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Decline PC Gaming is Dead (this time we really mean it)

Destroid

Arcane
Joined
May 9, 2007
Messages
16,628
Location
Australia
Hell, you can run Linux on ARM, so there is zero difference between PCs and tablets with respect to software selection.

A nit pick, but this isn't true in the slightest, ARM uses a different instruction set to x86. Most compilers and interpreters support ARM but not all of them, and converting x86 software to ARM isn't always going to be as simple as recompiling.
 

Mortmal

Arcane
Joined
Jun 15, 2009
Messages
9,158
Xbone and PS 4 are no go zones for most indies, the free to play crowd is huge and isn't going to migrate to the consoles any time soon, kickstarter and crowdfunding is mostly PC exclusive.
Yes but you dont need to buy crispy's high end rigs to play darkest dungeon, those kind of games could have been played on dos on 386 pc, even the more demanding kickstarters dont require beefy specs.
 

spekkio

Arcane
Joined
Sep 16, 2009
Messages
8,278
Can you use nude / furry mods on your precious consoles / tablets?

:smug:

Checkmate, consolefags!

glorious_pc_gaming_master_rce_by_thedarklord0-d5hc5td.png
 

TheGreatOne

Arcane
Joined
Feb 15, 2014
Messages
1,214
http://gamerant.com/pc-game-sales-exceed-console-global-revenue/

Sadly its very unlikely that we'll ever go back to the state the industry was in the 90s (Western AAA games for PC, Japanese AAA games on consoles+arcade games), but PC does have many things going on
Indy game market. It's getting bigger and bigger every year.
Kickstarter B-tier (in terms of budget size) games
eSports scene
MMORPGs
Niche genres (4X, train simulation) [You might add in Eastern European low budget PC games to this category as well]

The bulk of PC gaming sales (which have risen a lot over the years, PC gaming is more accessible than ever before) comes from indy game market and multiplatform games. Although some indy games (DayZ, Amnesia etc) are quite proper PC games, the fact is that apart from Starcraft, Civilization and MMOs, no one is making BIG budget, heavily marketed, AAA PC exclusive proper PC games anymore. That doesn't refute the fact that there's a lot of PC gaming going on these days, likely more than in the late 90s/early 2000s. Just a fraction of it consists of proper PC games though.
 

Siobhan

Arbiter
Joined
Feb 25, 2013
Messages
472
Location
1X 1Y 2Z
Hell, you can run Linux on ARM, so there is zero difference between PCs and tablets with respect to software selection.

A nit pick, but this isn't true in the slightest, ARM uses a different instruction set to x86. Most compilers and interpreters support ARM but not all of them, and converting x86 software to ARM isn't always going to be as simple as recompiling.

I don't want to derail the thread, but this is a point worth elaborating on. I never said that there aren't hardware differences, but modern software is abstracted enough that this is hardly ever matters, as you point out yourself. Here's some evidence that a switch from x86 to ARM --- should it actually happen any time soon --- won't impact users much. Let's take a quick gander at the number of packages in Debian Jessie for each architecture.

amd64 43149
armel 19083

Doesn't look too shabby to me considering that ARM is still an afterthought in Debian. And the armel branch includes all the essential software like a variety of DEs, window managers, Firefox/Iceweasel, Thunderbird/Icedove, LibreOffice, Latex, vim, emacs, mutt, tmux, bash, and so on. You can already put Linux on a Chromebook and use it like an x86 laptop, and if people should indeed move away from standard PCs to smartphones in the near future, ARM support will become a much higher priority for Debian. So the alleged demise of desktops does in no way entail the end of desktop software, nor should it make for a particularly bumpy transition (unless Windows programs are for some odd reason much less portable across hardware architectures).
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,394
PC on its current form and consoles are doomed on the middle term, the tech is evolving. There is a reason why Microsoft talked so much about a machine to rule them all on the living room even if they and others have no idea how to reach that point. If there is another machine that can accept complex user input like texts on a precise and convenient way, even if it doesn't look like a PC, if it still has PC functions, a PC it is. PC as a machine like it is today will die, its form will die but its functions will remain forever. And no, today smart phones and consoles can't destroy the PC as a platform unless someone invent a machine that can do the PC functions those devices can't. It is a fucking chore to send an email through an Iphone, let alone tons of typing and other stuff.
 

Bruticis

Guest
In that case you can commiserate with Bruticis -- he could probably use someone to talk to.

Heh. Please edit your post to include a tag to him.

Edit: Bruticis
Your tag's broken, I didn't see it until you just pointed it out to me. Metro is trash and knows nothing about hardware, not sure why you'd even engage him. He paid a company to build his PC ffs and pestered me for months about what to put in it. If you want to talk PC hardware and building, kodex isn't the place. Meet my me at hardocp.com or overclock.net, we'll do lunch.
 

gromit

Arcane
Joined
Jan 31, 2005
Messages
2,771
Location
Gentrification Station
And no, today smart phones and consoles can't destroy the PC as a platform unless someone invent a machine that can do the PC functions those devices can't. It is a fucking chore to send an email through an Iphone, let alone tons of typing and other stuff.
Bluetooth keyboard.
 

Daedalos

Arcane
The Real Fanboy
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
5,559
Location
Denmark
Wake up and get real.

It's stupidly easy to build your own PC nowadays, let alone order one online, or the parts. Even repairaring PC's aint even that fucking hard, and if you can't just RMA that shit and get a new one from the manufacturer.. Done deal.

People are figuring out how to deal with shit on their own, so yeah of course old school brick and mortar shops etc. are going bankrupt. Change or die out.

As for PC Gaming. It's fine.

Ironically, some AAA companies are starting to realize, that just making shitty PC ports of AAA console games ain't gonna cut it anymo'. PC games are on the rise, and so are expectations from the masses of both ports and genuine PC releases.
 

Makabb

Arcane
Shitposter Bethestard
Joined
Sep 19, 2014
Messages
11,753
PC gaming will never die, because when there will be no more games made for PC, when shareholders will go bankrupt, when market will collapse and walls brake down. In the midst of the ashes and rumble there will be one building standing with a sign to save us all.




Crispy's PC Emporium Extraordinaire, a shelter from modernity
 

Kattze

Andhaira
Andhaira
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
4,722
Location
Babang Ilalim
It's something that we all have to face. We saw it coming years ago, the slow steady dive into oblivion of the classic, designed-for-PC-only computer game, its future and fate sealed with the advent of close-to-PC consoles (argue that as you will) and the mass popularization of apps, tablets, smart phones, and thus an avalanche of crowd-pleasing shovelware. Please pardon the use of these overused phrases.

Seriously, it's inevitable at this point. Intel is no longer pushing for desktop performance. While Broadwell is perfectly suitable for its use, its main focus is on portability and fanless tablet implementation. No more keyboard + mouse, sorry. It's all about point and tap/drag now. AMD is still woefully behind and are still just hanging on with their lame APU's. Nvidia keeps tripping all over themselves and if you think ATI will save the day, I've got a pair of cool 3D glasses to sell to you.

So what's the future, then? The only good thing I can think of to say is that gaming itself is bigger than ever. People the world wide are finding more and more time to waste fiddling around with these plants and zombies and shit, so that's got to mean there's still a market for more serious games still, doesn't it? I mean not all of us are retarded and have the attention span of an endgame Lyric Suite, so there's hope still, right? Turn-based is still alive and kicking, Kickstarter is still responsible for plenty of shit that's slightly better than ritual suicide, so there's no need to fear, right?

I'm not so sure. I'm not convinced. We either need some sort of revolutionary answer to this terrible finger swipe plague or we may just have to kiss the whole thing goodbye. Funny how the future of PC gaming comes down to the demise of one of its most simple peripheral devices, isn't it?

Am I wrong? Convince me otherwise.

Microsoft will save us again

fee6354a-37a7-4f7e-a29d-1a8a3e42b8e0.jpg
 

Nikaido

Arcane
In My Safe Space
Joined
Sep 14, 2013
Messages
521
Location
9th Hell
It's something that we all have to face. We saw it coming years ago, the slow steady dive into oblivion of the classic, designed-for-PC-only computer game, its future and fate sealed with the advent of close-to-PC consoles (argue that as you will) and the mass popularization of apps, tablets, smart phones, and thus an avalanche of crowd-pleasing shovelware. Please pardon the use of these overused phrases.

Seriously, it's inevitable at this point. Intel is no longer pushing for desktop performance. While Broadwell is perfectly suitable for its use, its main focus is on portability and fanless tablet implementation. No more keyboard + mouse, sorry. It's all about point and tap/drag now. AMD is still woefully behind and are still just hanging on with their lame APU's. Nvidia keeps tripping all over themselves and if you think ATI will save the day, I've got a pair of cool 3D glasses to sell to you.

So what's the future, then? The only good thing I can think of to say is that gaming itself is bigger than ever. People the world wide are finding more and more time to waste fiddling around with these plants and zombies and shit, so that's got to mean there's still a market for more serious games still, doesn't it? I mean not all of us are retarded and have the attention span of an endgame Lyric Suite, so there's hope still, right? Turn-based is still alive and kicking, Kickstarter is still responsible for plenty of shit that's slightly better than ritual suicide, so there's no need to fear, right?

I'm not so sure. I'm not convinced. We either need some sort of revolutionary answer to this terrible finger swipe plague or we may just have to kiss the whole thing goodbye. Funny how the future of PC gaming comes down to the demise of one of its most simple peripheral devices, isn't it?

Am I wrong? Convince me otherwise.

So, PC gaming is dead because we can't get better graphics? the current graphics whoring capabilities (which are still beyond consoles like the PS4) are not enough for you? I hope you die in a fire. You are the decline. You associate PC gaming with stupid crap rather than different controls, freedoms and more complex games. Who cares if intel isn't pushing for more performance? It's not like they don't want to either, they're just hitting the limits of what technology can do. They've been screwed pretty hard in their planning for smaller chips because things just didn't go as well as planned and the jump to 10 and 7 nm processes will probably take forever.
Short of finding a way to make highly parallel programming more accessible, we're not going to see massive performance jumps any time soon now because the only serious way we could get more performance is to.. add more cores, which doesn't scale all that well with current methodologies.

You are reddit's "pc master race" faglords posterchild, despite your old age which one would expect would have come with better wisdom than muhgraphix. There's plenty that could be done to make better games without seeing any change/improvement in current hardware performance. What we have is plenty enough.
 
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abija

Prophet
Joined
May 21, 2011
Messages
2,893
Intel didn't hit any wall, they just don't want to compete with themselves. For example, if there was any competition, we would at least get chips with more cores and without the integrated video at a standard price.
 

:Flash:

Arcane
Joined
Apr 9, 2013
Messages
6,454
- I may only be a small computer shop, but no one's buying PC's anymore. It's dead. I'm telling you right now, it's dead -- I can see it. I will have to find something else to do within 5 years if I'm honest with myself. The glory days of PC sales are well over.
I actually think that the current development in the PC market are good for small shops, if they manage to capitalize on it.
When hardware was getting outdated every year, there was exactly one thing I cared for: Get the most bang for the buck, i.e. performance as cheap as possible, because I knew I'd need to get a new one sooner or later anyway. Cheap PCs were best bought preconfigured from the large chains.
Now that I know I'll keep my PC for quite some time, I don't worry about the price too much, and instead care about other things. Thus I bought my PC from a small online store specializing in freely configurable *silent* PCs. I want to have a silent PC, but I don't want to read thousands of review sites trying to find out how loud a component is. That store gave me a collection of components I could choose from, plus a special case, and displayed the approximate decibel the configured PC would generate.
I didn't mind paying extra, because a silent PC is what I wanted, and is what I got.
 
Self-Ejected

Davaris

Self-Ejected
Developer
Joined
Mar 7, 2005
Messages
6,547
Location
Idiocracy
Sounds good to me, but I'd like a cool PC. Something that gets the heat out of the room.
 

Nikaido

Arcane
In My Safe Space
Joined
Sep 14, 2013
Messages
521
Location
9th Hell
Intel didn't hit any wall, they just don't want to compete with themselves. For example, if there was any competition, we would at least get chips with more cores and without the integrated video at a standard price.
They did hit a wall. That they don't have competition to make them give you better deals is irrelevant to the question of whether they can squeeze more performance per core (which is the most important factor for gaming) or not. What do you even want more cores for? heat your room? Apart from things like 3d renders and video encoding there is little to no use for more than what top of the line processors can give us. More cores certainly won't make your games faster, they can barely make good use of the 4 cores of a mainstream CPU. You can get 8+ cores if you need the performance for professional uses. The mainstream doesn't need more core, why should intel give you more for the same price, you don't need even need them. Professionals who do have a need for it can poney up the $. They make 12+ (I think they even reached 18) core processors for server farms and the like. They can make that kind of CPU if they want to, for a public that needs it, and has the money for it. "More core" isn't the issue, they already make those CPU, and they are still pushing for more. They just can't push the performance per each core the way they used to.
 
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Trotsky

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2014
Messages
2,831
PC gaming has never been cheaper, better, and more convenient than now. I'm glad the pace of technology is slowing the industry needs to focus on making great games again.

The demise of PC gaming was plausible in the late 90s to mid 2000s when console gaming was at its apex. Since then consoles have gone to shit and aren't worth buying anymore.
 

treborSux

Arcane
Joined
Aug 22, 2013
Messages
1,677
I'm still using the same computer I built in 2009 and I don't even plan on upgrading for a couple more years. My old ass e8400 oc'd is still running faster than a lot of cpus you'd get out of the box today. That's insane. If PC hardware sales are way down, why wouldn't they be? There's little incentive for most people to upgrade anything. Remember the premium more RAM used to be? That doesn't exist anymore either.
 

Curious_Tongue

Larpfest
Patron
Joined
Mar 2, 2012
Messages
11,728
Location
Australia
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Serpent in the Staglands Codex USB, 2014
Haven't PCs become disposable nowadays?

When a PC karks it after a few years, it's an excuse to replace it, not fix it.
 

zwanzig_zwoelf

Guest
I think PC needs more genuine, "exclusive" PC games instead of console/mobile ports and multiplatform-targeted crap.

As long as there are alternatives, there is little to no reason for modern kids to spend their $$$ on a powerful PC and then upgrading it every 3-4 years when they can buy a console that will last for about 6-7 years and then rent games until they're fed up with them (can't say the same thing for tablets and mobile platforms, since they are growing rapidly). Sure, controls and graphics won't be as good as on PC, but it's not like these console kiddos care about graphics like PC gamers do.

But while I don't mind ports from PC to other platforms in some cases, I'd love to have really good games which require the players to become "PC bitches". But making these games requires balls, which are lacking even among veteran PC developers, and this sucks.

I'm 18 and I was raised on PC gaming. Plenty of people in my generation play PC games (mostly the usual suspects though, WoW, Diablo 3, Starcraft, etc.)
As a person who has to interact with people of your age every day, I have to say that most people of your generation are utter retards.
 

Broseph

Dangerous JB
Patron
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Messages
4,394
Location
Globohomo Gayplex
I'm 18 and I was raised on PC gaming. Plenty of people in my generation play PC games (mostly the usual suspects though, WoW, Diablo 3, Starcraft, etc.)
As a person who has to interact with people of your age every day, I have to say that most people of your generation are utter retards.
I don't disagree. Probably something to do with liberals

The state of PC gaming could be better, but it's been on an upward curve for the past few years.
 

zwanzig_zwoelf

Guest
The state of PC gaming could be better, but it's been on an upward curve for the past few years.
Depends on what you mean by upward curve.

Inferior clones of older games with ugly pixel art? Doesn't look like an improvement. I can install an emulator and play superior games with better graphics and gameplay on my tablet.
Ports of console games? While this allows PC users to play some of the good games with better graphics, these ports are usually half-assed.
AAA games with big budgets? They're usually targeted for console audiences and released for consoles on day one.
Good niche games by small companies/indie developers? Rarities, which are lost among games with huge marketing budgets (but I love to uncover those).
Great comebacks from veteran developers? There are, but I have a hard time calling most of those "great". A large part of them remind me of old men who are too late to the party and all they can do is rant about missed cake.

I'm not saying that console/mobile gaming in a better shape, though. But again, I'm yet to see a few PC exclusive games developed by people with balls (to avoid making dumb clones and borrowing too much from other games) and brains (to find a way to turn console kiddies into PC bitches).
 

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