in the preview, if Mass Effect or The Witcher count as RPGs even though combat is all cover shooter or twitch, then I don't see how doing combat adventure-style would be a bigger departure. It's certainly closer to the roots of role-playing; most bunches I've played with don't do figurine combat as a matter of fact.

But yeah, I've no doubt the grogs will howl, but then they always do.

so in other words 'running around talking to npcs: the game'

 

[Kasparov]

Those are not negative points in an rpg. Only thing that made RPGcodex bestest rpg ever combat tolerable were those little sprites dying in horrible and exciting ways with those stupid animations. Reading that your character tried to shoot his gun but failed miserably due to a bad dye roll is something from a CYOA book.

I think here is a good moment to interject that a lot of what goes on in dialogues - especially critical ones, where you partake in a combat situation - the outcomes are often animated.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Prime Junta -- Yet here we return to the one big difference between PnP and cRPG which I mentioned earlier - the ability to load game, and failiure as sth leading to alternate options vs failure as a source of frustration. I hope they keep this in mind when designing the failure outcomes.

I dare you to say "FURRIES" again. I DARE YOU!

I never did say it.

Oh, sorry - I mistakenly referred to the wrong broken record.

If you have already acknowledged this same consideration, then ok.

 

[Lurker King]

Kasparov, you should try to emulate these Triple-A games when they implement mini-games with fights, e.g., "God of War". I know you don’t have the resources, but you can implement a few animations and present the options to press some buttons to punch, etc. You will need more animations and a new mechanics, but the combat will feel less passive.