Not quite. As the update itself noted, Qilin is a completely useless hostage because Wuxing and his ilk view the unorthodox as lower than dirt, so she really is no ace at all. She is, however, valuable to us and none of the choices change that at all. Say what you want about C, but it takes a proactive stance towards actually doing something to pull her ass out of the fire now, as opposed to relying on ridiculous trolling in a volatile situation to make something happen out of thin air. And gambling her life like that is kinda dumb, when we have an in with the Cult, via the maidens and the established fact that we are their enemy's enemy, and Yunzi. We have people that will speak up for us on their side, and that's all the chance we need to open dialogue and offer barter. If they need our help to escape, then so be it. I don't thin anyone was planning to leave these guys, Yunzi and all, to a slaughter in the first place (except RealDDc).Fire cult, orthodox, sword saint.
C plans on interrupting whatever happens by going first and begging for the release of one of the aces up the sleeve of the numerically inferior side.
Like what? If we are negotiating for a hostage's life and neither us or the Cult is making a hostile move, how would Shagguan allow the orthodoxes to just initiate violence when he is here for pacifism? We brought him to be the Big Dick in this place, so let him do his thing while we look for our interest, namely Qilin.It gives us a vantage point. I know that B is the "sit and wait" option, but A still lets us see what develops from a central location. C either removes us from the big picture or could force something nasty to happen.
Okay, we distract everyone and get their eyes on us...and now what? What can MTP, the most reviled pugilist by the sects, say that will diffuse the situation and let Qilin run free, from the iron grip of the Amesha Spenta holding her? Sleigh of Hand doesn't come into negotiations, but Speech, standing and CHA do. We have enough to get our foot in the door and barter for Qilin's life. If they want our help to escape in exchange, why the hell not?It lets us do what we do best: distract and get everyone's attention. Qilin might be able to escape if we do something to distract them. I don't think our fighting ability will really be able to make all that much difference where we stand. The cult is on the apparently losing side. Unless our 5 SoH is really that godly, I don't see us making that big of a difference that would really do anything be it with bargaining or whatnot.
Whatever his plan is, he is a bad enough dude to pacify the two sides just by his presence alone, so I don't see why he needs Jing's help for anything here, especially if it is a diplomatic solution that he seeks. Jing is great for inciting fights, butthurt and trolololo in the Orthodox Sects. Why would Nie Wuxing listen to a word we say to him, when he is clearly in a stronger position? He can, without a doubt, crush us with no problems.It let's us pool our resources with the Sword Saint. We have no idea what he is planning. Since he, like us, is technically unaligned in this fight, he is probably our best candidate for help. If he does have a plan, we might be able to help him with it, or at least keep ourselves from getting in his way.
True, but absolutely nothing says we cannot meet him later down the line. He seems to be pretty tight with our Lord Zhang. However, with Qilin's life on the line, now is not at all the best time.Also, I think he is an incredibly interesting character. It might be well worth our time to sit with him and get to know him better. He might be an invaluable asset in the future.
It gives us a vantage point. I know that B is the "sit and wait" option, but A still lets us see what develops from a central location. C either removes us from the big picture or could force something nasty to happen.
It lets us do what we do best: distract and get everyone's attention. Qilin might be able to escape if we do something to distract them. I don't think our fighting ability will really be able to make all that much difference where we stand. The cult is on the apparently losing side. Unless our 5 SoH is really that godly, I don't see us making that big of a difference that would really do anything be it with bargaining or whatnot.
It let's us pool our resources with the Sword Saint. We have no idea what he is planning. Since he, like us, is technically unaligned in this fight, he is probably our best candidate for help. If he does have a plan, we might be able to help him with it, or at least keep ourselves from getting in his way.
Also, I think he is an incredibly interesting character. It might be well worth our time to sit with him and get to know him better. He might be an invaluable asset in the future.
Not quite. As the update itself noted, Qilin is a completely useless hostage because Wuxing and his ilk view the unorthodox as lower than dirt, so she really is no ace at all. She is, however, valuable to us and none of the choices change that at all. Say what you want about C, but it takes a proactive stance towards actually doing something to pull her ass out of the fire now, as opposed to relying on ridiculous trolling in a volatile situation to make something happen out of thin air. And gambling her life like that is kinda dumb, when we have an in with the Cult, via the maidens and the established fact that we are their enemy's enemy, and Yunzi. We have people that will speak up for us on their side, and that's all the chance we need to open dialogue and offer barter. If they need our help to escape, then so be it. I don't thin anyone was planning to leave these guys, Yunzi and all, to a slaughter in the first place (except RealDDc).
Like what? If we are negotiating for a hostage's life and neither us or the Cult is making a hostile move, how would Shagguan allow the orthodoxes to just initiate violence when he is here for pacifism? We brought him to be the Big Dick in this place, so let him do his thing while we look for our interest, namely Qilin.
Okay, we distract everyone and get their eyes on us...and now what? What can MTP, the most reviled pugilist by the sects, say that will diffuse the situation and let Qilin run free, from the iron grip of the Amesha Spenta holding her? Sleigh of Hand doesn't come into negotiations, but Speech, standing and CHA do. We have enough to get our foot in the door and barter for Qilin's life. If they want our help to escape in exchange, why the hell not?
Whatever his plan is, he is a bad enough dude to pacify the two sides just by his presence alone, so I don't see why he needs Jing's help for anything here, especially if it is a diplomatic solution that he seeks. Jing is great for inciting fights, butthurt and trolololo in the Orthodox Sects. Why would Nie Wuxing listen to a word we say to him, when he is clearly in a stronger position? He can, without a doubt, crush us with no problems.
True, but absolutely nothing says we cannot meet him later down the line. He seems to be pretty tight with our Lord Zhang.
Jing is really good at bugging the orthodox guys, but we haven't even met the Fire Cult and don't know how to push their buttons, or even if we'd want to try that. What we can be sure of is that if they don't know that Qilin doesn't have value as a hostage against the Orthodox, they're not going to let their hostage slip away (as they feel that without that extra leverage a new massacre might start) so we can be sure that they're going to be holding onto her pretty tight, multiple of the best fighters that the Fire Cult has to offer aren't going to let such a 'valuable' person slip away from their grip no matter what sort of antics a teenage attention whore tries to pull off while drinking half the battlefield away.
Besides that, precisely, Jing isn't quite big enough to be a big impact. They can't really influence the tide of the battle by demanding that he fight or else they'll kill her or something, so there's no reason for them to do that, but if they don't have a reason to hold onto her, then why should they bother? Jing very well might get saddled with some favor or something in return, but I think it's probably worth it for her.
If we don't want to get in his way, maybe we shouldn't get in his way. People are advocating getting him to have BJ serve us wine while sitting atop Vahista, I think that sort of scenario would be way more inflammatory with both sides than just talking with the Fire Cult guys. I'm not sure what we can possibly bring to his table that he doesn't have already, but I guess this is an alright point.
Yes, well, I can say the same about the fire cult characters, can't I? An intriguing group that Jing's first kinda love interest is all wrapped up within that Jing has consistently demonstrated zero interest in. We always say that we'll talk with them or figure out something later because something important popped up (or in this case for drinking I guess) but we never bother and have no idea what any of them are like. We've cumulatively spent more time with the Sword Saint who just showed up than any non-Yunzi member of the Fire Cult, and that worries me.
In a different situation, perhaps he could afford to kick our ass to the curb. However, look at this from his perspective: he is wounded, only two of his Amesha Spentas are in any condition to fight and his forces are even more outnumbered than they were before. No one in the jianghu has shown him or his people any consideration. Except, that is, Xu Jing when he rescued the children of his faction. They definitely received word of what we have done, as shown by our reputation increase, so I am definitely confident that this gives us the benefit of the doubt from him. Besides which, this is an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" situation: everyone knows that Jing is no friend to the Orthodox sects, especially not the Huehueshan. So, yeah, there are enough unifying factors here that C is a more surefire way than A is, and by a long shot.My biggest problem with C in this regard is that there are no absolutes. There is no guaranteeing us that they will even talk to us or free Qilin no matter what we do for them. I think that the maidens and Yunzi advantages are overstated. Sure, we helped the maidens get away, and that puts us into a good light, but they aren't that special at all. They seem to be acolytes of sorts, I doubt that they will be able to sway their masters much. The same goes for Yunzi. We have always had a love-hate relationship, so even if she is in a good mood and puts in a good word for us, like treave said, she doesn't have the clout to make anyone do anything. The cult is in a precarious position, so I don't think that the Lord will let the lives of a few neophytes or the child-hood frienemy of his squeeze put us above his cult's best interests. Like I said earlier, if throwing us or our girlfriend away saves their hides, then why should they care what happens to us. We have some slight connection, but it isn't nearly enough to make that big of a difference.
Uh, what can our childish antics and trolling possibly do to help Qilin escape from the iron grip of the Amesha Spenta holding her? That wasn't really stated in any uncertain terms:With a distraction we can attempt to get everyone's eyes and attention on us so that Qilin can make some move to escape. She is hardly a maiden in distress. Given a little help she can manage herself. Probably. I have no delusions that we will be able to stop the fighting on our own. I am hoping that we can do as much as we can to help Qilin escape without throwing ourselves in an unwinnable situation.
Again, it seems that A is relying on a nebulous something to happen and by some miracle help Qilin escape across the field, but what that something is no one has any idea of. C is a plan, a moderately risky plan, but a plan nonetheless that we can count on because we are the ones who ahve developed.The other has a hand clamped firmly around Qilin’s neck; a threatening posture, if you ever saw one.
Dude, that's hilarious, considering that we know almost nothing about these guys. How are they, survivors of a Muslim genocide looking for a new home and in a very precarious position that is open to negotiation with the Emperor via us, a bigger threat than the Orthodox Sects, infiltrated by the Grand Eunuchs' agents and having a stranglehold on the Empire's tax bases and farmlands?The cult is completely against all my views of how I want Jing to turn out. I still hope that we can work out some middle ground with the sects that can keep them all from seeing us as a traitor and scum. The sects seem to dangerous of a choice for me. Siding with them would almost assuredly be the last bridge we could burn with teh sects and ever hope for them to not eternally hate us. All friends that we have made up until this point could not save us if all the major organizations despise us.
Siding with the Saint allows us to still be unorthodox, but doesn't piss everyone off as much.
Also, my #1 is still and will always be helping Shun. Without question. I see having anything to do with the Fire Cult as directly contrary to helping China, and more importantly, Shun.
My biggest problem with C in this regard is that there are no absolutes. There is no guaranteeing us that they will even talk to us or free Qilin no matter what we do for them. I think that the maidens and Yunzi advantages are overstated. Sure, we helped the maidens get away, and that puts us into a good light, but they aren't that special at all. They seem to be acolytes of sorts, I doubt that they will be able to sway their masters much. The same goes for Yunzi. We have always had a love-hate relationship, so even if she is in a good mood and puts in a good word for us, like treave said, she doesn't have the clout to make anyone do anything. The cult is in a precarious position, so I don't think that the Lord will let the lives of a few neophytes or the child-hood frienemy of his squeeze put us above his cult's best interests. Like I said earlier, if throwing us or our girlfriend away saves their hides, then why should they care what happens to us. We have some slight connection, but it isn't nearly enough to make that big of a difference.
I don't see how this really relates to what I am saying. What I said had nothing to do with the Saint or violence/nonviolence. A places us in the middle of the battlefield, so we have a good view of both sides and can see if anything is brewing. I fear that going up to the cult in C might make us miss out on something important or push thing in a bad direction.
With a distraction we can attempt to get everyone's eyes and attention on us so that Qilin can make some move to escape. She is hardly a maiden in distress. Given a little help she can manage herself. Probably. I have no delusions that we will be able to stop the fighting on our own. I am hoping that we can do as much as we can to help Qilin escape without throwing ourselves in an unwinnable situation.
I assume that any help they might ask for involves fighting the orthodox sects and making a distraction or whatnot, but I do not think we are capable of accomplishing anything on the level of them giving her up. What could we do to help that wouldn't involve fighting the sects? We would be outnumbered and outmatched. This isn't the pirate situation where we are facing off against random nobodies. We would be up against the best of the best the sects have to offer. Failure could mean them not returning Qilin or even death.
It is late, I can hardly comprehend what I am trying to read or write, so this will be my last post for the night.
That is cool. I can understand that viewpoint. I just don't have anywhere near your confidence in our ability or the cult's generosity to see it working off that nicely.
The cult is completely against all my views of how I want Jing to turn out. I still hope that we can work out some middle ground with the sects that can keep them all from seeing us as a traitor and scum. The sects seem to dangerous of a choice for me. Siding with them would almost assuredly be the last bridge we could burn with teh sects and ever hope for them to not eternally hate us. All friends that we have made up until this point could not save us if all the major organizations despise us.
Also, my #1 is still and will always be helping Shun. Without question. I see having anything to do with the Fire Cult as directly contrary to helping China, and more importantly, Shun.
They are still at a numerical disadvantage, and Jing is worth at least as much as Guo Fu, who can stall 50 men by himself. I don't get why you think that the boss battles are the only ones that matter. Even Tulu Huodu have admitted that he could be swarmed by lesser fighters, and it was stated that the advantage in numbers could have allowed orthodoxes to overwhelm Vahista and Yunzi.Kipeci said:They can't really influence the tide of the battle by demanding that he fight or else they'll kill her or something, so there's no reason for them to do that, but if they don't have a reason to hold onto her, then why should they bother? Jing very well might get saddled with some favor or something in return, but I think it's probably worth it for her.
The distance ensures that just fine. You'd have to catch up to them to crush them, first.Jing can crush five regular guys in two seconds flat, those guys being sure that Jing wouldn't just make off with Qilin would have to be able to ensure that she couldn't survive if Jing did anything but help them, including if Jing went straight to attack them.
*cough* sword saint *cough*...and promptly end up sandwiched between a pussed Fire Cult and Orthodox sects, out for our blood, instead of one another's.
Not to worry. When Shagguan and Lird Zhang decide to a comedy show impromptu tournament, we'll just take the Cult's side and demand Qilin and Yunzi as our prizes.But with a very amused Zhang.
I am sure it would have turned out fine.