Interview Matt Chat 255: Feargus Urquhart on Black Isle, Baldur's Gate, and Fallout 2

[Awor Szurkrarz]

He mentioned the BG prototype being like an "RTS" again -- I'd really like to know the full background of that. I've heard that originally it was an RTS, which is why the UI and gameplay is like it is.

What do RTS games have to do with BG GUI and gameplay?

Defend command. Patrol command. Formations. Selection box to select multiple units. Default action commands (move/attack/talk).

Only defend command and patrol command stand out as an RTS thing (has anyone ever used the patrol command O_o ?).

Formations were very rare in RTS games. Actually I can't think of any that had them in BG1 times.

 

[Hormalakh]

Only defend command and patrol command stand out as an RTS thing (has anyone ever used the patrol command O_o ?).

Formations were very rare in RTS games. Actually I can't think of any that had them in BG1 times.

Age of empires I - Released September 1997
Baldur's Gate I - Released October 1998

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Only defend command and patrol command stand out as an RTS thing (has anyone ever used the patrol command O_o ?).

Formations were very rare in RTS games. Actually I can't think of any that had them in BG1 times.

Age of empires I - Released September 1997
Baldur's Gate I - Released October 1998

That's one game. Other than that RTS were almost always about commanding a shapeless blob of units.

 

[Volourn]

"Give me some names."

Do you REALLY want me to list 100+ Obsidian employees? FFS

 

[Roguey]

"Do you REALLY want me to list 100+ Obsidian employees? FFS"

Obsidian doesn't have 100+ designers.

 

[Volourn]

Yet all other 100+ Obsidian employees are better designers than Sawyer. Even the janitor. PE is likely to be a fun game IN SPITE of Sawyer NOT because of him.


I mean he and his cronies have set it up so no matter what happens Sawyer has an excuse. If it sucks, he blames IE/grognards/D&D. It succeeeds, he'll take all the credit.


LMAO

 

[Bladderfish]

Look! The pointless, repetitive trolls are trolling each other! Let's leave the fuckin thread and hope they never stop!

Yet all other 100+ Obsidian employees are better designers than Sawyer. Even the janitor. PE is likely to be a fun game IN SPITE of Sawyer NOT because of him.


I mean he and his cronies have set it up so no matter what happens Sawyer has an excuse. If it sucks, he blames IE/grognards/D&D. It succeeeds, he'll take all the credit.


LMAO

 

[Grotesque]

I don't get it. If Fallout was treated like an obscure B grade project, why would anyone in their right mind would talk about a sequel six months before release and assign a team to work on that sequel 3 months before?

Tim Cain said his team had an incredibly hard crunch time before Fallout's release. I perfectly understand why they said they do not want to work on a sequel when you're practically living at the office.
So Fallout is a big success (thanks to Cain's team vision), you take a break and forget about all the sweat and mental torture, and of course you want to work on a sequel because Fallout is your baby and you love it.
You come in, see that all is shit and start over only to find out that you are being raped in the butt by your "superiors". And leave with a very fuckin' heavy heart (leaving your child behind) to found Troika and make games that truly uphold the motto "by gamers for gamers" only to be raped in the butt by the games industry, poor management and the shit taste console players.

 

[Severian Silk]

Formations were very rare in RTS games. Actually I can't think of any that had them in BG1 times.

Homeworld

 

[Infinitron]

I don't get it. If Fallout was treated like an obscure B grade project, why would anyone in their right mind would talk about a sequel six months before release and assign a team to work on that sequel 3 months before?

Good question. It's possible that Black Isle had a policy of beginning preproduction on sequels by default. "Assuming the sale", as it were. If the original game had tanked, the sequel would obviously never leave the drawing board.

 

[Roguey]

After spending over three years working on an engine and assets, plus going overbudget thanks to Steve Jackson problems, there was no way they were just going to leave it as a one-off. Fallout 2's slamdunk schedule was a sign that they really needed to make money off of it.

Because of how development works you have to start pre-production on the next game/an expansion pack/dlc before the thing you're working on ships.

Also Tim Cain has talked about this.

 

[Infinitron]

Fred Hatch: http://www.mobygames.com/developer/fred-hatch/credits/developerId,13527/ - looks like he's working with Beamdog these days!

Producer of Descent to Undermountain - Reg Arnedo: http://www.mobygames.com/developer/sheet/view/developerId,41364/

 

[Paul_cz]

After spending over three years working on an engine and assets, plus going overbudget thanks to Steve Jackson problems, there was no way they were just going to leave it as a one-off. Fallout 2's slamdunk schedule was a sign that they really needed to make money off of it.

Because of how development works you have to start pre-production on the next game/an expansion pack/dlc before the thing you're working on ships.

Also Tim Cain has talked about this.

Where is that picture from, I want more?

 

[Hormalakh]

if nothing else, tim cain's experiences and the way he took care of all his employees at troika (severances with health insurance and other benefits when troika was shutting down) really strike me that TC was a good manager who just came on hard luck.

poor guy, i feel bad for him.

i also wish he was lead designer on PoE, no disrespect to Josh Sawyer.

 

[Roguey]

Where is that picture from, I want more?

Gamers at Work.

 

[LESS T_T]

Where is that picture from, I want more?

Gamers at Work.

Hey, it's currently on a bundle with minimum price of $3:

http://storybundle.com/games

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Where is that picture from, I want more?

Gamers at Work.

Hey, it's currently on a bundle with minimum price of $3:

http://storybundle.com/games

Thanks for posting it. There's 16 pages about Tim Cain.

 

[gromit]

:some bad joke about balancing a car:

Fred Hatch: http://www.mobygames.com/developer/fred-hatch/credits/developerId,13527/ - looks like he's working with Beamdog these days! been listed again for Sound / Localization production, on assets produced over a decade ago

Your google-fu is weak.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Interesting. Seems like there's a bit of butthurt on both sides of the line.
One being that Tim and Co. didn't play the diligent employee line and follow orders, but rather wanted more than maybe they should have gotten.
And Feargus being a bit pissed about some things that happened with the crew, maybe Cain and Co's arrogance, if they had any, or their attitude or something. Who knows. The guy he wanted to get the project didn't get it, maybe because Cain spoke up, maybe because Feargus made a bad choice and is still smarting about that.

Seems like it was a combination of a clash of egos and what was beginning to become a crappy workplace.

 

[Volourn]

Cain starts a company and promptly flops out after 3 games.

Feargus starts a company and is still going strong after 10 years.

Cain comes and begs for a job from his old boss after doing virtually nothing after hsi company folded, and is now stuck working under an inferior game developer.

Feargus wins in TOTAL KNOCKOUT.

(and, I don't mind Cain overall but the truthz is the truthz).

 

[TheGreatOne]

Cain made interesting broken games, Obsidian makes broken games. Cain wins. Cain's company also made ToEE, so unlike Obsidian, they could actually make games with competent gameplay as well. Cain wins. Fatality.
Only reason Obsidian is still going "strong" after 10 years is console ports; Obsidian makes multiplatform games, Troika didn't.

 

[Volourn]

Why so butthurt over Troika's failure? Your company goes under after 3 games that is a loss. Period.

 

[Duraframe300]

Cain starts a company and promptly flops out after 3 games.

Feargus starts a company and is still going strong after 10 years.

Cain comes and begs for a job from his old boss after doing virtually nothing after hsi company folded, and is now stuck working under an inferior game developer.

Feargus wins in TOTAL KNOCKOUT.

(and, I don't mind Cain overall but the truthz is the truthz).

Programming and Design Director at the NCSoft California Branch for 6 years = doing virtually nothing.

ROFLZ

(Also initially the Obsidian thing was just a 6 month period to do something while waiting for his next job. Chris Jones (NOT Feargus) offered to employ him during this time while meeting casually. Tim liked working at Obsidian which is the only reason he stayed)

Of course prepare for this post to get ignored because ROFLZ.

 

[TheGreatOne]

Financial success and artistic and/or design merits are two entirely different subjects, as there isn't a direct correlation between the two.

 

[Roguey]

That gay-but-not-as-a-pejorative MMO he was working on was practically nothing and it's already a failure.