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Editting Thread 2 - Proof-reading

Servo

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The best I can give you as a short answer is:
A CRPG is a computer game that belongs to the CRPG genre: A class of games that allow you to role-play an in-game character.

If you need more look here:
CRPG Analyzer

Again, not interested in debating that (here). My point is keep your glossary away from this thread. All we need to agree on is spelling.
 

HiddenX

The Elder Spy
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Divinity: Original Sin Shadorwun: Hong Kong
The idea was to make a glossary for special CRPG (or is it cRPG?) words.
So that the spelling is consistent all over the book.
I'm not sure if we need this. Felipe has to decide.
Of cause we could create e new thread for this, too.
The short explanations are only a side effect of a glossary and interesting mostly for new fans of the genre.
 

felipepepe

Codex's Heretic
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These were previously on the Edit thread:

Witchaven, by Jaz:
Witchaven is not a full-fledged cRPG – it’s a first-person shooter (or rather, hack’n’slasher) with cRPG elements. There are quite a few of those elements: XP, leveling up, degrading weapons, different types of armor, secrets, traps, spells and other goodies. There are five different types of poisons to collect, combat and utility spells to learn … but there’s no NPC interaction, no exploration and no character creation. While you can choose gore and difficulty levels, you are stuck with the knight Grondoval who is tasked with eradicating the witch Illwhyrin, period.

Gameplay-wise, that’s not a problem, because this knight is a one-man army! You’re just as proficient with physical weapons as with casting combat spells (though you will rarely have to rely on the latter, except for tougher enemies of later levels), and you soak up experience like a sponge. Killing trolls, imps and other enemies (or finding treasure, for that matter) will make you level up and become tougher still. Higher levels also mean less weapon corrosion and access to more potent spells … and you will need those to be able to defeat Illwhyrin.

Talking about defeat: The need to think tactical or die is exactly what makes Witchaven so compelling (another strong point are the neatly rendered fake-3D-sprites). Unless you are the type of gamer who likes to resort to cheating, that is. In the beginning, combat is mostly a close-quarters affair, but you will soon find out that the combination of degrading weapons and imprecise controls amkes it an especially dangerous one. Thankfully, most of Illwhyrin’s minions are just as susceptible to terrain-induced damage as you are, so using the environment to your advantage will end many fights early.

In later levels and at higher difficulty, llwhyrin’s miserliness comes into play: You will find less potions, scrolls and even weapons, and chances are that you will run out of essential supplies at the most unfortunate moment. Discovering that you have no spell scroll left when the trapped corridor you reached by flying turns out to be a dead end (and you haven’t saved in ages!) would be such an example. But if you were a little thrifty yourself, you might still be able to cross the corridor with the help of your bow and arrows … provided you saved up some of those

Witchaven might have a few shortcomings (mainly squishy controls and – as opposed to the detailed sprites - visually poor interior design), but the game scores with its clever use of physics and gripping combat. Defeating opponents with environmental help is even more rewarding than dropping the 'Nuke' spell on them, and only a Witchaven player will know the fuzzy feeling that comes with outsmarting a trap.

CyberMage, by Jaz:
In the not-so-far future, governments have made way for megacorporations, but the megacorps' creed to maximize their profit at all costs isn't to everyone's liking. As a consequence, armed rebels have taken the fight against corporate oppression to the streets. This is the political background of the Cyberpunk era you live in, and this is where you manage to get yourself killed.

Then you suddenly get better.

You awake in a lab – without memories, but with a gem implanted into your forehead, and with the minions of NeCrom hot on your trail. If you want to find out why this guy is after you and why you suddenly have access to a mystical power called ‘Darklight’, you’d better run … NOW!

Thus starts CyberMage: Darklight Awakening, a 1995 game by David W. Bradley of Wizardry fame. On the first glance, CyberMage may be a futuristic first-person shooter, but unlike most games of that genre, it is driven by a compelling story and also incorporates several RPG elements. There are traps and secrets and puzzles, exploration is an important (and quite rewarding) part of the game, the atmosphere is immersive. Areas are densely and appropriately populated. You can (and will have to) talk to NPCs to gather information – and by NPCs, I mean friendlies and hostiles alike. Not everybody should be killed just because the game looks like a shooter! Gambling and spending the money in different stores are options just as are watching TV or driving tanks. And then there are your ‘magical’ skills …

CyberMage’s way of imparting new spells on the player character is also intriguing. Collecting spells is one thing, but you will also learn a new Darklight power by being exposed to its effects! This makes for interesting situations: Running from an enemy with a strong power might be an option if your health is low, but if it’s not, charging him to get hit and return his gift would be the better alternative …

There’s also quite an arsenal for non-magical combat. Not every weapon works equally well against every type of enemy, so you need to take that into account when facing groups of hostiles. Body armor is split into separate parts; it degrades when you are hit, and it can be repaired before it is destroyed. But the most important piece of equipment is your jetpack. Once you acquire this, you will be immune to a score of… bugs.

Yeah, right. The game will CTD if you happen to tread on the wrong patch of ground. This bug doesn’t render CyberMage unplayable, but it can be a hassle. Add extreme hardware requirements, NPC stupidity and a choppy engine, and you’ll know why CyberMage never gained the cult following it actually deserved - people who bought CyberMage expecting a pure-strain shooter were disappointed. But behind those minor shortcomings lies an atmospheric, detailed and beautiful Cyberpunk world that begs to be explored. And don't forget that NeCrom is waiting for you …

Battlespire, by Jaz
The Battlespire is a training center for aspiring Imperial battlemages. It is built into a secret corner of the Daedric realm of Oblivion. When you enter the premises to take your final test, you discover that the academy has been taken over by Daedric invaders! And now that a seal blocks the portal you entered by, it looks like your only way out of this nightmare is through …

Originally planned as an add-on to Daggerfall, Battlespire was published as a stand-alone game in 1997. All the action takes place in the seven levels of the Battlespire and the regions of Oblivion intertwined with it. The character and class creation system is classic Elder Scrolls, even if only six player races made the cut. Also missing are the rest function, gold and shops. But it's not as if sleep was a good idea, anyway, with all those Daedric minions breathing down your neck … and if you need more equipment, find it on–site or take it off dead bodies. By the way, loot is the only randomized instance in Battlespire: Unlike the Daggerfall dungeons, the complex maps are entirely handcrafted, so you won't end up starving in a mis-built labyrinth.

No, you'll pretty likely die in combat instead. Enemies in the Battlespire are a lot tougher than those you encountered in Daggerfall. You need to outmaneuver hostiles if you want to survive! Now don’t get me wrong: Battlespire may be more action-oriented and linear than Daggerfall, but it's not all about bloodshed. You’ll have plenty opportunity of getting to know the invaders ... and make allies. Yes, you heard right: Allies. Not all Daedra are evil, nor does everyone agree with Mehrunes Dagon’s plans of conquest. While you can get far by being impolite or just resorting to violence, you would be a fool to not take advantage of all the political intrigue going on in Mehrunes’ household.

It's not as if this grey-on-grey morality had to keep you from being evil: If it’s more your style to betray your allies after they outlived their usefulness, just do so! Playing Clan leaders off against each other or teasing horny (but impotent) Spider Daedra can be insanely funny. In addition to that, Battlespire adds to and draws on established Elder Scrolls lore. You enjoyed Oblivion and want to learn more about the Daedric realm, Mehrunes Dagon and his infighting court? Go play Battlespire!
My only minor gripe are the bugs. While vanilla Battlespire is not the bugfest Daggerfall was, you might have to start levels over again. Glyphs tend to fall through floors (these things are needed to progress, mind you). But if you plan on ignoring this fun and demanding game just because of this, you'll commit a grave error, because patching it to version 1.5 will help a lot. The scheming, the voice acting and the (often hilarious) dialog options are too brilliant to miss out on.
 
Joined
Apr 3, 2006
Messages
1,386
Gratuitous misuse of ellipses ...
angry-must-resist.png

...
... is like ... William Shatner's ... diction ...
...

These reviews make the games sound like fun though. Some corrections:

Witchaven
Edits explained:
Witchaven is not a full-fledged cRPG – it’s a first-person shooter (or rather, hack’n’slasher) with cRPG elements. There are quite a few of those elements: XP, leveling up, degrading weapons, different types of armor, secrets, traps, spells and other goodies. There are five different types of poisons to collect, combat and utility spells to learn …[use em dash] but there’s no NPC interaction, no exploration and no character creation. While you can choose gore and difficulty levels, you are stuck with the knight Grondoval who is tasked with eradicating the witch Illwhyrin, period [confusing verbal idiom].

Gameplay-wise, that’s not a problem, because this knight is a one-man army! You’re [Use pronoun "He" to match the noun to the preceding sentence] just as proficient with physical weapons as with casting combat spells (though you will rarely have to rely on the latter, except for tougher enemies of later levels), and you soak up experience like a sponge. Killing trolls, imps and other enemies (or finding treasure, for that matter) will make you level up and become tougher still. Higher levels also mean less weapon corrosion and access to more potent spells …[use comma] and you will need those to be able to defeat Illwhyrin.

Talking about defeat: The need to think tactical ["tactically" is the adverb] or die is exactly what makes Witchaven so compelling (another strong point are ["is" the verb must agree with the subject, or to avoid confusion altogether reverse the sentence] the neatly rendered fake-3D-sprites). Unless you are the type of gamer who likes to resort to cheating,[redundant comma] that is. In the beginning, combat is mostly a close-quarters affair, but you will soon find out that the combination of degrading weapons and imprecise controls amkes[typo: "makes"] it an especially dangerous one. Thankfully, most of Illwhyrin’s minions are just as susceptible to terrain-induced damage as you are, so using the environment to your advantage will end many fights early.

In later levels and at higher difficulty, llwhyrin’s miserliness comes into play: You will find less potions, scrolls and even weapons, and chances are that you will run out of essential supplies at the most unfortunate moment. Discovering that you have no spell scroll left when the trapped corridor you reached by flying turns out to be a dead end (and you haven’t saved in ages!) would be such an example. But if you were a little thrifty yourself, you might still be able to cross the corridor with the help of your bow and arrows … [use em dash] provided you saved up some of those …[use full stop]

Witchaven might have a few shortcomings (mainly squishy controls and – as opposed to the detailed sprites - [typo: should be em dash not hyphen] visually poor interior design), but the game scores with its clever use of physics and gripping combat. Defeating opponents with environmental help is even more rewarding than dropping the 'Nuke' spell on them, and only a Witchaven player will know the fuzzy feeling that comes with outsmarting a trap.
Edits implemented:
Witchaven is not a full-fledged cRPG – it’s a first-person shooter (or rather, hack’n’slasher) with cRPG elements. There are quite a few of those elements: XP, leveling up, degrading weapons, different types of armor, secrets, traps, spells and other goodies. There are five different types of poisons to collect, combat and utility spells to learn – but there’s no NPC interaction, no exploration and no character creation. While you can choose gore and difficulty levels, you are stuck with the knight Grondoval who is tasked with eradicating the witch Illwhyrin.

Gameplay-wise, that’s not a problem, because this knight is a one-man army! He's just as proficient with physical weapons as with casting combat spells (though you will rarely have to rely on the latter, except for tougher enemies of later levels), and you soak up experience like a sponge. Killing trolls, imps and other enemies (or finding treasure, for that matter) will make you level up and become tougher still. Higher levels also mean less weapon corrosion and access to more potent spells, and you will need those to be able to defeat Illwhyrin.

Talking about defeat: The need to think tactically or die is exactly what makes Witchaven so compelling (the neatly rendered fake-3D-sprites are another strong point). Unless you are the type of gamer who likes to resort to cheating that is. In the beginning, combat is mostly a close-quarters affair, but you will soon find out that the combination of degrading weapons and imprecise controls makes it an especially dangerous one. Thankfully, most of Illwhyrin’s minions are just as susceptible to terrain-induced damage as you are, so using the environment to your advantage will end many fights early.

In later levels and at higher difficulty, llwhyrin’s miserliness comes into play: You will find less potions, scrolls and even weapons, and chances are that you will run out of essential supplies at the most unfortunate moment. Discovering that you have no spell scroll left when the trapped corridor you reached by flying turns out to be a dead end (and you haven’t saved in ages!) would be such an example. But if you were a little thrifty yourself, you might still be able to cross the corridor with the help of your bow and arrows – provided you saved up some of those.

Witchaven might have a few shortcomings (mainly squishy controls and – as opposed to the detailed sprites – visually poor interior design), but the game scores with its clever use of physics and gripping combat. Defeating opponents with environmental help is even more rewarding than dropping the 'Nuke' spell on them, and only a Witchaven player will know the fuzzy feeling that comes with outsmarting a trap.

CyberMage
Edits explained:
In the not-so-far future, governments have made way for megacorporations, but the megacorps' creed to maximize their profit at all costs isn't to everyone's liking. As a consequence, armed rebels have taken the fight against corporate oppression to the streets. This is the political background of the Cyberpunk era you live in, and this is where you manage to get yourself killed.

Then you suddenly get better.

You awake in a lab –[unnecessary break] without memories, but with a gem implanted into your forehead, and with the minions of NeCrom hot on your trail. If you want to find out why this guy is after you and why you suddenly have access to a mystical power called ‘Darklight’, you’d better run … [use em dash] NOW!

Thus starts CyberMage: Darklight Awakening, a 1995 game by David W. Bradley of Wizardry fame. On the [idiom is "At first glance"] first glance, CyberMage may be a futuristic first-person shooter, but [missing comma on parenthetical clause] unlike most games of that genre, it is driven by a compelling story and also incorporates several RPG elements. There are traps [list item missing comma] and secrets and puzzles, [comma splice] exploration is an important (and quite rewarding) part of the game, [missing coordinating conjunction] the atmosphere is immersive. Areas are densely and appropriately populated. You can (and will have to) talk to NPCs to gather information – and by NPCs, [redundant comma] I mean friendlies and hostiles alike. Not everybody should be killed just because the game looks like a shooter! Gambling and spending the money in different stores are options just as are watching TV or driving tanks. And then there are your ‘magical’ skills …

CyberMage’s way of imparting new spells on [impart to; bestow on] the player character is also intriguing. Collecting spells is one thing, but you will also learn a new Darklight power by being exposed to its effects! This makes for interesting situations: Running from an enemy with a strong power might be an option if your health is low, but if it’s not, charging him to get hit and return his gift would be the better alternative … [full stop]

There’s also quite an arsenal for non-magical combat. Not every weapon works equally well against every type of enemy, so you need to take that into account when facing groups of hostiles. Body armor is split into separate parts; it degrades when you are hit, and it can be repaired before it is destroyed. But the most important piece of equipment is your jetpack. Once you acquire this, you will be immune to a score of … bugs.

Yeah, right. The game will CTD if you happen to tread on the wrong patch of ground. This bug doesn’t render CyberMage unplayable, but it can be a hassle. Add extreme hardware requirements, NPC stupidity and a choppy engine, and you’ll know why CyberMage never gained the cult following it actually deserved - [typo: should be em dash not hyphen] people who bought CyberMage expecting a pure-strain shooter were disappointed. But behind those minor shortcomings lies an atmospheric, detailed and beautiful Cyberpunk world that begs to be explored. And don't forget that NeCrom is waiting for you …
Edits implemented:
In the not-so-far future, governments have made way for megacorporations, but the megacorps' creed to maximize their profit at all costs isn't to everyone's liking. As a consequence, armed rebels have taken the fight against corporate oppression to the streets. This is the political background of the Cyberpunk era you live in, and this is where you manage to get yourself killed.

Then you suddenly get better.

You awake in a lab without memories, but with a gem implanted into your forehead, and with the minions of NeCrom hot on your trail. If you want to find out why this guy is after you and why you suddenly have access to a mystical power called ‘Darklight’, you’d better run – NOW!

Thus starts CyberMage: Darklight Awakening, a 1995 game by David W. Bradley of Wizardry fame. At first glance, CyberMage may be a futuristic first-person shooter, but, unlike most games of that genre, it is driven by a compelling story and also incorporates several RPG elements. There are traps, and secrets and puzzles. Exploration is an important (and quite rewarding) part of the game, and the atmosphere is immersive. Areas are densely and appropriately populated. You can (and will have to) talk to NPCs to gather information – and by NPCs I mean friendlies and hostiles alike. Not everybody should be killed just because the game looks like a shooter! Gambling and spending the money in different stores are options just as are watching TV or driving tanks. And then there are your ‘magical’ skills …

CyberMage’s way of imparting new spells to the player character is also intriguing. Collecting spells is one thing, but you will also learn a new Darklight power by being exposed to its effects! This makes for interesting situations: Running from an enemy with a strong power might be an option if your health is low, but if it’s not, charging him to get hit and return his gift would be the better alternative.

There’s also quite an arsenal for non-magical combat. Not every weapon works equally well against every type of enemy, so you need to take that into account when facing groups of hostiles. Body armor is split into separate parts; it degrades when you are hit, and it can be repaired before it is destroyed. But the most important piece of equipment is your jetpack. Once you acquire this, you will be immune to a score of … bugs.

Yeah, right. The game will CTD if you happen to tread on the wrong patch of ground. This bug doesn’t render CyberMage unplayable, but it can be a hassle. Add extreme hardware requirements, NPC stupidity and a choppy engine, and you’ll know why CyberMage never gained the cult following it actually deserved – people who bought CyberMage expecting a pure-strain shooter were disappointed. But behind those minor shortcomings lies an atmospheric, detailed and beautiful Cyberpunk world that begs to be explored. And don't forget that NeCrom is waiting for you …

Battlespire
Edits explained:
The Battlespire is a training center for aspiring Imperial battlemages. It is built into a secret corner of the Daedric realm of Oblivion. When you enter the premises to take your final test, you discover that the academy has been taken over by Daedric invaders! And now that a seal blocks the portal you entered by, it looks like your only way out of this nightmare is through …

Originally planned as an add-on to Daggerfall, Battlespire was published as a stand-alone game in 1997. All the action takes place in the seven levels of the Battlespire and the regions of Oblivion intertwined with it["them" as "levels" is plural, or just use "within"]. The character and class creation system is classic Elder Scrolls,[no comma before subordinating conjunction following main clause] even if only six player races made the cut. Also missing are the rest function, gold and shops. But it's not as if sleep was a good idea,[redundant comma] anyway, with all those Daedric minions breathing down your neck ["But with all those ... , it's not as if" is better] … [use comma] and if you need more equipment, find it on–site or take it off dead bodies. By the way, loot is the only randomized instance in Battlespire:[following clause does not explain the preceding, recommend full stop] Unlike the Daggerfall dungeons, the complex maps are entirely handcrafted, so you won't end up starving in a mis-built[typo: "misbuilt"] labyrinth.

No, you'll pretty likely die in combat instead [this sentence should end the preceding paragraph]. Enemies in the Battlespire are a lot tougher than those you encountered in Daggerfall. You need to outmaneuver hostiles if you want to survive! Now don’t get me wrong:[use comma: following clause does not explain the preceding; the preceding is an introductory clause] Battlespire may be more action-oriented and linear than Daggerfall, but it's not all about bloodshed. You’ll have plenty opportunity of getting to know the invaders ... [use em dash] and make allies. Yes, you heard right: Allies. Not all Daedra are evil, nor does everyone agree with Mehrunes Dagon’s plans of conquest. While you can get far by being impolite or just resorting to violence, you would be a fool to not take advantage of all the political intrigue going on in Mehrunes’ household.

It's not as if this grey-on-grey morality had to keep you from being evil:[following clause does not explain the preceding] If it’s more your style to betray your allies after they outlived their usefulness, just do so! Playing Clan leaders off against each other or teasing horny (but impotent) Spider Daedra can be insanely funny. In addition to that, Battlespire adds to and draws on [parenthetical] established Elder Scrolls lore. You enjoyed Oblivion and want to learn more about the Daedric realm, Mehrunes Dagon and his infighting court? Go play Battlespire!

My only minor gripe are["is" verb-subject agreement] the bugs. While vanilla Battlespire is not the bugfest Daggerfall was, you might have to start levels over again. Glyphs tend to fall through floors (these things are needed to progress, mind you). But if you plan on ignoring this fun and demanding game just because of this, you'll commit a grave error, because patching it to version 1.5 will help a lot. The scheming, the voice acting and the (often hilarious) dialog options are too brilliant to miss out on.
Edits implemented:
The Battlespire is a training center for aspiring Imperial battlemages. It is built into a secret corner of the Daedric realm of Oblivion. When you enter the premises to take your final test, you discover that the academy has been taken over by Daedric invaders! And now that a seal blocks the portal you entered by, it looks like your only way out of this nightmare is through …

Originally planned as an add-on to Daggerfall, Battlespire was published as a stand-alone game in 1997. All the action takes place in the seven levels of the Battlespire and the regions of Oblivion intertwined within. The character and class creation system is classic Elder Scrolls even if only six player races made the cut. Also missing are the rest function, gold and shops. But with all those Daedric minions breathing down your neck, it's not as if sleep is a good idea anyway, and if you need more equipment, find it on–site or take it off dead bodies. By the way, loot is the only randomized instance in Battlespire. Unlike the Daggerfall dungeons, the complex maps are entirely handcrafted, so you won't end up starving in a misbuilt labyrinth. No, you'll pretty likely die in combat instead.

Enemies in the Battlespire are a lot tougher than those you encountered in Daggerfall. You need to outmaneuver hostiles if you want to survive! Now don’t get me wrong, Battlespire may be more action-oriented and linear than Daggerfall, but it's not all about bloodshed. You’ll have plenty opportunity of getting to know the invaders – and make allies. Yes, you heard right: Allies. Not all Daedra are evil, nor does everyone agree with Mehrunes Dagon’s plans of conquest. While you can get far by being impolite or just resorting to violence, you would be a fool to not take advantage of all the political intrigue going on in Mehrunes’ household.

It's not as if this grey-on-grey morality had to keep you from being evil. If it’s more your style to betray your allies after they outlived their usefulness, just do so! Playing Clan leaders off against each other or teasing horny (but impotent) Spider Daedra can be insanely funny. In addition to that, Battlespire adds to, and draws on, established Elder Scrolls lore. You enjoyed Oblivion and want to learn more about the Daedric realm, Mehrunes Dagon and his infighting court? Go play Battlespire!

My only minor gripe is the bugs. While vanilla Battlespire is not the bugfest Daggerfall was, you might have to start levels over again. Glyphs tend to fall through floors (these things are needed to progress, mind you). But if you plan on ignoring this fun and demanding game just because of this, you'll commit a grave error, because patching it to version 1.5 will help a lot. The scheming, the voice acting and the (often hilarious) dialog options are too brilliant to miss out on.
 

Servo

Arcane
Joined
Aug 7, 2013
Messages
1,479
Location
1988
If muds_animal_friend is anything like me then he's able to turn off editor mode when reading most forum posts. But when we're asked to edit things, it might be best if no one else is in the room.

By the way, can we please change all instances of "cRPG" to "CRPG?" The first letter of an acronym should always be capitalized.

Edit: Also "hack’n’slasher?" What gives? We really need a list of terms for consistent spelling (NOT a glossary), ala:

  • CRPG
  • RPG
  • Hack-and-slash (or simply "hack and slash")
  • Role-playing
  • etc...
 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 3, 2006
Messages
1,386
I have to turn off more than editor mode when reading the Codex. This forum makes The Necronomicon look like a Harry Potter novel. But yes, it would be better to organise a style guide for terminology sooner rather than having to retrofit two hundred reviews later. Both short and long forms of terms need to be covered (example variant short and long forms: PnP, P'n'P, Pen and Paper, Pen & Paper, Pen-and-Paper). HiddenX 's list of CRPG related terms could be used as a starting point.
 

felipepepe

Codex's Heretic
Patron
Joined
Feb 2, 2007
Messages
17,274
Location
Terra da Garoa
Yeah, that terminology guide is a good idea.

BTW, one of the reviewers sent me a horribly translated review, but also the original in german. Should I fix the english version, or someone here can properly translate it?
 

ERYFKRAD

Barbarian
Patron
Joined
Sep 25, 2012
Messages
28,237
Strap Yourselves In Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I can be of fixing the english verson, I am of the very much experience in understandment about bad English.

:troll:
 

HiddenX

The Elder Spy
Patron
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
1,655
Location
Germany
Divinity: Original Sin Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Yeah, that terminology guide is a good idea.

BTW, one of the reviewers sent me a horribly translated review, but also the original in german. Should I fix the english version, or someone here can properly translate it?

I can read Deutsch - if there should be some questions :)


PS:
really good in translating German to English is Jaz.
 

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