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Elite: Dangerous

praetor

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Urthor huh? the FAS is by far one of the best pure combat ships. it has manoeuvrability quite close to the Vulture (let's say 80%?) but with much more firepower, versatility and a much stronger hull (but weaker shields... which you can compensate with RNGineer mods and better power = more and better shield cells so more effective shields). it's much much better to fly than a Courier, and arguably even than a Clipper (similar rotational speed, significantly slower straight line speed, but much better vertical thrusters in the FAS compared to the clipper). before 2.1, it was the 2nd best combat ship after the FDL. btw, what do you mean "optimal PVE content clearing ship"? because the Asp is pretty bad for combat and the Cutter is atrocious to manoeuvre (the only way the Cutter can cut it [pun not intended] for combat is with an obscene amount of credits and lots of RNGineer mods to take advantage of the best shields and excellent speed).

as to rank. it has always been super shit, and it has only gotten worse with each patch. just to illustrate how supremely retarded it is, i'll tell you how i grinded to the penultimate ranks (this was right before 2.0): "found" (i.e. lurked reddit until someone posted one) a system that spawned lots of donation missions (at the time, those increased rank the best/most efficiently), and just spammed those until the ascension mission spawned, went out the station to collect the salvage that is enough for 3-4 ascension missions, and repeated grinding for something like 2 weeks every day while doing something else IRL. saying it's "stupid" or "retarded" is giving it a compliment
 

Burning Bridges

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You are probably right. The Python is probably the way to go, but its so damn expensive.

On top of all this the game has now become unstable for me. I had a dozen of connection losses, plus three scheduled server restarts that they announced in the game. This all subtracts from your play time, on top of the fucking wait times when you open menus. It's also nice when after half an hour search you have discovered an asteroid with the resource that you are looking for and the game kicks you out with some server error. Hell, I even had an infinite lockup in a hyperdrive jump and lately my collector limpets are often showing odd behavior where they are not doing anything anymore (which requires me to enter supercruise to destroy them or wait till they expire).

I think this is one of the few games which has turned me into a full time hater. I now understand the people who just want to give this company a hard time, because they can't take it from the game any more.

Just look at these retards, they cannot even play their own game:



I think none of them can have done anything much in this game before. It was just funny that someone eventually gave this loser maximum grief at the end, thats a bit of poetic justice.
 

Urthor

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Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Urthor huh? the FAS is by far one of the best pure combat ships. it has manoeuvrability quite close to the Vulture (let's say 80%?) but with much more firepower, versatility and a much stronger hull (but weaker shields... which you can compensate with RNGineer mods and better power = more and better shield cells so more effective shields). it's much much better to fly than a Courier, and arguably even than a Clipper (similar rotational speed, significantly slower straight line speed, but much better vertical thrusters in the FAS compared to the clipper). before 2.1, it was the 2nd best combat ship after the FDL. btw, what do you mean "optimal PVE content clearing ship"? because the Asp is pretty bad for combat and the Cutter is atrocious to manoeuvre (the only way the Cutter can cut it [pun not intended] for combat is with an obscene amount of credits and lots of RNGineer mods to take advantage of the best shields and excellent speed).

Cutter requires insane Engineering to be worth it yeah, but once it tops out with all that Engineering it is literally unkillable and it can haul major tonnage, and with full DD5s it is at least tolerable. You can legitimately kill most AI ships in the game with a turret and AFK build. PVE clearing ships is mostly about lowering the time to kill whilst not being the Corvette and having an actual jump range, and the biggest ships do that, Asp in an exception for niche running around the galaxy not killing things stuff.

Engineered Couriers with mega boosters are hilarious and great fun to pilot. Doing any activity you have previously done at 700 m/s is an experience not to be missed. And unfortunately for the FAS this is not before 2.1 and hull tanking isn't worth shit with the number of missiles the AI launches, also hull tanking was never good if you are playing the AI because you want shields getting damage not hull, that's always been the FAS' weak link. It's certainly manoeuvrable but if I wanted fun ride I'd go Vulture or Clipper, if I wanted efficient I'd go, well, Clipper/Python/Conda. FAS is the worst of all worlds. It's neat to tryout but it is not a Python replacement. Just do the guide I linked to get your Python money.
 

Burning Bridges

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I dont know, I am not an expert like you but the Python seems to me a great ship if I'm not doing a lot of combat per se, just playing the game, travelling alot, doing some cargo stuff etc, want to be able to fight back when needed, and for practical purposes only want 1 ship. It's like a much better Cobra in that respect, and the Asp Explorer sits right in between those two.
 

praetor

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Urthor dude, i don't need money. as i said previously i'm sitting at 2bil total assets. i have all the ships i care about (and some i don't). i tried them all. the only thing i didn't do is the RNGineer grind and i won't until they implement commodity storage so i cannot say how good the Cutter is with DD5, but i can definitely say that without them it's absolute garbage for everything but hauling and i don't see how the DD5 increase would help as even with that ~30% increase it would still be below stock conda levels which is barely tolerable

the FAS is still, pound for pound, one of the top 3-5 best combat ships in the game. it's pretty comparable to the Vulture when it comes to survivability in that it has ~50% shields but ~200% of it's hull, but it has almost double the available MW (i.e. more shield cells, meaning you can negate the shield disadvantage), 2 extra med hardpoints, a ~20% better distributor and only slightly worse manoeuvrability. it's not a FDL, but for combat it's better than a Python (which is not a good combat ship and hasn't been one since it was nerfed around 1.1). i haven't played all that much since 2.1, but i really didn't encounter as many missiles as you claim that flying a FAS would be problem (quite the contrary, i think it's way overblown, as is the supposed "AI buff", but going so far that "You can legitimately kill most AI ships in the game with a turret and AFK build." is definitely false. you could do that something like a year ago, but not anymore, and definitely not since 2.1)

that said, the Python is probably the best multirole ship around as it can literally do everything and do it pretty good, so if you want to have only one ship it's definitely the "ultimate" one to get. but if you don't mind having 2-3-4 specialised ships, there are at least 2-3 ships per "job" which are better than a Python
 

Urthor

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Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
the AI buff wasn't about AI, it was about Elite Anacondas spawning in every system to interdict you when you're at a really high rank for combat. I literally couldn't fly around in an unengineered ship straight after 2.1 dropped since I'm deadly. They've toned it down a bit now, my intercepts are mostly Federal ships which is tolerable

I mean if you're not engineering you're playing a different game to me and there's no overlap, engineering makes literally everything turn 25% more tightly and weapons roughly 2.5 times as deadly so yeah, there's no comparison. I wouldn't fly around in a CZ or a Hires with a hulltanker personally but if you feel like doing that that's okay as well.
 

Morkar Left

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Wow, reading all about this I'm glad I've already given up to enjoy the game. The game has such fundamental problems in its core design which will never get fixed. On the contrary, it gets worse. Still a bit angry about the wasted money for the Horizon dlc but I learned my lesson regarding FD.
 

Burning Bridges

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Well I got more than my money's worth out it. It is the best space station docking simulator ever, has a nice "asteroid factory ship" minigame that I really enjoyed, decent space combat and some nice looking vistas and fake planetary landings, and a lot of other stuff that could make sense if it was not completely retarded.

Each of those activities is worth 50+ hours of classical time wasting. Everyone who is interested should have a go and make use of those things like we did. I would just give up the notion that you can achieve anything in this game, or that you will be feeling great when it is over.
 

praetor

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yeah... because it has so much unrealised potential and because the things it does well it does really well, and the things that cockblock are infuriatingly, incomprehensibly retarded, it's one of the few (if not the only one) games where you'll get your money's worth in terms of hours of fun, but you'll end up hating the game from the bottom of your soul once you're done with it :)
 

Burning Bridges

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I can only assume that Frontier is a company in which half the people are brilliant and the other half are complete imbeciles. Or that some more experienced people did the design up to some point, and then complete retards took over.

I think that this game benefitted to some point from the Elite heritage and the many, many ideas in the 30 years in between. That's why it looks at first like a dream come true. But when it came to actually hiring a lot of new people they only got the riff raff that defines this whole pathetic generation of gamers. Unrestrained, flashy and superficial shit that only millenials could put up with. Whereas the original was extraordinary for its difficulty and balance, they try to mimic it through sheer difficulty without balance, resulting in a complete chaos of gameplay contradictions. I have rarely seen such shit produced with such massive investments.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth


http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-01-06-first-contact-has-finally-been-made-in-elite-dangerous

First contact has finally been made in Elite: Dangerous

For over 18 months, players have been following the breadcrumb trail of clues left by Frontier Developments towards the existence of aliens in Elite: Dangerous. And now, they've finally found them.

Back in April 2015 Frontier boss David Braben alluded to the fact there was more to be discovered in the game's vast world, sending players on a hunt for answers. They discovered mysterious artefacts and ruined spacecraft that hinted the Thargoids - an alien race that's been a part of Elite's history - were in Elite: Dangerous. After all this time, someone's discovered an alien spacecraft that is most definitely not a ruin.

A player on Xbox One going by the name of DP Sayre made first contact, posting a video of his encounter. It's very much worth watching it in its entirety - it's a masterclass in suspense, surprise and exquisite sound design, all of which combine to make the encounter feel truly special.

Frontier has seemingly confirmed via Twitter that the video is not a hoax, and since then other players have reported similar encounters.

As to the Thargoid's purpose and where they're headed, well... Players are speculating that these might merely be scout ships, and that while the encounters are currently peaceful they could be triggered into the violent behaviour they've exhibited in past Elite games. That's another mystery, however, which Elite: Dangerous players are enjoying unravelling right now.
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

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10 min of video for 5 sec of real gameplay, it really depicts the elite experience.
This is why I never bought Elite - despite really liking space games.

My dream space game was always part free roaming space game - like Frontier - and part RPG/roguelike with randomly generated missions and randomly generated crew members you could hire - with personalities that could interact with each other, conflict with each other, have different skills/perks and semi-randomly generated backstories. So an ex-mercenary might be useful to bring on board for raiding other ships, but he might have enemies that could pop up on certain types of missions and attack the ship, demanding you surrender him. Or you might have an ace pilot that's so much of an asshole that he makes certain other personality types want to leave if you don't fire him.

Basically your own unique Firefly-like story that changes every time you play it.

For the Nth time: I cannot fathom why developers of space games assume that all space game players are hopeless autists who only get off on space battles, courier missions and ferrying <insert sci fi cargo here> back and forth between planets for 100+ hours. I know a lot of the people who play the crap devs put out are, but they are ignoring the rest of us who want some meat in their game.

It'd be like if FPS developers assumed that 100% of their audience just likes to shoot things and ALL FPS games were just like Doom or Serious Sam. No Half Life, no Deus Ex - just Doom and Serious Sam over and over.
 
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The Fish

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My dream space game was always part free roaming space game - like Frontier - and part RPG/roguelike with randomly generated missions and randomly generated crew members you could hire - with personalities that could interact with each other, conflict with each other, have different skills/perks and semi-randomly generated backstories. So an ex-mercenary might be useful to bring on board for raiding other ships, but he might have enemies that could pop up on certain types of missions and attack the ship, demanding you surrender him. Or you might have an ace pilot that's so much of an asshole that he makes certain other personality types want to leave if you don't fire him.

For the Nth time: I cannot fathom why developers of space games assume that all space game players are hopeless autists who only get off on space battles, courier missions and ferrying <insert sci fi cargo here> back and forth between planets for 100+ hours.

Couldn't this mostly be explained by one being easy to make and the other extraordinarily difficult? Can you think of many games which have implemented systems close to the former style of game? Graphical demands make it even harder too. Star Citizen might have something resembling what they promised in terms of interactivity and dynamic gameplay had they just used ascii graphics. I don't think Elite ever had a chance of doing anything like the former, even if that's what the developers had wanted. Remember when Braben talked a lot about how you'd race with NPCs and players across star systems in order to return scan data? I wouldn't be surprised if lots of developers take the form of dreamers who slowly get ground down by the reality of having to grind out assets and basic working bugless systems. Peter Molyneux probably believed some of the shit he spouted at one point.
 
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Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...oleaxed-the-elite-dangerous-pen-and-paper-rpg

The copyright row that poleaxed the Elite Dangerous pen-and-paper RPG
Just days before its Kickstarter was due to end.

The Kickstarter for the Elite Dangerous pen-and-paper RPG was put on hold after a copyright claim sent just five days before the crowdfunding effort was due to end.

Elite: Dangerous RPG, from UK company Spidermind Games, was sitting pretty on £65,000 raised - £20,00 over its target - when the Kickstarter was put in limbo and its creators were left worrying for its future.

In an email from Kickstarter sent last Friday, Spidermind was told the project had been removed from public view because it had received a notice of copyright infringement that referenced the original Elite, created by David Braben and Ian Bell and released in 1984, as well as Elite Dangerous, the space game Frontier initially released in December 2014.

The project wasn't cancelled - rather, Kickstarter had simply removed it from public view, the funding paused but pledges intact.

jpg

Visit the Elite Dangerous RPG Kickstarter page and you get this.

The panicked staff at Spidermind were left with an ultimatum to stew over the weekend. The crux, from Kickstarter, as per the email seen by Eurogamer:

"If you update your project so that you believe it no longer infringes on other parties' intellectual property rights, and you notify us when edits have been made by responding to this email within 30 days, we will consider unhiding your project."

The information in Kickstarter's initial email was barebones to say the least. All Spidermind had to go on was the following:

  • Re: Elite: Dangerous Role Playing Game (ED RPG)
  • Description of copyrighted material: "Elite", the game developed by Ian Bell and David Braben, first published in 1984.
  • Description of infringing material: "Elite Dangerous Role Playing Game" books.
Chris Jordan, a long-time associate of Ian Bell, emailed Spidermind Games to reveal he was behind the copyright infringement notice.

In the email, Jordan claims the Kickstarter is guilty of "commercially exploiting" the work of Ian Bell, the co-creator of the original Elite game that came out in 1984 and co-owner, alongside David Braben, of historical rights to the early Elite games. Jordan also claims to now hold Ian Bell's Elite copyright, and signs the email "Chris Jordan, for Ian Bell Elite Rights LLP".

According to company records, Ian Bell Elite Rights LLP was incorporated on 8th February 2017. Companies House lists Chris Jordan, Judith Jordan and David Johnson-Davies - all registered to the same address in Cambridge - as being involved with the company. Ian Bell is not on the list.

Jon Lunn, producer of the RPG, told Eurogamer that the takedown came as a shock. The RPG is licensed to Spidermind Games by Elite Dangerous developer Frontier, Lunn insisted. It has nothing to do with the original Elite Ian Bell and David Braben created.

"If it's a dispute about items being used from the original Elite in Elite Dangerous, then that's an issue to take up with Frontier," Lunn said. "You don't fight a copyright war through proxy.

"If it's about content that was taken from the original Elite game and is now being used in the Elite Dangerous universe, that is not something we have any control over.

"If it's a particular thing that's in a promotional piece of material we have used, then they identify that piece of material and we talk to Frontier about it. But because they just said, the book, and the book has not yet been produced, that's why it smells off."

jpg

Spidermind is now working with Frontier's lawyers to try to have the situation resolved as quickly as possible, but it could take days, perhaps even weeks, before any decision is made - and that kind of delay could spell trouble for the Kickstarter.

"We're losing backers - not a huge number, thankfully," Lunn said. "It's around the 900 mark. It's now 895.

"It's in a sort of suspended animation, which stops the clock. We had four days to go. If and when this is resolved and we're back up and running again, they'll just start the clock again and we'll have four days to go.

"But some backers have themselves made pledges which rely on the Kickstarter finishing when it should finish so they have access to those funds. I've had one email already from one backer saying, I backed you to the tune of £250, but if this goes on for much longer I'll have to pull out."

Both Ian Bell and Chris Jordan are yet to respond to Eurogamer's requests for comment. Frontier declined to comment when contacted by Eurogamer.

Spidermind Games is now in the process of proving the validity of its license to Kickstarter as part of a counter-notification in the hope of a swift resolution.

The incident shines a light on the ownership of the long-running Elite franchise. Jordan says Bell does own some rights to the Elite franchise, and points to public statements made by Frontier as evidence of the claim.

For example, on 1st June 2008 Frontier entered into an IP Assignment Agreement with Braben for the rights to Elite, Elite 2: Frontier and Frontier: First Encounters. When this was announced, the wording referenced Braben's claim to own "all" the rights to the aforementioned games. But the wording was later changed to "all his" rights, suggesting Braben did not own all the rights in the first place. For its part, Frontier has insisted this change "is a minor point and not material to Frontier's business".

As that sorts itself out, Spidermind and the Elite Dangerous RPG Kickstarter could be caught in the crossfire of a potentially larger copyright battle that is yet to come.

"As far as I'm concerned, Spidermind Games took out a legitimate license with Frontier, as Frontier is the creator and owner of Elite Dangerous, and we're making an Elite Dangerous role-playing game," Lunn said. "That struck me as being a simple transaction.

"This mess about an original Elite - we're not making an original Elite RPG. We're making an Elite Dangerous RPG. Any argument of an Elite versus Elite Dangerous bent needs to be pointed towards Frontier rather than towards a license holder."
 

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Character creation and multi-crew is in. If they keep up development this game could have a lot of cool shit in it a few years from now, and Star Citizen will be long dead by then.

48:05

They made those asteroids too shiny. They look like floating turds in space.
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
Missed this:
Couldn't this mostly be explained by one being easy to make and the other extraordinarily difficult?
Of course I think that's what it is. Doesn't make me any more satisfied with this kind of garbage though.
Can you think of many games which have implemented systems close to the former style of game?
Yes, though in part and not in whole. Take Freelancer, for example: procedural side missions, a storyline, characters etc. Or a game like Mass Effect, which had a crew you could interact with, storyline, voice acting. The EV Nova series had storyline missions with a variety of paths you could take. Frontier had randomized courier missions with randomized NPCs. Daggerfall had the same.

It's all very doable, but instead with have this, "oh, look, here's a new ship model, aren't the graphics pretty? bet you'll have hours of fun playing number games in this".

Or worse yet, the X series, where they clearly had the expertise and time to script a lot of things, but fsr decided to waste it on having the player build giant factory complexes of boredom.
Graphical demands make it even harder too.
Yes, though again, it is still possible.
I wouldn't be surprised if lots of developers take the form of dreamers who slowly get ground down by the reality of having to grind out assets and basic working bugless systems.
A fine excuse, but in this age of kickstarters and supposedly "indie" games, I'd like to see some bigger dreams and some smarter, more creative people who can make them work.

At some point, someone has to go beyond just making Doom over and over and make Half-Life. At some point, someone needs to take a risk and make something new and better.
 

Mortmal

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Character creation and multi-crew is in. If they keep up development this game could have a lot of cool shit in it a few years from now, and Star Citizen will be long dead by then.

Plenty of cool shit, like inviting your friends realistic 3D models , have a stroll in superb 3D ships environments .... to convey goods A from station x to station Y, with the usual npc interdiction in he middle.
 

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