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Preview Pillars of Eternity II Fig Update #38: Exploring Neketaka

Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
Hey! The characters used to look like ppl in virtua fighter stuck on a treadmill and glued on a medieval painting.

Now they don't do that so much, they seem to blend. What happened?
 
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
Now they don't do that so much, they seem to blend. What happened?

You should have put a watercolour filter on the screen.

mmm well yeah the colors still look like sea washed clothes and hanged at the desert sun. And they run like they're on a treadmill.

but less so, especially in the thief scene.

as for the rest of the game, let's solve the question, not for this game but in general.

combat, dialogue and character development: SUCK.
 
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duanth123

Arcane
Joined
Mar 22, 2008
Messages
822
Location
This island earth
as for the rest of the game, let's solve the question, not for this game but in general.

combat, dialogue and character development: SUCK.

"Everything is shit." -- The Codex

How can Codexers who prattle endlessly about PoE remember so little of it?


Also, setting still looks fatally generic, with copy paste environments. At least they're indulging in the fantastical nature of their fantasy RPG, what with the mephit caller and I presume animated armor shop guards
 
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
as for the rest of the game, let's solve the question, not for this game but in general.

combat, dialogue and character development: SUCK.

"Everything is shit." -- The Codex

ok. sorry. Ill try to expand on that.

being a videogamer i can enjoy anything, maybe even time and brain-sinking action. Only, i'll be able to stomach 20 minutes per day of relentless spam.

so, this game, Pillars of eternity or of Little China, i would probably love it, because i'd get engrossed in the story and some tactics. Who cares, it's all good, it's a videogame, i "get" videogames!

but that's it. There's no other challenge in this game beside some tactics and a mothefuck-story. Where is the challenge?

so from a gamer point of view i can play anything, i like everything they shit me with, (it's good for what it is, you usually say), except possibly hardcore japanese console style of spam.
But from a non-selfish critic point of view, i really need a game that offers more content. So, hey, when do they make a new deus ex? What's Warren Spector doing? Videogames today need a return of the philosophy of "melange" Roberta Williams invented. Why are we wasting time talking about nonsense balance of die throws and combat rules? Videogaming sucks for the basis, not for the details they keep "updating" us of.
 
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Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
Where is the challenge?

What kind of challenge would you like to be present in video games? Would you like one that tried to kill you?

haha. no. it's the quality of interaction.

say there's a group of bandits holding a bridge. Your character has a rifle and stats determine if you're a good shot. depending on your human twitch skills plus the character's skills: so you interact with the bandits, and you decide which part of the body you want to aim at, whether you pull the trigger when they move or when they stand, whether you stand or crouch, and so on. These are factors that increase the difficulty here and you take them in consideration. These are a challenge.

Now, these video updates and the codex forum goers here squabble over these little tactical factors, body parts, skills, stats, movement, whatever, and the balance of it all. This is the level this game, Pillars of something, is, i guess.

interaction, or challenge, in this bandit scenario is limited to characters, maybe even the ground asperities, but it's a bubble that encompasses small things and you assume death is the objective.

So, what if: without letting the player know it directly, close to the bandits' camp there's an item locked in a chest which you can open learning the code from, whatever, the backpack you noticed lying on the grass; the item is too dangerous or precious for them to risk it, who knows, maybe their deity, maybe a radioactive bomb, and so if you show it to them they won't shoot you and you can have them drop their weapon and leave the bridge. What if: you can have an alarm sound in a nearby outpost that will attract them away. What if: you can poison the water and they drop dead drinking. What if: if you wait till night-time you can unlock a new quest because a bandit during his night watch wants to leave the bad guys so he'll help.

Now, with these new objects, which are only examples, the challenge "bubble" has expanded. There are many things you can interact with to get better "score". But maybe even more can be done. We just considered items. To go back to the bandits, not only may you interact with skills and items, but maybe you can interact and consider the story and plot of the game so far, and make predictions, because in this case you can interact with the whole story, and the story can end BADLY if you don't choose well. For example you don't want to kill these bandits because later they can help when you overthrow the government or something.

Now the bubble encompasses the whole world. You interact with "everything": the challenge is enormous.

So again, where's the challenge in this here game?
 

Prime Junta

Guest
So, basically, any game that isn't Fallout is shit. 'k

Also, you have a strange way with words. What you're describing is usually called "multiple ways to resolve quests." "Quality of interaction" is good too though.

Pillars is clearly nowhere near Fallout in that department. OTOH Fallout combat is kind of shit. It's a different type of game.
 
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
you're right, but there's not a clear degree, a measurement of "interactivity", when using old terms. that's why i called an old blog of mine "metre of interaction". old terms seem to be like black holes or tanks, new ideas seem to sink in them because old stories and meanings make all fall into assumption.

problem is, when i see new update videos or talks of whatever new games, i'd love to know right away the "degree" of depth. People seem to "assume" or "know" it right away, maybe cause they're resigned to lowness :)

that's why i always ask where is the challenge, so that maybe others will start wondering too.
 
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Iznaliu

Arbiter
Joined
Apr 28, 2016
Messages
3,686
So, basically, any game that isn't Fallout is shit. 'k

Also, you have a strange way with words. What you're describing is usually called "multiple ways to resolve quests." "Quality of interaction" is good too though.

Pillars is clearly nowhere near Fallout in that department. OTOH Fallout combat is kind of shit. It's a different type of game.

So basically Gylfi.Fenriz.Conquests is trying to have his cake and eat it too?
 

Prime Junta

Guest
problem is, when i see new update videos or talks of whatever new games, i'd love to know right away the "degree" of depth. People seem to "assume" or "know" it right away, maybe cause they're resigned to lowness :)

Possibly. Most games aren't ambitious at all about that sort of thing. Torment: Tides of Numenera attempted it but it didn't really work out in practice. None of the IE games had much of it at all, apart from the occasional stealthable quest.

This depth or range of interaction is something that's hard to communicate in an update though. You could demonstrate solving a problem several ways, but that would be a spoiler which has its own downsides.
 
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
285
problem is, when i see new update videos or talks of whatever new games, i'd love to know right away the "degree" of depth. People seem to "assume" or "know" it right away, maybe cause they're resigned to lowness :)

Possibly. Most games aren't ambitious at all about that sort of thing. Torment: Tides of Numenera attempted it but it didn't really work out in practice. None of the IE games had much of it at all, apart from the occasional stealthable quest.

This depth or range of interaction is something that's hard to communicate in an update though. You could demonstrate solving a problem several ways, but that would be a spoiler which has its own downsides.

by the way thank you for your consideration.
these sort of "degrees" of depth would have to be communicated only once, along with numbers associated to each. Then when you give a new game a 4.5 you know what kind of complexity you get. It might do some good, nobody likes to get low numbers, the "cause" for good interaction would have visibility.

what surprises me is that nobody talks about the amount of energy the brain has to spend when engaging the videogame, even though obviously the codex implies it, sometimes (because the codex hosts honestly amazing persons). It should be every journalist's introduction to a new game article, it brings clarity.

"how much you have to think" is the foundation of anything you do, for god sake, it's possibly a measurable amount of electricity that runs between the monitor and a brain.
 
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Prime Junta

Guest
Not everything is reducible to numbers, bro.

In fact most of the best things in life aren't.
 

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