Inventory screen

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Here are two more variations, one with hand slots back which also makes use of the extra space at the top, and the other with a slightly different layout, both with the embedded slot images to replace the text labels.

Also note the visibility of items in inventory. Instead of tangling with the background for the visibility of inventory items, tangling with items themselves may prove better. Look here for a comparison. I only raised brightness and contrast on inventory items.

( mirrors 1, 2 & the comparison )

I don't really like those new versions. Also, the new look on the items makes some look overlit and takes away nuances, making them look cheaper.

Eh.. distraction? It's hardly like scrolling through the inventory is a self-serving activity. I either want to check the stats anyway, or I'll go right to equipping the items.
I don't feel relaxed. I feel like I might want to look at both sides of the inventory at once.

In English, please?

Nah. You might actually be able to enlarge the equipment slots and use the entire space of the screen more efficiently instead of having unused space as you do now.


As is customary I decided to make a mockery of denizsi's remix of Elhoim's interface. Please note I didn't make any effort to use the space where he put the sort icons, I just pasted background over it.

Right click, Equip. No drag and drop needed

For now I´m leaving it as it is until VD has his say on the icon size.

One alternative that I´m considering, if the icons are made smaller, is to put the tabs vertical and move the info slots to the right. I was thinking that there´s gonna be some tab switch-item select in game, and they should be as close as possible. But with the current icon size is impossible.

Not a bad idea. It could be done with a simple ambient color change (two secs in PS) but I don´t know how doable is ingame.

I meant to say move the mouse cursor over the images as if you're playing the game.

So you don't think making things just to occupy space is ugly or unnecessary? But the problem (may not be a problem actually, but sure is extra work) in that case is that non-unified icon sizes. I've made both the inventory icons and the equipped icons the same size, so there would only be two sizes, one for inventory interface, one bigger (default size in original screenshots and the supplemental images VD has provided) for in-game controls. Elhoim's original interface at page 1 requires 3 sizes, which are also different from each other (just look at that huge amulet).

Well anyway, I provided a new version at the top of this page, occupying the empty space with hand slots.

Nice. When VD answered my question about dropping items with just a "right click" , I thought you'd drop immediately upon pressing right click, instead of context buttons.

By the way, VD on icon sizes:

He's stated the same for items in general in the other thread a few times as well. Redding is teh hard, right

Yeah, isn´t it? Why don´t you try it? j/k

He also stated strongly against it, even when I suggested him in private. From conversations with him and from many posts I know it is a delicate matter (because icon art is one of the game strongest points), and is something that is going to be considered, but not a fact. That´s why I said: "IF the icons are made smaller". Also READ what you quoted: "We CAN reduce the items size", not "we WILL reduce the item size". Redding is teh hard, isn´t it?

I think that there is no "consistent" icon size from the samples I got from VD, so I designed the slot sizes based on the biggest item that might go there. You have swords that are 110px wide and rings that are 35px wide. And yeah, the amulet is too damn big. Personally I would be happy with "icon type" consistency. I mean, that all weapon are within certain parameters, all rings within others, etc. I don´t want rings and swords having the same size.

You may remember my first prototype, which had the same slot size and linear placement. It was disregarded as uncreative and inorganical, and that´s why I made this new one.

It´s not 100% confirmed, but I guess that´s how it works. Maybe it is left click select, double left click equip, and right click drop. VD may confirm this.

Ok, just a reminder then: if item dragging were to be in, it could be made like Fallout, so you'd see bigger items when clicked & dragged, in all of their graphical glory.

Actually I've liked the placement on that one. Also, regarding that one being "disregarded", it's not like suddenly 10s of Codexers rushed and said "gee it sucks.

No, only one disregarded it, but it is the most influential one

He considered it too dry, like a database, and I kinda agree with him. Not that I dislike it, but having them in a line and all that makes it lack a "personal" touch, making it overly functional.

We can reduce the size of the items if everyone (ok, most people) think it's a good idea.

Right click -> Menu

I think it is. A small reduction (25% as denizsi showed) is nice and they don´t loose too much detail.

But more than a raw reduction, I think that making their size more consistent is far more important. Not making them all the same size (I wouldn´t like having huge rings and small swords) but between icon types. I think that every icon type should move between certain parameters (for example, weapons should be around 90px wide and 50px height, a not a having a sword that is 110*30 and an axe that is 85*55). That makes slot placement very difficult and having those disparities can make the game look bad.

So I propose setting limits for every icon type, and tailor the slots to each of them. Right now some icons aren´t too big (ex: armor), but there comes the super wide sword and forces me to make a huge inventory stack just for it, while the other icons are left with lots of empty space.

To summarize, make them a little smaller, keep the different ratios, but don´t make those differences too big.

PS: VD, if you need gruntwork for this, you know I can help

I'll refer to Fallout again on this matter. Fixed proportions for all items; knives, stimpacks, Bazookas etc. all in more or less the same size have never bothered me at all and the same goes for this one as well. Also keep in mind how it will affect the inventory area. Having unified sizes should also help with viewing inventory. Since the actual inventory hardly covers 1/4 of the screen estate and that it isn't semi-slot based, there would be some kind of inconsistency in viewing the inventory, but that would probably be based on the amount of space an item occupies besides its actual size. Example:



Smaller ring and amulet icons there. It looks acceptable to me on the left, because regardless of an item's size, all of them occupies the same amount of space in inventory. It looks like a mess on the right however.

That said, the main difference between the two games as far as item icons go is multiple and the much smaller equipment items like rings and amulets. So if some items just have to be smaller, I don't think it should include any other than these two particular item types.

I prefer the right version.

It's ok. Don't worry, it will pass.

VD, those inventory suggestions they make shape up nicely.

But please. I know you liked Fallout, but if you make this inventory in such a way that one can only see six items at a time I will send your wife the pictures of our last meeting.

Regards,
J.

For a resolution on viewable item count, there is still a question VD should answer. He has previously said the following as an answer to average item count a player would have but it missed the mark as it only seems to be a documentation of all the items in the game:

So I'll repeat my previous post:

It's more of a question of the average amount of items a player would have in inventory half way through the game. In Oblivion for instance, it's easily 40+ due to the nature of the game. It's literally a junk collecting game.

If I won't be carrying around 7+ weapons, 5 sets of armors, 50 seperate chemicals, 30+ scrolls, 20+ potions, 5+ rings, amulets, etc. etc., in other words all the shit in the world, all at once together in my inventory, then there's hardly any point to seeing more more than 6-8 items at a time. Also remember that there are sorting buttons.

Alternatively, there could be a button to expand the inventory over the doll/equipment slots area, and it might work pretty good too.

Yeah, personally I would be surprised if you carry more than 2-3 weapons, a couple of armors and helmets and 5-6 rings and amulets not equiped. Perhaps the most quantity would lay in the alchemy and crafting components. But let´s say that you have 18 of each. That´s only 3 scrolls in the tab. It´s not that terrible.

That's idiotic. I don't think it's worth shrinking them to fit a single extra item on the screen while gaining useless empty space in the process. Shrinking items is fine as long as it's done for a good reason, and I haven't heard one yet. Making the icons look more consistent is a different matter.

Maybe we could shrink the items to a size where we can fit two columns into the inventory, but that might be too small.

Eh, I don't know where you find those different item sizes. Equippend and inventory items are the same size in Elhoim's designs as well as the original screenshot I checked. I didn't check the "supplemental" images, but those may as well be just "concept art" and are a different matter anyway.

So you don't think making things just to occupy space is ugly or unnecessary?

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Excuse the image bombardment, I just played the idea of expandable inventory.

You got me there. Varying equipment-slot sizes as well as the reasonable (in my opinion) ring size vs. huge amulet caused a misperception on me. But they are still just big for the equipment slots.

Heh, can't say I liked it myself, I just wanted to try.

Just tell me: does the %25 reduction in icons' sizes make it less enjoyable for you or does it not? Do you feel some of the graphical glory of the item art is lost?

By the way, I wonder how no one else finds them big by 800x600 standards. Comparing to other games which play similarly, new and old, they look huge, with others, tiny.

Well, I think that depends on the player's personality. Some people carry everything they can (just in case), selling only inferior items; some people carry only what they need using/selling the rest.

I've just loaded a random save and here is what I have: a short sword (my weapon of choice), a 2H sword (against heavy armor), two one-handed crossbows (great way to start a conversation), a few nets, shield/armor/helmet, a lot of ore (you can transform weapons/armor into ore) of several kinds, 2 types of bolts (armor piercing and jagged), a merchant's robe/headdress, 5 amulets, 3 rings, rope, 9 scrolls (hmm, we probably need a container for scrolls), a 2H hammer (one word: knockdown), 4 different potions, 5 alchemy ingredients, a pretty helmet, a toolkit.

Personally I wouldn´t say less enjoyable, but some details are lost. I´m seeing them in full screen and the original ones, while big, look superb. And something is lost in the reduction... I don´t think it´s worth one item more.

I think that some resizing is necessary, especially in the uberwide swords and the huge amulet, but apart from that, the size is not THAT bad.

All in all, that's an average of 40. That with a +/- 20 range in 6 or 7 slots is perfectly acceptable to me with sorting buttons, but you also pointed out that it's player preference. What do you think about an expendable inventory like the ones I made? That might solve both problems, having big icons and also the ability to view many at a time when desired.

Ah yes, you do While at it, you could also make a container for amulets and rings, or jewelry and such accesories in general, as it used to be and still is the norm, carrying these small vallet-like containers for such pieces when not stored in their own box at home.

I thought there would be these ingredient "kits" which contain all the alchemt ingredients you carry. I remember reading something like that in a thread where you have explained some parts related to it.

Some detail just has to be lost. Have them re-render the items on an even larger size and see if you want to give up the details in those ones.

I think if those "uber-wide" items could be re-rendered in an angle where they would be put into perspective, that would do greatly.

those oversized amulets are not bad, it makes it possible to see the details. for example on the swiss knife amulet, it's nice to actually see that magnifying glass in there. i vote for same size on every item

I totally agree with you. Take the sword in my screen, for example. With a little tilt and some small adjustments, we could gain some extra width pixels.

Why? That's a stupid question. It's not a matter of principle. The whole issue only came up because you shrunk the size and created a layout with an empty space at the top stretching almost the entire inventory screen.
I didn't like how you moved the inventory to the right and placed the sort icons vertically, so I suggested restoring Elhoim's original layout in this regard, but that didn't actually get rid of the empty space, only shift some of it to the right, and that's why I suggested increasing the item slots - and by implication their icons - again, only of course it's less a matter of increasing them than a matter of not unnecessarily shrinking them in the first place, gaining virtually nothing but creating excess space.

So let me get back to your question before. I reconsidered. If that's how you want to put it, then yes, at the end of the day it's perfectly sensible and not at all ugly (what's supposed to be "ugly" about it?) or unnecessary to increase the icon size to occupy the space.
I don't see what's "unnecessary" about sizing the inventory icons appropriately so the interface fills the screen. The empty space looks dumb, and some shifting of the interface elements, more generous space and a slightly larger size of some elements should be able to take care of it.

Maybe I should ask what's paining you about not shrinking the icons so much?