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Enemy spawn mechanics in Baldur's Gate

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IncendiaryDevice

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yup, all four levels, popped out in that map below the bridge. I don't recall any chests. Thanks, I'll go search that cave again. [vanilla from disc]
 

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
yup, all four levels, popped out in that map below the bridge. I don't recall any chests. Thanks, I'll go search that cave again. [vanilla from disc]

Yeah there's a chest in Level four that you need to open, I think that triggers the chapter change itself, either that or looting a particular scroll from the chest.
 

Cael

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I can't remember if the 4th level is Mulahey's room, but there were several things that should have triggered warnings:
1. You were supposed to find and kill the fella behind the iron poisoning scheme in the mines. If you didn't fight an intelligent boss, something is wrong.
2. You were supposed to find out what is going on in the mines. You suddenly appeared in the wilderness somewhere with no closure and further instructions. Something is wrong.
3. If you went back to Nashkel, they are still talking about the iron problem, meaning you didn't solve it. Ergo, you haven't completed your mission.
Find Mulahey's room. Kill him and his dozen skeletons and kobolds, find his papers proving everything, put the elf in the party with Viconia for giggles, move to the next chapter.
 
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This. This is why quest compasses and walkthrough popups are so fucking harmful.
:decline:

I'm guessing you're being sarcastic here?

IMO it's more a problem with open world games. With open world games you don't have a specific dead end to force yourself to work back from, you can just keep going and going, whereas with IWD you get to the brick wall of the brick wall to Kresselack's tomb and then look for an on-line walkthrough to discover there's a lever hidden halfway up a column right next to the wall, in good'ol pixel-hunting tradition. I think that's why they invented the ALT to search for clickable items. Or was it SHIFT, whichever, I tried all those and the version of BG I'm playing doesn't have any highlight button.

Are highlight buttons quest compasses?
 
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I can't remember if the 4th level is Mulahey's room, but there were several things that should have triggered warnings:
1. You were supposed to find and kill the fella behind the iron poisoning scheme in the mines. If you didn't fight an intelligent boss, something is wrong.
2. You were supposed to find out what is going on in the mines. You suddenly appeared in the wilderness somewhere with no closure and further instructions. Something is wrong.
3. If you went back to Nashkel, they are still talking about the iron problem, meaning you didn't solve it. Ergo, you haven't completed your mission.
Find Mulahey's room. Kill him and his dozen skeletons and kobolds, find his papers proving everything, put the elf in the party with Viconia for giggles, move to the next chapter.

1. I haven't encountered a "boss" culture in BG at all. You start chapter 2 simply by walking into a town.
2. Appearing in the wilderness could suggest the area you appear in has the answer. The first encounter in that area was a very high level fight, making you want to come back to that map later.
3. I know, I said that in my post.
You don't need to spoil the details of the fight...
 

Cael

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I'm guessing you're being sarcastic here?

IMO it's more a problem with open world games. With open world games you don't have a specific dead end to force yourself to work back from, you can just keep going and going, whereas with IWD you get to the brick wall of the brick wall to Kresselack's tomb and then look for an on-line walkthrough to discover there's a lever hidden halfway up a column right next to the wall, in good'ol pixel-hunting tradition. I think that's why they invented the ALT to search for clickable items. Or was it SHIFT, whichever, I tried all those and the version of BG I'm playing doesn't have any highlight button.

Are highlight buttons quest compasses?
I think he meant the proliferation of things like quest compasses means that people no longer bother to THINK when they play a RPG. They just want to get through the thing and rely on walkthroughs and stuff to get by.
As I said in a previous post, there should have been a few warning signs that you have not yet completed the mission in the mines. At least for veteran RPG players who were brought up before the time of quest compasses, highlights and the like. Try figuring out Hawksbluff in Dark Queen of Krynn without a walkthrough sometime. Have fun figuring out why you are stuck forever in the temple.
 

Cael

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1. I haven't encountered a "boss" culture in BG at all. You start chapter 2 simply by walking into a town.
2. Appearing in the wilderness could suggest the area you appear in has the answer. The first encounter in that area was a very high level fight, making you want to come back to that map later.
3. I know, I said that in my post.
You don't need to spoil the details of the fight...
You haven't played BG, then. Each chapter has a goal that you have to achieve, and not all of them is "find X guy and stop him". Chapter 2 is. And at least a couple of other chapters. It pays to pay attention to the game. BG is not like modern day crap and it doesn't handhold you at all.
And if you believe that BG doesn't have a boss culture, I got news for you, buddy: You're toast.
 
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I'm guessing you're being sarcastic here?

IMO it's more a problem with open world games. With open world games you don't have a specific dead end to force yourself to work back from, you can just keep going and going, whereas with IWD you get to the brick wall of the brick wall to Kresselack's tomb and then look for an on-line walkthrough to discover there's a lever hidden halfway up a column right next to the wall, in good'ol pixel-hunting tradition. I think that's why they invented the ALT to search for clickable items. Or was it SHIFT, whichever, I tried all those and the version of BG I'm playing doesn't have any highlight button.

Are highlight buttons quest compasses?
I think he meant the proliferation of things like quest compasses means that people no longer bother to THINK when they play a RPG. They just want to get through the thing and rely on walkthroughs and stuff to get by.
As I said in a previous post, there should have been a few warning signs that you have not yet completed the mission in the mines. At least for veteran RPG players who were brought up before the time of quest compasses, highlights and the like. Try figuring out Hawksbluff in Dark Queen of Krynn without a walkthrough sometime. Have fun figuring out why you are stuck forever in the temple.

Not everything is an agenda opportunity... I don't think I've ever played any game ever when I haven't looked at a walkthrough at some point, even if its after finishing a game and discovering new stuff. The problem with walkthroughs is it's difficult to avoid spoilers. I worded my post very carefully in this regard, but it seems even with a quest compass you dumb as bricks.
 

Cael

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[
Not everything is an agenda opportunity... I don't think I've ever played any game ever when I haven't looked at a walkthrough at some point, even if its after finishing a game and discovering new stuff. The problem with walkthroughs is it's difficult to avoid spoilers. I worded my post very carefully in this regard, but it seems even with a quest compass you dumb as bricks.
Aww, poor guy. He got a vague description of ONE fight in a game of hundreds, and he is hiding behind that as salve to his ego of being an unthinking moron. Think what you will, kid. At least I completed the game without needing to look at walkthroughs or ask for help online, and didn't miss a VITAL fight even on my fight time through the place.
 
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1. I haven't encountered a "boss" culture in BG at all. You start chapter 2 simply by walking into a town.
2. Appearing in the wilderness could suggest the area you appear in has the answer. The first encounter in that area was a very high level fight, making you want to come back to that map later.
3. I know, I said that in my post.
You don't need to spoil the details of the fight...
You haven't played BG, then. Each chapter has a goal that you have to achieve, and not all of them is "find X guy and stop him". Chapter 2 is. And at least a couple of other chapters. It pays to pay attention to the game. BG is not like modern day crap and it doesn't handhold you at all.
And if you believe that BG doesn't have a boss culture, I got news for you, buddy: You're toast.

Good god you're an agenda ridden retard. I got news for you, up to this point, and I've completed about 20 maps, there has not been a boss culture anywhere and neither the prologue nor chapter 1 ended with a boss fight. Stop projecting and you might learn how to be a productive member.
 
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Not everything is an agenda opportunity... I don't think I've ever played any game ever when I haven't looked at a walkthrough at some point, even if its after finishing a game and discovering new stuff. The problem with walkthroughs is it's difficult to avoid spoilers. I worded my post very carefully in this regard, but it seems even with a quest compass you dumb as bricks.
Aww, poor guy. He got a vague description of ONE fight in a game of hundreds, and he is hiding behind that as salve to his ego of being an unthinking moron. Think what you will, kid. At least I completed the game without needing to look at walkthroughs or ask for help online, and didn't miss a VITAL fight even on my fight time through the place.

Spastic.
 

Cael

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Good god you're an agenda ridden retard. I got news for you, up to this point, and I've completed about 20 maps, there has not been a boss culture anywhere and neither the prologue nor chapter 1 ended with a boss fight. Stop projecting and you might learn how to be a productive member.
I don't think you understand what the word agenda means, kid.
As for completing maps, you do realise that it means nothing, right? At least not in the "boss fight" stakes. I also pretty sure you don't know what a boss fight is either.
 
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Good god you're an agenda ridden retard. I got news for you, up to this point, and I've completed about 20 maps, there has not been a boss culture anywhere and neither the prologue nor chapter 1 ended with a boss fight. Stop projecting and you might learn how to be a productive member.
I don't think you understand what the word agenda means, kid.
As for completing maps, you do realise that it means nothing, right? At least not in the "boss fight" stakes. I also pretty sure you don't know what a boss fight is either.

Spastic.
 
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nrZkbyu.png


Uh-oh, looks like spazman spotted an opportunity... again.
 

Sensuki

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IMO it's more a problem with open world games. With open world games you don't have a specific dead end to force yourself to work back from, you can just keep going and going, whereas with IWD you get to the brick wall of the brick wall to Kresselack's tomb and then look for an on-line walkthrough to discover there's a lever hidden halfway up a column right next to the wall, in good'ol pixel-hunting tradition. I think that's why they invented the ALT to search for clickable items. Or was it SHIFT, whichever, I tried all those and the version of BG I'm playing doesn't have any highlight button.

The first few times I played BG1 as a teenager, I couldn't find how to trigger Chapter 3. I think I can see what you did, in the fourth level of the mines, you simply went around the outside of the map, killed the ochre jellies and then came to the exit that takes you to the bottom right corner of the world map. There's a fight near the exit in that area that is 'tough' for low level characters.

There's a cave within that last area of the mines surrounded by water. Not sure how you missed it, as a Kobold Commando sort of near the door shoots you with fire arrows as soon as you can see the moat.

x_5404.jpg
 
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IMO it's more a problem with open world games. With open world games you don't have a specific dead end to force yourself to work back from, you can just keep going and going, whereas with IWD you get to the brick wall of the brick wall to Kresselack's tomb and then look for an on-line walkthrough to discover there's a lever hidden halfway up a column right next to the wall, in good'ol pixel-hunting tradition. I think that's why they invented the ALT to search for clickable items. Or was it SHIFT, whichever, I tried all those and the version of BG I'm playing doesn't have any highlight button.

The first few times I played BG1 as a teenager, I couldn't find how to trigger Chapter 3. I think I can see what you did, in the fourth level of the mines, you simply went around the outside of the map, killed the ochre jellies and then came to the exit that takes you to the bottom right corner of the world map. There's a fight near the exit in that area that is 'tough' for low level characters.

There's a cave within that last area of the mines surrounded by water. Not sure how you missed it, as a Kobold Commando sort of near the door shoots you with fire arrows as soon as you can see the moat.

x_5404.jpg

Yeah, I walked round that rock in the middle, killed some things along the path, just didn't notice any entranceway. Since that whole dungeon, from 1-4, is chock-full of meaningless dead ends I just assumed it was another dead end. I did scan the end of the path for an entranceway, as I was expecting one, or some reason for the pathway, but there wasn't an entranceway at the end of the path. From what you say it sounds like the entrance in right at the beginning of that path, just after the bridge-like thing. After killing the Kobolds I guess I was concentrating on looting them then moving on with the path. That's awesome, I'll go and do that next.

This all came up because my inventory was getting chock-full of scalps, about 18 of them and nobody was interested in them, that was my trigger for googling "Baldur's Gate Bandit Scalps", to which the answer was to sell them to a guy in chapter 3 (and that they were stackable), so I thought, ok, I should probably be in chapter 3 by now then.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Yeah it is in line with the bridge. Go inside that cave, and you'll be on your merry way. Just make sure you read the scrolls inside the chest ;)

Nashkell Mines definitey isn't the best dungeon, but I think the design works pretty well for the most part for the first playthrough. The dead ends in the level above have traps in some of them, and help instill a sense of dread, and keep you on your toes.

On subsequent playthrough's it's pretty easy just to beeline to where you need to go and not really much need to explore any of the 'dead space'.
 

Mexi

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The forest outside of Nashkel Mines, near that sculpture of Ellisme. I had Kobold commandos popping up.
 

Murk

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Been years since I last played BG 1 but... I thought hovering over the big stone dome of the "cave" gives you the 'more information' icon which in turn tells you it's a cave that can be entered (assuming you didn't see the entrance which is right next to the land bridge that connects to it)

Anyway, fucking LOL.
 

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It doesn't in vanilla BG, unless I misremember. If you're playing TuTu or BGT, then you get that notification.

The very first time I made it to level 4, I also managed to walk around the rock and through the cave to go outside. The second time, I forgot that the exit there existed, so I walked my way back through all the levels. The THIRD time I did it properly - kill Mulaney and exit via the east side tunnel.
 
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assuming you didn't see the entrance which is right next to the land bridge that connects to it... fucking LOL.

What GarfunkeL said, and I'll also add that the detail of the situation is a lot more vague than sentences like this presume. You are drawn across the bridge because there are some Kobolds firing fire arrows at you. At this point in time you are not looking at the world map, nor really the background details of what you are running past to get to the Kobolds. The Kobolds are past the door and down the path a bit, so it's very easy to finish them off and see nothing of interest in the background, to which the most logical step to take would be to continue down the path. Continuing down the path does indeed present another monster encounter, followed by a dead end, at which point one looks at the world map to see why there's no door at the end of the path. Having realised there's no door at the end of this path, the next logical step is to continue down the currently unexplored part of the tunnel before one got 'distracted' by the Kobolds, to which one can just use the world map to select all and click your group to the new location, thereby not providing any more scrolling past of that area.

To surmise, the only time one would 'see' the entrance would be as a brief three second background feature during which time your eyes are much more likely fixed on the fire arrows and their destinations.
 
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Murk

Here's a video illustration:

I have no idea who this let's player is and haven't watched their videos, this was just the first one I found when I looked and it perfectly illustrates my point above:



At time stamp 0:22 you are just walking into a new tunnel.
At 0:28 you see the first Kobold on one of the forks in the road.
At 0:29 all three kobolds are in view and the combat has begun but the cave entrance is not visible yet.

The cave entrance becomes visible at 0:34, while one is actively engaged in combat.
At 0:39 the cave entrance goes out of view as one of your characters reaches the first Kobold.
At 0:53 the player then selects all and starts them walking further down the path.

So the 'window of opportunity' to 'see' the cave entrance is literally less than 5 seconds of background feature during a potentially intense combat situation.
 

Murk

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Good lord, that post was over a month ago and I had forgotten I even said it.

Yeah I don't care. As a kid I saw it immediately and went to it. Sucks you didn't, whatever.
 

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