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Majesty 2 sucks massive multi-headed dongs

1eyedking

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I just tried a couple of missions and man is it a very bad game. It completely misses what made the original Majesty great and stand out from the rest.

Graphics
The 3D transition is horrible, as it always seems to happen. Heroes no longer stand out from the scenery since they blend with the beige/green/brown terrain all too well (you know, team colors are used for a reason) and they all lost their distinctive look (gone is the orange-gowned Thief and awkward-hatted Paladins; Mages now look like generic explorers, even after upgraded; Warriors look like bandits instead of knights; and Clerics as if taken seriously from D&D). Buildings also tend to fall into the background along with random debris and neutral buildings, adding to the confusion. Games are supposed to provide visual information quickly: less time guessing, more time playing. It's quite ironic that the aesthetics fall prey to that which the first game parodies: generic fantasy. All the more proof that the developers failed to grasp the basic concepts behind Majesty.

I mean come on. Is it so difficult nowadays to create your own artistic style? Does every game have to be a carbon copy from another? This is getting beyond ridiculous.

Sounds
Hiring the same Advisor's voice-actor from Majesty gave the game as much soul as Ron Perlman gave to Fallout 3, but probably enough for most dumb fucks to claim the game has the "same feel" as the first one. Probably the same reason why they recycled a lot of sounds from the first one.

Of immediate note is the fact that Heroes can't be heard. Their voices are muffled because of zoom distance (LOL 3D), and furthermore their acting doesn't pack the same vibrance and personality as before:

"I'm melting!", "My power grows!", "Ooh tough fight!", "Brighter, brighter!", "Leave my gold alone!", "Hmm, what a delicious looking reward!", "You wont get MY gold!", "Ooh, pretty star!", "Pretty bright light...erggh". All those quotes were a treat to hear. They're now either gone or voiced uninspiredly.

As for the music, it's just your typical generic, epic fantasy fare. What happened to the good old playful tunes? Majesty at least had appropriately aloof and catchy music instead of this filler, bland crap.

Sound effects? Out of Skyway's three most popular catchwords, pick your favorite.

Interface
The HUD suffers from the same generic and bland polish treatment all games get nowadays. It looks like it came from King's Bounty: The Legend. Mind you, the original Majesty's HUD aesthetics were nothing to write home about, but the menu and main map were incredibly stylish, at least.

However, my biggest complaint is the lack of immediate on-screen information. In the previous Majesty with just clicking a hero or building you would immediately get all the important stuff in the main tab through numbers, but now you rather gave to click each goddamn tab to get all the relevant information, and what's worse is that weapons no longer offer a fast +1/+2/+3/etc. icon, but rather you have to deduce the weapon quality from the image (which as you have guessed is pretty non-descriptive).

Double clicking on the mini-map no longer creates an explore flag. Even if you click on the explore flag icon and then on the mini-map the game still drags your main screen to where you clicked, and you must put the flag on the main screen. HURR.

In fact, double-clicking no longer creates flags anywhere. You now have to right-click once, which brings me to the point that scrolling is way too slow and painful since sidescrolling is the only mainscreen method. Even then, if you click on the minimap scrolling is not instantaneous and rather imitates sidescrolling; is this supposed to make casual gamers feel better somehow? Talk about amateur stuff.

Gameplay
Holy fuck, can you say dumbed down?

● you can no longer remove houses, inns or markets from tax routes;
● there are now defense flags and fear flags which previously weren't needed (just Attack tag all nearby monsters for the former, or remove an Attack tag from a monster for the latter);
you can now build only one market: escalating market costs was a crucial part of the first Majesty's economy;
no market day in markets (...);
● heroes can be upgraded to a higher hero tier: they lose all their items but keep their most important asset, their experience (previously you would have to build another guild to allow room for special heroes enabled by temples, which costed a fuckton of money and gave room to various strategical dichotomies);
no random map generator;
you can now form hero squads - no comments on how stupid and unfaithful this is;
no puzzles - the first game had some very interesting missions that could only be finished by solving them in a certain way, particularly the expansion pack;
● which brings me to the next point: no expansion pack stuff;
● the game is very slow, so slow they even had to add a speed slider as an interface feature because they actually managed to remove the thrill from a minotaur onslaught because everything happens and moves at a snail's pace;
● heroes can be revived without researching insanely-priced spells or building mausoleums which if destroyed released tons of undead - you're given a graveyard for free and there is no time window to do so;
● also, no trolls seem to spawn...

Worst of all, however, is that the game's heroes are devoid of personality and greed. Thieves now run away from foes with ransoms on them, even if you offer an exorbitant sum (I've lost countless of avaricious Rogues in the first Majesty to 100 GP explore flags), Warriors are no longer buy-a-holics, and Wizards carefully select their targets before casting their spells instead of blindly assaulting Medusas - which made hero management all the more, you know, FUN AND CHALLENGING.

/edit: filled some gaps, unfinished trains of thought
/edit2: toned <s>shit</s> language down a bit
/edit3-*: minor corrections
 

Hamster

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Eh, i think admins should look into this, i am afraid skyway is hijacking accounts of other forumers.
 

Black_Willow

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1eyedking said:
Wizards carefully select their targets before casting their spells instead of blindly assaulting Medusas - which made hero management all the more, you know, FUN AND CHALLENGING.
They improved the AI so it's dumbed down.
 

Hamster

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The 3D transition is horrible, as it always seems to happen. Heroes no longer stand out from the scenery since they blend with the beige/green/brown terrain all too
The 3d transition is great. Heroes no longer stand out from the scenery and i think it's a good thing.

Buildings also tend to fall into the background along with random debris and neutral buildings, adding to the confusion.
Only if you have black and white screen.

Sound effects? Out of Skyway's three most popular catchwords, pick your favorite.
Sound effects in original Majesty were horrible.

but rather you have to deduce the weapon quality from the image (which as you have guessed is pretty non-descriptive).
Oh please.

there are now defense flags and fear flags which previously weren't needed
Weren't needed? Newsflash: most people wanted to have such flags in original Majesty.

you can now build only one market:
And?

no market day in markets
And?

you can now form hero squads - no comments on how stupid and unfaithful this is;
Parties are unfaithful in a game about fantasy heroes? You are trolling.

no puzzles - the first game had some very interesting missions that could only be finished by solving them in a certain way,
???

which brings me to the next point: no expansion pack stuff;
Wait for expansion pack.

heroes can be revived without researching insanely-priced spells or building mausoleums
And why are ignoring the fact that ressurection itself isn't cheap at all?
 

Multi-headed Cow

Guest
I agree with 1eyedking on the heroes blending in being a bit annoying, and being disappointed that it has less content than Majesty 1, and especially the lack of a random map generator.

Disagree with most of the rest though. Still felt like Majesty to me (BECAUSE OF TEH VOICE~!!!!!!!).

I do really, REALLY hope they patch in a random map generator though. I would even be happy if they release an honest to god expansion instead of DLC and include one there, along with more heroes and monsters and items and upgrades and everything. Though I've only done the demo thus far, full version is downloading on Steam at the moment. Going to dig into it later tonight.
 

Hamster

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Multi-headed Cow said:
and especially the lack of a random map generator.
.
I agree.

I agree with 1eyedking on the heroes blending in being a bit annoying
But not with this. I really like the way heroes are scaled to enviroment and have more realistic proportions in M2.
 

Multi-headed Cow

Guest
Started dicking with the full version. Really, REALLY needs more maps/scenarios/a random map generator. Enjoying it otherwise though. I really should have waited for a price drop but oh well. I think this is the only game I've bought at full price this year, and even that was $40.
 

Hory

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Apart from all the criticism, which is well founded, I have to say that I've finished over half of the missions in the game without being allowed to build temples. Which retard thought it would be fun to play with the same basic units for most of the game? Note how this implies the lack of tactics required since you don't need to specialize, especially with healers being included as "normal" units. Now I'm in a mission in which I can build one temple, tho. Joy.

Also, Hamster, you're a big 3D decline incarnate whore.
 

Hamster

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1eyedking said:
Warriors look like bandits instead of knights.

I even made screenshots:

1-webbig.jpg

Left - low level warrior, right - high level warrior.
Only low level looks like bandit and it shows that you didn't bother to play the game to see a high level one.
 

Multi-headed Cow

Guest
I kinda wish the rogues got more bling for leveling up. Most everyone else looks noticeably fancier, but rogues only get a leather sleeveless jacket/vest and I think a scarf.

I do like that though. I'd prefer it to be tied to their equipment instead of level, but this is good too.
 

1eyedking

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Black_Willow said:
They improved the AI so it's dumbed down.
This has nothing to do with AI, but rather with game design. Heroes now stay alive longer easier, and if they get killed you can revive them without any previous preparation whatsoever.

The first Majesty had you building up Markets, Inns, Elven Longhouses and other shit so that you could afford to pay replacement heroes while you escalate through Temple spells so you can research either Resurrect (1000) or Raise Dead (1500).

In this...sequel-thing you really don't need an economy since no heroes die, and all you do is just watch them move around aimlessly around town instead of wandering all around your territory and allowing trolls to destroy your Markets, Inns, etc. In case something goes awfully wrong, you can put a Defense flag and have a smoke. You see? Everything is fucked up. And even if one of your lovely polygonal marionettes bites the dust it's no biggie since the game automatically sets up a graveyard so you can revive them whenever you want.

Hamster said:
The 3d transition is great. Heroes no longer stand out from the scenery and i think it's a good thing.
Go play other generic piles-of-shit RTS if you want that; this is Majesty, not Supreme Commander.

Sound effects in original Majesty were horrible.
They weren't all that great, but at least they were original (as in non-recycled).

1eyedking said:
but rather you have to deduce the weapon quality from the image (which as you have guessed is pretty non-descriptive).
Oh please.
This is actually a somewhat serious issue. This wouldn't be so annoying if armor and weapon design didn't suffer from Blandness™. They could have added a colored background or auras à la WC3 for easier reading but they were too busy copying WoW's shoulderpads and cartoony swords.

Weren't needed? Newsflash: most people wanted to have such flags in original Majesty.
Yeah, just as we've now found out most "people" wanted Fallout to be first-person.

Newsflash: those people are dumbfucks.

1eyedking said:
you can now build only one market
no market day in markets
And?
Are you dumb? It was part of the core of Majesty's economy. Read above/below.

Parties are unfaithful in a game <s>about</s> that parodies fantasy heroes? You are <s>trolling</s> a God.
Fixed. Furthermore, Majesty is all about using reward flags to indirectly command your heroes. This was the key concept around the game that made it stand out, actually. Seems like you missed it.

1eyedking said:
no puzzles - the first game had some very interesting missions that could only be finished by solving them in a certain way,
???
Did you even play the first Majesty? Some missions made you exploit a particular strategy such as: spamming Wizard Towers to cast Lightning to destroy lairs; abusing a particular Hero type or combo since it would be the most apt to handle the quest at hand; choosing between mutually exclusive special Race dwellings; spamming Inns to safeguard your heroes; starting a game with lots of cash so you can quickly upgrade a Wizard's Tower to use Lightning Storm to stop a massive wave of Minotaurs, etc.

You know, puzzles. Stuff that makes you think and not just build at least 100 SCVs, 30 Supply Depots blocking memorized entry points, 10 Barracks, 1 Academy, spam Stimpacked Marines & Medics LOL DESU WIN~.

Wait for expansion pack.
You are a very critic and intelligent person and clearly not a prey of braindead consumism at all.

And why are ignoring the fact that ressurection itself isn't cheap at all?
Are you fucking kidding me, kid? In the previous Majesty you had to build a Temple (1000), upgrade it twice (1500+2600), and then a 1000 (or 1500 if following Krypta) for every Resurrect which had to be done fast since tombstones disappeared within seconds.

In this dumbed down piece of crap you only pay 1000-2000 depending on level without any planning whatsoever and there is no time window. Incredibly strategic.

Hamster said:
1-webbig.jpg


Left - low level warrior, right - high level warrior.
Only low level looks like bandit and it shows that you didn't bother to play the game to see a high level one.
Oh joy. He went from bandit to townguard. :roll:

Even a WC3 Footman has more personality than that:
footman.gif
 

thesheeep

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1eyedking doesn't like the game. Oh noez!

Seriously, you don't like the game and brought some arguments, of which almost all are completely subjective. I don't agree with 90% of those, or they simply don't disturb me and love the game. Don't mistake your opinion for general truth and don't play crybaby because they moved the game onwards, changed some things and made it more accessible. It's not like they made it 1st person, ffs...

But then again, I'm certainly a dumbfuck and have no idea what I'm talking about.
 

1eyedking

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What the hell? What is so subjective about no longer requiring to manage an economy, being served resurrections on a plate, and no challenge whatsoever?

Maybe you're just butthurt because I at least have arguments while you don't.
 

Lyesmith

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"I'm melting!"
"Leave my gold alone!"

I could agree with some flaws game have. Sure it's not as great as the first.

Other than that...
1eyedking said:
Thieves now run away foes with a ransom, even if you offer an exorbitant sum(...)Wizards carefully select their targets before casting their spells instead of blindly assaulting Medusas
I only played demo, but thieves are still dumbfuck greedy, rangers quickest to explore, clerics lazy-ass bitches and wizards blind fucks that get to close to ogres. Dunno about warriors, tough.

1eyedking said:
Hamster said:
1-webbig.jpg


Left - low level warrior, right - high level warrior.
Only low level looks like bandit and it shows that you didn't bother to play the game to see a high level one.
Oh joy. He went from bandit to townguard. :roll:
It's maybe more fantasyish, than previous
warrior-walk.gif

but
1eyedking said:
Even a WC3 Footman has more personality than that:
footman.gif
Warcraft as a comparison? Fail.

...shows major butthurt.
 

1eyedking

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Lyesmith said:
I only played demo, but thieves are still dumbfuck greedy, rangers quickest to explore, clerics lazy-ass bitches and wizards blind fucks that get to close to ogres. Dunno about warriors, tough.
Maybe they complained about this in the demo, because somehow retail M2 behavior is either random or fucked up.

Lyesmith said:
Warcraft as a comparison? Fail.
Which was the main idea.
 

thesheeep

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Okaaay...

1eyedking said:
What the hell? What is so subjective about no longer requiring to manage an economy

What? There is no difference here. You managa an ecenomy the same way as you did before. You gain money from tax collectors, thieves guild and market transports.
All of those (except the guild) are extremely easy prey of any enemy, so you have to make sure they are as safe as possible.

The only difference I see is that you can only build trading posts on certain fixed locations. I don't really like that but it really isn't THAT bad.
Oh, and you can upgrade the posts to defend themselves. This is cheaper than building guard towers, obviously, but those trade-post arrows are kinda weak, just enough to fend off weak creatures.

1eyedking said:
being served resurrections on a plate

Because ressurections are simply not worth the money you had to pay in Majesty 1.
Don't know if it was like this in M1, but in M2, ressurections become more expensive, the higher the level of the hero is. Ressurecting a lvl 5 ranger is about 400-500, recruiting a new one is 150. Probably a bit too cheap, but still nothing that really disturbs balancing.

1eyedking said:
and no challenge whatsoever?

Play harder levels then. Yes, novice in M2 is easier than novice in M1. but that's the way novice SHOULD be. It should be a challenge to only those that play for the first time. Advanced is already significantly harder, as you can easily lose a mission if you make some certain mistakes.
I don't know if it will reach the same level of difficulty as it did in M1, but I don't really want to end with missions that are more frustrating than they are fun.


Again, those things you mentioned are definitely changes. And you don't like them. I do, mostly.
But, oh well, I guess you are right and I simply like bad changes :roll:
 

Hamster

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1eyedking said:
Black_Willow said:
They improved the AI so it's dumbed down.
This has nothing to do with AI, but rather with game design. Heroes now stay alive longer easier, and if they get killed you can revive them without any previous preparation whatsoever.
There are not staing alive longer, the are quite easily killed by strong monsters and spawns from lairs. That if you played the game long enough to see strong mosters.

I am not in favor of new ressurection system, i liked old one better. But it's not at all bad really. Yes, you don't need any preparations, but you also don't have needed money at the start of the game, 1500 is pretty much when you are just building your economy. Unlike 1500 for late game temple spells in M1.

Go play other generic piles-of-shit RTS if you want that; this is Majesty, not Supreme Commander.
So Majesty to you was just graphics?

They weren't all that great, but at least they were original (as in non-recycled).
They were shit. The sound of sword hitting something was just unacceptable.

This is actually a somewhat serious issue.
It's absolutely not.

Yeah, just as we've now found out most "people" wanted Fallout to be first-person.

Newsflash: those people are dumbfucks.

Yeah, Fallout 3, dumbfucks, blah-blah.

These two flags are absoluely logical, they make perfect sense. It's what a king is supposed to be able to do.

Are you dumb? It was part of the core of Majesty's economy.

Core of Majesty's economy was building a bigger settlement and collecting more taxes.
Multiple markets with their market days were a pretty cheesy exploit of direct control.

Fixed. Furthermore, Majesty is all about using reward flags your to indirectly command your heroes. This was the key concept around the game that made it stand out, actually. Seems like you missed it.
So , creating a party is a crime against direct control, but abusing your control over markets and thieves guild is a core of majesty? Makes no sense.

Oh joy. He went from bandit to townguard.
Just like in Majesty 1? Lyesmith already showed you the picture.


Overall, you are just butthurt about any changes without taking into account if they are positive or negative. Basically, you are bitching for the sake of bitchin, like skyway likes to do.
 

CrimsonAngel

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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong
I will admit the game is not as good as the first one, but it is good enough.

Fun, Challenging, invokes nostalgia and so on.

Over all i am happy i got it.
 

Hory

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