Tacticular Cancer: We'll have your balls

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Piranha Bytes ELEX RELEASE THREAD

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Raapys, Oct 17, 2017.

  1. Sigourngender: ⚧ Magister Village Idiot

    Sigourn
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    Turd as it may be, it is true grenades were really useful in that game. Then again, they were useful in Fallout too (W2 did had the ability to see the range of the explosion, though).
     
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  2. GloomFrostgender: ⚧ Savant

    GloomFrost
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    In fallout you needed throwing skill to use grenades properly. Actually Wasteland went one step beyond. You could also use grenade launchers and bazookas without any training so sometimes the weakest party members without any combat skills killed more enemies then everyone else. So how can you complain about OP grenades in Elex after this nonsense :)???
     
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  3. Sigourngender: ⚧ Magister Village Idiot

    Sigourn
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    Which was really retarded to be honest, it made no sense than a fully grown human being was unable to somewhat calculate how much strength was needed to thrown a grenade across the field. (In the end, it should have been Strength and Perception the two S.P.E.C.I.A.L. stats to judge your throwing skill, not an arbitrary skill that made no sense)

    It's been a while since I played Wasteland 2 so I can't remember how grenade launchers worked, but "weakest" party member is overreacting considering a rocket launcher in W2 wasn't exactly the heaviest thing ever made. I do agree it requires skill to use one in real life, though.
     
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  4. Murkgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Murk
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    Nades (molovs, really) are the solution to the bandits at the bridge in Arcanum.

    Rain fire from above, etc.
     
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  5. Zerthgender: ⚧ Learned

    Zerth
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    So, in regards of the Ignadon 'Ulbritch big offensive' main quest. What happened to all the empowering stuff about Nasty? Because everything about being such a tactical mastermind; and a strong woman thriving in a 'chauvinistic world', has been proven to be absolute rubbish, since She actually plans and behaves like a meth head during this quest and their companion related ones. And I though the Ignadon converter assault was dumb enough with everyone charging at the mechs like if the whole thing was a huge Nordic Metal mosh pit.
     
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  6. Elexgender: ⚧ Educated

    Elex
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    now i want a special topic on the codex about " the history of grenades (and other explosives) in RPG"
     
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  7. Murkgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Murk
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    Div OS 1 had great grenades too =(
     
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  8. T. Reichgender: ⚧ Arcane

    T. Reich
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    I've finally finished reading through all the 156 pages of this very thread :prosper:, and I'm ready to leave my own impression of the game.

    TL;DR: GOTY 2017 for me, an unexpected and very pleasant return to form for PB after so many years of pure, unadulterated decline. ELEX has got that old PB vibe, which is a somewhat detracted from by some questionable design decisions and severe lack of polish.
    I'll rank it below G1+2, somewhere on a level of R1. While it lacks the simple grace of these three, it mixes up the old formula somewhat and adds a few new things, even if some of them are of questionable quality (or, of unquestionably low quality).
    I haven't originally bought into the ELEX meme magic, but now I'm cautiously optimistic and waiting for ELEX 2.
    :takemymoney:

    Regarding certain aspects of the game:
    Exploration - stellar. Everything I love about the classic PB is here. They could've done better monster and loot placement (which feels really random and underwhelming at times), but environmental storytelling is top-notch. I really enjoyed exploring ebery corner of the world, even if only to look around. And, of course, the jetpack! It's simply majestic.
    Combat - fair. I was originally sceptical of it (being used to the old formula of getting better with skill increases), but there is a depth to it, because you can really get gud and use all sorts of stuff to fight enemies. Unfortunately, said depth is often ignored by decline enablers in favour of super-cheesy gamebreaking combat mechanics (splosuns!, and DoT that ignores armor). It could really have used a more extensive in-game combat tutorial. Anyways, anyone who complains about ELEX's combat system being shit is simply a crap player, and their unqualified opinion can be disregarded.
    Plot - actually interesting. Rewards optional exploration by providing extra historical lore. Companions are actually interesting, for the most part, and add a bit of lively commentary during exploration and occasionally while conversing with other NPCs.
    Reactivity - good, but there are many unfinished (or bugged) plots that could be expanded further.
    Role-playing system - decent. I liked the interesting design decision with the role of stats as only skill/gear checks, but the skill system could do with an overhaul (too many useless or questionable skills). And IMO Elex should have been made a limited resource - it's too easy to break the game by abusing the Elex drink crafting recipe.
    Inventory design - atrocious. As already discussed in this thread, there are no redeeming qualities to it whatsoever. I was ok with the quest journal and map, though. Semi-reliance on the quest markers is a bit unfortunate, but for me it was a mild annoyance - most of the time you don't need them to find quest objectives on your own.
    Difficulty curve (I play on Difficult) - rather steep, even for G1+2 veterans. Lack of a proper manual and/or ingame tutorial really hurts the game.
    Overall pacing - not ready to judge yet. I'm approx 50 hours in (36 according to ingame timer), lvl23, haven't joined a faction yet, but can do it at any moment. Explored approx half of each region.

    Personally, I'm probably going to stick with Berserkers, because they're the least annoying of the factions for me.
    I'm mostly using melee (2h swords are my favourite, though I've tried everything), but I also use a variety of ranged weapons to soften up enemies. Currently rocking a 2h fire sword ++ from Ignadon, War bow ++, shotgun +++, flamer B +++ (not really using it, because cheatmode), grenade launcher +++ (same, plus it's clunky). I've also got a couple of unique plasma and laser rifles, plus buffing up the stats to try out the regular +++ varieties of those.
    I'm not going to use magic most likely, though I'll try it out just to get a feel for it.
    I'm trying not to rely on elex potions too hard - I probably used less than 30 - mostly during early game to be able to use decent weapons (the ones with approx stat req of 40-ish, they really allow to kickstart an offensive vs the wildlife).
    In melee I can take down any enemy solo, but I'm still having troubles with chimeras (duh!) and the colossi. I have also managed to get gud enough to be able to comfortably take down groups of 3-4 humanoids or 2-3 monsters without taking too much damage myself.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017 at 10:29 PM
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  9. Tigranesgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Tigranes
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    Serpent in the Staglands Torment: Tides of Numenera
    Basically the story arc is about how someone who seems crazy retard from minute 1 can reveal just how more crazy retard they can be, a masterpiece about human nature
     
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  10. Make America Great Again Grimlorngender: ⚧ Arcane

    Grimlorn
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    You guys are just misogynists.

    Nasty is a strong, powerful, independent woman. She don't need no man and is the best commander the free people have. Better than Jax.

    You guys are just intimidated by strong women.
     
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  11. Incantatargender: ⚧ Arbiter

    Incantatar
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    Her character was easily the worst written. Everything about her. She is the best fighter and goes down on the ground in her own challenge fights after 10 seconds. PC kills the monsters and she stands up and screams how that wasn't a worthy challenge.
     
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  12. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    So why do people believe that hitting enemy multiple times increases damage? Because I think players are just confused with design of healthbars and DoTs maybe.

    The only thing which increases is obviously the Q attack.
     
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  13. Abu Antargender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Abu Antar
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    I think it increases because there's actually a skill that increases attack with each hit you land.
     
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  14. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    What skill?

    Power Strikes, isn't it +poise damage? (what does it say in german?)
     
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  15. Abu Antargender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Abu Antar
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    I misread: Attack Strength - Increases the power of your strikes.

    For some reason, I thought it said that it increases the power of each strike.
     
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  16. Murkgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Murk
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    I don't think many have said that hitting multiple enemies increases damage. I know I have said that the further in a combo chain you are, the more damage each subsequent hit does. This does seem to cap off at the natural end of the combo though.
     
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  17. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    I don't see any evidence of that. Or maybe damage bonus is so small it's just not noticeable.
     
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  18. Murkgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Murk
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    I found it to be very noticeable if you check how much HP is taken off with the 4th hit in a combo compared to the first two.

    This is assuming all standard LMB clicks with no DOT.
     
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  19. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    If there is indeed very noticeable boost in damage, wouldn't that mean that you could penetrate high level enemy with metal bar if you can hit him 10 times? Or even 5 times?
     
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  20. Make America Great Again Grimlorngender: ⚧ Arcane

    Grimlorn
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    It's pretty easy to tell when you you're hitting an enemy more than 5 times. You'll see the hp drop about twice as much with each hit once you're combo is in the 5+ range.

    No you'd have to get past it's defense first. It's unclear but I've noticed where the hp bar barely moved or didn't move at all the first 2 or 3 hits, then once I got into the 8+ hits it would start dropping chunks of hp.

    Really you can build up you stamina to be able to swing a two hander 15+ times.
     
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  21. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    Out of curiosity I hit (an overleveled) mass rat with iron bar up to 10 times I think and I noticed increase, but it seems like a single increase. Basically after 4-5 hits damage increases once and never again until you break combo. What a strange system.

    It certainly doesn't feel like "more hits you do more damage you do", that's just not true, i.e it's not cumulative.
     
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  22. RK47gender: ⚧ Degenerates happily Patron

    RK47
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    Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
    Try using a grenade
     
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  23. Murkgender: ⚧ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Murk
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    I don't know what the specific mechanism is (it could also be that after your combo bar fills up a certain amount, you get bonus damage [some have speculated there is hidden stat scaling here]) but I do know that in subsequent attacks damage does go up. It could be a binary situation, but I think after 2 hits the increase kicks in. Though it could be that it's a flat additive quantity per swing and with many enemies you don't pierce the armor, and so it doesn't show until you stack enough "bonus combo damage" until you bypass it. Dunno.

    You can see it here at around 10 seconds. I managed to get the 2nd hit to be interrupted by the doomturkey but the 1st and 3rd attacks connect, and you can see the damage difference between the two:

     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2017 at 2:11 AM
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  24. Abu Antargender: ⚧ Arcane Patron

    Abu Antar
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    Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    I knew I wasn't hallucinating. That's how it was for me, too.
     
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  25. Shadenuatgender: ⚧ Arcane

    Shadenuat
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    Hard to judge from this example about "multiple" hits since it's basically 2 hits. One before combo one after, and then monster has no health.
     
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