Jagged Alliance: Drug Flashback

[imweasel]

Here is that update if anybody wants to read it.

Spoiler

Anyway, the game is pure shit. Don't buy it.

 

[sser]

"Our dream was to be around 60."

Fucking LOL. Don't dream too hard, fellas.

 

[Alienman]

Not aiming very high

 

[Consul]

That is just pathetic... They are happy with 60% score on steam. These guys were supposed to revive JA franchise? I didn't play JAF and didn't follow closely its development but that attitude is simply embarassing.

 

[PosledniKovboj]

Sorry for the restricted link, didn´t realize. Anyway, I hope Full Control as a company is fucking done for, there´s enough shitware developers raping good franchises as it is.

 

[Baron Dupek]

http://www.jaggedallianceflashback.com/forum/27/6856#post_6856

So much undetected butthurt...
Basically - they blame people for too high expectations, praying for fan made mods and fixes and if nothing change - abandon ship.

Some quotes.

As most of you by now have discovered, JAF launched end of October. The reception has been all over the board ranging from “Absolutely love it” to extreme hatred by a small rabid core group. While we do love the positive feedback, it is the negative one that has taken up most bandwidth online and internally at our end.

... the major feedback issue really stems from expectations. And I think expectations from “outsiders” that have not been following JAF development as a Kickstarter project on a small budget, but expectations from hardcore JA fans expecting JAF to be the next JA3.

Please...

As you and we know, this project was never meant to be a replacement for JA2. It was a project where we as a fan community could in unity get JA back to its core roots of great TBS combat, modding and create a foundation for keeping the brand alive. ... it has a good solid combat system that screams JA, and an ok story that has good elements. Modding wise it is miles ahead of where JA2 was when it was released ... we really think there is a great basis for lots of content updates in the future through community efforts.

Do our job and you can lure all that hate toward you. Thanks. Modders gonna modders etc.

... the gamers or even you as backers have not yet given us credit for this work by revising your reviews on Steam. ... If you really think JAF is only worth 40% positive, then so be it. I cannot change your mind then, and we will be forced to stop here. ... So please! Give the game a fresh look and a positive review if you like it!

EDIT
Seems like JA Flashback is truly faithful to the series, enemies with pistols have outstanding aim and may harras your snipers. Fucking lol.

 

[R@S]

I have followed the development of Jagged Alliance Flashback closely since the start, and here's my thoughts on how it turned out in the end.

First, they released the game on Steam in a very sorry state. It was full of bugs and lacked a lot of content that was advertised and promised. This resulted in a very low rating. Full Control blames Steam for setting the release date in October.

Full Control keep mentioning they have financial issues, and have the gall to blame this on people who bought their product. They changed office as soon as they got their Kickstarter money, moved to a fancy developer house to be around the big boys. I bet that cost them a nice sum. I guess their expectations of making a successful Jagged Alliance game were spot on, right? The game subsequently got a very low rating, they blame players for the bad reviews, which led to bad sales. Full Control says the bad reviews has to do with player expectations being too high. Reality check, please!

The one to blame should be whomever thought it would go any different releasing the game in the state it was back in October. The one to blame should be whomever thought they could afford the higher rent on their new office space. The one to blame should be the one that hired some random guy, now fired I hear, to make a crap GUI and then left the company unable to fix it.

They want sympathy from Jagged Alliance fans, but honestly, they don't deserve it. Modders will not be able to fix this game, I have checked the files and documentation, and what needs to be done can't be fixed or added.

 

[Alienman]

Think it's funny when they say it was not supposed to be JA 3...

Buy JA license
Do Kickstarter, promise the world to JA fans
Fail making said game
Blame JA fans

 

[Burning Bridges]

I dont know about you but to make a new game and set the goal to mediocrisy is very unprofessional.
There are of course limits when you operate with 1,2 developers but 350,000 is a pretty large sum.
Anyway they at least made a game and the statements were not totally unrealistic so one should give them credit for that.

 

[Astral Rag]

http://store.steampowered.com/app/256010/

75% off

 

[Infinitron]

http://store.steampowered.com/app/256010/

75% off

It actually had a larger discount than that during the Early Access, although that may have been a glitch: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...flashback-released.82137/page-10#post-3436553

 

[Astral Rag]

http://store.steampowered.com/app/256010/

75% off

It actually had a larger discount than that during the Early Access, although that may have been a glitch: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...flashback-released.82137/page-10#post-3436553

I know, that's when I made the mistake of buying it.

 

[R@S]

I see that many people are wondering about Full Control and the future of this game. For those who don't know yet, I will now provide the details to remove any speculations. Basically, FC is in financial trouble and mismanaged this entire project (details will follow):

Thomas Lund offering his office space for rent online: http://www.spiludvikling.dk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3439

A quick search on internet indicates that every member of the JAF production team is not working for FC anymore.

Moreover, a more thorough examination of the team members reveals that the game was actually produced by at most 4-5 people who actually have some game development experience. Shockingly, the large majority of the JAF development team was formed by a group of unpaid interns (mostly students) with no solid experience in game development.

Significant parts of the game were developed by unpaid interns, including but not limited to: large parts of level design, 3D modelling, and sound.

FC was fully aware that they shipped a subpar game. It is evident that all resources were put on developing Space Hulk instead of JAF.

I hope that those who disputed FC's mismanagement and conning of consumers are now convinced of FC's deceipt. Thomas Lund basically misused JAF's brand name to attract money for his studio. Money that his company in normal conditions would never be able to gather.

http://www.jaggedallianceflashback.com/forum/70/7076#post_7087

Professionals, huh? It wont be long before they are out of business.

 

[Infinitron]

That sounds like it could be right, but some evidence would be nice (LinkedIn profiles)

 

[Roguey]

TBH who cares if interns make the levels, art, and sound? Harebrained Schemes used a lot of interns for those things too.

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

This thing is out already? Totally missed it.

Anyway, please tell me how any of you hoped that this will turn out good?
Imagine those talentless Danish fags would have announced their JA clone on Kickstarter but without the licence. Would any of you have backed this game? Of course not.
But when they slap the Jagged Alliance on it you got excited and the "this is actually looking promising!" bullshit started.

What you people need to understand is that a proper sequel is only possible if (1) at least some of the original core team members are involved or (2) the game is made by the same studio which upholds the tradition and legacy of the games series despite the original team being replaced step by step, akin to the ship-of-theseus-principle.
Exceptions are extremely rare and only possible if the new development team is extremely devoted to every detail of the original game.

The Jagged Alliance name in itself is not something that magically allows some morons from Denmark to somehow capture the gameplay brilliance, design, humor and atmosphere of JA2. I could tell this one to be a stinker right from the start when I saw how these guys handled the game's artwork (CUTE HAMSTERS everywhere, lol we're so meta ), of course this argument wouldn't have convinced anybody because the Codex is full of pseudo-rational autists who have no appreciation of aesthetics.

 

[Infinitron]

What you people need to understand is that a proper sequel is only possible if (1) at least some of the original core team members are involved or (2) the game is made by the same studio which upholds the tradition and legacy of the games series despite the original team being replaced step by step, akin to the ship-of-theseus-principle.
Exceptions are extremely rare and only possible if the new development team is extremely devoted to every detail of the original game.

The Jagged Alliance name in itself is not something that magically allows some morons from Denmark to somehow capture the gameplay brilliance, design, humor and atmosphere of JA2. I could tell this one to be a stinker right from the start when I saw how these guys handled the game's artwork (CUTE HAMSTERS everywhere, lol we're so meta ), of course this argument wouldn't have convinced anybody because the Codex is full of pseudo-rational autists who have no appreciation of aesthetics.

the developers actually have enough money to make it.

Fixed

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

So I guess Bethesda was on the brink of filing for bankruptcy when they released Fallout 3. And NV being so much better was purely accidental and not the results of being developed by a studio that carries on the BI/Interplay legacy.

 

[Infinitron]

What I'm saying is that talking about humor, atmosphere and aesthetics when you're dealing with a team that was trying to make a Jagged Alliance game on a budget of $350,000 is kind of missing the forest for the trees

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

Fair enough. Anyway, I guess the point I was trying to make is that I just don't get how people get even cautiously optimistic about sequels that are developed by people/studios that haven't even the faintest connection to the original game, no matter the budget size.

 

[m_s0]

What I'm saying is that talking about humor, atmosphere and aesthetics when you're dealing with a team that was trying to make a Jagged Alliance game on a budget of $350,000 is kind of missing the forest for the trees

The budget was tiny, sure, but reading about all the mismanagement makes me think that given a higher budget FC would've just failed that much harder. You can't solve everything by throwing money at it.

 

[sser]

Xenonauts budget wasn't that big and they made a pretty credible game even with a shitty engine. This was just a poorly managed operation, maybe even intentionally so if they're hiring interns to do shit while they keep the cash.

 

[Infinitron]

Xenonauts budget wasn't that big

Development of Xenonauts began in 2009.

Looks like Xenonauts is one of those "made it for free in my spare time over a period of many years"-type indies. Different kind of thing. I believe we've spoken about this before.

Maybe that's the kind of indie development model that the Jagged Alliance franchise needs to resurrect itself. But for that, somebody needs to step up and begin working on it, knowing that the final product might be released in 2020.

 

[sser]

Xenonauts budget wasn't that big

Development of Xenonauts began in 2009.

Looks like Xenonauts is one of those "made it for free in my spare time over a period of many years"-type indies. Different kind of thing. I believe we've spoken about this before.

Maybe that's the kind of indie development model that the Jagged Alliance franchise needs to resurrect itself. But for that, somebody needs to step up and begin working on it, knowing that the final product might be released in 2020.

The Xenonauts guy started his own company with a family trust. It was a bonafide company where his role was largely managerial. Xenonauts issues had a lot to do with the engine they chose and their primary programmer bailing out at like the halfway point. The game just fell into development hell, it was never intended to take that long. I mean look at the engine they used and what they managed to squeeze out of it. What I'm saying is that with a similar budget they managed to produce an actual, good game. And had they chosen a better engine or maybe even a better programmer the game would have been done twice as fast, and probably would have been way better as there are obvious limitations all over what Xenonauts' engine can do, but I chalk that up to the owner's general inexperience. I don't feel as though budget would be the primary concern with making another JA. It's more like proper management than anything. I think these guys fast-tracked a JA game, pushed it out the door with unpaid interns doing a lot of the heavy lifting, and then they kept most of that cash to themselves. This always looked like a cashgrab to me, anyway, but then again I'm automatically suspicious of most Kickstarters to begin with.

 

[Infinitron]

The Xenonauts guy started his own company with a family trust.

Do you know how large that family trust was?

Also, since you mention Full Control's unpaid interns, was most of the work on Xenonauts, up until the Kickstarter at least, not unpaid?

The game just fell into development hell, it was never intended to take that long.

And neither was Age of Decadence, but somehow all of these part-timer shoestring-budget working-in-my-basement indies just keep on getting delayed. Now why oh why would that be the case?

I think these guys fast-tracked a JA game, pushed it out the door with unpaid interns doing a lot of the heavy lifting, and then they kept most of that cash to themselves. This always looked like a cashgrab to me, anyway, but then again I'm automatically suspicious of most Kickstarters to begin with.

Yes, I'm well aware of your conspiratorial thinking with regard to Kickstarter.

(To the other people reading this - here's our previous exchange on this topic: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...her-business-things.94319/page-7#post-3562346)