Eternity Pillars of Eternity II Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Lacrymas]

According to the wiki, Ixamitl are a mix between not-Bulgarians and not-Ethiopians.

 

[fantadomat]

Nothing inclusive about this obvious white supremacist dumpsterfire. It's only Indo-Europeans and people Europeans colonised, it's so extremely reviled by any non-Europeans and avoids depicting them that some of their natives are European natives and its representation of non-Europeans is Italians. It's some super exclusive atlanto-hyperborean Germanic supremacist racism.

Oh my god.... here's new avatar for you my friend.

This game sure is problematic!

Lol mate,don't be so cruel. If someone from his country see this,he could be stoned to death while going to the market for goat milk.

 

[FreeKaner]

I should remind you Josh Sawyer has ancestry from Austria. A country known for its traditional and catholic outlook, with an uniquely positive perspective on monarchy. As well as being birthplace of many supremacist ideas such as Austrian school economics and Hitler. If we see the only unique IP developed by Obsidian with Josh Sawyer as lead designer avoiding or at best skirting any non-European cultures, or putting them at a submissive position to be dominated, the agenda becomes clear. In fact, there is no need for contextual clarity, as the result is obvious under minimal scrutiny. The game is an atlanto-hyperborean Germanic supremacist piece of media. If it dabbled in occult too you could call it spiritual successor to Himmler, instead of IE games.

 

[Lacrymas]

I wouldn't say that. The problem is the technological advances and ideological rationalization that makes it possible for the not-Europeans to subjugate the natives. Vailians are basically black, but they are the ones leading the colonization, so a racist reading is unlikely.

 

[FreeKaner]

I wouldn't say that. The problem is the technological advances and ideological rationalization that makes it possible for the not-Europeans to subjugate the natives. Vailians are basically black, but they are the ones leading the colonization, so a racist reading is unlikely.

Vailians being black is basically Germanic supremacism. It was claimed by them that Italians are not Europeans or have African admixture. When you look at it as not Blacks colonising, but Italians being black then it's basically this taken to an extreme:

 

[Lacrymas]

It doesn't matter whether the Italians are black or blacks are leading the colonization, both of those interpretations preclude a racist angle, at least a white supremacist one. You might say it's Euro-supremacism, which I'd agree, but that places the cause only on a specific ideology/worldview, rather than a combination of factors which might not even include such. Did the irl colonizers think of themselves as superior at first in the way modern discourse portrays supremacism or did they just see an opportunity for expansion and had the means to do so? I'm pretty sure they did see themselves as superior post factum, but was that a leading cause for the beginning of colonization?

 

[FreeKaner]

It doesn't matter whether the Italians are black or blacks are leading the colonization, both of those interpretations preclude a racist angle. You might say it's Euro-supremacism, which I'd agree, but that places the cause only on a specific ideology/worldview, rather than a combination of factors which might not even include such. At first, did the irl colonizers think of themselves as superior in the way modern discourse portrays supremacism or did they just see an opportunity for expansion and had the means to do so? I'm pretty sure they did see themselves as superior post factum, but was that a leading cause for the beginning of colonization?

The reality is irrelevant. The ideology of supremacy isn't necessarily connected to factual process of colonisation, indeed in real life the aspect of supremacy came later, in 18th and 19th centuries. You have to not look at it in a then contemporary point of view but a retrospective meta-commentary. It's why Germanic supremacist created belief systems based on lost ancient civilisations, atlanic ancestry, hyperborean migration and Indus valley civilisations actually being Germanic etc.

Similarly, in PoE the meta-commentary is obvious the civilisation is begotten by Europeans, whether it be indigenous protectors of ancient heritage or marching colonisation. The skirting non-European aspects are only given benefit of doubt and seen as misled and indeed greedy competitors. Vailians being black is commentary on the post-roman Italians, being a corrupt and impure race turned black despite clearly being Italian in culture.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

But FreeKaner, it ain’t white boy day.

 

[Delterius]

PoE is the most racist fantasy since Tolkien.

 

[Lacrymas]

The reality is irrelevant. The ideology of supremacy isn't necessarily connected to factual process of colonisation, indeed in real life the aspect of supremacy came later, in 18th and 19th centuries. You have to not look at it in a then contemporary point of view but a retrospective meta-commentary. It's why Germanic supremacist created belief systems based on lost ancient civilisations, atlanic ancestry, hyperborean migration and Indus valley civilisations actually being Germanic etc.

Similarly, in PoE the meta-commentary is obvious the civilisation is begotten by Europeans, whether it be indigenous protectors of ancient heritage or marching colonisation. The skirting non-European aspects are only given benefit of doubt and seen as misled and indeed greedy competitors. Vailians being black is commentary on the post-roman Italians, being a corrupt and impure race turned black despite clearly being Italian in culture.

Ok, I get what you are saying now, but accusing Sawyer of seeing blackness as impure and corrupt is hyperinterpretation. I'm pretty sure they are just trying to retell European history as-is and don't have any intention of lacing it with white supremacist elements. I see how it can be interpreted this way, though, but only if we assume that European culture is rationalized as almost synonymous with white culture and making everyone in it black doesn't matter. We'd make another faux pas this way, though, projecting real life history onto the game, which I guess is unavoidable in this context. We must know, however, why the colonization happened in the first place, whether it was a logical culmination of factors that isn't tied to race (which is what I subscribe to) and it couldn't have happened any other way OR something else (I don't know what). Everything else is revisionist and a contemporary rereading of history that veers a lot into basic SJW territory.

 

[FreeKaner]

The reason why colonisation happened was Crown of Aragon, specifically the Principality of Catalonia, ran out of money after pursuing a rentier economy as a conclusion to their bustling and robust commercial power.

 

[Mazisky]

Old or never heard? 3 dlc\expansions

https://www.pcgamesn.com/pillars-of-eternity-2-deadfire/pillars-2-dlc

 

[Lacrymas]

That might be the financial reason, but it doesn't explain how and why the colonizers subjugated the natives and not the other way around, which is the more important factor in this discussion. That is the crux of the matter and goes much farther in explaining the situation if we are trying to place it into a racist context.

 

[Quillon]

Old or never heard? 3 dlc\expansions

https://www.pcgamesn.com/pillars-of-eternity-2-deadfire/pillars-2-dlc

Looks like Ubisoft style DLCs... 5 hours of gameplay each prolly.

The important stuff could be free updates if they treat it the same as Pillars 1.

Now I'm expecting a Sawyer & badler stream for today

 

[FreeKaner]

The glory of the Spanish, under God, would not be submitted to few pagans. Divine providence and guidance willed it so, and His will claimed all of Americas, where most people are now Christians.

Also as I said the reality of colonisation does not play into racialist examinations of the ordeal. It's entirely retrospective. One could look at colonisation from any different lenses, from economic to racialist, from environmental determinism to coincidental cultural interaction, and indeed from genetic and biological impact.

What's more important, in my opinion, was the motive. The rest is interconnected factors that can take any ideological shape if one decides to examine it as so.

 

[Mazisky]

Anyone can calculate stream time for CEST?

 

[Lacrymas]

I'm also expecting that the "Season Pass" from the Fig campaign to only include these 3 DLCs, as opposed to every DLC. I suspected as much during the campaign and is a pretty sleazy move.

 

[Quillon]

Anyone can calculate stream time for CEST?

Looks like its tomorrow. Without badler.

 

[Infinitron]

Here's the original press release:

3 New DLC Packs Plus Season Pass Details Revealed For The Deadfire Archipelago.

Irvine, California – April 24th, 2018 – Obsidian Entertainment, developer of critically acclaimed role-playing games, in partnership with indie publisher Versus Evil, today announced plans for three exciting, in-depth expansion packs for Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire. The expansion packs will include new quests that will add to the lore of the Deadfire, new areas to discover, new secrets to reveal, and a whole host of new characters to meet and challenges to overcome!

The first downloadable-content pack (DLC), ‘Beast Of Winter‘ will be available in July 2018, and will take your party to an island populated by a mysterious doomsday cult, that hides an ancient secret. Players will get to experience adventuring in ‘The Beyond,’ a mysterious dimension populated by ancient souls and filled with devilish challenges.

The second DLC ‘Seeker, Slayer, Survivor’ available in September 2018, is a combat-focused expansion taking place on a previously undiscovered island that will challenge the martial prowess of your party, and your tactical skills as a commander, as you embark on a mission to rediscover ancient relics, and pit your party against Eora’s most skilled and savage.

The third DLC, ‘The Forgotten Sanctum’ available in November 2018, will test your party’s allegiance and morality in a quest to help (or obstruct) the great wizards of Eora. Will you befriend, betray or befuddle these venerable mystics as you uncover secrets lost to the generations? The consequences of your actions will be felt across the Deadfire Archipelago whatever you decide.


Those are the current expansions for “Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire”.

All three packs are included as part of the Obsidian Edition of Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire which is available for sale now. A Season Pass including all 3 DLC packs will also be available for purchase when the game launches for $24.99. The expansion packs will be sold individually for $9.99 as they are released. FIG Backers that backed at the Collector’s Edition tier or above or included the Season Pass as part of their backer pledge will also receive the Season Pass.

Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire launches on May 8th, 2018 on Windows PC, Mac, and Linux platforms and is currently available for pre-order through Steam, GOG.com, Obsidian.net and Versus Evil, as well as other digital retailers.

About Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire
In Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire players will embark on a dangerous voyage of discovery to become master of the seas as they command their ship across the new open world region of the Deadfire. Pillars II builds on the foundation of classic RPG gameplay with vastly improved graphics, deeper game mechanics and a whole new handcrafted adventure where choices truly matter. Players can immerse themselves in exploration and discovery as they navigate the rich and exotic Deadfire archipelago by ship, discovering new races, visiting tropical islands, interacting with their inhabitants and engaging encounters at every port. In Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire players can be accompanied by companions, both familiar and new, and witness their personal relationships evolve with the new companion relationship system. Players can customize the path of their companions by assigning multiple classes and further specialize by choosing a subclass.

About Obsidian Entertainment
Headquartered in Irvine, California and established in 2003 independent developer Obsidian Entertainment is comprised of a team of over 170 experienced games developers, who focus to create compelling games based on home grown intellectual properties. The team have previously developed titles including Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords, Neverwinter Nights 2 and Fallout: New Vegas. For more information, visit www.obsidian.net

About Versus Evil
Versus Evil, LLC is a US based independent video game publisher behind critically acclaimed and award winning video games such as The Banner Saga, Antihero, Guild of Dungeoneering, Let Them Come and most recently, the hit action RPG Like A Boss. A solid release line up for 2018 includes the sequel to the award winning RPG game Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire, the eagerly awaited and final installation in the Banner Saga trilogy, Banner Saga 3, and BAFTA Games award winner At Sundown. Publishing games on all major mobile, PC and console platforms, Versus Evil works with development studios in North America, South America, and Europe. For more information visit http://versusevil.com

 

[Lacrymas]

Didn't the DLC poll say that people wanted meatier expansions, rather than middling ones that are over too fast and constitute a momentary diversion from the main quest?

 

[FreeKaner]

They have looked at the poll and decided players don't know what they want and they concluded what players want is a dumpsterfire.

 

[fantadomat]

It doesn't matter whether the Italians are black or blacks are leading the colonization, both of those interpretations preclude a racist angle. You might say it's Euro-supremacism, which I'd agree, but that places the cause only on a specific ideology/worldview, rather than a combination of factors which might not even include such. At first, did the irl colonizers think of themselves as superior in the way modern discourse portrays supremacism or did they just see an opportunity for expansion and had the means to do so? I'm pretty sure they did see themselves as superior post factum, but was that a leading cause for the beginning of colonization?

The reality is irrelevant. The ideology of supremacy isn't necessarily connected to factual process of colonisation, indeed in real life the aspect of supremacy came later, in 18th and 19th centuries. You have to not look at it in a then contemporary point of view but a retrospective meta-commentary. It's why Germanic supremacist created belief systems based on lost ancient civilisations, atlanic ancestry, hyperborean migration and Indus valley civilisations actually being Germanic etc.

Similarly, in PoE the meta-commentary is obvious the civilisation is begotten by Europeans, whether it be indigenous protectors of ancient heritage or marching colonisation. The skirting non-European aspects are only given benefit of doubt and seen as misled and indeed greedy competitors. Vailians being black is commentary on the post-roman Italians, being a corrupt and impure race turned black despite clearly being Italian in culture.

You are giving too much credits to Obsidian mate. Most likely some new millennial said "Why don't we make them all black because inclusiveness?" ,and everyone jumped on the train.

Didn't the DLC poll say that people wanted meatier expansions, rather than middling ones that are over too fast and constitute a momentary diversion from the main quest?

Yes,they did.

 

[Infinitron]

Obsidian decided long ago that expansion-sized DLC didn't make business sense. It was naive to think that a poll would overrule that. The question is how big are these. As I said in January:

I hope you folks are right about the DLC. The only thing that's giving me concern is Feargus's comments on how the WMs cost more to develop than they brought in, and that they want to go with smaller, episodic DLCs instead of full-blown expansions in the future.

He considers the Fallout: New Vegas DLCs to be smaller and episodic - even though they weren't that small...

I wonder if Obsidian would consider, say, White March Part 1 without Siege of Cragholdt to be a $10 value "smaller, episodic DLC".

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

Didn't the DLC poll say that people wanted meatier expansions, rather than middling ones that are over too fast and constitute a momentary diversion from the main quest?

Yes, but what makes you conclude that these will be mid sized rather than meaty (or tiny for that matter)? All I got from the descriptions is that they're self contained.

 

[Lacrymas]

Yes, but what makes you conclude that these will be mid sized rather than meaty (or tiny for that matter)? All I got from the descriptions is that they're self contained.

Because of their price and their release schedule. You can't make MotB-like or even TotSC-like expansions in 2ish months.