Fallout: Tactics - Any tips from the pros?

[Cael]

Example of the kind of game I am playing currently:

Guess where my line of punching troopers were :D

 

[Modron]

200 meters in front and missed by a heavy weapon burst?

 

[Cael]

200 meters in front and missed by a heavy weapon burst?

Beastlords with heavy weapons??? That's it! I'm going home due to ridiculous bullshit!

 

[flushfire]

How much charisma does it take to notice a difference in ranks? Is there a difference between 4 & 5 for example? I know about going 8 for divine favor but it's pointless without gifted. I've always played a low cha sniper, really want to try something different this time.

Also, how does the Tag! perk behave in this game? Is it the same as it was in FO2 where you could pump the skill really high, tag it with the perk, then lower the skill afterwards to get more points than you invested?

 

[Cyberarmy]

Get 8 CHA and use mentants at base, before getting supplies and soldiers.

 

[Thor Kaufman]

Get 8 CHA and use mentants at base, before getting supplies and soldiers.

This. And if you want many chars that you don't have in your squad to level up while not on mission you have to do a bit of annoying switch-a-roo
And don't ever kill anyone innocent (even in random/unique encounters) or your rank will be utter dogshit afterwards.
You either go 8 CH (plus epic perk) or no CH. Anything in between is bullshit.

Tbf I ended up doing sniper at the start and then just ended up with big gunner solo (with high PE you don't even need big big gun skill and can still be excellent sniper obv) with lifegiver and psycho and just run up to enemies and roflburst them because combat is fucking shit tedious but I got bored around that one mission where you are in that city with lots of barricades.
Also you can farm ALL unique encounters in the beginning of the game if you're into that, including the one that gives you +1EN iirc (gas station granny). Some are very region/point specific like pipboy and osme others too though. But you can get up to three encounters around one tile.

 

[Cael]

Tbf I ended up doing sniper at the start and then just ended up with big gunner solo (with high PE you don't even need big big gun skill and can still be excellent sniper obv) with lifegiver and psycho and just run up to enemies and roflburst them because combat is fucking shit tedious but I got bored around that one mission where you are in that city with lots of barricades.
Also you can farm ALL unique encounters in the beginning of the game if you're into that, including the one that gives you +1EN iirc (gas station granny). Some are very region/point specific like pipboy and osme others too though. But you can get up to three encounters around one tile.

Macomb? It is a lot easier if you have women in your team.

Spoiler

They can sneak through cracks in walls and barricades men can't IF equipped with leather armour. That means you can circle around things and blow them away from the rear before they even know you are there.

One of the reasons I don't like burst weapons is the burst fire bug. It is basically abusing the bug where you actually WANT to have a low skill rating in Big Guns because you want to miss.

Farming unique encounters right at the beginning is good except for 3 things:
1. You are not likely to have the ring pulls right at the beginning to buy everything you want (unless you find the Poker encounter first).
2. If you run out of unique encounters, the game crashes the next time you step on a tile marked for unique encounters.
3. Pitch Black.

EDIT: You can get 4 encounters on a single tile. Just use the corners.

 

[laclongquan]

Point 1: there are two major mods that patch almost all the bugs in 1.27. They change quite a bit of content, but generally 100% playable. The famous burst fire bug is gone now (you can burst one guy in the pack and only that one and that one alone get it, not the one in line, or around).

Point 2: Drugs are almost all of your answer. Vodoo? Buffout? etc... Read the discription and plan the usage.

Point 3: That and playing solo even if you have a full team. The key is to raise a specialist to deal with a situation and you have 6 slot for 6 different situation. A sneak-burst, sneak-melee, sniper, machinegun burst, grenade thrower, close range flamegun, etc... Then sending one guy to situation, drugged to the gills for maximum configuration. The whole central principle of Fallout Tactics is to build specialist for each situation, not a team battle (because it's faster, less reload, that way)

Point 4: not exactly a point but the encounter 13 square to the west of the Brahmin woods, in the mountain, is where you always get Pipboy, I think, patch or no patch. Get him early and you got an excellent recruit.

Point 5: Mechanized infantry. You can send your whole team in that APC. Get in the edge of your own range and start potting one SM. If they run forward to shoot, move back down. If not, stand and shoot. Get one Repairman to behind your APC so it shield the man. Fix the car in battle. You play that way with SM and attrition them to death. In the newest mods the SM got heavier machigun and they can kill you faster than you can fix so this got nerfed.

For a basic 1.27 game (no mod) you can do Afterburner gum on machinegun or flamer user and kill SM in one map fight. Or Vodoo for increased crit chance for one battle(20min). ORRRRRRR you can send

 

[Cael]

Point 1: there are two major mods that patch almost all the bugs in 1.27. They change quite a bit of content, but generally 100% playable. The famous burst fire bug is gone now (you can burst one guy in the pack and only that one and that one alone get it, not the one in line, or around).

Which defeats the purpose of bursting in the first place. The problem with the burst fire bug is not that it is area effect. The problem is that it is a 100% hit on everyone else in the area if you missed the initial target. You want the AoE when you have entire packs of supermutants with SAW and M2 coming at you.

 

[laclongquan]

Tell that to the coders, not me~ Either you find a way to deal withthe original burst, or you learn to use the fixed burst.

Also, if you have two or SM at a close group, it's time for a Rocket Launcher, or a series of grenades. Not a machinegun.

 

[Cael]

Tell that to the coders, not me~ Either you find a way to deal withthe original burst, or you learn to use the fixed burst.

Also, if you have two or SM at a close group, it's time for a Rocket Launcher, or a series of grenades. Not a machinegun.

Jackhammer, dude. Jackhammer.


Also:
Beastlords surrounding an outnumbered squad of "unarmed" Brotherhood soldiers is becoming a distressingly common sight...

Poor bastards... They forgot that being surrounded means a target rich environment... for the surroundee.

 

[laclongquan]

A note for 1.27 version is that you can utilize the burst fire bug by just stay in car. That way the damage is not spread, and when you shoot it spread.

 

[Cael]

A note for 1.27 version is that you can utilize the burst fire bug by just stay in car. That way the damage is not spread, and when you shoot it spread.

There is that. I don't use vehicles, though. In TB, it is a PITA to move it around.

Back to the original question:

Spoiler

St Louis is the first "big" mission you get if you want to storm the fort. There is no two ways about it. That fort is nasty, ugly business.

First thing you need to realise is that there are three M2 wielding super-ultra-supermutants sitting at the main entrance. That's right, they are NOT normal supermutants. They are Psycho-drenched, ultra-armoured, HP shitpiles wielding M2s loaded with DU rounds. They are each worth over 4k XP on Tough Guy mode, IIRC. That is 10 times what a normal supermutant is worth? I don't know. But multiple times anyway, and they are commensurately nasty. A single burst of DU .50 will wipe out your squad, nevermind 3 of them. Fighting them face-to-face is asking for your whole squad to be wiped.

Second thing to realise is that there is a back entrance to the fort. It is guarded by 3 normal supermutants wielding SAWs, which is much more manageable. However, there are 2 other supermutants in the way, a grenadier and a SAW wielder. Starting a gunfight with them at close range is asking for trouble because that area is overlooked by about 4 other supermutants on the walls, all wielding SAWs. Even if you manage to use the overhang to avoid the 4 guys, you can't re-stealth as they know you are there.

So, what do you do?

Well, first thing is to clear the bloody trenches. Use stealth and ambush tactics. Clear the surrounding areas and then the trenches.

With your best sniper, use the sniper rifle to take a potshot at a supermutant at max range. Then run away. The rest of your squad should be stealthed, armed with shotguns and lying down across your line of retreat. If the supermutants chases you (most in the trenches would at least try), run right past your guys and way. Do NOT use Overwatch in TB for the rest of your squad. That is a rookie mistake as they will all fire on the first supermutant to move into range and expose themselves to the rest of the supermutant squad (if any; there usually is) on your tail, which usually results in a lot of lead or explosives coming their way. Once the supermutant squad have ALL moved into range, then manually have your guys blow them away. Remember, you can't move and overwatch at the same time. Neither can they. That gives you 5 out of 6 guys of your squad free shots at the supermutant squad before it is their turn again. That should end them before they could squeak.

Some supermutants, however, love to take cover instead of chasing. The M2 idiots in the trenches do that. In that case, you are dealing with lone cowards. A few auto-shotgun burst in the back will end them and there is no one else around to take revenge on your suddenly exposed soldiers (there are a couple of exceptions, but careful positioning would eliminate that threat). So, make them take cover and sneak up on them with soldiers armed with shotguns and close-range burst them to death before they could fire a shot.

Once the trenches are cleared, organise your guys at the eastern side of the trenches. The two supermutants on the way to the back entrance is there. Your goal is to end both of them before they duck, so sneak up to them and do called shots to the eyes at as far away as you can while still retaining a 95% hit rate. Sniper rifle and M16s both work. If you don't kill them both but did knock them out, restealth as fast as you can and come back to the exact same spots where you opened fire. Then, get out of combat and wait with Aggressive Stance on. Once they regain consciousness, they should drop dead.

Now, use your best sniper with the sniper rifle and snipe the guys along the wall. Remember that those who moved cannot fire back in retaliation, so you can run in, fire and run our again. The sniper rifle has enough power that it will do damage to supermutants even without aimed shots or crits. Keep plinking away and stay the hell out of range of the SAWs (40) and M2 (45). If they drop behind cover, move your sniper to the south side of the wall and play there. The ones on this side will eventually stand back up and vice versa when the south guys decide to play coward. WATCH OUT FOR THE M2 WIELDERS. There are a couple of them on the walls and they look the same as the SAW guys until they open fire on your ass. Their usual position is the bunker overlooking the main entrance (and they are not the three ultramutants) so you can sometimes see them runing for the eastern wall. The Awareness perk is worth its weight in gold here. You should be able to clear a large portion of the defenders that way, including some melee mutants that rush to the wall from the central bunker area. Kill those as a priority as they can fuck up the next part if you are not careful.

Now comes the twitchy bit. Sneak across the main bridge at a crawl and crawl all the way to the back entrance with all but your best sniper. Pick up the 5.56mm assault rifle along the way (the XE-whatever the hell). It is the best 5.56 weapon in the game, if a bit short-ranged for my taste (same as AK47, so it isn't that short). Have your sniper hang around the trenches on the other side of the moat. Once your guys are at the back entrance, have the sniper fire on the supermutants guarding it. They should drop down behind their fortifications. Now, crawl up the back ramp and then immediately crawl to the very north edge of the map. There is a VERY small, 1 hex corridor between the bunker containing 1 supermutant and the edge of the map. Use it. It looks like you are climbing on to the edge of the bunker, but you are still below the rim if you did it right, and he won't see you. Doubly so if he is cowering from your sniper's fire. Get all 5 guys across there one-by-one. Now, you have 5 guys on the northern edge INSIDE the fort, and all the supermutants are looking outwards.

Head for the central bunker. It has 2 supermutants in it and 2 entrances: north and west. Position two guys at the north entrance so that they can fire at only one of the supermutants inside AND they cannot be seen by any other supermutant. Do the same with the western entrance except they must target the other supermutant in the bunker and only that one. Make sure they are using weapons that will end supermutants with one blast (i.e., auto-shotguns). Flip all 4 to Aggressive Stance and fill the interior with lead. Restealth and get out of Aggressive immediately. This is where the melee mutants would usually fuck you over if they are still around as they will prevent you restealthing. Not all of your guys will be able to restealth even without the melee mutants there, but all you really need is 1 to do so (as you have that other guy in reserve who is still stealthed).

Head for the northern bunker (the one you crawled past just now on your way in) with the two stealthed guys. Remember to always be crawling within the fort until all supermutants are dead unless otherwise stated or you are dead. You should be able to crawl into the bunker behind the supermutant if he is not looking your way. If he is, just stay at a distance and wait until he turns back to the trenches. Your sniper outside would be helpful in attracting attention. Blow him away once you get into position and restealth again. The entire fort should be dead except for the 3 ultramutants sitting by the main entrance (assuming you got all of the guys on the wall and the bastard with the grenades in the tower that you can't get to; if not, the two guys should be able to kill what's left along the way) with your sniper. Crawl to the bunker next to it. It is the beginning of the wall area and you should be able to crawl from it and get to the bunker overlooking the main entrance by hugging the wall. The three guys in the central bunker should get to the south facing side and crouch under the windows. Bring your sniper to the main entrance area.

Fire on the nearest of the three ultramutants with your sniper, remembering to stay out of M2 range. Then, run away but stay within line of sight of the three ultramutants. If they make any movement at all other than rotate on the spot (i.e., crouch, kneel, get up, move, etc.), have your guys in the two bunkers pop up/out, fire a burst of whatever weapon you want at them, get out sight and restealth. If they can't restealth, bring your sniper back to attract attention. Remember, if they move, they can't retaliate fire. USE THAT. Keep repeating, but be ready to modify your tactics if they start doing funny things. Sometimes, it pays to get out of combat mode and just wait until the ultramutants lose interest and return to their original positions. Keep on your toes and you should be able to blow them away eventually without taking a shot in return.

Congrats! The fort is yours. You can loot it at your leisure. Just do NOT forget the mines at the main entrance. They are still there and you need to clear them the old fashioned way (at a distance with shotgun blasts).

Remember: WATCH YOUR STANCE. If you left your guys in Aggressive Stance while trying to sneak, you might as well restart the mission.

 

[laclongquan]

In term of strategy: it's beneficial to build specialist in term of weapons: SMG, BG, and EW. And with BGs, you can use several rocket launchers along with the car (to carry heavy ammo). Please read my recruit guide for how to do it in vanilla 1.27

In term of St Louis, Rocket Launch Snipers! Your specialist in BG can shoot RL at the extended range and bombard those suckers with explosive heads. Use up all of it because it's not like you have much place to use explosive RL after all. it require large fields.

In term of rocket launchers, the only type of ammo you can save for rainy days is EMP and pulse heads. Explosive, AP, etc... can just be shot whenever you have the chance (long range).

 

[Cael]

In term of strategy: it's beneficial to build specialist in term of weapons: SMG, BG, and EW. And with BGs, you can use several rocket launchers along with the car (to carry heavy ammo). Please read my recruit guide for how to do it in vanilla 1.27

In term of St Louis, Rocket Launch Snipers! Your specialist in BG can shoot RL at the extended range and bombard those suckers with explosive heads. Use up all of it because it's not like you have much place to use explosive RL after all. it require large fields.

In term of rocket launchers, the only type of ammo you can save for rainy days is EMP and pulse heads. Explosive, AP, etc... can just be shot whenever you have the chance (long range).

Rocket launcher has a range of 40. M2 has a range of 45. You are going to get shot before you can get a round off.

 

[Piotrovitz]

Not if you're sneaking up.

RL is perfect for this mission - like laciong said, there's not much use for it afterwards beside few exceptions, so you can shoot rockets left and right in St. Louis without worrying about stockpiling ammo for future missions.

 

[Cael]

Not if you're sneaking up.

RL is perfect for this mission - like laciong said, there's not much use for it afterwards beside few exceptions, so you can shoot rockets left and right in St. Louis without worrying about stockpiling ammo for future missions.

You will either not kill the guy you aim at in one shot and he blows you away with his MG, or the guy next to him will blow you away with his MG. To get a good hit % you have to get closer than the 40 range limit, which means you are now potentially in the fire arc of multiple MGs. Those guys can and will fire at you from max range and if you have anyone else near you, they are dead, and even if you don't there is a high chance you are dead.

And if you use the rocket launcher vs the 3 ultramutants, you are most definitely dead.

The point is, the rocket launcher does not have the range to keep you safe. Even the Sniper Rifle is not 100% safe. If you make even one error with it, you are eating MG lead. Fighting supermutants is an exercise in precision movement and positioning. Do it right and you will have tens of thousands of 7.62 and thousands of .50 to play with. Do it wrong and you are going to be bleeding all over the ground.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

I always felt that fights with Supermutants vs. other groups required the most complex lines of thought strictly because they were so fantastically powerful in their damage output.
Some of those maps were absolutely devastating if you weren't careful.
After that, a lot of the stuff was kind of a let down.

 

[Cael]

I always felt that fights with Supermutants vs. other groups required the most complex lines of thought strictly because they were so fantastically powerful in their damage output.
Some of those maps were absolutely devastating if you weren't careful.
After that, a lot of the stuff was kind of a let down.

Supermutants are actually quite squishy as long as they are not wearing armour. Even 9mm ball rounds can punch gaping holes in the unarmoured ones. It is the ones that are wearing the spiked mutant armour that is a major problem and requires a higher class of guns. Even so, .45 rounds will kill them and the sniper rifle's output is enough to punch gaping holes in them. Supermutants are basically the glass cannons of the game. Devastating firepower, but can be taken out fast if you know how.

Reavers are the high tech end of the enemy spectrum. Energy weapons and grenade launchers and the like really can wreck your day and their armour isn't bad either. But they are still squishy, basically making them a higher grade of glass cannon, one that is more tailored towards punching past advanced armour.

Robots, on the other hand, is the equivalent of battleships to the supermutant battlecruisers. High end damage weapons with massive armour and high hit points.

 

[laclongquan]

You are attacking him 4-5 Rocket per turn at the very extended range of 40. As long as the rockets land nearby, splash damage count~ On the other hand, he counter fire at that range he's lucky to get a hit through the APC armor.

The spectacle is awesome: booom booom booom booom boooom Taktaktaktak booom

 

[Cael]

You are attacking him 4-5 Rocket per turn at the very extended range of 40. As long as the rockets land nearby, splash damage count~ On the other hand, he counter fire at that range he's lucky to get a hit through the APC armor.

The spectacle is awesome: booom booom booom booom boooom Taktaktaktak booom

The APC isn't going to help you vs the fort in St Louis. Nor any of the other missions. That is why I always discount vehicles in my tactics.

I am also talking TB, not CTB. Fallout, like XCom, is a TB game. A pox on CTB/RT :D

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

Man I need to play FOT again

I never realized those Super Mutants in the bunker were Psycho-pumped. I remember that tactic in multiplayer was infamous, making a Psychotic Super Mutant, and then you load him up on Psycho and Voodoo, giving your Super Mutant +120% Normal Resistance just from drugs alone and +35% from Spiked Armor, total at like 155% DR (DR can go over 90 in FOT - don't remember if Super Mutants have innate DR too), making Super Mutants effectively bullet-proof. You could hose the fucking things in Gauss Minigun or DU bullet gunfire, and they would't even feel it. That was SUCH bullshit, lol!

Robots, on the other hand, is the equivalent of battleships to the supermutant battlecruisers. High end damage weapons with massive armour and high hit points.

Nice comparison.

The difference is that you're way more ready to fight Robots than to fight Super Mutants. The problem of Robots is that you get a rude awakening when your Small Guns/Big Guns party runs into enemies that laugh at Gauss Rifles. Then its pretty much "well, time to spec into Energy" which is kind of helped because the early late missions alternate between Robots and Reavers.

The Super Mutant phase of the game goes from Sniper Rifles and Auto-Shotguns to machinegun fire at longe range. I'm actually surprised the devs didn't give Supermutants energy weapons too, and they lack those sprites, because that part of the game would have been even more infamous if they had Laser Rifle snipers to counter your snipers.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

As far as I remember taking the fort is pretty pointless (I only took it once a long time ago and never did it again in subsequent plays). XP gain is minimal, you don't get anything useful : the M2 can be had on other mutants, the gun in the chest can be taken by stealth and the littlle DU ammo mutants have is mostly used once they are dead. I lnow I did it once to show them that mine was bigger than theirs, but is there any other valid reason ?

 

[Cael]

As far as I remember taking the fort is pretty pointless (I only took it once a long time ago and never did it again in subsequent plays). XP gain is minimal, you don't get anything useful : the M2 can be had on other mutants, the gun in the chest can be taken by stealth and the littlle DU ammo mutants have is mostly used once they are dead. I lnow I did it once to show them that mine was bigger than theirs, but is there any other valid reason ?

I got ALL of their DU ammo. 3 full mags worth. Plus all of the other ammo.

And EACH of the ultramutants is worth 4k XP, not including the other 12+ supermutants. That one area gives more XP than most whole maps.

 

[Cael]

I never realized those Super Mutants in the bunker were Psycho-pumped.

I don't actually know if they are, but their HP and damage reduction is through the roof. It may take 3-4 shots of a sniper rifle to kill a normal supermutant, but it would take over a dozen to kill those guys. And their guns are loaded with DU, so closing in on them is suicide. I am pretty sure they were there to reinforce the idea you are not supposed to go there, but they are killable.

Robots, on the other hand, is the equivalent of battleships to the supermutant battlecruisers. High end damage weapons with massive armour and high hit points.

Nice comparison.

The difference is that you're way more ready to fight Robots than to fight Super Mutants. The problem of Robots is that you get a rude awakening when your Small Guns/Big Guns party runs into enemies that laugh at Gauss Rifles. Then its pretty much "well, time to spec into Energy" which is kind of helped because the early late missions alternate between Robots and Reavers.

The Super Mutant phase of the game goes from Sniper Rifles and Auto-Shotguns to machinegun fire at longe range. I'm actually surprised the devs didn't give Supermutants energy weapons too, and they lack those sprites, because that part of the game would have been even more infamous if they had Laser Rifle snipers to counter your snipers.

I use sniper rifles and autoshotguns on robots all the way up to Mr Behemoth. The humanoid, hover, scurry and security bots are relatively vulnerable to them, and load lifters gets KO'd easily as they are slow so you have more time to punt them in the "eyes" and you can punch them to death when they are out. It is the bigger ones that can get dicey.

Laser rifles have the same range as M2s, so there was really no need :D I play with no Big Gun specialists as I hate burst weapons as being wasteful. I really dislike the idea of throwing 40 5.56 rounds at someone when 3 would do