Let's Play VtM: Wild Nights - Chapter 10

[Serious_Business]

So what are our goals behind all this? Two words : survival and power. Everything we do is to secure our position and furthen it. So far we've been kind of acting on the situation without really keeping our goals in mind. We've had opportunities to side with Sabbat and Anarch, which we've refused. I think it's fair to say we'll be working with the Camarilla from now on - and we shouldn't stray from that path. So how do we maintain and further our position in the Camarilla? Well, first of all, those who suggested we'd be prince - I'd get away from that idea. Especially since I read our guy's background info (which was nice) - he's not prince material. But more concretely - our power base is totally scrawny. We have only contacts, basically no retainers, and we can't do much with our hands (we've more or less decided not to thug it up). Everything we should do is putting bricks on the way to success. One word : patience and efforts. Going for the "brilliant one stike move" will not work. Maybe we'll be Prince - in 300 years. So forget about it.

I suggest that we become good Camarilla scum from now on. Our interest in the interest of the Camarilla. The more the Camarilla gets stronger, the more we reap. The Camarilla needs a strong position. I'm not even sure why we'd want to go agaisnt the Prince's plan to strengthen his power. If anything, supporting him to success would be more beneficial to us. Of course, putting all our eggs into one basket is a bad idea - we shouldn't rely on the Prince exclusively. But remember that the Camarilla have ennemies - and that's not us. I might sound very nice and idealistic about this - I know Camarilla is all about back stabbing - but we need to "fight for the cause", so to speak. We need to be more and more seen as the guy with convictions, that doesn't stray from his path, and that knows how to get shit done. We need to build up that tower of Babel. Right now we barely have anything to stand on. If we want to increase our power base, then we do it in Camarilla parameters. There's no other way.

I'm being vague and abstract as usual, but I'm saying this because we need to focus right now. We've been fucking around too much, which is understandable, because we didn't really know where we were going. We need to start planning - which means stop reacting, but also acting. We've been little bitches until now, as far as I'm concerned. We only go "OH NO WHAT SHOULD WE DO" - why? Because we have no goals. We don't know why we do what we do. Of course we're many individuals, so it's hard to set up on that goal. It's understandable that our char is divided and not very driven... because that's how the game works. But I think we really need to look to the future right now.

That said - why the hell do we do what we do? Why go agaisnt the Prince, for once? What do we have to gain here? If the prince goes down, it's a power vaccum, and forget about filling it. We have nothing to fill it with. In fact if we ever get to the position where we could step in - it would be much wiser to resist. We'd get torn to shreds. So what the hell are we doing? We've building a tower, that's right. So we need bricks - what can increase our position?

I think it would be smart to support the Prince's moves, if his intention is really to strengthen his own position. I don't see why we should go agaisnt this, really. I'm not saying to be his bitch, but we have nothing to loose if he gains position. If anything we should show him that he should have confided with us from the start. Gaining his confidence would be a good step. But we don't want to be seen as the prince's underling either, as I've said before, just because his position is not strong enough and he could get replaced.

We still don't know some parameters, of course. But we need to pick a side and stick to it if we're ever going to build anything. Loosing Oscar is really pissing me off right now - that shouldn't have happened. It wasn't a strategical spending of ressources - it was "oh shit I don't know what to do". Bullshit. No one's out to kill us right now. We aren't even a fucking threat. We really need to flatten our egos.

What's our problem here? DuMarchais. That's our real problem, as I've said from the start. We need to get this guy out of the way. Everything he gains is against our own gains. This is petty - this is the level we're at right now. The prince looks at him better than he looks at us? We've lost the game. Think yourself in French 17th century court politics. We have to bow down and look clever and do things cleanly, not diablerize shit left and right expecting great easy success. That mentality is for plebos. This is the Camarilla way, and this is what we've chose right now, so start getting into the right mentality.

I suggest B. We need to get at this guy - he's our main concern. We need to show our support for this whole crap going down, but we need to outmaneuver this fuck. We need to be the ones that gain from this mess. This should be our goal right now. As far as calls go - we need to call our of our political contacts to cover this, of course.

 

[laclongquan]

Okay, it's RECAP time and SPECULATION:

RECAP:

1. Prince know something about Rannigan's dangerous association so he sent two of his men out to capture/kill him. Then he provide you info that implicate the Anarchs who currently meet the bounty on Camarila's vamp set by Sabbat. If you follow that trace Prince will have some cause to wage war against Anarch. We didnt bite that, his men died, so Du marchais went out and bitten some bullshit about Sabbat caught Rannigan and held him somewhere in Sabbat territory. Hold that thought here.

2.Dubrik, a Sabbat spymaster, want to rob and kill you. His vase, we stole. And should this raid fail the Camarilla ties will be weakened, it will be harder to call for war again in future. If we are in this raid deep inside Sabbat's territory, ONE we are easier to get killed TWO our territory is defenseless, easier to get robbed. Three birds, one stone. Masterful plan! Also hold that thought.

3. Du Marchais think for sure we are getting the sack now. We held valuable services so our death is not needed. He will try to retain our services as before but cheaper and tighter reins. In time we might get killed but only in time, not this night. Talking with him hold no risk. Also hold that thought.

4. We dont have much resource in defense. Our most reliable man is here in this stupid raid. Our second resource, the Russian thugs, are newly in our corner and who know how reliable they are. We can call them to defend our territory and let them get killed by Sabbat strike team, yeah, but can they defend successful. But do we have any other choice left. Hold this thought.

Speculation of this night''s event:

1. It's highly possible there's NOTHING at that warehouse. Camarila walk out for nothing and the bond weaken. Sabbat lose nothing.

2. It's moderately possible that there's an assassination aim at you this night. if you are with Du Marchais there's a chance he will die in your stead and Camarila suffer a loss, BUT not the bond. The Prince lost his baron but fuck the prince.

3. IT's highly possible a strike team will aim at our personal holdings to find the vase and trash the place. If we keep it in Whitehall's office, they will have trouble to infiltrate there but still possible. If we keep it in our modest abode, nothing as of now can prevent that.

Recommendation:

We are facing a choice and consequence:

1. Call Whitehall to arrange cover up. Our home will be trashed but the masquerades is holding.

2. Call Ruskies to defend our homes. Baron Du Marchais will have cause to accuse us of neglience in keeping Masquerades.

Then again, if the good Baron turn to ashes it's only between Prince and us. And Prince surely has many other to influence media, police, firemen, etc... Surely he must have or our value would have gone through the roof. So it's not that much necessary for us to call Whitehall.

You see, choice and consequence...

My vote is

2. Go to the raid and meet Du Marchais. pray like hell a team of assassins are hitting at that time and rid us of this troublesome baron.

And call Ruskies. With one baron dead and one battle happened in our territory we can raise bloodlust further. And any awkwardness resulted we just shift blame to the dead. Mwahahahahahahaah.

 

[Esquilax]

Definitely call the Home Secretary. Even if Oscar were an option right now, I'd rather call Humphrey. We need to work damage control and make sure that there's as little fallout as possible from this raid. When we called him last time, there was already some worrying stuff on the news that threatened the Masquerade. Priority #1 is making sure that any bullshit is dealt with immediately. See if he has Dubrik's address, as well.

D and E are right out. Going to a sewer with no backup to gain the allegiance of some horrible abomination sounds like a great way to get killed. I might be open to it if Edgar was with us - but right now? No fucking way. And as for E, we don't even have three people to call right now.

Finding info on Rannigan is very tempting, but short-sighted. The one thing we have on our side is secrecy, which gives us a bit more time to work. Our absence will only arouse suspicion and come back to bite us in the ass - that sycophant du Marchand will be watching to make sure we are there. When the raid is finished, we can get Oscar his server and hopefully get some info on the sedan location then. However, if we headed to Rannigan's territory, we could probably find out what kind of crew he was getting involved with.

We've been playing the good, loyal Ventrue so far in the last few updates. The Prince is completely unaware of what we're doing and we can't just fuck off now. That leaves A or B. What makes you guys think that B is such a bad option? What, you guys think du Marchais would try to kill us during the confusion of the raid? The guy has already become Baron - he's confident now and he doesn't view us as a threat. In his mind, we're eliminated. This is paranoia talking. We need to take down that motherfucker ASAP, we've been playing around too fucking long.

A will allow us to step into the fight, but aside from being able to protect Edgar, I see no positives.

Call Home Secretary, B.

 

[zool]

I like to go against the flow, so I suggest we choose E.

Obviously, we'd like to see how the raids unfolds. But do we have enough time to be a mere spectator and watch Cammies fighting Sabbat shovelheads for the whole night? A smarter course of action would be to use that precious time to get ahead of our enemies and try to understand better what's going on. Choosing E. would allow us to do just that by calling:

1. Humphrey Trentbridge, the Kine Home Secretary, in order to protect the Masquarade as the Prince ordered us to - it gets him off our back.

2. Antonia, our ghoul and secretary. We haven't used her so far, and we could ask her to compile all the available info we have on the Sheriff - we'd better know our new ally well in case she tries to betray us.

3. Oscar. Let's try to contact him and inform him that thanks to the video, we've got the Sheriif on our side and that he has no reason to fear for his life anymore (well, we think so anyway... ). If he goes into hiding for good, we will have lost a precious source of information, one thing we cannot afford to.

 

[laclongquan]

E is good in that we can call Ruskies and Humphrey Trentbridge to cover both our bases. E is bad in that we are going home in a severely weakened Camarila territory. IF there's an assassination team aim at us, they know about our route: from base to gathering place, then back to base. Dont forget we got assassinated just at the start of chapter 1, two nights ago. Let alone political fallout from AWOL of this important raid. Dont forget that every barons appeared, even Sammy.

E is nearly as risky as visit the sewers. No thanks.

 

[Esquilax]

So what are our goals behind all this? Two words : survival and power. Everything we do is to secure our position and furthen it. So far we've been kind of acting on the situation without really keeping our goals in mind. We've had opportunities to side with Sabbat and Anarch, which we've refused. I think it's fair to say we'll be working with the Camarilla from now on - and we shouldn't stray from that path. So how do we maintain and further our position in the Camarilla? Well, first of all, those who suggested we'd be prince - I'd get away from that idea. Especially since I read our guy's background info (which was nice) - he's not prince material. But more concretely - our power base is totally scrawny. We have only contacts, basically no retainers, and we can't do much with our hands (we've more or less decided not to thug it up). Everything we should do is putting bricks on the way to success. One word : patience and efforts. Going for the "brilliant one stike move" will not work. Maybe we'll be Prince - in 300 years. So forget about it.

I suggest that we become good Camarilla scum from now on. Our interest in the interest of the Camarilla. The more the Camarilla gets stronger, the more we reap. The Camarilla needs a strong position. I'm not even sure why we'd want to go agaisnt the Prince's plan to strengthen his power. If anything, supporting him to success would be more beneficial to us. Of course, putting all our eggs into one basket is a bad idea - we shouldn't rely on the Prince exclusively. But remember that the Camarilla have ennemies - and that's not us. I might sound very nice and idealistic about this - I know Camarilla is all about back stabbing - but we need to "fight for the cause", so to speak. We need to be more and more seen as the guy with convictions, that doesn't stray from his path, and that knows how to get shit done. We need to build up that tower of Babel. Right now we barely have anything to stand on. If we want to increase our power base, then we do it in Camarilla parameters. There's no other way.

I'm being vague and abstract as usual, but I'm saying this because we need to focus right now. We've been fucking around too much, which is understandable, because we didn't really know where we were going. We need to start planning - which means stop reacting, but also acting. We've been little bitches until now, as far as I'm concerned. We only go "OH NO WHAT SHOULD WE DO" - why? Because we have no goals. We don't know why we do what we do. Of course we're many individuals, so it's hard to set up on that goal. It's understandable that our char is divided and not very driven... because that's how the game works. But I think we really need to look to the future right now.

That said - why the hell do we do what we do? Why go agaisnt the Prince, for once? What do we have to gain here? If the prince goes down, it's a power vaccum, and forget about filling it. We have nothing to fill it with. In fact if we ever get to the position where we could step in - it would be much wiser to resist. We'd get torn to shreds. So what the hell are we doing? We've building a tower, that's right. So we need bricks - what can increase our position?

I think it would be smart to support the Prince's moves, if his intention is really to strengthen his own position. I don't see why we should go agaisnt this, really. I'm not saying to be his bitch, but we have nothing to loose if he gains position. If anything we should show him that he should have confided with us from the start. Gaining his confidence would be a good step. But we don't want to be seen as the prince's underling either, as I've said before, just because his position is not strong enough and he could get replaced.

We still don't know some parameters, of course. But we need to pick a side and stick to it if we're ever going to build anything. Loosing Oscar is really pissing me off right now - that shouldn't have happened. It wasn't a strategical spending of ressources - it was "oh shit I don't know what to do". Bullshit. No one's out to kill us right now. We aren't even a fucking threat. We really need to flatten our egos.

What's our problem here? DuMarchais. That's our real problem, as I've said from the start. We need to get this guy out of the way. Everything he gains is against our own gains. This is petty - this is the level we're at right now. The prince looks at him better than he looks at us? We've lost the game. Think yourself in French 17th century court politics. We have to bow down and look clever and do things cleanly, not diablerize shit left and right expecting great easy success. That mentality is for plebos. This is the Camarilla way, and this is what we've chose right now, so start getting into the right mentality.

I suggest B. We need to get at this guy - he's our main concern. We need to show our support for this whole crap going down, but we need to outmaneuver this fuck. We need to be the ones that gain from this mess. This should be our goal right now. As far as calls go - we need to call our of our political contacts to cover this, of course.

Fucking great post. It doesn't matter how much more competent, intelligent, tough, or resourceful we are, and it doesn't matter how much of an incompetent dumbfuck du Marchais is. It matters what the Prince thinks. And if he thinks du Marchais is all those things, well, then he is. If our Home Secretary comes through with Dubrik's address, what do you suggest we do with it? Give it to the Prince? Seems to be the best choice, that way we can rise a bit in status after this Rannigan situation.

Previously, I and others here were wondering whether to stay Camarilla or defect to the Sabbat. There was no focus. But clearly, we are heading more towards the Camarilla and we had damn well better act like it.

EDIT: laclongquan, what is with you and that fucking vase? Nobody gives a fuck about our vase. C'mon man, the Sabbat Bishop has a raid to deal with, he doesn't care about our vase because he has far more important things to think about. People, you are developing delusions of grandeur here. We are vastly becoming more and more insignificant and we kept quiet about the info - nobody will be going out of their way to assassinate us at this point. And that's exactly the problem.

 

[zool]

E is bad in that we are going home in a severely weakened Camarila territory. IF there's an assassination team aim at us, they know about our route: from base to gathering place, then back to base. Dont forget we got assassinated just at the start of chapter 1, two nights ago. Let alone political fallout from AWOL of this important raid. Dont forget that every barons appeared, even Sammy.

E is nearly as risky as visit the sewers. No thanks.

E) I’d better head for home. This city may be set alight before the night is over. (Allows you to make three calls instead of one, carries no risk.)

 

[laclongquan]

Let's assume for the best that there's no ambush for us personally. The fallout of AWOL in this event will be big enough that should warrant cautions.

And just because the vase is not valuable in your eyes doesnt mean it's not valuable in Dubrik's eyes. Beside, it's our personal abode they are planning to trash. There's a matter of principle here: you are not to let Sabbat scums trashing your house.

Read my RECAP and Speculation post again to see why, please.

 

[laclongquan]

Iif my choice is chosen there's something to consider:

1. In the worst case that is there's no assassination aim at our Patrician. We still can dig more info from good ol Gullible to see how did he arrive at his data of Rannigan's warehouse. Matter of fact is that we havent spoken with him at all since chapter 1. He will gloat? Please, keep gloating. The more he speak the better.

2. In a better case, we can have a chance to quietly dispose Du Marchais and blame that on Sabbat. It carries risks of its own but it should be on the table. And frankly speaking his ashes are more useful to Camarilla cause.

3. IN the worst case: he's alive, no fight at the warehouse, the Sabbat raid successfully in our turf. Massive disappointment, massive loss etc and etc... We still can turn it around to our benefit but the damage to Camarila's cause is very big.

Be paranoid!

 

[ironyuri]

Call Humphrey


B - We need to have a little chat with du Marchais


Good posts, grotsnik (and Serious Business' above as well). Sorry I'm late to the party this time, I was playing Bloodlines til my haven computer bugged out and broke my game, so I came back for some of this.

My thoughts:

We've been outmanouevred on this. Whatever we found out about Rannigan from the beginning was worthless because du Marchais was never going to expose any shady dealings anyway. This raid was always an eventually, unless of course if we had visited du Marchais first. Now that we're in this position we need to be savvy and politick. We've got the sheriff in the know, now and she's doubting the Prince or du Marchais, if she wasn't, she'd have branded us a traitor and had us staked out in public.

We need to go through with the raid, and regardless, breaking down Sabbat power will preserve our lives in the long-run if Dubriik still wants our head. We need to preserve the masquerade, or we may lose our influence with Trentbridge and the foreign office kine and we need to catch du Marchais offguard. If powerful kindred die because of a raid he called on a false pretense he'll catch a sunrise before he can even think about his next night and we know that he's lying about Rannigan. We have the upper hand and we may find him at our mercy, so we can use both of those things to our advantage.

 

[laclongquan]

Choice and consequence are such a bitch.

Ah well. Bed await! I just cant wait to see what you guys will come up with in the morning.

 

[ironyuri]

Given we had the choice to do to du Marchais exactly what he's done to us (blame the Sabbat/Anarchs/whoever) and move on wiith the plot, I believe we've taken the better path for our ventrue and possibly for the overall London Camarilla.

du Marchais has lazily blamed the Sabbat because he didn't want to go to the trouble of actually finding Rannigan, but rather making a power play against us. He has been an enemy since day one and we haven't kept him as close as perhaps we should have, but now we have something on him that could be his final death, we might be able to make use of him. He can be the first rung of the ladder as we climb upwards. We may not be Prince materiall, but that doesn't mean we can't be a real kindred and kine power broker in the London Camarilla.

Who wants to be Prince anyway? It would tie our hands. We'd be left to deal with all the petty squabbles of the London primogen. Let them be Kirkbeck's problem while we make gains behind the scenes and orchestrate our plans from the shadows. We don't need the kind of publicity being a Prince would bring.

As SB said, we've determined our long-term personality as a politick kindred. That's what we need to be right now. We may not get another chance to move on du Marchais in the open, which is what we'll have at the raid. We can dispose of him, or blackmail him- if we do the latter after we've been removed from Whitehall, he could probably have us staked out and the former won't be easy and won't ensure we would become baron. We can use the cover of this raid to turn the screws on him one way or another, especially since the Sheriff knows the raid- du Marchais' raid- is an exercise in bloody farce.

 

[Esquilax]

Btw, I'm curious, what kind of vampire would be "Prince material"? I know that going after that goal for us is a fool's errand and puts a huge fucking bullseye on us, just curious on what that phrase entails.

 

[Zero Credibility]

How is B going to work? Right now, as far as prince and du Marchais know, we are just a sucker that got played out for his domain. If we start giving them hints that we have damaging evidence (and a video that shows prince's thugs kidnapping a baron is quite damaging), we might just find ourself upgraded to a dangerous liability. Not a healthy position to be in without backup. Let's keep our distance (A) until we gather some.

 

[SCO]

The plot points to a massacre today. A massacre of both the sabbat and the cammies, that is not what i hoped for, ever since i tried to make the anarchs move against the sabbat. As that didn't work three things:
1) The meeting was general, the mole(s) knows about the raid and already informed the bishop. It will be a failure and a trap. The setite doesn't even have to say anything.
2) to disarm this trap for our chosen faction, we need to call the home sec, naturally, to keep the masquerade, and also to find out the real nest.
3) We need to move the attack tonight if we are to strengthen our faction.
Problem is, that shithead duMarchais is one of the warleaders, and worse the one that "knows" where the Tarrence is.
We will have to either reveal ourselves (and our hidden asset, the mole) to make him see our point/blackmail him.
Or we need to force the sheriff to see our point and "ASSUMING CONTROL" (which i would recommend)
Or to inform the prince himself about the mole and the info, and let him "ASSUME CONTROL".


I don't know exactly what to do now, but i think you should consider this strong possibility.


We can of course force the raid off (very risky) by telling the home sec to make police presence be felt and HARD all NIGHT LONG. Then when the prince comes calling "WTF WAS THAT MOTHERFUCKER" we can tell him "BOYO YOU WERE PLAYED" and tell/show the record of the homesec phone call. Not sure that would save us.

 

[Desmodus Rotundus]

@ laclongquan

Stop going on about him calling his russian thugs, he had two options take the contact for the sewer thingie or russians, he took the former one, so he doesn't have the latter.

 

[Esquilax]

How is B going to work? Right now, as far as prince and du Marchais know, we are just a sucker that got played out for his domain. If we start giving them hints that we have damaging evidence (and a video that shows prince's thugs kidnapping a baron is quite damaging), we might just find ourself upgraded to a dangerous liability. Not a healthy position to be in without backup. Let's keep our distance (A) until we gather some.

Man has a point. Yeah we have the opportunity to talk with du Marchais, but what the fuck would we talk to him about? What would be the goal of our conversation and what would we get out of it?

 

[SCO]

I can only see us blackmailing/enlightening him (hey, he doesn't know that the sheriff knows) to move the attack to the real bishop nest.

I guess i can tolerate the shithead taking credit. It's hard though. Maybe he'll die heroically though.

 

[Desmodus Rotundus]

How is B going to work? Right now, as far as prince and du Marchais know, we are just a sucker that got played out for his domain. If we start giving them hints that we have damaging evidence (and a video that shows prince's thugs kidnapping a baron is quite damaging), we might just find ourself upgraded to a dangerous liability. Not a healthy position to be in without backup. Let's keep our distance (A) until we gather some.

Man has a point. Yeah we have the opportunity to talk with du Marchais, but what the fuck would we talk to him about? What would be the goal of our conversation and what would we get out of it?

Whatever the goal of that conversation could be doesn't mean that we have to be a complete moron and hint that we know something stinks about the affair, nothing so far in our protagonists character suggests that he is a suicidal moron, why do you think that would be the only way for him to act. Also Duwhatever thinks that he just beat us and would want to gloat, why not let him, he might let something slip out.

 

[SCO]

If we could kill some policemen around the area of the attack, it could be called off. Do we know where are we going?

The sabbat zones of influence are spread out.

 

[grotsnik]

If we could kill some policemen around the area of the attack, it could be called off. Do we know where are we going?

The sabbat zones of influence are spread out.

Yup, I'm assuming that you will be able to trail the masses of Kindred to the raid location without too much difficulty.

 

[SCO]

If we don't care about part of our faction being weakened, we could just do two things:

Go home

Call the home sec for the location of the bishoph and to keep the masquerade.
Call the sheriff showing the real location.

duMarchais and a great part of our faction gets killed, we raid the lasombra place of power while the thugs are out. He is probably there, lasombra lead from shadows.


How about it?

I'm voting this.

E) (P) home sec, keep the masquerade on the sabbat areas, find out the location of the bishop (hope he is home)
(P) Shoreditch, tell him to follow the sheriff, turn on his auspex
(P) the sheriff, tell her the real location of the bishop, let her strike out.



That is all. Let the stupid motherfucker hang himself. We can get Dubrik ourselves.

 

[SCO]

Don't you know? We only just knew. It's even true. We only just called the home sec.

Pity Fellowes knows about the mole. He may snitch or let slip out, but we can remind him that that place is a deathtrap and we are doing him a favor by letting him just attack a sabbat bishop. Hahah.

 

[Esquilax]

Guys, we can't make use of Fellowes, as he's participating in the raid.

 

[SCO]

Terribly sorry, ever so ignorant about those foreign places.