Old stuff

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No, I understand the true purpose of CRPGs, that people play them for a number of DIFFERENT reasons. Not all are into building themselves up into a demi-god or anything like that.

Context, asshat. Learn what it means. Your examples were so far out of context, they were hilarious. No, wait. I lie. They were pathetic.

Blather, blather, blather. To sum it up, there are two kinds of people in this subject. Those who are familiar and experienced with the subject versus those who are naive.

No, wait. Three; the uneducated who argue cluelessly about the subject. Of which you are a prime example.

Demonstrably more aware than you. So is there a purpose to your whining, or are you just wanting the attention?

in fallout 2 you start off having a small amount of power to change or affect the world around you. the pc can rescue a dog from the hunting grounds, get his/her auntie to give up a piece of flint and kill some plants for the shaman. moving on to the next town, he can help a simpleton save some cattle, find a trapper and clearout some mines. after that, he can get involved in a gangwar, break a slaver ring and help a spirit be layed to rest. later on he/she is putting an end to a conspiracy with a gauss gun. he/she does become more powerful as a character in the process, but only as a result of having an effect over the gameworld.

that would be the definition of "power fantasy" i gathered from his postings.

And yet, when confronted with the real meaning, continues to argue even more with it.

it's all relative and perception is reality. you read it and choose that it is something you need to disagree with, because you suck brahmin nuts. after a casual glance, you decide that since it is not your opinion, you have to rail at it with your great repitoire of childish insults and poor debating skills. this is simply the way you preceive the world around you, something which is to be feared and loathed with an upmost contempt. it is simply the manifestation of the sad and pathetic creature you've become.

your dad wants you out of his basement by new years, btw, rash.

now for myself, being a kind and compassionate soul, read over what simmschn had written. inference from the interesting grammar and diction led me to believe that english was not his native tongue, so i'd have to look deeper in what was written. after doing so, i began to see the point he was trying to make regarding the term 'power fantasy' eventho' it was a poorly chosen term. not fault of his own on that one, as english is tricky language. beyond the use of curse words and hyperbole, you often stumble through your thoughts as well, rash.

the ability to affect the world around is measured by a value of strength. strength of character, or intellect, or resolve or even that of sheer muscle. even information is a strength, knowing something gives the pc more power, as information is power. in order to overcome the various tasks appointed to a pc in the game environment, a character must grow in order to meet these challenges, in a way that people like rash are unable to. they want to move into new, more dangerous areas and be able to not only adapt but to overcome them as well. this is the principle of what simmschn defined as a 'power fantasy', not the growth per se, but the use of that growth to meet new challenges. this is the basis of any crpg, previous encounters giving the pc the ability to take on the new ones and having the choices made in these encounters having some effect on the overall gameworld. how you go about dealing with these encounters, in a good game at least, is upto the player and his/her style, but still requires a growth of 'power' inorder to meet them. as stated before, this power can be an upgrade to the stats of the pc, the weapons and armour they may find or a familiarity of the player/pc-hybrid with the gameworld itself.

physical prowess and ph@t lewt is a much different animal than power. given your taste for beastiality, rash, you should be much more familiar with animals.

God, so this how how it's going to be, eh. You drop a few reasonable-sounding posts here and there, flip on attack mode when you see someone who reminds you of Daddy, get flamed, play innocent pointing out said reasonable-sounding posts, people get irritated at your self-centered, manipulative, and in the end simplistic mind games, you get a charge out of it, and on and on to 12 pages. Someone calls for a ban, then you get to play martyr.

How 'bout we just cut to the chase. We're all now bored, quit feeding you, you in return get bored, then leave and find somewhere else to play. Sound fair?

Thank you Mr Lamat, you explained it better than I ever could.

But I am quite a bit shocked that my English seems to be that bad. I think I need additional training, perhaps I will start a new flame war with Rosh in a few weeks.

i second that, rash is beginning to bore the hell out of me too. 'straw man' this and 'clueless' that... really rather sad... i don't think he even knows what straw man means.

Let's all congratulate Mr Asshat for breaking into the leading rank of current half-wit trolls, followed up by SimMoron right behind, and in a "distant but still floundering around like a coked up hummingbird" third, KingClueless.

'u r teh intraweb twoll, straw mang! qwoowess fawk!"

your style of debate is of no greater poise than that stated above. i have shown levels of comprehesion and reason far surpassing your own. your tangential, expletive filled arguments continue to be smashed by my superior wit and calm demeanour. once again have i found the true meaning in another posters words, being grossly and amateurishly read by your ilk, explained them and risen above your debased hissyfits. the challenge here is truly lacking but the need to educate such sordid ranks does pull on my heart strings...

simmschn, don't worry about your use of english. it was easy enough to understand, it's just that people like rash are so insecure* that they need to instantly jump on and insult anyone new who comes here.

(*insecure? but he's famous on 'teh intraweb'! chris taylor called him! he is teh real fanboi!)

You may not like it but at least Rosh is very straightforward unlike some people. Look at me, I'm a designer working on a secret project, I wanted to tell you, but you were mean, so now I won't unless you all beg me, and did I mention very casually-like that I worked at Sir-Tech? Yeah, that's because I'm uber kewl designer Whatever, man, go jerk off while you are thinking of how awesome you are.

*does as VD suggests and jerks off* :wink:

:shock: No comments

the nda's prevent me from mentioning whom i'm contracted with. additionally, there's no way in hell i'd give up that information here. when all is said and done, meaning once the project is announced, i'll don ye olde moniker once again and address concerns/questions about the project in a much more civilized manner on the company boards. for the time being, it's just research and raggin' on the queefage. none of us get to tease the queefage on our own sites, so this is just a bit of stress relief. shits and giggles, mate, wholly unserious. think of how much goes unsaid inregards to queefage by devs and designers... it takes serious diplomatic skills to keep from laying into wankers at times, especially those drunk on their own sense of 'teh intraweb powah!'. inregards to my own thoughts on subjects i am fully straightforward with my opinions and ideas. the deluge of banality and the dirth of stimulating thought offered by rash and his ilk doesn't lead to much of discussion or debate tho'...

meh... whaddaya gonna do, eh? personally, it's suicidegirls.com or nuffin' for purposes of monkeyspankin'

Well, I didn't expect you to come here and tell us all about you and the project. I didn't expect you to play a "mistary" game either and tease folks. I may have missed some of your posts, but I think this is the first one that makes sense. Welcome, then.

Umm.. It's funny whend evs tease people about mystery games and the reaction it gets. hilariousness

I have to agree with the kid on this point. "Power Fantasy" is an unfortunate nomination, but I can see where it's at. It's important to make the player feel as if their character is making some kind of difference, no matter how major or minor that may be. Role-Play requires feedback of some kind, which is why Fallout is considerably stronger in this respect than many other games. Whether it's reactions to dialogue choices, or more major location based outcomes, the fact that the player knows their choices are making a difference in the game world is essential to the RP experience. That's the "Power Fantasy." Knowing that the system responds to your actions.

At least that's part of it. The other part, which is not necessarily essential to any game, RPing or not is the concept of growth. I agree in part here with Rosh, because XP and levelling do not make the RPG. This is worsened by the willingness to label anything with stats and character growth an RPG. Likewise, it's usually a pretty solid hook to give the player progression goals. Consider the number of games that rely solely on the concept of character growth and achievement, and you know it's a plus. Certainly not a vital mechanic, but one that appeals on some kind of base level.

As for the far ranging arguments over the past few pages, I kind of missed them at the time, so I'll let them be. Most people around here know my thoughts on TB vs RT vs Etc anyway

Here's the game mr. lameass is squealing about:

And then I went to the page of the game company and read this:

Yeah, mate, you're really gonna blow our minds with your MAD RITING SKILLZ when your Diablo-clone comes out. Please keep stringing us along! U R TEH NEW KING!!! LOL! OMG!!!!11

i live in vancouver, which would make the daily commute to austrailia quite a bitch. keep reaching for the stars tho... that short bus will get you there eventually.

No you don't. Nobody in North America says "mate" in conversation or writing--if you were Canadian you'd know how fucking effeminate it sounds. At any rate, let's say you're an Aussie immigrant living in Canada; you said you worked for a third-party organization creating the manual and whatnot for a game. Telecommuting for such menial work isn't unheard of. You're the one who dropped "Project Hotdog"--you expect us to believe that it's just a conincidence that there's another CRPG being developed under the same name? C'mon--give it up. We've got your number now. Stop lying and come clean, or crawl away in shame.

I had pinned him down before yet he also dismissed it then. 'Twas on that long news post.

I absolutely agree with you that the feedback for every action is important, that is essential to rp experience and that's what motivate players, but what the kid is talking about is a simplistic "get more powah as you grow" thing

The problem with growth, as I see it, is that eventually and in most games sooner then later, you become so powerful that in order to keep you entertained and challenged, the designers have to throw waves of uber monsters at you making anything else obsolete in comparison. Take Fallout for example, once you get PA and a plasma gun you are nearly unstoppable. If you decide to return to the prev areas, you can kill the whole cities very quickly. That somehow feels wrong. Granted through the course of a game you learn things, you gain experience of doing things, and as a result you are much better then most people in your home town, but hardly the best in the gameworld, and hardly a person with godlike powers (including hitpoints)

Oh, sorry if I stepped on your toes. I must have missed that post. Did you find anything different than what I found?

No no, it's not about stepping on my toes or somesuch. I'm just saying he's been spotted before, yet, still refuses to admit the hard to disprove similarities.

The post was this one, nothing new.

Ah damn, I thought I was so on top of it. I'll have to keep searching for something new to add. Good work, RP.

Valid points, but have you seen the immensely growing dissatisfaction of people when it comes to games like Dungeon Siege and most MMORPGs? That stems from the games being built for those who care about "powr fantasy", the munchkins. Developers have been using the level treadmill for far too long, it is wearing upon the players.

You could very well see a commercial CRPG that doesn't go along those lines soon, as perhaps Molyneaux or someone else will think obscure enough to come up with a solid CRPG that doesn't involve a stat treadmill or anything of that sort. True, it wouldn't get the munchkin sales, but it will definitely be innovative in a commercial development sense. I think that Molyneaux may be one of those capable to do it, as for Black & White, most of the stats and numerical data was under the hood. Yes, there is a drive to get a bigger creature, but that is subservient to a play mechanic that doesn't make it seem like a level grind, "teaching" an AI what to do in certain conditions. While it wasn't a completely solid concept and game, it did show that there was other venues to play. This game was especially noteworthy over most CRPGs in certain aspects, including those in BioWare's library of releases, in that you could act how you wanted within the game world and it would respond to you whether you were good or evil, although it does tend to run into evil being much tougher to play like the IE games.

As for the presence for attributes that go up as you progress in a CRPG, that is common to computer and console games pretty much entirely. Downhill Domination isn't a CRPG, but I certainly like the new bikes, unlockable courses, etc. The reason for this is that there has to be some reward for playing the game. Numerical stats can be substituted easily by other game mechanics, which I posted before you decided to chime in and point out the obvious even though I was well ahead of you.

That is truly funny is that you claimed to have done something here, but for the life of me all I can really find is insults and barely disguised drivel as you go into tangents in the discussion without actually contributing much. The bit about stats or some other measure going up is charming, but also not wholly exclusive to CRPGs, plus there's ways of doing it without a building stat system, which I've mentioned before.

This wouldn't be so hilarious if you hadn't earlier used a single insult and then dry-humped it into the ground in the same post, brought it up in another post, where you gave new definition to ad nauseum. If you want to talk about educated, at least simmschn can type decently, something that you seem to have the inability to do. It just makes your post seem all the more irrelevent. It is made even more so when you use hyperbole and jump over certain points that I used to show that DeminKing was a clueless wonder when they posted the nonsense they did. So I was called by Chris Taylor. You're the one who seems hung up on that fact, I really don't care about it. If you're really just going to paraphrase and spam the same shit over and over, you can leave already.