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I'm very upset about Div 2's combat

Lesifoere

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So I'm replaying to get through DKS and already I'm not looking forward to the fuckwitted jumping puzzles because this game has some of the shittiest physics known to man and you can get stuck on practically nothing, while occasionally executing impossibly high jumps, and fuck this shit where's TWitcher 2? No Div 2, you aren't AssCreed, leave the platform puzzles out you dumbfuck.

But aside from that, is there a way for a mage build to conduct combat that doesn't involve leaping around like a lunatic to dodge projectiles/enemy fireballs while occasionally pausing to return magic missile fire? I remember that it got much better after I got Fire Wall, but until then--oh god, two more levels to go--my character jumps around like a lunatic. Who was it that thought it was a fantastic idea to give every single enemy ranged attacks? Even the seemingly melee enemies can shoot fireballs.

Fucking Larian.
 

Murk

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Damn glad I went melee then, though you are right in that everyone seems to be a ranged fighter of some kind.

real talk: I installed divinity 1 and started playing that instead.
 

AlaCarcuss

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Jeezz, you sure have a stick up your ass over this game Lesi.

I fucking love it to bits. I guess the combat's a matter of taste, but the dodging, jumping and tactical manouvering is what I like about it.

I've actually got two builds running, just started a low level pure mage (lvl 6) and a lvl 18 (on sentinal island atm) Fighter / Archer build. With the F/A, I usually start with an exploding arrow at a group, then lock on to one and hit him with a poison arrow (dot), then lower his armor with ranger suprise - switch weopons to sword/shield and usually knock 'em down with an awsome charge attack. Of course, as you say, all the while doging and weaving attacks comming for all directions. Fucking great fun I say.

It's an action RPG, though like DD it's pretty much equal parts action/RPG.

Also, you've mentioned getting stuck before in other threads, I just don't under stand it. It's never happened to me, an I jump all over the place into all sorts of places I'm pretty sure the devs never intended PC's to go. Never been stuck once. You do know you can just shoot loot containers (not chests) from a distance rather than say - jump up to interact with them, right?

Great, fun game with lots of diversity in the gamplay (yeah, including the jumping puzzels - a nice little diversion), some of the quests are really interesting and well designed - on par with NV as GoTY for me (so far). :salute:

Edit: Oh, by the way - you get to jump, what you call 'impossibly high' only after you become a Dragon Knight - obviously a trait.
 

Lesifoere

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AlaCarcuss said:
Jeezz, you sure have a stick up your ass over this game Lesi.

I fucking love it to bits.

Newfag. When Ego Draconis first came out I was one of the few people who raved about it. This is the bitterness of someone forcing herself to replay through the tedious parts in the vague hope that FoV will be worth it. So far I haven't even seen any improvement over the original either, though I think there are now more quest markers.

I've actually got two builds running, just started a low level pure mage (lvl 6)

Great, no reason I should be the only one to suffer.

Also, you've mentioned getting stuck before in other threads, I just don't under stand it. It's never happened to me, an I jump all over the place into all sorts of places I'm pretty sure the devs never intended PC's to go. Never been stuck once. You do know you can just shoot loot containers (not chests) from a distance rather than say - jump up to interact with them, right?

Yeah, good luck targeting containers from a distance.

I'd be playing NV if Bethesduh's engine didn't put me off so much. Then again, it's no worse than Larian's take on Gamebryo. Probably better actually; Obsidian at its worst still has more polish, and of course better writing, than Larian.
 

Lesifoere

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I should. But then I'm left with nothing to play except Gray Matter, NV and Drakensang: RoT, none of which is particularly attractive. I hate non-isometric 3D RPGs.
 

AlaCarcuss

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Lesifoere said:
So far I haven't even seen any improvement over the original either, though I think there are now more quest markers.

Graphics/lighting/optimisation are much better in DKS (I have both ED and DKS installed) - not sure about the other stuff.

Lesifoere said:
Yeah, good luck targeting containers from a distance.

WTF? I can target and shoot containers from pretty much any distance with a bow - quick and easy.

Lesifoere said:
I'd be playing NV if Bethesduh's engine didn't put me off so much. Then again, it's no worse than Larian's take on Gamebryo. Probably better actually; Obsidian at its worst still has more polish, and of course better writing, than Larian.

As for polish - actually I'm quite supprised all round at the level of polish - especially DKS over ED. Havn't found any gamebreaking bugs or glitches at all yet and the graphics/atmosphere are perfectly acceptable. At least as polished as any other gamebyro engine game, or DA:O for that matter.

I also quite like the dialog and somewhat hammy voice acting.

But yeah, skyway thinks my taste in games sucks too so take what I say with a grain of salt. I obviously have pretty low standards. (Funny thing is skyway actually likes this game - colour me confused).

Nah, guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

EDIT: Oh, BTW - after entering my second half century of life and my forth decade as a gamer - being called a 'newfag' is actually kinda flattering :smug:
 

made

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Playing 2worlds2 made me appreciate Div2 a lot more in hindsight.

Dungeons that aren't empty, interface that doesn't suck, responsive controls... Hell, I even liked the dragon combat - kinda reminded me of an old Dragonlance game for Amiga.

Didn't try mage or archer builds but melee combat was quite painless if boring. Charge -> whirlwind -> flurry -> next. ED required some jumping around/dodging, in DKS mobs don't even scratch you most of the time.
 

commie

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AlaCarcuss said:
EDIT: Oh, BTW - after entering my second half century of life and my forth decade as a gamer - being called a 'newfag' is actually kinda flattering :smug:

Aha, that explains your carefree attitude and ability to take enjoyment from things that others do nothing but bitch and moan about(as with Two Turds 2). Only we older gamers have the wisdom to appreciate things without regard for hivemind peer pressure and the need to score KKK's all the time by hatin' just for the sake of it, which makes our genuine displeasure at things far more authentic than from the 'dial a rage' squad! :smug:
:thumbsup:
 

Lesifoere

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VentilatorOfDoom said:
picking magic missile was probably not the smartest move

It's the only spammable mage ability. You could say that picking a poor mage build was not the smartest move, but then the fault would be Larian's for their utter inability to balance shit.

made said:
Playing 2worlds2 made me appreciate Div2 a lot more in hindsight.

That must be dire.

@AlaCarcuss: I was referring to the fact that I probably played Div 2 before you did.
 

DraQ

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AlaCarcuss said:
I guess the combat's a matter of taste, but the dodging, jumping and tactical manouvering is what I like about it.
Combat is shit, but those things actually make it better by making it more involved.

Also, the game as a whole was surprisingly pleasant and atmospheric ride.

As for getting stuck, I remember it happening to me once, then suddenly, after I was becoming frustrated with futility of my attempts to free myself, and tried to remember when was the last time I saved the game went "fade out, fade in" and I was unstuck.
:love:

I'm speaking of ED. I'll probably get DKS at the beginning of the next week.
 

Lesifoere

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DraQ said:
As for getting stuck, I remember it happening to me once, then suddenly, after I was becoming frustrated with futility of my attempts to free myself, and tried to remember when was the last time I saved the game went "fade out, fade in" and I was unstuck.
:love:

The game does do that--auto-unstucking you--but it's very inconsistent, and as you've said, sometimes it takes a while before the game realizes that lulz the character can't leap down from this particular chunk of rock.
 

DraQ

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Lesifoere said:
DraQ said:
As for getting stuck, I remember it happening to me once, then suddenly, after I was becoming frustrated with futility of my attempts to free myself, and tried to remember when was the last time I saved the game went "fade out, fade in" and I was unstuck.
:love:

The game does do that--auto-unstucking you--but it's very inconsistent, and as you've said, sometimes it takes a while before the game realizes that lulz the character can't leap down from this particular chunk of rock.
Given that I only got seriously stuck once, I don't really have statistically meaningful data.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

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Lesifoere said:
It's the only spammable mage ability. You could say that picking a poor mage build was not the smartest move, but then the fault would be Larian's for their utter inability to balance shit.
I don't like spamming the same shit all the time to begin with. I've read the description, thought to myself that's going to suck and picked something else. Can't say I regret it after hearing your whining.
 

Lesifoere

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Lulz whining. Get some reading comprehension--my complaint wasn't with magic missile as a spell. It acts like all other ranged attacks. My "whining" is concerned with the combat being shitty, and leaping around like a maniac (or strafing in time to enemy attacks) isn't my idea of a tactical challenge. Twitchy yes, tactical/challenging no.
 

AlaCarcuss

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Alexandros said:
DKS was a pleasant surprise for me.

Nicely put. I guess that's the reason for my enthusiasm. When I picked up ED a year ago - I never got much past the starter island, initial impression was "this is gonna be shit".

Now I've persevered with DKS and am having a rollicking good time, so yeah, a pleasant surprise.

commie said:
AlaCarcuss said:
EDIT: Oh, BTW - after entering my second half century of life and my forth decade as a gamer - being called a 'newfag' is actually kinda flattering :smug:

Aha, that explains your carefree attitude and ability to take enjoyment from things that others do nothing but bitch and moan about(as with Two Turds 2). Only we older gamers have the wisdom to appreciate things without regard for hivemind peer pressure and the need to score KKK's all the time by hatin' just for the sake of it, which makes our genuine displeasure at things far more authentic than from the 'dial a rage' squad! :smug:
:thumbsup:

Ahh, a fellow 'old fart' hey commie? Probably why we tend to agree on most things.

Yep, I 'spose you're right. I used to be a lot less forgiving, but realised if I'm going to remain a gamer, my standards were going to have to become much more flexible.

The amout of bitching about trivial aspects of games that goes on here - "game is shit - fix the arm animation", "game's not 2D/ISO/TB - uninstalled" etc.. makes me laugh. Pick another fucking hobby or go replay fallout for the 33rd time... :smug:
 

commie

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AlaCarcuss said:
Ahh, a fellow 'old fart' hey commie? Probably why we tend to agree on most things.

Yep, I 'spose you're right. I used to be a lot less forgiving, but realised if I'm going to remain a gamer, my standards were going to have to become much more flexible.

The amout of bitching about trivial aspects of games that goes on here - "game is shit - fix the arm animation", "game's not 2D/ISO/TB - uninstalled" etc.. makes me laugh. Pick another fucking hobby or go replay fallout for the 33rd time... :smug:

Same here, I raged and raged....BUT in the end like you I learned that we're NEVER going to get those old times back again in exactly the same way, so what's left? Either give up totally, or find things in the new shit that are enjoyable in their own right and not constantly compare them to the things we love from the past that are not replicated anymore. It doesn't mean that we wouldn't be overjoyed to see Van Buren, but shit, while we wait, we may as well get something out of the stuff that available.
 

Murk

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I don't think you need to be old for that, there's plenty of us younger cats who just enjoys hit for what it is but don't bother memeing about it online.

Div 2 is good, I'm just terribly disappointed because of how much I loved Div 1.

Rough list of good things:

+ respectable voice acting
+ good dialog lines (sometimes comical, sometimes just plain well written)
+ quests are fun, have multiple solutions, and often are more involved than they would appear if you go off of gamist logic
+ legitimately appealing choices/consequences (which may turn out to be bunk but they present them well enough)
+ graphics are good, not great, but good - areas like caverns and catacombs are actually much much more beautiful than outdoor areas
+ environments are often very well detailed, again not the open outdoor areas but the enclosed spaces like towns or indoor areas, often much of it is interactive (this does lead to some silly things like checking a hanging corpse in a dungeon to find that it has a cut of meat you can eat or a diamond or something)
+ mindreading is a nice addition that leads to some immediate and long term benefits depending on how much you pay attention to what's said
+ still lots of fun/quirky meetings with NPCs trying to con you or presenting weird scenarios and events
+ the jumping puzzles and riddles are a welcomed addition, and it is fun to not just murder everything as a modus operandi

- large open areas are often very barren and empty
- enemies often just mill around MMORPG mob style waiting to be killed
- combat is a bit of a mixed bag as its often difficult to estimate the flow of battle, things get hectic easily (not from a challenge point but simply from a "wtf is going on" point)
- slightly buggy with a crash here and there
- lost a lot of the charm of the original in terms of music, tightly knit outdoor areas, and the kind of 'painted' 2d feel. Biggest disappointment so far is the music to be honest.

+/- lots of references to past games, which I'm not sure if they're ham-fisted or not. I think they're a bit obtuse but at the same time I can see how a person who hasn't played div 1 wouldn't get the references to Aleroth, the Divine one, or Penumbra. Regardless, its nice to see some continuity (like the remodeled 3d Smith npc model, nice touch that was).
 

Murk

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I downloaded the digital version of DKS and am playing the ED part right now. So far the worst bug is that the game fails to render objects and NPCs in game and interacting with them is... weird. Basically I'll hit an invisible wall, hit ESC and press resume which usually cures the problem, and I realize there's a giant building in front of me that wasn't there before.

Worse, this happens to enemies and NPCs that trigger small cut scenes you can't ESC out of because there's dialog or so - so you better hope the game renders them quick or you're stuck until it does. For instance, with the Hermit at Sentinel Island (when you first get there) I was stuck for about 6 minutes and had to alt-tab and go back into the game so it auto-brings me to the main menu, where I saved in a new file and loaded it to have the game render everything. Totally unnecessary imo, but better than replaying 30 minutes' worth of shit or whatever.

Incidentally, I didn't notice these problems until I installed the hotfix which admittedly made other parts better... though to be honest I did install the hotfix early in the game and its possible that the village of Broken Valley and its immediate surroundings just didn't have that problem.

Other problem - character just hangs at times as the game locks everyone for about 15 seconds. I can see my character run in place or hang int he air until the game resumes as if it is lagging or pinging out.

EDIT: much of the above was cured by a clean re-install and no hot-fix patch.

Weird shit, mostly minor, but annoying over time and at times flat out aggravating.

One pro I forgot to mention, the way battle music cuts out when you die in a fight (sounds like a record player skidding to a stop, made me laugh after I got punked by some undead)

oh right, is there any game that features HDR without Bloom? Cuz the HDR isn't terribad in divinity but the bloom can drive me nuts when it shines off the weapon on the character's back. tho I guess the game itself on a high resolution looks fine enough. It won't let me force high quality textures due to 'low memory' (1.5gb), which is kind of irking me. Its not that I really need it, but I'll be damned if I'm told what to do by my own fucking computer. Makes me feel like

Shepherd said:
I won't be talked down to on my own ship, by my own ship!
 

AlaCarcuss

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Well, I guess the problems you're experiencing must be an optimization thing. None of those things has ever happened to me and I just got through having a chat to the hermit on sentinel isle.

Playing in tripple screen (nVidia surround) maxed out @ 6020x1080 - silky smooth. Obviously, I do have a reasonably hi-end machine though for that to be even possible. So I'm guessing the game doesn't scale down too well?
 

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