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Dwarf Fortress

Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,103
So DF2014 is coming out soon, probably this or next week, with over two years of stuff in it. That is reason enough to be excited, but if you are not hardcore enough to play it in ASCII (like me), some excellent news on that front as well. First, there is a very beautiful (relatively) new tileset available called Obsidian, which for me, has replaced Phoebus as the best looking one so far:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=126934.0

And then, some of you might have seen the StoneSense utility for DF before. It used to be a graphic visualizer, which ran in a separate window and showed whatever was happening in DF in an isometric 2D perspective. Well, recently some guy developed a tool to hook the whole thing into the game itself, and they've come up with an overlay version of StoneSense now that actually serves as an isometric graphical interface to the game, that you can use to control everything as well, at least according to this article:

http://www.wired.com/2014/07/dwarf-fortress-3d/

The StoneSense thread on DF forums makes it seem like this thing is currently buggy as all hell, so it might require some time to really be functional, but holy shit, we could finally have a real graphical interface to DF if this works out, and the controls are bearable. I am excited!
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,103
And the two year long update is live! Update changes:

"New stuff
  • World activation! There are a few things that aren't active, like megabeast invasions, but lots of world gen actions made it into the game. Birth, death (to the extent it wasn't handled before), marriages, site foundation as well as reclaims, basic succession and appointments/etc., invasions, as well as some more detail beyond world gen, like patrols, banditry and animal population handling. We still don't have army battles -- the invasions are all successful right now, unless they are locally interfered with by you.
  • The game advances two weeks before each play -- the calendar there still moves slowly when there's a lot of action, as there is in larger worlds, but there are quite a few things I can do soon to speed that up. Due to the speed of the calendar, new forts in particular also get just two weeks. This'll probably cause some shenanigans with the caravan (or you'll just have to wait a year in an autumn fort for your first one) until we sort it out.
  • Fortresses can be retired and unretired. Losing is still fun but if it doesn't happen when you want, you can put it off for a while. Retired forts can be conquered (much more easily than they would be if you still controlled them), so don't be surprised if you have to reclaim instead of being able to unretire sometimes. You can reclaim forts that didn't make it through world generation.
  • Site maps for dwarves, elves and goblins. These are very basic, but they are there, anyway.
  • Multi-tile trees and lots of new plants. Fruit and flowers. Leaves that fall in little clouds. I had to put off dwarf mode tree harvesting, but we should get to that before long.
  • Megabeasts/forgotten beasts can attack, destroy and then reside within world gen sites like dwarf fortresses.
  • Various movement changes. Climbing/jumping/sprinting in both modes, though invaders still require a line of site to use them. Adventure mode has a stealth rewrite, and some elements of that are present in dwarf mode (it is generally easier to spot thieves and ambushers, and I'll probably need to make them smarter about finding cover). Movement and combat are separate now. Startled people climb up the walls of their homes a little too often.
  • Tracking information in adventure mode. You can pull up a little window and see tracks (capital K), and you can also have it describe the freshest track that isn't yours to more easily stay on a trail (alt K). Tracks are also part of the regular look command.
  • Different levels of conflict -- your opponents in adventure mode will be listed with the current status (non-lethal, lethal, no quarter, etc.).
  • Combat moves take place over a period of time now, and you can do things like catching an opponent's attack -- you have to do that by targeting a grab at the offending part now (reactions used to have a menu, but that was before combat got more smeared out). You can get information about what attacks your opponent is doing in the attack menu -- the quality of the information depends on your situational awareness skill. You can add adjective modifiers to your attacks (quick/heavy/etc.) and you can perform more than one attack at a time for a significant penalty to its force. It might make sense with two adamantine swords or something, twirling them about.
  • Rumors of incidents can be spread, and the rumors need to be spread before you gain reputation (good or bad). Killing all of the witnesses to an event will effectively remove it from play if you don't let them get off the screen. People are a little psychic as it regards ongoing conflicts, so that they can make decisions non-stupidly. Your liaison can share rumors with your fort, but I still need to set up the screen for reviewing them after you've seen them the first time... not that you can do much with the information.
  • You can travel through tunnels.
  • You can get a guide to travel with you to a faraway place -- it still ended up being too cumbersome, so locals continue to be able to tell you the location of sites, but only within a certain distance of their home town.
  • In general, conversations have been redone. They no longer have their own screen, but run along with other actions, and there are many more options.
  • The mind has been rewritten quite a bit -- people now experience emotions according to different circumstances (lots of awkward monologues there), and they consider actions differently. The main outstanding issue is that I didn't get around to converting existing dwarf mode thoughts, so they sort of exist concurrently with the new emotions and that needs to be changed. I'll get to that before job priorities (which was one of the main shorter-term reasons for the rewrite). Some dwarves have life-long dreams and it is possible for them to recognize that they've accomplished the ones relating to skills and family. They cannot yet realize their dreams of taking over the world.
  • The paragraph at the beginning of adventure mode was marginally more useful, but that slipped a bit at the end as things were tweaked. I think it'll still describe certain invasions and abductions, but it needs to be redone.
  • Lots of new arena options -- not just the conflict state, but you can set the temperature etc. to all sorts of extremes.
  • Some experiments with procedural items, though the new demon-type sites are still quite un-fun now. The knowledge on the slab at the bottom can be used, but it is probably not worth the trouble.
  • The stuff I forgot


Bug fixes
  • I'm sure several old bugs were "fixed" as large portions of the code was rewritten/removed, but I haven't tried to track exactly which ones. Bug fixes will commence in earnest now, and everything will be handled over at the bug tracker.
"
 

Eddas

Learned
Joined
Jul 3, 2014
Messages
105
Location
A Morada do Sol
Holy fuck, it's upon us. But I will wait the Lazy Newb Pack version (or whatever it's called today), because I'm that casual.
 

Konjad

Patron
Joined
Nov 3, 2007
Messages
3,930
Location
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
And the previous thread about dwarf fortress was not enough for your ingenius posts beccause why exactly
 

Baron Dupek

Arcane
Joined
Jul 23, 2013
Messages
1,870,765
Are we talking about that game with extreme long delay between updated? Heard there was some, propably turning DF into beta, but release?
 

Machocruz

Arcane
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
4,315
Location
Hyperborea
Anything about changes to geography? I find the maps post 40d to be boring, with no interesting features between surface and caverns. I wish Toady would bring back underground rivers, the magma pools and pipes with embark information, empty chasms, etc.
 

Borelli

Arcane
Joined
Dec 5, 2012
Messages
1,260
And the two year long update is live! Update changes:

"New stuff
  • World activation! There are a few things that aren't active, like megabeast invasions, but lots of world gen actions made it into the game. Birth, death (to the extent it wasn't handled before), marriages, site foundation as well as reclaims, basic succession and appointments/etc., invasions, as well as some more detail beyond world gen, like patrols, banditry and animal population handling. We still don't have army battles -- the invasions are all successful right now, unless they are locally interfered with by you.
  • The game advances two weeks before each play -- the calendar there still moves slowly when there's a lot of action, as there is in larger worlds, but there are quite a few things I can do soon to speed that up. Due to the speed of the calendar, new forts in particular also get just two weeks. This'll probably cause some shenanigans with the caravan (or you'll just have to wait a year in an autumn fort for your first one) until we sort it out.
  • Fortresses can be retired and unretired. Losing is still fun but if it doesn't happen when you want, you can put it off for a while. Retired forts can be conquered (much more easily than they would be if you still controlled them), so don't be surprised if you have to reclaim instead of being able to unretire sometimes. You can reclaim forts that didn't make it through world generation.
  • Site maps for dwarves, elves and goblins. These are very basic, but they are there, anyway.
  • Multi-tile trees and lots of new plants. Fruit and flowers. Leaves that fall in little clouds. I had to put off dwarf mode tree harvesting, but we should get to that before long.
  • Megabeasts/forgotten beasts can attack, destroy and then reside within world gen sites like dwarf fortresses.
  • Various movement changes. Climbing/jumping/sprinting in both modes, though invaders still require a line of site to use them. Adventure mode has a stealth rewrite, and some elements of that are present in dwarf mode (it is generally easier to spot thieves and ambushers, and I'll probably need to make them smarter about finding cover). Movement and combat are separate now. Startled people climb up the walls of their homes a little too often.
  • Tracking information in adventure mode. You can pull up a little window and see tracks (capital K), and you can also have it describe the freshest track that isn't yours to more easily stay on a trail (alt K). Tracks are also part of the regular look command.
  • Different levels of conflict -- your opponents in adventure mode will be listed with the current status (non-lethal, lethal, no quarter, etc.).
  • Combat moves take place over a period of time now, and you can do things like catching an opponent's attack -- you have to do that by targeting a grab at the offending part now (reactions used to have a menu, but that was before combat got more smeared out). You can get information about what attacks your opponent is doing in the attack menu -- the quality of the information depends on your situational awareness skill. You can add adjective modifiers to your attacks (quick/heavy/etc.) and you can perform more than one attack at a time for a significant penalty to its force. It might make sense with two adamantine swords or something, twirling them about.
  • Rumors of incidents can be spread, and the rumors need to be spread before you gain reputation (good or bad). Killing all of the witnesses to an event will effectively remove it from play if you don't let them get off the screen. People are a little psychic as it regards ongoing conflicts, so that they can make decisions non-stupidly. Your liaison can share rumors with your fort, but I still need to set up the screen for reviewing them after you've seen them the first time... not that you can do much with the information.
  • You can travel through tunnels.
  • You can get a guide to travel with you to a faraway place -- it still ended up being too cumbersome, so locals continue to be able to tell you the location of sites, but only within a certain distance of their home town.
  • In general, conversations have been redone. They no longer have their own screen, but run along with other actions, and there are many more options.
  • The mind has been rewritten quite a bit -- people now experience emotions according to different circumstances (lots of awkward monologues there), and they consider actions differently. The main outstanding issue is that I didn't get around to converting existing dwarf mode thoughts, so they sort of exist concurrently with the new emotions and that needs to be changed. I'll get to that before job priorities (which was one of the main shorter-term reasons for the rewrite). Some dwarves have life-long dreams and it is possible for them to recognize that they've accomplished the ones relating to skills and family. They cannot yet realize their dreams of taking over the world.
  • The paragraph at the beginning of adventure mode was marginally more useful, but that slipped a bit at the end as things were tweaked. I think it'll still describe certain invasions and abductions, but it needs to be redone.
  • Lots of new arena options -- not just the conflict state, but you can set the temperature etc. to all sorts of extremes.
  • Some experiments with procedural items, though the new demon-type sites are still quite un-fun now. The knowledge on the slab at the bottom can be used, but it is probably not worth the trouble.
  • The stuff I forgot


Bug fixes
  • I'm sure several old bugs were "fixed" as large portions of the code was rewritten/removed, but I haven't tried to track exactly which ones. Bug fixes will commence in earnest now, and everything will be handled over at the bug tracker.
"
And not a single concrete improvement for fortress mode.:|
 

Eddas

Learned
Joined
Jul 3, 2014
Messages
105
Location
A Morada do Sol
And not a single concrete improvement for fortress mode.:|

I'm not sure how Fortress Mode could improve on its own right now. I mean, the whole focus of the game is in the world as a whole. Improvements to the world have, as a consequence, improvements to Fortress mode.
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2013
Messages
5,103
Are we talking about that game with extreme long delay between updated? Heard there was some, propably turning DF into beta, but release?

Usually, the devs used to release updates every half year or so, up until this last one which took over two years. But it's not even close to beta. The guy doing most of the work stated he wants like another 20 years to work on it. :)

And not a single concrete improvement for fortress mode.:|

This release mostly had stuff that right now can only be seen in the adventurer mode, but it's also like laying the foundation to make the whole world work. Once all of that is in motion, and more stuff is added, there will be a lot of impact on the Fortress mode as well. DF isn't a city builder where you build a settlement on an isolated map, it's a fantasy world generator, where yoru settlement is affected by and affects the rest of the world. So in that way, this update will definitely impact it.
 

MisterStone

Arcane
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Messages
9,422
And the two year long update is live! Update changes:

"New stuff
  • World activation! There are a few things that aren't active, like megabeast invasions, but lots of world gen actions made it into the game. Birth, death (to the extent it wasn't handled before), marriages, site foundation as well as reclaims, basic succession and appointments/etc., invasions, as well as some more detail beyond world gen, like patrols, banditry and animal population handling. We still don't have army battles -- the invasions are all successful right now, unless they are locally interfered with by you.
  • The game advances two weeks before each play -- the calendar there still moves slowly when there's a lot of action, as there is in larger worlds, but there are quite a few things I can do soon to speed that up. Due to the speed of the calendar, new forts in particular also get just two weeks. This'll probably cause some shenanigans with the caravan (or you'll just have to wait a year in an autumn fort for your first one) until we sort it out.
  • Fortresses can be retired and unretired. Losing is still fun but if it doesn't happen when you want, you can put it off for a while. Retired forts can be conquered (much more easily than they would be if you still controlled them), so don't be surprised if you have to reclaim instead of being able to unretire sometimes. You can reclaim forts that didn't make it through world generation.
  • Site maps for dwarves, elves and goblins. These are very basic, but they are there, anyway.
  • Multi-tile trees and lots of new plants. Fruit and flowers. Leaves that fall in little clouds. I had to put off dwarf mode tree harvesting, but we should get to that before long.
  • Megabeasts/forgotten beasts can attack, destroy and then reside within world gen sites like dwarf fortresses.
  • Various movement changes. Climbing/jumping/sprinting in both modes, though invaders still require a line of site to use them. Adventure mode has a stealth rewrite, and some elements of that are present in dwarf mode (it is generally easier to spot thieves and ambushers, and I'll probably need to make them smarter about finding cover). Movement and combat are separate now. Startled people climb up the walls of their homes a little too often.
  • Tracking information in adventure mode. You can pull up a little window and see tracks (capital K), and you can also have it describe the freshest track that isn't yours to more easily stay on a trail (alt K). Tracks are also part of the regular look command.
  • Different levels of conflict -- your opponents in adventure mode will be listed with the current status (non-lethal, lethal, no quarter, etc.).
  • Combat moves take place over a period of time now, and you can do things like catching an opponent's attack -- you have to do that by targeting a grab at the offending part now (reactions used to have a menu, but that was before combat got more smeared out). You can get information about what attacks your opponent is doing in the attack menu -- the quality of the information depends on your situational awareness skill. You can add adjective modifiers to your attacks (quick/heavy/etc.) and you can perform more than one attack at a time for a significant penalty to its force. It might make sense with two adamantine swords or something, twirling them about.
  • Rumors of incidents can be spread, and the rumors need to be spread before you gain reputation (good or bad). Killing all of the witnesses to an event will effectively remove it from play if you don't let them get off the screen. People are a little psychic as it regards ongoing conflicts, so that they can make decisions non-stupidly. Your liaison can share rumors with your fort, but I still need to set up the screen for reviewing them after you've seen them the first time... not that you can do much with the information.
  • You can travel through tunnels.
  • You can get a guide to travel with you to a faraway place -- it still ended up being too cumbersome, so locals continue to be able to tell you the location of sites, but only within a certain distance of their home town.
  • In general, conversations have been redone. They no longer have their own screen, but run along with other actions, and there are many more options.
  • The mind has been rewritten quite a bit -- people now experience emotions according to different circumstances (lots of awkward monologues there), and they consider actions differently. The main outstanding issue is that I didn't get around to converting existing dwarf mode thoughts, so they sort of exist concurrently with the new emotions and that needs to be changed. I'll get to that before job priorities (which was one of the main shorter-term reasons for the rewrite). Some dwarves have life-long dreams and it is possible for them to recognize that they've accomplished the ones relating to skills and family. They cannot yet realize their dreams of taking over the world.
  • The paragraph at the beginning of adventure mode was marginally more useful, but that slipped a bit at the end as things were tweaked. I think it'll still describe certain invasions and abductions, but it needs to be redone.
  • Lots of new arena options -- not just the conflict state, but you can set the temperature etc. to all sorts of extremes.
  • Some experiments with procedural items, though the new demon-type sites are still quite un-fun now. The knowledge on the slab at the bottom can be used, but it is probably not worth the trouble.
  • The stuff I forgot


Bug fixes
  • I'm sure several old bugs were "fixed" as large portions of the code was rewritten/removed, but I haven't tried to track exactly which ones. Bug fixes will commence in earnest now, and everything will be handled over at the bug tracker.
"
And not a single concrete improvement for fortress mode.:|
Go play Minecraft you spaz
 

Derek Larp

Cipher
Joined
Jul 25, 2008
Messages
423
[...] very beautiful (relatively) new tileset available called Obsidian, which for me, has replaced Phoebus as the best looking one so far:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=126934.0

YmYaK7u.png



DONGS
 
Unwanted

jcd

Punished JCD
Patron
Joined
Jan 4, 2012
Messages
10,681
Location
UNATCO HQ
Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Bubbles In Memoria
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MisterStone

Arcane
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Messages
9,422
Not playing this anymore. It's being developed slower than Grimoire. And after so many years, it's still broken, horribly unbalanced, full of laggy, unnecessary crap.

I lost all interest.

1) it has not been developed slower grimoire, which predates the WWW and has a fraction of the scope of this.

2) unecessary for what? Yeah, if you just want to play Sim City its mostly unecessary. I don't think that this is the point of this project though. I lose interest too for a year at a time or so, but the big releases always have lots of fun.
 

Fowyr

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
Mar 29, 2009
Messages
7,671
I wonder if hospital bug was fixed. It killed last version for me. Damn, I like my micromanagement and do not want constantly lose thread and cloth!
Deleted it and went to play 2D version instead.
 

Ashery

Prophet
Joined
May 24, 2008
Messages
1,337
I wonder if hospital bug was fixed. It killed last version for me. Damn, I like my micromanagement and do not want constantly lose thread and cloth!
Deleted it and went to play 2D version instead.

I know that at least some of the hospital bugs have been fixed, but I haven't played the latest version yet (Waiting on the updates to stabilize) and so I can't say what behavior's still buggy.
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,804
Ok so i high-jacked this thread because i started playing DF 0.40.+ And since there have been like 5 threads over last 2 years all of them with random shit i suppose i shouldn't look elsewhere.

Ok so first off DF0.40.+ is a thing after two years.

Changes in 0.40 compared to 0.34:

- world is alive after you create it. you can just leave fortress instead of abandoning it and come back later. (will be treated as any other city)
- in 0.40.14 total overhaul of happiness system. No it is based on stress/pleasure factor and it is long therm thing. Up until today's release it was buggy though as dworfs were sad due to their family being murdered in other towns when goblins attacked and conquered them. Now both always-win and long therm stress has been dealt with with 0.40.17
- trees are actual tress now with many Z levels, leaves, braches and stuff. What is more interesting is that 0.40.15 introduced fruits gathering. Which means apple trees will give you apples, peach tree peaches and so on.
- ton of shrubs are now usable, harvestable, red beans, strawberries and such.
- climbing ! You can climb those tress and eat fruits directly from tree. Also attackers can now if they have skill climb your walls. They can also combine jumping with climbing so your two z level high wall will be useless for skilled ninja. 3z level walls ftw.
- combat and speed was rewriten. So that you can for example try 3-4 quick lighter attack or just 1 heavy one. Several different types of running mechanic from walking to fast walking to sprinting.
- conversation system overhaul also introduced rumor system so things spread out over world. Also you can claim sites for yourself after killing owner (though stuff after that is not implemented yet)

also Tbwt plugin for DFhack recently received amazing update that splits ui stuff from game stuff so you can have nice fond based on normal looking fonts (instead of fucking square font) and graphic tiles squares. This means ui font is now much better without graphic using rectangles.

Also there is update to tbwt (or DFhack ?) that gives ability to completely change graphic tiles to unspecified images. So this means that for example if you build Still people can now instead of 3x3 standard DF jack graphic can now import great looking hand painted still (or ripped). This works for everything from dwarves (which no longer need square tiles) and rest. This means that in few next months there will be tileset that will make DF look like sprite based strategy game.

People are experimenting with Stonesense. Now it is possible to get Stonesense for main DF graphic window. Though UI actions and stuff is unsuported (as stonesense needs to be updated to contain UI)


Currently i am running small racist community 0.40.17 and i will see how that goes.
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,804
yes. It is 2014 not 2012 you need to upgrade CPU.

Also ! Stop playing @ 100fps cap. Reduce it to 50FPS. It will run twice as slow but it will feel much better (as actions will look more realistic along with combat) also it will smooth out FPS dips.

To me DF @ 100FPS feels like fast forward game now.

If you have shitty PC then limit your embark size and population cap to max 100 instead of 200.

I usually play 7x7 embark + i almost always do above ground city and for me it works well (i have i53470 though)
 

Destroid

Arcane
Joined
May 9, 2007
Messages
16,628
Location
Australia
yes. It is 2014 not 2012 you need to upgrade CPU.

Also ! Stop playing @ 100fps cap. Reduce it to 50FPS. It will run twice as slow but it will feel much better (as actions will look more realistic along with combat) also it will smooth out FPS dips.

To me DF @ 100FPS feels like fast forward game now.

If you have shitty PC then limit your embark size and population cap to max 100 instead of 200.

I usually play 7x7 embark + i almost always do above ground city and for me it works well (i have i53470 though)

The whole point of running at 100fps is so you don't have to claw your eyeballs out waiting for stuff to happen.


I wonder if there is any game on earth that has benefited as much as dwarf fortress from CPU grunt improving over it's lifetime.
 

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,804
yes. It is 2014 not 2012 you need to upgrade CPU.

Also ! Stop playing @ 100fps cap. Reduce it to 50FPS. It will run twice as slow but it will feel much better (as actions will look more realistic along with combat) also it will smooth out FPS dips.

To me DF @ 100FPS feels like fast forward game now.

If you have shitty PC then limit your embark size and population cap to max 100 instead of 200.

I usually play 7x7 embark + i almost always do above ground city and for me it works well (i have i53470 though)

The whole point of running at 100fps is so you don't have to claw your eyeballs out waiting for stuff to happen.


I wonder if there is any game on earth that has benefited as much as dwarf fortress from CPU grunt improving over it's lifetime.

imo default speed of DF was always too "fast forward" for me. At start yeah it is a bit slow but later you have stuff to do either way so this means little. As for hardware also low latency ram is super important.

Imo the greatest weapon and at the same time greatest weakness is mentioned complexity.
We can all curse bloat but when your dwarf will die because his body fat melted and he bleed out you know it was worth it.
 
Unwanted

jcd

Punished JCD
Patron
Joined
Jan 4, 2012
Messages
10,681
Location
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Last edited:

Perkel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Messages
15,804
Imo the best games i had were always with ~70-80 dwarves.

Also i forgot to mention that migration waves are a bit different. First off first two migration waves that were hardcoded are no longer hardcoded so if you change pop cap to 7 there will be no migration waves.
Second migration waves themselves now are different as math changed a bit. Now if you are not producing wealth you can attract no one. I often start with creating minifort for defense and sometimes i get no new dwarves.

Also Toady updated his feature list to do in coming months:

http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/dev.html?skjbgsldjfb

embark with different set of laws seems to be interesting as well different types of embarks. Like for example embark to create fortress or to create tavern and each of those will attract different types of migrants.
 

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