Endless Space

[MicoSelva]

So, I start a playthrough of this with everything on random (the way i like it) and I'm playing these Cravers. Everything else is my food. Fine. Then, these space pirates arrive and kick my ass to oblivion. Ok. They were not my food.

So, I restart the game an instead of focusing on one tech tree, as I did the first time, I always research the cheapest available technology (in random order). Also, I exploit my meta-knowledge and level up my heroes so they kickstart my empire's ascent considerably. I'm doing a little better, even managing to fend off space pirates this time, but still I'm second-to-last in the space race. So, since everyone else is my food, I declare war on my nearest neighbours and destroy them, and then the second ones (who are Cravers too), and the third ones (who are also Cravers). Now I am first point-wise, but I notice that some United Empire has 65% economic victory already and is getting around 1% per turn. I doubt I can wipe them out in 35 turns, but still going to try.

Combat is a joke. Either You make good tactical combat (like MoO2 or Space Empires IV) or You don't make it at all, to save time (like Civilization series or GalCiv2). Maybe this card-choosing makes sense in multiplayer, but AI is too random in its picks to make any choice significant.

Overall, either 1) I'm getting too old for 4X, or 2) this game is very mediocre. I'm too scared to try playing MoO2 one more time, because if I do, and I don't like it, it means 1). Right now I'm going with 2). Probably not going to pick it up again.

Anyone knows if Sword of the Stars 2, the so-called Enhanced Edition, is any better?

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

Overall, either 1) I'm getting too old for 4X, or 2) this game is very mediocre. I'm too scared to try playing MoO2 one more time, because if I do, and I don't like it, it means 1). Right now I'm going with 2). Probably not going to pick it up again.

Don't know which version you're running, but I've noticed a definite improvement in AI adequacy between the old v1.0.38 I've played before and the latest v1.0.46 I'm playing now.
On Normal difficulty (yeah, I was just checking the game out), it's making reasonable battle card choices and tries to retreat from battles it can't win. And one can finally pick cards for auto-resolve, which pretty much makes manual mode optional for those who don't care for it.

Anyone knows if Sword of the Stars 2, the so-called Enhanced Edition, is any better?

I don't think they can be compared very well. ES is all macro, while SotS2 is heavy on micro. They play very differently, and I've enjoyed them both for different reasons. I'd say ES is better for quick matches and SotS2 is better for a more 'hardcore' basement-dwelling experience.
ES is way better polished, though. SotS2 is a never-ending beta that runs like shit (but is still a good game underneath).

Ninja edit: Just remembered a video LP on YT I've watched some time ago. Might be a good showcase for the game.

 

[MicoSelva]

Thanks. I already finished my playthrough, and would not try again on the same version. But if the game shows continuous improvement I will definitely start over sometime, after I throw some money at the developers.

 

[ohWOW]

So I bought it after all on -50%. Seems like a new patch went out lately (achievements???), but I'm still waiting for diplomacy/tech remake and adding bigger galaxies.

 

[Zardoz]

I guess I'll give it a try. Even if some aspects seem incomplete maybe the patches and mods will fix the game somewhat like moo3.

 

[Multiple Sarcasm]

Aaand the AI ("Impossible") is back to being retarded: after getting his butt kicked in, instead of giving his battered fleet a turn or two to repair and replenish numbers, the AI just sends those 1-2 ships holding on duct tape right back at you.
Not to mention a bunch of half-strength unmerged fleets flying in tandems for easy pickings.

 

[ohWOW]

It wouldn't be a a big problem really, if this game had some sense of distance.

We're flooded with such situations every turn, because ~10th turn we've uncovered a whole galaxy map. Bummer.

 

[Snerf]

Is there anyway to raze planets/systems?

I've tried googling and looking around but couldn't find a recent answer. This is an absolute deal-breaker if I'm forced to keep every single colonized system I want to attack. They can't be so retarded as to not give the option to do this.

 

[Misconnected]

I doubt it. In terms of the game mechanics, razing a planet would never be the right choice - if it was a choice.

You can kill system improvements and change/remove planet specializations, though.

 

[Snerf]

I doubt it. In terms of the game mechanics, razing a planet would never be the right choice - if it was a choice.

You can kill system improvements and change/remove planet specializations, though.

It's not about making the right choice. It's about cleansing every system I see of Cravers and leaving a no-man's land 2 or 3 star systems deep around my territory. I want a small, tight empire while keeping enemy growth in check.

Yes, I turtle.

 

[Misconnected]

ES is an on-rails version of a 4X. Fast-expand followed by rapid & total conquest is the only supported playstyle. If you do anything else, you're playing badly/wrong.

You might want to consider a different 4X. Distant Worlds, Galactic Civilizations 2, Call to Power, Alpha Centauri, and the SMAC mod for Civilization IV are all good choices if you're looking for some "my empire is a fortress" 4X fun.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

the SMAC mod for Civilization IV

has it been finished? last time i tried it, about a year ago, it was a total mess of incomplete, bugged and missing features.

 

[Snerf]

ES is an on-rails version of a 4X. Fast-expand followed by rapid & total conquest is the only supported playstyle. If you do anything else, you're playing badly/wrong.

You might want to consider a different 4X. Distant Worlds, Galactic Civilizations 2, Call to Power, Alpha Centauri, and the SMAC mod for Civilization IV are all good choices if you're looking for some "my empire is a fortress" 4X fun.

Thanks, I've played and generally enjoy most of those but haven't heard of Distant Worlds or that Civ4 mod. I'll have to check them out.

 

[Zardoz]

ES is an on-rails version of a 4X. Fast-expand followed by rapid & total conquest is the only supported playstyle. If you do anything else, you're playing badly/wrong.

You might want to consider a different 4X. Distant Worlds, Galactic Civilizations 2, Call to Power, Alpha Centauri, and the SMAC mod for Civilization IV are all good choices if you're looking for some "my empire is a fortress" 4X fun.

I agree after fooling around with a "demo" for a bit. Might be a fun multiplayer game but for now I'll stick to the classics and wait to see if it improves. Didn't like the weapon/armor rock paper scissors thing in Galactic Civ 2 either but it has it's perks I'll admit. Haven't played distant worlds much but I like it so far despite the real time thing. The expansions really add a lot of fun features and the automation helps the learning curve a lot.

Haven't tried Call to Power I'll look it up. That SMAC civ mod's pretty intriging as well.

 

[Riel]

After a short adventure with Moo3 lately I fucking lust for Endless Space.

MoO3 could have been a good game if it had been finnished, the ammount of bugs and glitches even after patching it as much as you can both with official and unofficial patches is stagering. You can actually be prevented to conquer a planet by an allied fleet, lol. But I admit even without bugs it would still remain a souless game, MoO2 made you feel more involved. Also MoO3 was a grand campaign game more akin to Paradox games than MoO2, this also led to the fan base being dispointed and selling very poorly.

Back on topic is ES game any better now? I played it a few months back, don't remember the version, but it was just when it was posible to pick a portrait different of the main trait. with custom race.

What I disiked mostly was:
Souless diplomacy
Way too easy
Land grab phase followed by all out war for the win.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

It's on sale again, if anyone's interested. Latest updates here.

 

[Misconnected]

Back on topic is ES game any better now? I played it a few months back, don't remember the version, but it was just when it was posible to pick a portrait different of the main trait. with custom race..

Custom races are still so heavily based on the primary races that they're not all that easily distinguishable from them.

Diplomacy is still just a means of breaking the AIs that has little non-meta justification, if any at all.

ES was never "way too easy". It's always had difficulties that shift rather abruptly between "AI is a fucking tool there to make me look good no matter how badly I play" and "there to beat the snot out of me because it achieves certain victory conditions faster than it is possible to do so by the rules the human players have to abide by." So yeah,. it's still utterly fucked. But it definitely isn't easy. Winning on Endless is sort of like rolling Yatzee*5 because under almost every possible circumstance one of the AI opponents will achieve a VC before it is ideally possible for a human player to achieve the same VC.

Expansion into total war remains the only way to play the game. Regardless of VCs, human players must fast-expand into total war to slow down AIs enough to have any kind of chance to obtain any VC.

- Mind that I'm not saying Endless can't be beaten. It most definitely can. But not reliably, and not because the AI is any kind of capable. It's much like playing Fallen Enchantress on Ridiculous or higher difficulties: the fuckers win purtely because they cheat so fucking hard the randomly generated maps mostly don't give you enough of an opportunity to stomp them before they can win purely by breaking the rules. The ES AI is a flaming fucking retard, and it never gets better than that. It just gets to cheat so much it will almost automatically win regardless of how idiotically it plays.

 

[tindrli]

After a short adventure with Moo3 lately I fucking lust for Endless Space.

MoO3 could have been a good game if it had been finnished, the ammount of bugs and glitches even after patching it as much as you can both with official and unofficial patches is stagering. You can actually be prevented to conquer a planet by an allied fleet, lol. But I admit even without bugs it would still remain a souless game, MoO2 made you feel more involved. Also MoO3 was a grand campaign game more akin to Paradox games than MoO2, this also led to the fan base being dispointed and selling very poorly.

Can you share with us what bugs in MOO3 did you encounter in your last play???

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Haven't played in a while (I think I'm at least two mini-expansions behind if not more) and I fired it back up.

Thought #1: GOD DAMN I LOVE THE ENDLESS SPACE SOUNDTRACK. If nothing else this game was worth it for that. IIRC the files are .oggs in the game folder so I can yoink it as-needed for any other space games. One mild annoyance is how the music changes depending on what screen you're on, some songs are great on the galaxy map while others are better in a sub-menu.

Thought #2: The addition of goodie huts, anomalies, "Natural wonders", and other crap does help a bit. Spices things up nicely.

Thought #3: AI still seems pretty dumb. Won my first encounter with an enemy fleet without taking damage. Unfortunately I got a REALLY FUCKING AWFUL random event which had my hero find space religion and I had three choices. Choice #1 was lose an assload of population from various planets which I didn't want. Choice #2 was pay 1000 dust (More than I had) and get a massive penalty to happiness for 20 turns across the empire. Choice #3 was lose my hero, who was leading my fleet into enemy space right at that very moment. I went with #2 and I'm pretty badly fucked at the moment. Completely out of money and nothing's happening in my empire due to the low happiness.

Thought #4: Even though it doesn't seem massively changed from my last stab at the game I'm still enjoying it. Will have to see if this continues.

 

[Stonewolf]

So did they fix multiplayer crashing every five turns by now? Pretty pointless to play this vs clueless ai and even more pointless to play when it fucking crashes after youve invested an hour into a multi game.

 

[ohWOW]

This game still needs much bigger galaxies and better AI.

 

[Riel]

After a short adventure with Moo3 lately I fucking lust for Endless Space.

MoO3 could have been a good game if it had been finnished, the ammount of bugs and glitches even after patching it as much as you can both with official and unofficial patches is stagering. You can actually be prevented to conquer a planet by an allied fleet, lol. But I admit even without bugs it would still remain a souless game, MoO2 made you feel more involved. Also MoO3 was a grand campaign game more akin to Paradox games than MoO2, this also led to the fan base being dispointed and selling very poorly.

Can you share with us what bugs in MOO3 did you encounter in your last play???

It's been a long time since I played last, All I remember and not perfectly is the one a mentioned in his thread about being prevented to invade a planet by a neutral force. But I should have been more specific, bugs I didn't find many (Moo 1.25 + bruic's I think) , what annoyed me most was how unpolished the game was and the ammount of features that were clearly intended to be there but weren't, also the interface needed work and a compelty new section in "Fleet" Screen, Construction section to order the damn ships you want to be buoit empire wide. so you don't end with a ton of scout a troop transports... All in all playing MoO3 feels like a chore with you either wishing for more game or fighting against the game to get your empire working the way you want.

Thanks Misconnected, guess I will have to wait for an expansion for ES, IA expansion Considering how streamlined most mechanics are, it actually puzzles me how AI can be so poor.

 

[Dim]

So did they fix multiplayer crashing every five turns by now? Pretty pointless to play this vs clueless ai and even more pointless to play when it fucking crashes after youve invested an hour into a multi game.

This. Whats (G2G) mean in updates? Does it mean voted on or version difference? Do mods work with multiplayer yet?

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Not sure what causes pirate fleets to spawn in this but holy shit. I was stomping the AI players flat (Killed Horatio, working on Hissho) until a bunch of massive* pirate fleets appeared in my empire and started invading. Ended up accepting a cease fire from the other Hissho just so I could pull my forces back and deal with pirates.
Going to assume they come from unhappy systems which I have a bunch of, due to (I guess) size of my empire and a fair number of them are conquered territories. Maybe I should try researching more happy tech, but I want more dakka so I can keep the pressure on.

*Massive in Endless Space terms means high military power. They're actually like 4 ships per fleet.

 

[ohWOW]

pirates are bullshit in this game
There's was that one time, when I was defeated by 2 pirate fleets in first 10 turns that spawned in 2 neighbour systems (and the only ones I was connected with).