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Dota 2 Discussion (~Boston Majors & Road to TI7~)

What modes should we play?


  • Total voters
    66

Mr. Pink

Travelling Gourmand, Crab Specialist
Joined
Jan 9, 2015
Messages
3,044
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
OG fucking did it again. Been a fan of them since the Monkey Business days, but AF also made me a fan. Incredible run they had.

Grats to both teams. Game 3 was the most exciting game I had the privilege of watching. I was listening to the stream driving home from work and I had to pull over for 30 minutes just to watch it. The ending is so perfect it had to have been scripted.
 

InD_ImaginE

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
5,415
Pathfinder: Wrath
I am reading that the frog is going to nerf "solo carry a team" so heroes like AM, alch, invoke, sven, may be storm, could get the bat. And I think people are bloody sick of the illusion high ground push meta that SD, maybe manta+octairine, could also get the bat as well.

Just please don't make it a 60 minutes at bare minimum a game meta.
 

InD_ImaginE

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
5,415
Pathfinder: Wrath
Not talking about nerfs, but reworks. Hero's boring as shit to play as/against.
Eh honestly I don't think all heroes should be "fun" to play. Tanky, stun, slow, buff, he is pretty much a good hero for people to start learning how to support. Accordingly besides DING DING DING, he is unable to make much of a play either. There is not much of hero like him in the game and that's good for variation. actually maybe nerf bloodlust a bit. Its impact on hitter heroes is really high that it basically often becomes THE reason people pick ogre (much like Disruption for SD).

The same could be said about PA. Before and even after TI6 she is considered low tier hero that loses much of effectiveness entering late-game, having 2 of her skills invalidated by force staff and MKB. But as shown by several teams (TI6 MVP beating OG being the first if I am not mistaken?) having her and a team that could play around her strength is an awe to watch. Heck I think she is more interesting to play than, lets say, AM or spectre, because using her simple skills carelessly usually will result in death. AM and spec game plan is farm until I get net worth advantage and trample all over the enemies while PA needs to play correctly to use that mid-game opportunity where she is at her strongest. Dagger nerf is needed though. Maybe increase mana cost or CD.

OD, beisdes him droping the hammer being game breaking some time, is actually fun to watch with all the offensive and defensive way Astral can be used, pretty much like Disruption.
 
Joined
Apr 3, 2013
Messages
2,071
Location
Siberia
Fun is subjective obviously, but for newbies there are heroes like venge. Strong in a lot of ways and are pretty simple in terms of execution, but are not frustrating to play against.

Ogre is unbeatable in lane due to ridiculous base hp, armor and damage values. Yet takes absolutely no skill to play, shit's boring, period.

PA is an rng simulator that again is very strong (and safe) during laning phase, yet has a skillcap comparable to that of an ogre.

OD is just as demoralizing to play against, his rework made him even stronger in fights (which he definitely didn't need) and slightly less annoying during laning stage (but still gay af, since you can't really gank him due to high base stats and imprisonment).
 

Mr. Pink

Travelling Gourmand, Crab Specialist
Joined
Jan 9, 2015
Messages
3,044
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Ogre is unbeatable in lane due to ridiculous base hp, armor and damage values. Yet takes absolutely no skill to play, shit's boring, period.

Ogre is fun as hell what are you talking about. Ogre is great because of how much he can do with no items at all. There aren't any mandatory items for ogre like a lot of supports so a lot of clowny builds work great. His laning is decent, but not as good as you make it out to be. In lane, he's got relatively little kill potential without help from two more, and can't harass unless he has a way to get mana fast. The skill floor is low since any retard can stun and blood-lust, but like every other hero, it's how you play and itemize that's way more important.

PA is an rng simulator that again is very strong (and safe) during laning phase, yet has a skillcap comparable to that of an ogre.

PA hasn't really been about rng for a long time since the psuedo-rng patch. You've got around a 70% chance to trigger a crit somewhere in the first 5 hits, and almost guaranteed after 7. While early game is pretty luck based, by mid-game you just have to assume PA will crit you after every jump (dagger+ atleast 2-3 right clicks) and get ready for it. By lategame, not getting crit is more surprising.

If you think PA has a low skillcap, you haven't seen Artour demolish everyone in the summit before ti4 with mid PA back when it wasn't meta. I would say PA is harder to play effectively than AM because of the lack of an easy escape,mediocre farming speed and emphasis on early-mid game aggression. Really exciting to watch and to play.


OD is just as demoralizing to play against, his rework made him even stronger in fights (which he definitely didn't need) and slightly less annoying during laning stage (but still gay af, since you can't really gank him due to high base stats and imprisonment).

Every single skill that OD has pisses me off. I hate him almost as much as techies. Still, OD fulfills the niche of snowballing int mid that relies on attack damage, in contrast to QOPs magic damage or TAs agility and neg-armor skills. OD is also the worst hero to play when behind, so it's pretty satisfying to blow him up with mana burn.

The only heroes I consider anti-fun is naga and techis, but they don't really need work either.
------------
7.00 wishlist

Nerf
Drow - Lv4 aura is still too strong, could be nerfed by being disabled when an enemy hero is within melee attack range...
Shadow Demon - Fuck these fucking illusions. Lower illusion lifespan.
Luna - Glaives don't bounce off buildings any more.
Alchemist - It's retarded how strong this hero is even without gold. he ought to be weak without items, and strong with them, not strong no matter what.
Ogre - Nerf bloodlust cooldown.

Buff pls
Natures Prophet - Pretty terribad right now.
Lycan - Why does this hero even exist when other heroes push faster and hit way harder. Wolves being made of tissue paper kind of nullifies the point of this hero. The enormous post TI2 nerf, and then the jungle xp nerf is just too much for poor doggyman
Lina & Zeus - Early game magic heroes that are made useless by a 225 gold item with 6 charges.
QWOP of Pain - Again, fucked over by all the early magic resistance options.
Visage - One of the lowest winrates on every skill level ;_;
Tusk - Forgot this hero exists
Chaos Knight - Forgot this hero exists... maybe for the better.
 

Saark

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jun 16, 2010
Messages
2,228
A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
The biggest issue with SD/Manta on certain heroes is how some of the abailities are coded. Everything that is technically a spell deals full damage. Stuff like Radiance burn, Counter Helix or Moon Glaives are all spells, so I would imagine instead of dumping SD back into the trash we are going to see a change to at least some of these mechanics.

Apart from that the only real change I would like to see is a .5 modifier to greevils greed working on neutral creeps. It's just ridiculous how even when you crush him in lane he can just get back up by farming neutral stacks. I dont think anyone had envisioned alch to be this insane splitpush faggot with radiance/manta/octarine, so we might aswell nerf this shit as much as possible. Buff some of the remaining bad heroes (WR, QoP, Lina), make Iron Talon buyable after 3 minutes, make raindrops buyable like wards, only 1 every couple of minutes and we're set.
 
Joined
Apr 3, 2013
Messages
2,071
Location
Siberia
http://www.dota2.com/700/

Talents (instead of +2 stats), 4 rows with 2 choices for each hero
Pre-game pick
New slardar viper enigma models
Reworked jungle (with bounty runes in them apparently)
Moved rosh
New buildings that heal you
etc.

Well that's basically dota 3, much more than I expected (not sure if better though, we'll see)

No proper patch notes yet (pastebin aside)
 

InD_ImaginE

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 23, 2015
Messages
5,415
Pathfinder: Wrath
well fuck off valve
If I want to play that kind of game I'd be playing HOTS. Regretting buying the compendium now. Fuck this, maybe this is a good reason to uninstall.

From google translated chinese patch notes: backpack is hilarious. Item moved from inventory to backpack have 6 seconds cooldown. You can bring damage item and if you lose swap in SB, wait 6sec, disappear. No need to micro ward for support. Fucking icefrog.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 3, 2013
Messages
2,071
Location
Siberia
well fuck off valve
If I want to play that kind of game I'd be playing HOTS. Regretting buying the compendium now. Fuck this, maybe this is a good reason to uninstall.

From google translated chinese patch notes: backpack is hilarious. Item moved from inventory to backpack have 6 seconds cooldown. You can bring damage item and if you lose swap in SB, wait 6sec, disappear. No need to micro ward for support. Fucking icefrog.

Cue overreaction, item swapping will probably lock in combat (or they'll make it so in a patch or two). Courier micro (not using it in general, but actually trying to get an item out of it if you are full) is the most fucking annoying thing in the game anyway.

Talents > +2 stats

Balanced rosh placement >

Other map changes are up for discussion though.

This might be the best dota in the last 5 years simply due to the chaos that will ensue in the next few months, I missed the time when I and everyone else sucked at it. Shit was way more fun on garena and other pirated b.net like communities back in the day of wc3.
 

Cromwell

Arcane
Joined
Feb 16, 2013
Messages
5,443
so no attributes to skill what dio I skill now? I have 4x4 abillities and 4 skilltreestuff thats 5 missing points
 

v1rus

Arcane
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
2,254
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The fuck is happening?
 
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,894
This might be the best dota in the last 5 years simply due to the chaos that will ensue in the next few months, I missed the time when I and everyone else sucked at it. Shit was way more fun on garena and other pirated b.net like communities back in the day of wc3.

I often feel the same way about competitive games in general - they're just much better when everyone playing sucks, because things feel more spontaneous and there's no set 'recipe for success' that people try to replicate without understanding the game first, which is what we have now with so much information so readily available - everyone thinks that they're playing on a 2 million dollar tournament and that they're the equivalent of pro players because they watched a video.

Just as another example, this is true of fighting games, too. Shit was just way more fun in arcade SF2 Champion Edition because people thought it was cool when the player playing Guile managed to throw out a Flash Kick, instead of arguing for 3 years about which +3 move is the most overpowered on message boards. This is part of why fighting games only really worked in an arcade setting - you had to literally put your money where your mouth was and there was no comfort zone, you just fucking went against the fucking beggar on the other side of the controls and you pushed his shit in, or you lost and faced the end of the (huge) line in hopes of a rematch. Or you just quit like a little bitch and went home, never to be seen again. It was that simple. Now all people have to do is sit at home with training modes and infinite rematches, so they talk shit about the tiniest little things that they have no real idea about.

In other words, everything is shit, get off my lawn, etc.
 
Joined
Oct 4, 2010
Messages
1,445
I'm fine with drastic changes, but I don't feel the need to spew knee-jerk reactions. Gotta play it to see how it works.
 

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