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Incline Realms Beyond - Chaos Chronicles reborn!

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Infinitron, Dec 21, 2017.

  1. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    Potentially. In our quest designs, we tend to consider different approaches a player might want to take, and an evil/asshole path is certainly a valid playstyle. Why stop bad guys when you can work with them and profit instead?
     
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  2. Jimmious Arcane

    Jimmious
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    Maybe I missed this info but will we see any gameplay soon or is it too early to ask? (I'm sold)
     
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  3. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    Be patient. We're still working on the systems, but yes, there should be some presentable combat footage soonish. The overworld map gameplay will take a little longer till it's presentable, as will dialogues and cities.

    We'll continue with our semi-regular blogposts and reveal more details about the gameplay and about our world bit by bit. We'll try to keep up a steady pace of 1 to 3 per month with those.
     
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  4. Grunker RPG Codex Ghost Patron

    Grunker
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    Codex 2012 Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    Well, good luck JF! I hope you're able to make it through this time.

    They have won't have close to the resources necessary to meet those demands lol. Get a grip. BG2's itemization alone requires hand-crafting, and coding unique effects for, tons and tons and tons of items
     
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  5. Circuit Savant

    Circuit
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    Handcrafting - yes, but I don't think it's too hard to implement in code. Most of BG's items effects were similar to existing spells (just spell on hit or permanent buffs on the user), others were +XdY of %type% damage or +X apr. They just felt really unique because they were designed that way. They had great descriptions, which fitted with their actual properties, and really felt like magic items in a fantasy world. Compare BG2 with titles that use diablo-like itemization. +3% fire res. +7.5% move speed +5ft javelin throwing range is not a proper Magic Item.
     
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  6. FeelTheRads Arcane Patron

    FeelTheRads
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    lol Infinitron getting butthurt at this too.
     
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  7. Abu Antar Tweet, tweet Patron

    Abu Antar
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    Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    Btw, can you kill everyone? Or are there some plot critical NPCs that can't die. Not that I, uh... play that way or anything.

    Show Spoiler
    Only on my third run.
     
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  8. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    Yes, this. Our itemization is one of the least difficult things to implement for us. The most difficult part of creating unique items is making the 3D models, but that doesn't take a gargantuan effort either - it's much easier to do than creating new enemy models, for example, since it's just a model, no animation rigging and stuff.

    Effort required for a unique BG2 style weapon = 45% 3D model, 45% coming up with a proper backstory and integrating it to the world, and 10% actual scripting implementation, if I had to give a rough estimate.

    We got some pretty decent tools that let us script pretty much anything into an item. We can even have a Lilarcor-style sword that talks to you, and the bulk of the work would be to write all the dialogue. We also got a pretty good and efficient tool for writing dialogue trees (with a built-in testing functionality), so yeah.

    In an hour of work, I can create between 3 and 5 unique items with their own backstory and interesting magical properties, and actually implementing them takes only a little bit of scripting depending on the item's effects. Like, say, I come up with a dagger that used to be wielded by a dreaded lich king and it paralyzes enemies on strike and does +1d4 damage against humanoids in addition to its 1d3 acid damage against all targets and its general +2 to hit and damage. All of these effects are easy to implement. If we were to take an entire weekend off to just create unique items, we'd end up with over two dozen of them or what. Probably more.

    We're aware of the challenge and effort required to create a game as ambitious as this, and we're also aware of how much effort it takes/how difficult it is to implement each planned element of the game, so don't worry about that. Yes, of course, there's always the chance not every planned feature makes it into the initial release version, but if the game does well we're going to work on some expansions right away, so there's always a chance to see it later - and, most importantly, we've got a tight vision and know what we want from the game, so there won't be any terrible development decisions that fuck everything up like there was in the development of Torment: Tides of Numenera.

    Essentially, we know what we're doing. Mostly.

    Since we're going for a decentralized plot structure anyway, I don't think there will be any plot critical NPCs that absolutely can't be killed.
    And even if there might be one or two NPCs who are critical to finishing the game, the most you'll get would be a Morrowind-like warning that you fucked up your game when you kill them, not a magic immortality mode like in Oblivion or Skyrim.

    Do keep in mind that not all of our maps are designed to be combat zones, so major cities and villages will have cramped quarters that aren't intended to be fought in. But even there, if you want to, you can start combat with anyone you want. Innocent bystanders? Major quest NPCs? Merchants? Slaughter them all. Suffer the consequences.

    Only children won't be killable. They'll just disappear when combat starts.
    You can change that with a mod though :M
     
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  9. ArchAngel Magister

    ArchAngel
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    Maybe just make those NPCs teleport away or something when you attack them. Then there is a ingame reason why you cannot kill them. There are 100 ways to explain why that happened.
     
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  10. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    Nah, you can kill anyone except children. No plot armor or convenient teleport skill. We'll try to give the player alternate paths through a main quest if you kill an important NPC.
    Remember how in Arcanum, when you killed P. Schuyler and Sons you could still get the information they were supposed to give you by checking their files?
    We'll make sure to include workarounds like that. If the player wants to be a supreme murderhobo, he can be a supreme murderhobo.
     
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  11. Kyl Von Kull Arcane

    Kyl Von Kull
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    I was totally on board until you said this. Pure decline. Have laws about child killing in video games gotten more strict since Fallout?
     
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  12. ArchAngel Magister

    ArchAngel
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    Yea but if you can join a One God church in the game they will for sure let you fuck little boys.
     
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  13. ERYFKRAD Arcane Patron

    ERYFKRAD
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    Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    Probably the case in krautland.
     
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  14. cherry blossom Magister

    cherry blossom
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    Make it so that children can be killed, ideally with repercussions but disable the feature for the release so that users can "mod" it "back".
     
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  15. aweigh Arcane

    aweigh
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    just leave it on as an option in the main menu and it will be win-win:

    - if the game journos pick up on it tons of free publicity for the game and nobody can do shit cos its an option.
     
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  16. Zed Codex Staff Patron

    Zed
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    Killing children is my right as a psycho-gamer!
     
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  17. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    We're a company based in Germany, the country where Fallout 2 had children removed entirely. Same with the UK version, if I remember correctly. Bethesda didn't allow for children to be killed in their Fallouts and Skyrim because they didn't want to get slapped with a Mature or Adults Only rating. Etc etc. Unlikely as it is for an isometric turn based RPG to cause controversy over this nowadays, considering we're based in Video Game Censorship Land, we'll just leave the kids out of combat altogether.

    We don't have death animations for the kids but modding them to stay in combat and be killable will be an easy thing to do if you want. I'd give it one month tops before someone, somewhere releases a killable children mod.
     
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  18. VentilatorOfDoom RPG Codex Staff

    VentilatorOfDoom
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    I predict that JarlFrank will quit Codex forever over this game, after the Darth Roxor review came out.
     
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  19. InD_ImaginE Savant

    InD_ImaginE
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    A right oriented website with boner for conservatives values whose USA members climax on the thought of having big guns openly carried out in public wants children to be killed.

    What a surprise . :lol:

    Anyway goodluck, JarlFrank . Loving everything you said about the game right now. Just a question, and I might missed it due to skimming a lot of details, but how is funding? Has your company secured a budget or are you looking for another source of investment?
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
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  20. thesheeep Arcane

    thesheeep
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    About the unique weapons:

    How are you making sure that there is a variance and certain spread?
    BG2 always had the problem that some unique weapons were so strong that not using them would just be a waste, so you knew one guy would have to skill 2H swords, one guy going for the flail, etc.
    Same with the fact that some weapons could only be found so late that some char would have his "best" weapon for almost half of the game, while another char would only have it for the final 10%.

    As good as the unique weapons and their backstories were, I always found all of that rather limiting. Some weapon choices were simply objectively much worse than others due to that.
     
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  21. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    I'm actually looking forward to Roxorowski ripping my shit apart. It's certainly going to be a more entertaining read than anything the mainstream reviewers will come up with. :M

    We're aiming for a Kickstarter later this year. We've studied some other Kickstarter projects and learned from the often-made mistake of developers jumping onto the platform way too soon, so we're going to take our time, spread the word, make people interested about the game, and prepare some gameplay that we can show off before we go on KS. Also, we'll launch an Early Access once we have a sizeable chunk of playable content ready to get some additional income during development.

    So yeah - Codex: prepare your wallets.

    Since we have plenty of weapon types, we'll make sure to have a cool unique weapon for each group so we don't end up like most RPGs where swords > everything else. BG2's flail of ages was amazing, but then there were also way more unique swords and only the one flail.
    We'll offer a variety of unique weapons within each weapon group, and some of them will have equally useful stats so making a choice between Axe of Buttkicking and Axe of Facepunching will be hard because one isn't objectively better than the other, they just have different uses.

    For example, one unique weapon I recently designed belonged to a legendary hero who drove off a certain monster type from the lands of Hirru. This weapon is more effective against that monster type. So when you're going against these things, equipping this weapon is a good idea.
    It's still a decent weapon in general, but against other types of foes, you'd rather use something else.

    Situational bonuses and bonuses that depend on foes rather than bonuses that apply universally are one way to diversify the selection of unique weapons, and make different uniques more or less useful according to the circumstances.

    Furthermore, the really powerful unique weapons will be found in challenging dungeons with hard enemy encounters and maybe some puzzles to solve. Won't be easy to get your hands on. And since our game has a non-linear structure, you can get them in any order you want. Feel suicidal and wanna go for that supergood unique weapon in the level 15 dungeon when your party is level 10? You can try, nobody's stopping you.

    Weapons in the style of the Flail of Ages are also a good solution, and a thing we are going for. They start out reasonably good, and become more and more powerful as you find more pieces and add them to the weapon. We're spreading these pieces around rather than having them all placed in the same dungeon.

    Besides, most of the early game will be fought with standard or minimally enchanted equipment. The powerful stuff will only become attainable for you in the later stages of the game, when your party is strong enough to master the challenges behind which the unique items are sealed. You might even find an incredibly difficult dungeon in the first area of the game, impossible to even attempt at your level - then you note down its location, remember it for later, and return when you've gained some levels. ;)
     
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  22. Grunker RPG Codex Ghost Patron

    Grunker
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    Codex 2012 Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    IMO don't knock yourself over weapon balance and shit like that. As long as every weapon type have great options, I don't think it matters much that some are broken/way better than others. It's more important you secure breadth of content considering your limited resources.
     
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  23. Sykar Arcane

    Sykar
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    What's with people's obsession to kill everything in games?
     
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  24. thesheeep Arcane

    thesheeep
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    Not everything.
    Just the children.

    Nasty little buggers. :argh:
     
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  25. JarlFrank I like Thief THIS much Patron Developer

    JarlFrank
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    Murderhobos. Murderhobos never change.
     
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