I missed this back then: What's up with Mark Morgan stealing music for Fallout?

[Runciter]

It did make me wonder why the tracks he has composed for Wasteland 2 and Torment sound so bland and uninspired, especially compared to his earlier Fallout work. It is true that in music and art you stand on the shoulders of others, but after seeing that youtube vid my regard for him has dropped through the floor. I dabbled a bit in composing music myself so I know how difficult it is to come up with atmospheric, dynamic, catchy and non-repetitive sequences and which is why I had such a high opinion of him as a composer. But that vid appears to very clearly show that all he did was cherry-pick the best works of others and adopt them with minor changes as his own. By now he probably believes that he is as good as he is reputed to be and he composed his most recent music from scratch, which is why it sounds so mediocre.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Why do some of you care at all if he stole some tracks? It is not a nice thing to do, but let the artists and lawyers deal with this. I will enjoy the music whether it is Morgan's own, or not. Quite hypocritical to talk about stealing other people's intellectual property, when every second person on the codex pirates games and plays them without playing.

Because everyone here makes small modifications to the games they pirate and then sells them en masse pretending they made them, right?

 

[Infinitron]

It did make me wonder why the tracks he has composed for Wasteland 2 and Torment sound so bland and uninspired

I wouldn't assume everybody else shares this opinion.

I actually find myself preferring NuMorgan over his older work. The Fallout soundtrack was a bit too gimmicky IMO to be considered truly great music, and PS:T's was a bit hit-and-miss.

You know what game had great Mark Morgan music? Zork Nemesis:



Honestly though, it's all very similar. The man hasn't changed much.

 

[Runciter]

You know what game had great Mark Morgan music? Zork Nemesis:

Honestly though, it's all very similar. The man hasn't changed much.

Well, you're right that the Zork soundtrack does sound very similar to MM's recent music. I've only really known him for the Fallout soundtrack which does stand out strikingly, it wouldn't surprise me now if he hasn't made any music of similar style since.

It did make me wonder why the tracks he has composed for Wasteland 2 and Torment sound so bland and uninspired

I wouldn't assume everybody else shares this opinion.

I actually find myself preferring NuMorgan over his older work. The Fallout soundtrack was a bit too gimmicky IMO to be considered truly great music, and PS:T's was a bit hit-and-miss.

The Fallout soundtrack is certainly unconventional, at least to an ear not accustomed to niche 90s ambient, but this is also what makes it so interesting to listen to. The Zork soundtrack, as well as the Wasteland 2 and Torment soundtracks, is atmospheric, but it is also monotonous and sounds the same as a million other tracks out there. You could easily replace it with something similar under relaxation music on youtube. Monotonous tracks like this don't take that much skill to compose if you have a good synthesiser and samples. I know of no other music (or, rather, I didn't until now) which sounds like the Fallout soundtrack.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Original Character Do Not Steal

 

[Roguey]

Screw that. 1) This is art and not academia, so there is no need to cite sources,

Legally there is. For whatever reason, the artists Morgan stole from chose not to pursue legal action (possibly because they aren't even aware).

2) art is its own best explaination and everything else is superfluous, including the artist,

Copying someone else isn't art.

 

[DefJam101]

But what is art?

Let's discuss

 

[Roguey]

If someone ever steals something I created and gets paid money by a third party to do it, it I'm going to beat them half to death with a heavy object, take a picture of their bloody, broken body, and call it art.

If they were to list me in the credits, then everything's cool.

 

[Forest Dweller]

There's something here that I think should be pointed out. We don't know the exact circumstances of how Morgan came to model (heavily) many of Fallout's tracks on Aphex Twins songs. If someone at Interplay or Black Isle showed him the artist, what matters is how much leeway they gave him. For instance, they could have just said, "make something like this with a similar tone," and Morgan simply took the lazy route. Or they could have said, "make it like this with just enough variations to avoid a lawsuit," which is an entirely different thing. Or they could have told him to make something similar, but as he kept showing them his music, they kept saying, "no, make it more like this," until it arrived at its final state.

A composing job for a movie or game is a work-for-hire job, meaning he actually doesn't own anything he produces, so he has to do whatever they tell him do. How much freedom he gets is really up to the director (or lead developer). Without knowing more of the internal working conditions at Black Isle regarding how the music was produced (which we won't know short of someone from the inside spilling the beans) it's hard to determine who's "at fault" for something like this. I do agree that a lot of it is verging on plagiarism, though not legally plagiarism.

 

[Humanity has risen!]

There's something here that I think should be pointed out. We don't know the exact circumstances of how Morgan came to model (heavily) many of Fallout's tracks on Aphex Twins songs. If someone at Interplay or Black Isle showed him the artist, what matters is how much leeway they gave him. For instance, they could have just said, "make something like this with a similar tone," and Morgan simply took the lazy route. Or they could have said, "make it like this with just enough variations to avoid a lawsuit," which is an entirely different thing. Or they could have told him to make something similar, but as he kept showing them his music, they kept saying, "no, make it more like this," until it arrived at its final state.

A composing job for a movie or game is a work-for-hire job, meaning he actually doesn't own anything he produces, so he has to do whatever they tell him do. How much freedom he gets is really up to the director (or lead developer). Without knowing more of the internal working conditions at Black Isle regarding how the music was produced (which we won't know short of someone from the inside spilling the beans) it's hard to determine who's "at fault" for something like this. I do agree that a lot of it is verging on plagiarism, though not legally plagiarism.

It's no different from Gameloft looking at successful games and changing them just enough to avoid the possibility of getting sued. They even have instructions manuals to tell them exactly how to do it.

 

[crawlkill]

New Vegas already has FO 1&2 tracks by default. The only ones not present are, I think, the Arroyo and SanFran ones, and that's ok, cuz those tracks were retarded anyway. Oh, and the New Reno one, but that doesn't really fit anywhere in NV.

I couldn't remember whether it did or didn't, but urgently wanted to get rid of all the orchestral stuff, anyway, so.

A composing job for a movie or game is a work-for-hire job, meaning he actually doesn't own anything he produces, so he has to do whatever they tell him do. How much freedom he gets is really up to the director (or lead developer). Without knowing more of the internal working conditions at Black Isle regarding how the music was produced (which we won't know short of someone from the inside spilling the beans) it's hard to determine who's "at fault" for something like this. I do agree that a lot of it is verging on plagiarism, though not legally plagiarism.

I don't think anyone's suggesting Aphex Twin should run off and try to sue the wreckage of Interplay, or even necessarily assigning specific blame. It's just disappointing.

Another disappointed fallout fan, first it's this, then it's tim cain being inconveniently gay, will someone think of the libertarian bigots?

Tim being a big goofy breeder lifestyle settle-down-and-get-married bear was pretty adorable, really. It's only a disappointment in that I wish he hadn't fallen into that heterofascist "oh man I will lub u forever" bullshit. We're supposed to be better than that.

What does this have to do with music plagiarism, again?

If someone ever steals something I created and gets paid money by a third party to do it

And here we arrive at the point. This wasn't an enthusiastic fan doing his own versions. This was actually taking someone else's work and selling it, without apparent permission or any credit.

I don't really care about the legalities. It's just a shitty thing to do, and now it's going to bubble to the front of my mind every time I hear the Fallout soundtrack.

 

[crakkie]

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZDkH3Vd76s#t=147
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0Z44BIDPPc#t=4

Hmmm...

 

[SCO]

eh

 

[dunno lah]

That track sounds like the new Desert Wind.

 

[crawlkill]

eh

nice save, fuckwad. maybe next time don't tell a faggot he hates faggots.

 

[Infinitron]

Oh, crawlkill is a sassy gay guy. It all makes sense now.

eh

nice save, fuckwad. maybe next time don't tell a faggot he hates faggots.

...but I think SCO was replying to my post.

 

[crawlkill]

...but I think SCO was replying to my post.

I know, but I chose to pretend he had the testicular fortitude to own his nonsequitur shithattery.