Just completed Dragon Age: Origins

[Lhynn]

I would play pillows if it had less text...so much reading feels like school again.
If I wanted to read I would take some good book not waste my time on Sawyers pseudo-intellectual masturbation.

I dont mind text, i play text based games a ton. The writing in pillows is just garbage, im amazed at how many worthless words made it into the game, if there was ever a fucking case for word count meaning absolutely nothing, then it can be made with pillows.
90% of what you read means fuck all, shouldnt be there, gets in the way, its redundant, takes you out of the game, gets in the way of understanding the situation or is just poorly worded.
Add to that the fact that combat is a trainwreck with no real depth and a ton of needless complexity that basically allows you to use the same tactic over and over again against every single enemy in the fucking game (with the exception of maybe 2-3 enemy types). Then 2 of the 3 things you spend all your time doing are complete crap, and the other thing you do is walking around everywhere which admitedly is very well implemented, but only outside of combat, because of the fucking pathfinding, oh my fucking god the fucking pathfinding in this fucking game.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Yeah, and then you stop destroying everything with Sleep and stock on Magic Missiles.

Maybe if you are a min/maxer. I actually enjoy role-playing the character, and growing with him. So, I don't want to use some crappy throw-away spell just because it's functionally great at low levels. I'd rather grow with the long-term spell.

But more to the point of the original argument, look, so you have your one sleep spell per day at the beginning in D&D. Meanwhile, by level 2 in DA:O, I have limitless Cone of Cold, which cc's everyone, not just low level trash AND at the same time does good damage to them, and can lead to shattering. And other damage/cc spells too, all being able to be cast as needed. So stop nitpicking.

 

[the_shadow]

Yeah, and then you stop destroying everything with Sleep and stock on Magic Missiles.

Maybe if you are a min/maxer. I actually enjoy role-playing the character, and growing with him. So, I don't want to use some crappy throw-away spell just because it's functionally great at low levels. I'd rather grow with the long-term spell.

But more to the point of the original argument, look, so you have your one sleep spell per day at the beginning in D&D. Meanwhile, by level 2 in DA:O, I have limitless Cone of Cold, which cc's everyone, not just low level trash AND at the same time does good damage to them, and can lead to shattering. And other damage/cc spells too, all being able to be cast as needed. So stop nitpicking.

I agree that mages in Dragon Age: Origin shit all over mages in other D&D games like Infinity Engine games or Neverwinter Nights, unless both are at really high levels. Level-capped mages in Dragon Age: Origins don't ever get spells like Time Stop or Wish.

It's also important to note that mages in Dragon Age can output huge amounts of damage even without spell casting with a wand/staff attack, whereas mages in other D&D games can only use slings.

 

[Delterius]

So stop nitpicking.

I said it was a nitpick. Not really a hostile one. I even agreed with your overall point on that same post. You just keep pulling dumb arguments to defend your previous lack knowledge about level level D&D magic. The latest of which seems to be that the only proper way to roleplay a Mage is to make him completely inept at his job. Here's an instructional video for future reference:


Featured: a bipolar autistic nitpicker and storyfaggot extraordinaire.

 

[Lhynn]

Featured: a bipolar autistic nitpicker and storyfaggot extraordinaire.

Could you be more specific? thats like half the codex right there.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

I said it was a nitpick. Not really a hostile one. I even agreed with your overall point on that same post. You just keep pulling dumb arguments to defend your previous lack knowledge about level level D&D magic. The latest of which seems to be that the only proper way to roleplay a Mage is to make him completely inept at his job. Here's an instructional video for future reference:

Stop being so butthurt. Has nothing to do with knowledge about D&D magic. If you are just playing the game without meta-knowledge and if you have limited spells as in D&D (since you can only pick a few at the beginning, and you don't know which ones you can buy/find later), and you read the descriptions, anyone normal would pick magic missile and other always useful spells like identify instead of a spell that explicitly tells you it only works against trash. Now, as I mentioned above, if you are a min/maxer with meta-knowlege, sure you might go for that kind of cheese, but most people go for good overall spells.

 

[Delterius]

Stop being so butthurt. Has nothing to do with knowledge about D&D magic. If you are just playing the game and don't really know anything about it you'll pick the useless spells, like Identify and 1d4 Magic Missile. But if you know how the game works you'll pick the spells that are useful at early levels, like Sleep and Blindness. But I repeat, this have nothing to do with knowledge about the game.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

But if you know how the game works you'll pick the spells that are useful at early levels, like Sleep and Blindness.

You are just skipping over what I am saying, or maybe not understanding it. Given a choice, typical players will choose a good all-around spell like Magic Missile or Identify, that stays useful throughout the game, or in Magic Missile's case, even grows more powerful over the course of it, over some crappy spell that only works at very low levels, and even then in a utility way (since someone else will have to do all the cool stuff). I'll create a simple analogy for you, let's say you had a warrior that had to make a choice at level up, to pick some temporarily useful ability that will become useless in a level or two, or an ability that starts off weak but will eventually become stronger and remain useful for the entire game, which one do you think most RPG players would choose? Do you see what I am saying now?

 

[Delterius]

Do you see what I am saying now?

You are a mage, not a sorcerer. You don't marry your spells. Your analogy sucks. Magic Missile is a useless spell at level 1. Identify is always useless. Its the sort of thing you cast at an inn and don't suffer to waste spell slots on while on the field.

The simple fact is that your overall point doesn't hold ground, at least not in the way you intend it to. Before you compare a level 1 Mage from Dragon Age to a level 1 Mage from AD&D you have to control for two things.

First how spell progression is balanced in AD&D. The prospecting Mage sees a spell that deals piss poor damage, and another which can disable every monster semi permanently as long as they are below level 4. Its a no brainer. A few levels later, you'll exchange those for direct offense like Magic Missile, though mostly as a means to disable enemy casting. This is something you didn't know about but, hey, we learn something new every day.

Second is how low key first level combat in the IE games was when compared to Dragon Age. Its not just the characters themselves, but the whole thing is much more subdued in, say, Baldur's Gate. As long as you don't farm EXP from wolves, you'll get less than a handful encounters between rests. Maybe one or two that is an actual threat to you, like Tarnesh and Silke. Never is 1d4+1 damage all around useful. But make any of those casters Blind and its game over.

And, yes, even when you control for these things you find out that the Dragon Age: Origins spellbook was half assed in a way that only Dragon Age: Inquisition could surpass. There are readily avaiable spells that can one shot the most powerful enemies in the game. And you can bet your ass the devs knew this. Why else would they arbitrarily limit what spells can be cast with a sword out and which can't? Because Arcane Warrior was even more broken on top of an embarrasingly designed magic system and at least then something had to be done.

 

[newtmonkey]

I did not mind this game at all, especially considering what came next. It was probably the last recent major RPG I enjoyed. In fact, it was almost like a return to RPG form for me, compared with what I was playing at the time (were there any good RPGs even released then??).

The combat was pretty lame, I was triggered by Alistair's modern douche haircut, and the final battle was awful.

However, for a modernish RPG it has a nice sense of exploration. I know you just pick spots from a map. But, you can equip each member of your party with weapons, armor, and equipment (oh my god what a world we are in now that this is a feature), and you still had some places to select from on that map.
I think it compares nicely to older second-tier RPGs like Demon's Winter, Battletech Crescent Hawk's Inception, etc. Those old games were actually quite linear, but you never knew it because they were so good at hiding it. I guess, my way of looking at it was, not every game can be the Pools of Radiance/Ultima IV or V of it's day. Compared with almost anything else released around the same time, DA:O is really not bad.

You guys definitely have some excellent points, but a lot of RPGs are smoke and mirrors, even the classic ones. I think DA:O just didn't do enough to hide what it was doing behind the scenes. If it had some world you had to run around between places of interest, I think it would have seemed a lot more like what we think an RPG should be.

(I am avoiding talking about the combat system because, to be honest, very few classic RPGs had good combat systems. There is not a single Ultima that had good combat, for example. But a good RPG can overcome that, and I guess DA:O was not able to do that for a lot of people. For me, I was able to overlook the combat and also Alistair's derpy haircut, and have some fun with this game.)

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

You are a mage, not a sorcerer. You don't marry your spells. Your analogy sucks.

Wrong. The entire mage kit/sub-class in BG/NWN/etc is based around spells (which ones you can and cannot use). Moreover, in terms of lore/role-playing/immersion, which spells your mage uses define them. A mage using Fireballs would look/feel completely different from one casting Summoning Conjuration spells. Even you should be able to see this.

Identify is always useless. Its the sort of thing you cast at an inn and don't suffer to waste spell slots on while on the field.

For someone who talks so much about game/spell knowledge, you seem to not even know how things work in D&D. We are talking about which spells one selects at char creation/level-up, not which ones a char chooses to memorize. Since you can only select a small number, you are admitting that you would select so called "useless" identify so you could cast it at inns, thus invalidating your own point. If you cast it at inns, and thus save yourself quite a bit of gold, it's not exactly useless now, is it?

First how spell progression is balanced in AD&D. The prospecting Mage sees a spell that deals piss poor damage, and another which can disable every monster semi permanently as long as they are below level 4. Its a no brainer. A few levels later, you'll exchange those for direct offense like Magic Missile, though mostly as a means to disable enemy casting.

Again you ignore the fact that Sleep is a gimped anti-trash spell, is described in its own description as such, and is utility-only. Magic Missile on the other hand, is an actual damage dealing spell, which gets better with time. I would argue that most people who take pride in their character would take the latter waaay before the former. If I am starting the game without meta-knowledge, and have to choose 2-3 spells, you can bet your sweet ass I am taking MM and Identify (and others) before Sleep. Now if you would sacrifice long-term stuff to have some temporary boon, then that's your flaw, not my problem.

 

[Delterius]

The entire mage kit/sub-class in BG/NWN/etc is based around spells (which ones you can and cannot use).

What a beautiful non sequitur.

"Dude, that makes no sense. You can change your spells later."

"WRONG. MAGE KITS EXIST!"

What?

Well, indeed they do. And let's say you pick Invoker, just to make sure your useless first level Magic Missile is as thematic as possible. A specialist isn't someone who is limited to his specialization. You sure as fuck wouldn't pick Infravision just because you are a Diviner. Besides, can you think of a more useful Invocation spell at first level? I can, its called Chromatic Orb. At least then your shitty damage may come with a round of blindness. Nothing compared to the actual Blindness spell but who cares? I am the Hero! The Hero is the one who does the damage XDDD.

Hey, if you want to move away from your crappy analogy, fine by me. Its just another subject to tackle.

We are talking about which spells one selects at char creation/level-up, not which ones a char chooses to memorize. Since you can only select a small number, you are admitting that you would select so called "useless" identify so you could cast it at inns, thus invalidating your own point.

Welcome to class. You see, Mages can learn spells outside of levelling up. All they need to do is procure a few scrolls. This is yet another difference between Mages and Sorcerers and yet another reason why your crappy analogy is still crappy.

But oh dear, you caught me. I have cast Identify at some point in my life. What I didn't do, however, is waste a first level spell pick on a scroll that routinely drops from Gibberlings (this is what actual metagame knowledge looks like, by the way).

Again you ignore the fact that Sleep is a gimped anti-trash spell, is described in its own description as such, and is utility-only.

If this were PnP or even NwN, that 'utility only' spell would cause every enemy to be susceptible to coup de grace. If this were Baldur's Gate, that would be more or less the case anyway. Surrounded by a kobold horde? Hopefully your shitty Magic Missile can kill one of them! Thanks Porky! Now the party doesn't have to do all the action! Oh my God, the arrows! They hurt! If only we could control this crowd, somehow!

Magic Missile on the other hand, is an actual damage dealing spell, which gets better with time.

An actual damage dealing spell that can be outdamaged by a Sling and that will eventually be worth memorizing. It isn't at level 1, though.

I would argue that most people who take pride in their character would take the latter waaay before the former.

Now this is rich.

Tell, me does your character wake up every day and says 'a week from now I'll be about level 4 so let's memorize Magic Missile right now'?

No, what the fuck would that even mean?

Here's a better thought process. 'My foster father Gorion is a great mage, he can easily invoke 5 Magic Missiles in an instant whereas I'd be hard pressed to fire a single one. Worse still we are about to travel cross country and that bolt might not even dispatch a single Gibberling, much less a horde! But you know what, I know another spell. Its called Sleep. Its not very powerful, but I'm sure that it can stop many of the beasts in the wilds. Hopefully one day I'll be as powerful as my foster father, but until then I won't act like a fucking moron and waste my free spell pick on fucking Identify.'

If I am starting the game without meta-knowledge

If you start the game without meta knowledge you might pick anything. You might pick Armor and Infravision. There are tons of even more useless spells than 1st level Magic Missile avaiable for you to peruse.

Now if you would sacrifice long-term stuff to have some temporary boon, then that's your flaw, not my problem.

You see, your analogy still sucks. A 1st level mage with Sleep and Blindness can easily out do many encounters with those same spells and still personally outdamage your shitty magic missile with a sling. And then that mage climbs up levels and uses a cheap ass scroll to learn Magic Missile.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

What a beautiful non sequitur.

"Dude, that makes no sense. You can change your spells later."

"WRONG. MAGE KITS EXIST!"

What?

Well, indeed they do. And let's say you pick Invoker, just to make sure your useless first level Magic Missile is as thematic as possible. A specialist isn't someone who is limited to his specialization. You sure as fuck wouldn't pick Infravision just because you are a Diviner. Besides, can you think of a more useful Invocation spell at first level? I can, its called Chromatic Orb. At least then your shitty damage may come with a round of blindness. Nothing compared to the actual Blindness spell but who cares? I am the Hero! The Hero is the one who does the damage XDDD.

Heh, you seem to be writing more and more, most of it off-topic. But that aside, let's see, yes you are still wrong, as you intentionally ignore the real point of my argument in that case, which is that mages ARE defined by which spells they cast, as the subclasses clearly show. And you intentionally left out the second part as well.

Welcome to class. You see, Mages can learn spells outside of levelling up. All they need to do is procure a few scrolls. This is yet another difference between Mages and Sorcerers and yet another reason why your crappy analogy is still crappy.

But oh dear, you caught me. I have cast Identify at some point in my life. What I didn't do, however, is waste a first level spell pick on a scroll that routinely drops from Gibberlings (this is what actual metagame knowledge looks like, by the way).

Again, you are refuting your own arguments. A player playing for the first time (or after years away) will not remember/know which scrolls drop or are sold where. So based on that, they will select the most important spells at level up.

If this were PnP or even NwN, that 'utility only' spell would cause every enemy to be susceptible to coup de grace. If this were Baldur's Gate, that would be more or less the case anyway. Surrounded by a kobold horde? Hopefully your shitty Magic Missile can kill one of them! Thanks Porky! Now the party doesn't have to do all the action! Oh my God, the arrows! They hurt! If only we could control this crowd, somehow!

Strawman. MM is obviously a single target spell, and a very effective one even at later levels, because there are spell memorization limits. So once your high level DD spells run out, MM can do a lot of damage. Sleep will be useless by that point, because on such low level creatures, you can just beat them to death with your staff.

Now this is rich.

Tell, me does your character wake up every day and says 'a week from now I'll be about level 4 so let's memorize Magic Missile right now'?

You keep piping in with this strawman. We are not talking about memorization. We are talking about spell selection at level-up or char creation. Eventually you will have all spells from level 1, but by that point Sleep/blind are too weak and pointless anyway. Early on, you will only have what you select.

If you start the game without meta knowledge you might pick anything. You might pick Armor and Infravision. There are tons of even more useless spells than 1st level Magic Missile avaiable for you to peruse.

Lack of meta-knowledge is not the same as lack of reading/thinking ability. Most people read the spell descriptions and select based on that. MM and Identify descriptions = useful/cool, Sleep description = gimped anti-trash.

You see, your analogy still sucks. A 1st level mage with Sleep and Blindness can easily out do many encounters with those same spells and still personally outdamage your shitty magic missile with a sling. And then that mage climbs up levels and uses a cheap ass scroll to learn Magic Missile.

Meta-knowledge much?

 

[Delterius]

Heh, you seem to be writing more and more, most of it off-topic.

"Dude, that makes no sense. Mages and Sorcerers are different."

"WRONG MAGE KITS EXISTS"

"Well, the thing about mage kits is that..."

"LOL stop going offtopic you dumb man"

You keep piping in with this strawman. We are not talking about memorization.

"I only want to compare mages from different games, stop talking about how the classes work goddammit!!"

Again, you are refuting your own arguments. A player playing for the first time (or after years away) will not remember/know which scrolls drop or are sold where. So based on that, they will select the most important spells at level up.

Oh, yeah, because first time players who don't know anything about the game are totally going to pick fucking Identify.

Strawman. MM is obviously a single target spell, and a very effective one even at later levels, because there are spell memorization limits.

Holy shit you are even more dense than Lhynn.

 

[the_shadow]

Heh, you seem to be writing more and more, most of it off-topic. But that aside, let's see, yes you are still wrong, as you intentionally ignore the real point of my argument in that case, which is that mages ARE defined by which spells they cast, as the subclasses clearly show.

Even if that were true (which is debatable, since you don't *need* to select a specialist if you want to play as a mage, and it doesn't limit your spell selection that much), how does that effect the observation that one can simply start memorizing Magic Missile instead of Sleep at Level 4? If you were limited to the number of spells you could learn per spell tier (like a Sorcerer is), I'd agree whole-heartedly with the claim that learning Sleep as a mage is pretty dumb considering it becomes obsolete too soon. But mages can know any spell, assuming they find a spell scroll, and scrolls of magic missile are a dime a dozen.

I'll also add that I think Magic Missile is one of the most over-rated spells in D&D games, and that I never cast it. Sleep is very useful at low levels.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

"LOL stop going offtopic you dumb man"

The reason I said that was because the part I quoted had you writing up a wall of text which completely ignored the main thrust of my arguments and instead put up an imaginary conversation between you and I guess a dumbed down version of me that you dumbed down just enough to your level so that you could then argue with it. You then flavored that imaginary conversation having nothing to do with the actual argument at hand with some Brasilian hipster overtones (I guess) and decided that's gonna fly. It won't my friend.

"I only want to compare mages from different games, stop talking about how the classes work goddammit!!"

Except you are not talking about how classes work in any relevant way. You are comparing two different mechanics, which obviously ruins the whole argument.

Oh, yeah, because first time players who don't know anything about the game are totally going to pick fucking Identify.

Why not? Anyone who has played RPGs in general knows about the Identifying mechanic, so when you read the spell description, it sounds like something you would want to have. This isn't specific game meta-knowledge, just playing experience. Even if you didn't, just by using common sense and logic, you can read the description and think, hey there is an identifying mechanic at work in this game, that sounds like it would be useful to have this kind of spell. Unlike say a spell that, oh I don't know, describes itself as working exclusively against low level trash.

Holy shit you are even more dense than Lhynn.

I dunno, Lhynn is pretty dense. But I like the guy.

Even if that were true (which is debatable, since you don't *need* to select a specialist if you want to play as a mage, and it doesn't limit your spell selection that much),

Well, it defines it somewhat, and then he conveniently "forgot" to quote the other part of that argument, ie "Moreover, in terms of lore/role-playing/immersion, which spells your mage uses define them. A mage using Fireballs would look/feel completely different from one casting Summoning Conjuration spells." This is basic RPG stuff and why you have different schools of spells in the first place.

how does that effect the observation that one can simply start memorizing Magic Missile instead of Sleep at Level 4? If you were limited to the number of spells you could learn per spell tier (like a Sorcerer is), I'd agree whole-heartedly with the claim that learning Sleep as a mage is pretty dumb considering it becomes obsolete too soon. But mages can know any spell, assuming they find a spell scroll, and scrolls of magic missile are a dime a dozen.

I'll also add that I think Magic Missile is one of the most over-rated spells in D&D games, and that I never cast it. Sleep is very useful at low levels.

Ok, here is my argument again:

1. We are talking about early game.
2. We are talking about a regular player without advance meta-knowledge of the game.
3. At character creation and the first 1-2 level ups, the player has to choose a small number of spells.
4. At that point, since the player has no meta-knowledge, they don't know what spells they will find/buy in the future.
5. Based on that, they are forced to select the spells they deem most important, not just at that moment, but for their character for possibly a very long time, since they don't know when something will become available.
6. Under the circumstances described above, I would argue that most people who care about their character's development and take pride in creating that character would select spells that are good long-term, such as Magic Missile, Identify, etc, instead of a spell that describes itself as a low level one that stops working against tougher enemies.

 

[Lhynn]

Retarded wall of text

Just do yourself a favor bro, concede. You are wrong, and you are a fucking disgrace. Let it go, youll get to argue another day.
Also learn to quote scrub, youve been around for over 3 years.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Just do yourself a favor bro, concede. You are wrong, and you are a fucking disgrace. Let it go, youll get to argue another day.
Also learn to quote scrub, youve been around for over 3 years.

I dunno, Lhynn, first, I think I am easily winning this argument, and second, you disagreeing with me makes me certain I am on the right side of it.

 

[Lhynn]

I dunno, Lhynn, first, I think I am easily winning this argument, and second, you disagreeing with me makes me certain I am on the right side of it.

Poor stupid men. you already lost.

 

[Lostpleb]

DA:O was a fun game if you had been out of the Bioware loop since BG2 and wanted some kind of spiritual sequel. Even though DA:O was probably more or less just an engine upgrade to anyone who had played Jade Empire or KOTOR beforehand, to me it made for a very enjoyable 70 hours+ playthrough.

Couple of things that it did well

+Origin stories
+Combo spell system
+Passive skill management
+Party interaction

The only low point of the game was the DLCs that came after. Pointless mini-dungeons with NPCs or loot that didn't really do much for the main game, unless you planned on doing a rerun with the Nightmare+ mod. Still, there aren't very many RPGs that are consistent in their quality from the beginning to the end these days, and DA:O was among them.

The combat is terrible for many reasons. The sameness of enemies (darkspawn/undead/humans on repeat). The way mages are ridiculously OP while warriors are completely underwhelming. Unlike a more balanced system like AD&D for example, here mages get damage+cc in same spells (cone of cold, fireball, snowflake, earthfist, etc), much of cc is irresistible (cone of cold, combo cc spell), massive nukes (entropic death/mana clash), no spell limitations (e.g. spells per day), so the end result is 0 challenge.

Conversely, warriors are completely shafted. Defense determines chance of avoidance, which is the only real defensive mechanism in DA:O, and only rogues can effectively invest into it. Warriors can only invest into armor, which is fairly useless. My main character had around 40 armor by the end of the game, and everyone above trash mobs would still be going through him like butter. So rogues end up being better tanks than warriors. Likewise, for 2 handers, it's very hard to hit a lot of things regularly outside of when Perfect Striking ability is off the CD.

The mana costs were well-balanced as a form of spell limitation, the main problem was that the devs didn't get around to implementing a Lyrium addiction mechanic before the game could be released - that was what was supposed to keep Mages in check and prevent them from chain chugging mana potions.

As for Warriors, they melted on Nightmare but the other two classes melted even faster, so how did you even beat the game with a Rogue tank? My only complaint there would be that both Bow Rogue and DPS Warrior were garbage tier RP specs, although that was thankfully fixed with mods later on.

 

[canakin]

My favourite parts of the thread so far:
5-"Compared to DA2 and DA:I its a masterpiece." Nigger please, the shit I took this morning was a masterpiece compared to DA2.

4- "The characters were brilliant; the replayability very high; as I said early I personally loved the tactical combat; the story was deep; the music amazing; the world rich etc.I personally would call it a masterpiece."

3- "And who can forget Gaxkang?" Who the fuck is Gaxhang?

2- "Don't be. DA:O was great in every way but the Codex will never acknowledge that because here RTwP is considered a crime." RTwP should be considered a war atrocity and included in Geneva convention.

1- "Let me guess, you measure your characters in DPS terms." Yes I do because I'm not a larping homosexual, characters are as useful as their performance in combat.

Honorabru mention: Bunch of dick measuring about DnD knowledge and other nerd shit. Educating

10/10 would read again.

 

[Wayward Son]

3- "And who can forget Gaxkang?" Who the fuck is Gaxhang?

My exact reaction to this.

 

[Neanderthal]

Demi Lich in Athkatla docks weren't he?

 

[Lostpleb]

Demi Lich in Athkatla docks weren't he?

That was Kangaxx, which was a nice step up from Irenicus on the overall boss difficulty curve of BG2.

Gaxkang is the Dragon Age homage to that boss. Unlocking him takes about as much time, but the payoff is not nearly as good - this is because he is just a slightly beefed up demon mage, unlike the Demi Lich in Athkatla that had immunity to all but the best weapons in the game as well as a permadeath instant cast spell.



Unlocking the mystery of that damn door and summoning the secret boss of DA:O felt pretty good, but the fight as a whole was one big faceroll that could be solo'd. The Broodmother was more interesting from a mechanical standpoint, Flemeth was harder, and the Archdemon was infinitely more epic.

 

[JBro]

I thought DAO was harder than Baldur's Gate 1. Though I hated DAO and loved BG1. It dragged on too long and all the difficulty came from fighting hundreds of enemies in every encounter.