KickStarter Guido Henkel's Deathfire: Ruins of Nethermore - CANCELLED

[stony3k]

Sorry didnt read properly .

No worries

 

[stony3k]

Don't have decided yet, but I guess I might pledge for the episodic variant, even if I don't think it's such a great approach for an rpg.
On the other hand, I'd like to play the game and do think that he deserves a chance to deliver it - if it turns out shit - well, I have spend much more than 20 bucks on worse stuff than computer games.

Kickstarter however - don't think there's hope for that, unless probably he finds some really big names for it.
Didn't even see the big problems with the pitch, tbh - worse pitches have made more money.

The problem is that pitch appeals to hardcore RPG fans, those who were fans before the IE games. It talked about mechanics and stuff that most gamers (outside the Codex) are not really interested in. The story sounded too bland and the name weird. He was appealing to rational side of the brain instead of the emotional side (like not wanting to discuss his past or even not marketing this as the spiritual successor of RoA).

 

[Gord]

Probably, I guess I'm a more rational guy, as is Guido.

 

[stony3k]

Probably, I guess I'm a more rational guy, as is Guido.

if you even compare with Shaker, they had marketed it as "old School game from the developers of Wizardry", and just that itself got them plenty of pledges.

 

[Lady_Error]

I love how this only made $17,000 today because a couple of jokers decided to fake-spring for $10,000 and $5,000 knowing it wasn't happening.

The $5000 pledge has been there for weeks. Why don't you go back to trolling the PE megathread...

 

[Zombra]

I'm sad. First he wanted a million. Then he wanted 400K. Ended up with zero both times. Now he only wants 1/8 of his last needed amount, but he's taking no chances with a third failed campaign. Pay him straight on his website, money straight to him, no question of getting your money back if the project turns to vapor. He gets some dough right now to pay his rent and feed his team for a couple months, and then what? Maybe they can cobble together an intentionally feature-incomplete first episode release, maybe they can't. I'd love to see a good game come out of all this, but I can't put money towards it. It just seems way too unrealistic at this point. Good luck Guido.

 

[Roguey]

I love how this only made $17,000 today because a couple of jokers decided to fake-spring for $10,000 and $5,000 knowing it wasn't happening.

The $5000 pledge has been there for weeks. Why don't you go back to trolling the PE megathread...

Okay, so it only made $7000 instead of $2000 (assuming that $5000 wasn't a fake, it probably was). Still barely nothing, and it still only had 39 new people in its last day, so the majority of those were, as I said earlier, previous backers increasing their pledges in desperation.

 

[Gord]

I'm sad. First he wanted a million. Then he wanted 400K. Ended up with zero both times. Now he only wants 1/8 of his last needed amount, but he's taking no chances with a third failed campaign. Pay him straight on his website, money straight to him, no question of getting your money back if the project turns to vapor. He gets some dough right now to pay his rent and feed his team for a couple months, and then what? Maybe they can cobble together an intentionally feature-incomplete first episode release, maybe they can't. I'd love to see a good game come out of all this, but I can't put money towards it. It just seems way too unrealistic at this point. Good luck Guido.

It's certainly more of a leap of faith than with Kickstarter.
Although one has to consider that even with KS, you can still lose you money - just look at Clang (and technically most other big projects haven't delivered so far either, it's just a question of time until a large one goes belly-up).
Depending on the modality of the payment, I might pledge a few bucks and see how it turns out - if they release an episode and it's good - hey, why not.
It might even save him via Steam early access - he only need the first episode up there.

 

[stony3k]

I'm sad. First he wanted a million. Then he wanted 400K. Ended up with zero both times. Now he only wants 1/8 of his last needed amount, but he's taking no chances with a third failed campaign. Pay him straight on his website, money straight to him, no question of getting your money back if the project turns to vapor. He gets some dough right now to pay his rent and feed his team for a couple months, and then what? Maybe they can cobble together an intentionally feature-incomplete first episode release, maybe they can't. I'd love to see a good game come out of all this, but I can't put money towards it. It just seems way too unrealistic at this point. Good luck Guido.

He's already clarified that it's a two week campaign and he will return the money if they don't reach 50K. It's funny how your comment makes him out as some kind of a scammer

 

[Infinitron]

I'm sad. First he wanted a million. Then he wanted 400K. Ended up with zero both times. Now he only wants 1/8 of his last needed amount, but he's taking no chances with a third failed campaign. Pay him straight on his website, money straight to him, no question of getting your money back if the project turns to vapor. He gets some dough right now to pay his rent and feed his team for a couple months, and then what? Maybe they can cobble together an intentionally feature-incomplete first episode release, maybe they can't. I'd love to see a good game come out of all this, but I can't put money towards it. It just seems way too unrealistic at this point. Good luck Guido.

He's already clarified that it's a two week campaign and he will return the money if they don't reach 50K. It's funny how your comment makes him out as some kind of a scammer

You do know that it's not as simple as "returning the money"? PayPal takes a cut. If he doesn't make it, somebody is going to lose money, either Guido or the backers (or both).

 

[Gord]

You do know that it's not as simple as "returning the money"? PayPal takes a cut. If he doesn't make it, somebody is going to lose money, either Guido or the backers (or both).

You certainly shouldn't pledge to crowdfunding campaigns if you couldn't live with/risk losing the money. Not Kickstarter, not direct campaigns like this.

 

[Zombra]

Pay him straight on his website, money straight to him, no question of getting your money back if the project turns to vapor. He gets some dough right now to pay his rent and feed his team for a couple months, and then what? Maybe they can cobble together an intentionally feature-incomplete first episode release, maybe they can't.

He's already clarified that it's a two week campaign and he will return the money if they don't reach 50K. It's funny how your comment makes him out as some kind of a scammer

Well ... I didn't really mean if he doesn't make 50K, I meant more if the game doesn't get made or turns out to be unplayable garbage. Obviously this is a risk with any KS, but the history of this project really doesn't inspire confidence. He's asking for five percent of what he wanted for Thorvalla. I'm pretty sure he'll get the 50K, but what can he really deliver for that?

As for his being a scammer, I wouldn't say that. I have no reason to doubt that he's sincere, but it's also clear that he's getting desperate. If I wanted to be really cynical, I could point out that there is no third party monitoring pledges ... they can post any numbers they want on their website. I don't honestly think they'd lie about making the $50K so they didn't have to return the pledges, but who's auditing them this time around?

 

[theSavant]

I've looked again on his website and it doesn't make sense:

So the first reward is that you buy Chapters 1-3 altogether (you can't pledge for a single Chapter). Now let's assume the worst:
- the money stops at 50K
- he finishes Chapter 1 and delivers to the backers
- hardly anyone else buys this game

Then he has no money left to continue, but already promised 3 chapters to every backer in his rewards.

I don't like that... these promises layed out as straight facts. I don't question so much on successful campaigns, but it makes it a lot more questionable after 2 failed campaigns and all these other weird stuff on the project. I'd rather liked to see a down-to-earth reward promising only Chapter 1. Sure, the example is exaggerated and maybe the Steam boys will buy him rich... but still... he can't act like that anymore...

 

[Zombra]

Exactly.

 

[Gord]

He's asking for five percent of what he wanted for Thorvalla. I'm pretty sure he'll get the 50K, but what can he really deliver for that?

Well, it's a completely different game than Thorvalla, isn't it?

As for the promises - he promises chapter one alone, people will complain that he has no faith in the project/doesn't give them enough/whatever, it's a catch 22.

That being said - if it's PayPal only, I will likely not pledge to the campaign, since I don't like PayPal and had decided long ago not to get an account.
However, should he land in early access, I'll be all over it (and I wouldn't be surprised if he's counting on it).

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

I have my concerns but kicked in $35 anyways. PS:T is wholly unique and if he can deliver something nearly as imaginative it will be pretty special.

 

[Lady_Error]

That being said - if it's PayPal only, I will likely not pledge to the campaign, since I don't like PayPal and had decided long ago not to get an account.

They're saying that there will be other payment options soon too:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects...e/posts/687941?cursor=5379246#comment-5379245

 

[Zombra]

He's asking for five percent of what he wanted for Thorvalla. I'm pretty sure he'll get the 50K, but what can he really deliver for that?

Well, it's a completely different game than Thorvalla, isn't it?

Oh, fine.

He's asking for less than thirteen percent of what he originally wanted for Deathfire. It still seems ridiculous. I'm pretty sure he'll get the 50K, but what can he really deliver for that?

Happy?

As for the promises - he promises chapter one alone

Yeah. I'm not a game designer, but I'm not confident that it will work out too good. Give us 1/8 of what we need and we'll deliver 1/6 of a game! Then hopefully sell that to fund the next 1/6, and so forth.

My impression is that, when you make a game, you have to dump a major amount of "up front" resources to build stuff like the basic engine, AI, combat system, etc. Then you can fill in the actual content, like levels, artwork, dialogue, etc. Can they build a solid foundation for the whole game on 1/8 the budget? No - Guy himself says that the game won't start fully featured! More features will be added with later episodes. So what the hell will the first episode look like? Walking and hitting?

I'd love to see them make it work, but from a project management* standpoint, this plan seems nonviable.

*Another field in which I am not a professional. If any game designers or project managers out there would care to enlighten us, knock yourselves out.

 

[Alchemist]

My impression is that, when you make a game, you have to dump a major amount of "up front" resources to build stuff like the basic engine, AI, combat system, etc. Then you can fill in the actual content, like levels, artwork, dialogue, etc. Can they build a solid foundation for the whole game on 1/8 the budget? No - Guy himself says that the game won't start fully featured! More features will be added with later episodes. So what the hell will the first episode look like? Walking and hitting?

I'd love to see them make it work, but from a project management* standpoint, this plan seems nonviable.

*Another field in which I am not a professional. If any game designers or project managers out there would care to enlighten us, knock yourselves out.

Well, keep in mind they are using Unity, which lays a lot of the technical groundwork for them. And they've probably worked out a lot of the basics in their prototype already. We've already seen the footage of walking around in dungeon and town environments and a few monster models. So they aren't exactly starting from scratch.

I agree that in general this is a sketchier proposition, but I don't believe it's hopeless.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

We don't know enough about any plans to have any real insight on potential for success. Clearly he has spearheaded some impressive work in the past but he doesn't have the support of an established studio.

In the absence of any true insight we have only conjecture based on assessment of his campaigns. I think it is likely that the lack of business background, organizational backing and solid marketing teams he is forced to deal with the mundane realities of business. I think he pining for the ability to just do the creative work and so has turned to us for a leap of faith and permission to focus on the creative.

I can get on board with that. I think we can agree the creative part he has covered, I just hope he finds his stride, it would be a shame it he fails because of the burden of having to do something he's not great at.

 

[Infinitron]

Pre-order DLC for Kickstarter backers! http://deathfiregame.com/2013/12/benefits-of-your-founder-status/

 

[Zombra]

Yeah, I shook my head when I saw that foolishness. Like I said, desperate.

 

[Infinitron]

Yeah, I shook my head when I saw that foolishness. Like I said, desperate.

He's trying to get existing Kickstarter backers to back him on PayPal ASAP. "Hey guys, where are you going, COME BACK!!"

Let's see if it works.

 

[Zed]

Pre-order DLC for Kickstarter backers! http://deathfiregame.com/2013/12/benefits-of-your-founder-status/

Those bonuses feels very... MMORPGish. "Nether Orb of Trade: creates an inter-dimensional connection to an NPC Trader, rare In-Game-Item" is something I would expect in WoW but not a singleplayer game.
Oh well. If I get this game, it will be standard retail edition without cheats anyway, so I'm not too bothered.

 

[Gord]

He's asking for less than thirteen percent of what he originally wanted for Deathfire. It still seems ridiculous. I'm pretty sure he'll get the 50K, but what can he really deliver for that?

I admit that he will likely need to make some concessions, or probably he's counting on additional money from Steam Early access or something like that.
Whatever it is, he seems determined to pull through now - Thorvalla got buried pretty fast.
I'd still like to see the game, so I guess I might give him some money - and I'm fully aware that it might be lost along the way.