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Company News Gygax Games partner with Fig to publish a game based on Gary Gygax's unpublished "personal campaign"

Don Peste

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Some very codexian comments from http://www.tenkarstavern.com/2018/04/whats-10-years-old-and-losing-value.html

What's 10 Years Old and Losing Value Every Day? - The Gygax Trust (CRPG Games to be Licensed by the Gygax Trust via Crowdfunding)



How do you ensure the IP you are entrusted with withers on the vine? Refuse to license it for 10 years.

How do you attempt to revive its value? Talk about the death of its original market and aim for a new one.

What am I talking about? Why, the Gygax Trust and the ludicrous attempt to get value from Gary's work, not from tabletop RPG but from computer games.

There are two articles floating around today about the Gygax Trust making a deal with Fig (some crowdsourcing program) to license CRPG rights to Gary's works to developers. Let us look at those articles, shall we? Be warned, there's a shitload of snark from your bartender, and I'm not referring to Alex Gygax...

First, from Polygon:

Dungeons & Dragons creator’s unpublished work to be turned into video games

Gygax Games and Fig announce open call for interested developers
By Charlie Hall@Charlie_L_Hall Apr 17, 2018, 12:00pm EDT

It’s been 10 years since the death of Gary Gygax, the man who co-created Dungeons & Dragons. Now, Gygax’s family, through the auspices of the Gygax Trust, wants to bring his unpublished works to life as video games. (Here's the deal - Gail's hope to have movies / streaming services / multimedia from the deal with theTransformers producer in July of 2016 hasn't come up with shit and Gail / Alex need money - the rest of the family is NOT involved)

The Trust announced today that it has partnered with crowdfunding and investment website Fig (who the fuck is "Fig"?). Together, they will begin a global search for the right developers to carry the legacy of Gary Gygax forward. (this should have happened 10 years ago. The Gary Gygax legacy has withered on the vine)

To accomplish their goal, the Gygax Trust has rejuvenated Gygax Games (you would think they would have revived the website BEFORE the announcement) and installed Gary’s youngest son (and Gail's only child), Alex Gygax, as the CEO.

“I was gaming since I could walk and talk,” said Alex, who was raised in the family home in Lake Geneva, Wisconsin. “My first D&D adventure I’d say was when I was four or five years old, running a solo campaign with my father on his work breaks. So I was playing D&D before I knew what any of that was.”

Alex told Polygon that at an early age he played an instrumental role in playtesting another creation of Gary’s, a tabletop role-playing game called Lejendary Adventure, which was licensed for a time to Troll Lord Games. The game is now out of print. (and why is it put of print? Gail. Yep, she's a real wizard at making money)

“I was playing in our Thursday group through the entire creation of the Lejendary product line,” Alex said, who is also one of the lead bartenders at a local pub called Sprecher’s. “Since then I’ve been working here in town, doing a lot of gaming, hanging out with the locals, going to my local game store. I’ve played everything from Xbox games to computer games, board games, over at my brother’s house or Magic: The Gathering events at the local game store.”

Alex said that his job will be to ensure that future projects based off his father’s work continue to retain the spirit of the original Dungeon Master. Right now the Gygax Trust is working to archive handwritten materials and Gary Gygax’s personal effects, some of which formed the basis for the creation of Dungeons & Dragons. Alex called the collection a “treasure trove.” (problem with this - anything Gary wrote before he left TSR is probably owned by WotC these days, whether or not Gary revealed it at the time. What does the trust have rights to? Lejendary Adventures, the game they refuse to put back in print)

Alex Gygax was one of the first playtesters of Lejendary Adventure, a role-playing system by Gary Gygax and published for a time by Troll Lord Games. You can still find the quick-start rules at their website. (Grab it before the Witch of the Mid-West demands it be taken down)

“One of the major ones that everyone knows about is his personal dungeon,” Alex said. “It was his personal D&D campaign that he had never released to the public. He didn’t want his game nights being destroyed by publishing his work and then having his group go out and buy it and find out all of his secrets. So that’s one of the main things that we have to use, and all the little side derivatives of that.” (not so sure where the rights for that actually lie, but whatever)

More than anything, Alex said that he’s excited to find his father’s original work a new home in the future of digital role-playing games.

“I grew up playing this and I’m also a huge video gamer, so I’ve always wanted to see my dad’s work because I thought that they were some of the greatest stories and tough adventures,” Alex said. “I’ve always wanted to see them put out in the next level. Pen and paper is a dying art. (There you go tabletop gamers. Get your Fucking Shine Box! Tabletop RPGs are hitting new highs but they're dead. Sigh. Alex, I had high hopes for you. Ever get your name actually on the GMF website as a member of the board or is that still "in the works"?) Computer games, video games, they’re the next generation, the next wave of games and I’ve always wanted to see them on that new medium (that's all fine and dandy, but why not tabletop too?) and I’ve always wanted to be working with someone who’s excited as I am about it.”

Alex said that many of the games that his father created were always meant to be digital properties, and the time is right to fulfill his wishes.

“He always had the intention of taking certain product lines and transferring them to the digital realm (I'm guessing this was in addition to print versions), it just never came to fruition,” Alex said. “There are a few lines that he created specifically with that in mind. So published or unpublished, there’s definitely the digital realm in mind with these lines. It’s something that has been talked about for a very long time, and I’m really excited to get this underway.” (sure it has been. So why is Gail finally giving it the OK? is the Trust broke?)

Fig CEO Justin Bailey told Polygon that his company entered into a licensing agreement with the Gygax Trust with the intention of finding developers to pair with it. Ultimately, the Fig platform will be used to run the crowdfunding campaigns that will in turn produce the games.

“We’re running a full green-light process with our advisory board,” Bailey said, referring to the team of experienced game developers who help curate games on that platform. They include Randy Pitchford (Gearbox Software), Feargus Urquhart (Obsidian Entertainment), Tim Schafer (Double Fine Productions), Aaron Isaksen (Indie Fund), Alex Rigopulos (Harmonix Studios) and Brian Fargo (InXile Entertainment).

“Any developer who wants to propose something, get it in through pitches@fig.co and we’ll review it with our green light committee and with Alex to make sure that it’s a good fit. Once Alex is able to get the Gygax Games website up, that will be another avenue for submissions.” (Holy Shit! See this? The website isn't up for Gygax Games - that's some shade throwing right there. CEO of a shit show don't mean shit)

So why did it take 10 years to bring these foundational pieces of Gary Gygax’s work to the digital space? Alex said that it was all simply a matter of timing. (LOL! Timing? The timing was lost long ago. This is a matter of desperation to finally get some cash from the rotting IP)

“It’s just a combination of things,” he said. “Technology. Having the right group of people there. (Mom being broke) Wanting to have the fans involved and being able to keep some creative control. Maybe not full control, because we want a developer to be able to do what they’re good at, but making sure that it’s done with Gary’s spirit in mind. So being able to keep his spirit with everything is I think one of the really big parts of why we waited so long.” (No, the reason you waited so long is Gail wanted a million bucks to even open the vaults. Now, she's willing to take coppers on the gold piece in the hopes of making some kind, and kind of money.)

Yep, fun times.

Now, from
VentureBeat:

D&D co-creator Gary Gygax’s trust and Fig partner on video games

Video games owe a great deal to Gary Gygax, the co-creator of Dungeons & Dragons. In many ways, his game set foundations for the medium, and its mechanics and spirit branch out to all genres these days. But Gygax never created a video game that made it to market.

Alex Gygax wants to add video game development to his father’s legacy. Today, The Gygax Trust is announcing a partnership with the crowdfunding platform Fig to publish video games based on the unpublished works of Gary Gygax. Timing for the first campaign was not disclosed. (Because there IS no timing for the campaign. Judging from the lack of details, this probably just developed)

In an interview with GamesBeat, Paul Stormberg (I'm clueless) of Gygax Games said that the projects would deal with, among other things, the original home role-playing game campaign that Gygax ran. (Good luck on that - isnt that owned by WotC thse days?) “We’ll just say it’s something people have been waiting for a long time,” said Stormberg, who’s worked for years in the pen-and-paper RPG industry.

Alex Gygax said that the trust picked Fig as a partner because of the important role fans play in crowdfunding. (Huh? Correct me but wouldnt, I don't know, Kickstarter be a better choice?) Since they don’t have a development studio signed or a game prototype yet, they chose Fig to work with. This platform differs from Kickstarter and Indiegogo in that people backing products can get a piece of the action and a return on their pledges. (interesting)

“It’s a good opportunity to get some games produced and work with gamers and still be able to have some direction of where some things go,” Alex said, “making sure the spirit, the essence, of Dungeons & Dragons (bad Alex! Bad bad bad) and the RPG Realm is kept in mind.”

I asked if it was at all based on Castle Greyhawk, the megadungeon that served as the base for one of Gary Gygax’s home campaigns. They were a bit coy about it, but they did confirm that the projects wouldn’t involve Gord the Rogue, his character that appeared in novels after the D&D co-creators breakup with his own company, TSR, or the Castle Zagyg, a Castles & Crusades megadungeon that could be called “The Son of Castle Greyhawk.” (right, so is LA stuff that's been rotting for 10 years)

“We’ll just saw it’s something people have been waiting for a long time,” Stromberg said.

The Gygax Trust has had years to adapt Gary Gygax’s works into a game. So, why did they decide now is the time? It’s a combination of platforms like Fig and the advancement of in-game design and computer tech. (sure, and like I said above - Gail is finally desperate to make money off the IP - 10 years to late and a million dollars short)

“Video games have caught up” with the ideas and concepts my father played with, Alex Gygax said. “I think [the industry] has caught up with what we’re trying to create.”

Stromberg explained how over the years, the family has tried to work with studios to make games on Gary Gygax’s works before.

“Gail [Gygax, Gary’s wife] herself is quite familiar with the development of her husband’s IP for computer games, having worked with a number of companies over the years to do so. While the projects all had promise, some of them quite fantastic, the developers could never quite achieve the vision Gary had laid out,” Stromberg said. “However, now, with Fig, an amazing pool of talented developers, and some truly amazing advances in computer gaming, we know we can begin to bring the real jewels of Gary’s unpublished IP to his legions of fans and the larger gaming community.” (as a betting man? this goes nowhere)

As we chatted, Alex Gygax and Stromberg kept talking about the fans. It’s certainly the people who play, who create adventures and worlds of their own, that have been the key to D&D‘s longevity over the past 40 years. Poking around internet communities such as Reddit and forums devoted to RPGs, you find people still playing the old editions that Gary Gygax published decades ago. (so, there's a market for Gary's work, but they aren't going to market to the market...)

“[My father’s work] is something people love, and they stick with it. It had a very family like feeling to it, to everyone that has played or enjoyed it over the years,” Alex Gygax said.

On Reddit and those forums, you’ll also find people recounting their fond memories of encounters with Gary Gygax, who always made it a point to interact with fans at conventions and answer thousands of letters and emails. Alex Gygax even noted how his father would answer letters from prisoners.

And it’s that passion and goodwill that Fig and the Gygax Trust are hoping to tap for their crowdfunding campaign.

So, there you have it. Another deal from The Trust that will go nowhere. Beleive me, with 10 years of practice doing nothing with the Gygax IP, Gail is a master at the art now.

If I appear to be overly harsh in my assessment, feel free to make counter-arguments below. Note that Gail is a shrewd business woman, able to balance a Trust and a Fund and accomplish nothing with both of them
.
 
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Infinitron

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Yep, the Tenkar's Tavern blog is great grognardy goodness: http://www.tenkarstavern.com/2018/04/more-thoughts-on-gygax-games-fig.html

More Thoughts on the Gygax Games / Fig Announcement (Snark Free)

Last night in Tavern Chat, one of the topics that came up was the Gygax Games / Fig announcement. As we were discussing, I received a PM with the following screenshot:



Talk about horrible timing. Not only is there no Gygax Games website to go along with the announcement that Gygax Games was to license IP for video games BUT the Gygax Memorial Fund website was down (still is as I type this)

So, why the apparently rushed announcement that Gygax Games was apparently NOT ready for? And yes, they weren't ready, as you can see from the Facebook commentary of one of the Gygax Games team members:



The announcement benefitted Fig but does little for Gygax Games. Fig needs "eyes on". It needs traffic. It needs incoming links. Sure, it's funded some huge IPs for millions of dollars, but these were well-known IPs / developers with huge followings. Compared to Kickstarter and Indiegogo, Fig is barely a fig leaf.

Here are some Alexa traffic rankings for Kickstarter, Indiegogo, and Fig:







See the traffic rankings? I'll throw ENWorld in for comparison.



Just as important, if not more, look at the "sites linking in". Nearly 40k for Kickstarter. Over 18k for Indiegogo. 75 for Fig. They aren't in the same ballpark.

That's telling. It means that Kickstarter and Indiegogo are destinations unto themselves. Backers will go there to find projects. Few are going to Fig to find projects. Projects are sending folks to Fig.

So, yesterday's announcement was potentially huge for Fig. It got them press. It got them traffic. For Gygax Games, with no website, it means very little. No traffic from yesterday's announcement. Just an opportunity to piss off the established fanbase of Gary's work (why Alex couldn't you have avoided trashing TTRPGs?) Gamers have a short attention span when it comes to news in the industry, but insults tend to linger.

My advice, unsolicited as it is, is for Alex to start priming the "social media pump". For this endeavor to have any chance to succeed Gygax Games needs to have a presence on Facebook, in gaming forums (both tabletop and electronic), news articles, blogs, and Alex needs to be that face. He's personable enough in person. He can't be like Gail, a recluse, as that WILL NOT build up the fan base that will be needed for success.

Gygax Games needs a website like yesterday. Professionally done. Pleasing to the eye. It needs to be updated frequently with news related to this project. It needs to funnel Alex's excitement.

Anyhow, for comparison, below is The Tavern's Alexa statistics. We're no ENWorld ;)




Talking about ENWorld, the commentary on the relevant thread over there is worth the read.
 

Deuce Traveler

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as every GP of treasure equalled 1 XP
Wasn't there some rule that xp gains it's based on treasure spent,rather than treasure accumulated?

No, that was an alternate rule I had mentioned that I liked to incorporate sometimes in order to make my players spend money as fast as they make it, like Conan. In the original rules, you earned XP for treasure gained. But with my adoption of this house rule, characters always were looking to spend instead of horde. If your characters are always perpetual broke, whether spending it on fortresses and guards or hookers and ale, they are always going to be looking for the next big score.

If I was ever to create a video game based on high fantasy model of fiction, I'd somehow incorporate the spend GP to make XP house rule, have them have to buy food and water and basics to survive, and make the setting the Wilderlands of High Fantasy to encourage players to constantly want to explore the sandbox while blowing their money on frivolties.
 
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screeg

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Alex also stressed that the family is seeking a collaborative process and will want everybody involved to contribute their ideas.
Ah yes, the family members want to collaborate and have final sign-off on all decisions. Sounds like a dream deal! Wish I had $10,000,000 to throw at that.

Infinitron: you've obviously put a *LOT* more thought into this than Alex Gygax. To me his pitch sounds like, he had a great idea and he's throwing it out there expecting someone else to do all the heavy lifting. He gets to contribute creatively, as much as he feels like, then reaps the benefits.
 
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Darkzone

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as every GP of treasure equalled 1 XP
Wasn't there some rule that xp gains it's based on treasure spent,rather than treasure accumulated?
No, that was an alternate rule I had mentioned that I liked to incorporate sometimes in order to make my players spend money as fast as they make it, like Conan. In the original rules, you earned XP for treasure gained. But with my adoption of this house rule, characters always were looking to spend instead of horde. If your characters are always perpetual broke, whether spending it on fortresses and guards or hookers and ale, they are always going to be looking for the next big score.
If I was ever to create a video game based on high fantasy model of fiction, I'd somehow incorporate the spend GP to make XP house rule, have them have to buy food and water and basics to survive, and make the setting the Wilderlands of High Fantasy to encourage players to constantly want to explore the sandbox while blowing their money on frivolties.
While i see today that XPs are based on gathered fighting experience, i quite like the idea of spending money as fast as you make it, for becoming a better adventurer. Perhaps there is a nice intersection between this XPs paradigmas, like in "Conan the Cimmerian" (1992) computer game, where you spend most of the money you earn on skills and equipment. Paying for training (HP, THAC0, and etc), equipment and skills could be a solution and while on a adventure you cannot raise this things, like in Pool of Radiance and Bard's Tale where you had to pay to advance in levels and for new spells that you would learn.
 

baud

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RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'm also wondering how much cache Gygax's name has in computer game circles. People playing P&P RPGs likely heard of him, not sure the same is true for CRPGs though
It's not really known, especially if players have only been avid with one medium, Garriott is barely recognised - and he started a lot of design trends the best CRPGs have tried to follow. There is enough in-fighting over I.P rights at the P&P level, by the time RPG rulesets extend to video gaming the mastermind behind it all gets a bit lost.
I wouldn't go so far. felipepepe gave talks in 'game dev schools' where 'elder scrolls fans' legit never heard of anything pre-Oblivion.
baud look up felipepepe's articles on Gamasutra.

Thank you.
Link for the lazy: https://www.gamasutra.com/blogs/author/FelipePepe/982590/
 

Bohrain

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While i see today that XPs are based on gathered fighting experience, i quite like the idea of spending money as fast as you make it, for becoming a better adventurer.

It's also something that would solve the lack of moneysink that many CRPG's tend to have especially towards endgame.
 

Quantomas

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Chances are that the Gygax Trust contacted InXile or Obsidian and that they suggested Fig. In this case they certainly had a look at the source material first and concluded that it isn't that good to drive sales on its own.
 

Zed Duke of Banville

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as every GP of treasure equalled 1 XP
Wasn't there some rule that xp gains it's based on treasure spent,rather than treasure accumulated?
An article by Jon Pickens in Dragon Magazine #10 (October 1977) suggested that experience points only be awarded for treasure spent rather than treasure obtained, specifically citing Leiber's Fafhrd & the Gray Mouser. However, this rule was not adopted into AD&D, though it did include mandatory monthly expenses for PCs, which increased with their level as well as the need to maintain henchmen and strongholds. Plus, the actual act of gaining a level, after having acquired sufficient experience, required a considerable expenditure of both time and money.
 

Darkzone

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An article by Jon Pickens in Dragon Magazine #10 (October 1977) suggested that experience points only be awarded for treasure spent rather than treasure obtained, specifically citing Leiber's Fafhrd & the Gray Mouser. However, this rule was not adopted into AD&D, though it did include mandatory monthly expenses for PCs, which increased with their level as well as the need to maintain henchmen and strongholds. Plus, the actual act of gaining a level, after having acquired sufficient experience, required a considerable expenditure of both time and money.
Now that is an impressive reasearch. RPG.net? ("Too Much Loot in Your Campaign? D&D Option: Orgies, Inc." Jon Pickens The Dragon #10)
 

Deuce Traveler

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An article by Jon Pickens in Dragon Magazine #10 (October 1977) suggested that experience points only be awarded for treasure spent rather than treasure obtained, specifically citing Leiber's Fafhrd & the Gray Mouser. However, this rule was not adopted into AD&D, though it did include mandatory monthly expenses for PCs, which increased with their level as well as the need to maintain henchmen and strongholds. Plus, the actual act of gaining a level, after having acquired sufficient experience, required a considerable expenditure of both time and money.
Now that is an impressive reasearch. RPG.net? ("Too Much Loot in Your Campaign? D&D Option: Orgies, Inc." Jon Pickens The Dragon #10)

I just looked up that issue online... the associated image is... well, NSFW... Man, this just makes me love the early years of D&D that much more. I talked to Tom Wham in person once, and he said they used to smoke pot while working on the magazine... and it shows.

NSFW image:
Orgies+Inc.png
 

Zed Duke of Banville

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Now that is an impressive research. RPG.net?
Nah, I recently read through all issues of Dragon Magazine (and its short-lived predecessor, the Strategic Review) from the beginning to the demise of TSR, taking brief notes on which articles are useful for gaming. I knew that the idea of requiring PCs to spend treasure in order to gain experience had been advocated by various people as a house-rule over the decades, but I was surprised to see it appear in print so early.
 

aratuk

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Part of the reason the Gygax Trust is working with Fig is because the platform could serve some of the roles of a publishing partner while allowing the Gary's family to retain creative control. While some creators may ordinarily balk at those sorts of conditions, Bailey said that hasn't been the case in his early discussions with prospective developers.

I can more easily see "early discussions" being permissive of the idea of family members' input, than allowing that input to be binding once the money starts to run through the hourglass. Like, maybe they get to make a few preliminary stipulations and sit in on some meetings, but they get to dictate the game about as much as Queen Elizabeth II gets to govern, right? We'll make you feel very special about your inherited position, but we won't let you actually do anything.

And how does it benefit anyone to talk about this right now, anyway? Either it's pointless buzz since these kind of closed-purse discussions don't usually go anywhere, or there's more to it than they've said.

:M

I'm leaning toward pointless.
 

Heretic

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Interesting

photo.jpg

Mike BreaultApril 17, 2018 at 8:05 PM
I'd like to comment on this quote: “Gail [Gygax, Gary’s wife] herself is quite familiar with the development of her husband’s IP for computer games, having worked with a number of companies over the years to do so. While the projects all had promise, some of them quite fantastic, the developers could never quite achieve the vision Gary had laid out”

I was at TSR from 1984-1989. I left to make my way into digital games and spent 10 years as a freelancer, working on some TSR stuff, some HeroQuest stuff, and a bunch of video & computer games. In the early-to-mid 1990s, a producer from Cyberdreams called me up and said, "You've worked with Gary Gygax before, right?" I said "Yeeesssss..." hesitantly, as I wondered what was coming. Turns out they'd contracted with Gary to design a fantasy RPG computer game (tentatively titled "Hunters of Ralk") and they had gotten his design for it and it was unworkable (according to the producer). He asked if I'd be willing to re-work it. I promptly asked if Gary had agreed to it being re-designed, as I knew of old that this was an issue. I was told yes and we agreed on a price and I signed a contract.

A couple of days later a very heavy FedEx box arrived for me. In it was Gary's "design" for HoR -- roughly 1,500 pages of unworkableness (to be polite). I read through it and it was very obvious that Gary had never played a computer RPG and had no idea how to design for one. There were speeches from NPCs that went on for five full pages of text, for example.

So I sighed and got to work. Took me 5-6 weeks and I eventually turned over a ~300-page design doc that was still too weighty but retained as many of Gary's original elements as I felt should be there. A week or two later the producer called me up and sheepishly told me that, while I was still going to get paid, they discovered that Gary's contract did indeed give him the right to refuse any changes to his work and he was exercising that right. Because, you know, his work was always perfect, even for media he was completely unfamiliar with. Since the game was not remotely publishable the way Gary wrote it and he wouldn't allow any changes, Cyberdreams killed the project.

I was told by the producer that there was some contract-related involvement from Gail at the very end, when the company said they were going to kill the project. But since I have no direct knowledge of her involvement, I'm not going to repeat what I was told. That's the only time I ever heard Gail's name mentioned in reference to this project (though of course I knew her from my time at TSR, when she was Gary's secretary).
 

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