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Dev Log #56: Experimental Branch with Version 1.0.3.13

Lhynn

Arcane
Joined
Aug 28, 2013
Messages
9,824
The new difficulty is pretty intense, i have troubles surviving most encounters as a psi monk.
The stupid alpha rathounds are critting for 60 damage and attack like 3 times, the psibugs were doing like +50 damage with their psi fists, that meant instant loss.
 

Lhynn

Arcane
Joined
Aug 28, 2013
Messages
9,824
I have noticed a trend with these post release patches, i dont think there has been one of them that hasnt nerfed lightly armored builds.
I have to wonder if a 10 agi maxed dodge/evasion + dodge/evasion gear is enough to reach the avoidance cap anymore.
 

Ent

Savant
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Messages
539
I'm wondering if I can ignore steadfast aim and dump my strength and get even more intelligence for that high technicalities bonus damage I would probably miss that crit tho. Also those goliath psy beetles drop some amazing quality carapace.
 
Last edited:

Vorark

Erudite
Joined
Mar 2, 2017
Messages
1,394
  • Added two new belts that augment chemical pistol attacks
  • You can now use High Efficiency Energy Converter to reduce the energy cost of firing energy pistols
  • Energy Pistols now have two enchancement slots when crafted
  • Plasma pistol damage increased by 25%
  • Laser pistol base action point cost changed to 15 (down from 22)
  • Laser pistol usage energy cost reduced by 20%
  • Increased the damage of chemical pistols by 50% (will be applied retroactively on exisiting items)
  • You can now unload chemical pistols
  • Cooked Shot special chemical pistol AoE attack with radius of 1
  • High-Technicalities increases damage with energy pistols by 7% for each point of intelligence above 5
Pistols finally get the attention they deserved. Thanks a lot for looking into this, Styg. :salute:
 

Parabalus

Arcane
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
17,432
I have noticed a trend with these post release patches, i dont think there has been one of them that hasnt nerfed lightly armored builds.
I have to wonder if a 10 agi maxed dodge/evasion + dodge/evasion gear is enough to reach the avoidance cap anymore.

Infused leather was also gutted, around a 50 point quality drop from what it was.

Probably for the best since it made light fist unbalanceable but still :negative:-
 

ciox

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 9, 2016
Messages
1,278
I don't think I'm going to bother infusing leather for armor anymore, just for tabi boots. Infused leather was already a highly debatable competitor to regenerative overcoats, even before the nerf.
 

Tygrende

Arbiter
Joined
Aug 2, 2017
Messages
872
I don't think I'm going to bother infusing leather for armor anymore, just for tabi boots.
It wasn't nerfed that hard.


Infused leather was already a highly debatable competitor to regenerative overcoats, even before the nerf.
Let's compare an infused pig leather armor made out of 131 infused pig leather (160 super steel fiber and 60 pig leather) and 120 high-density padding to a tactical overcoat made out of 160 quality super steel sheet and 120 regenerative vest.

Leather armor:
41%/9
30% more DR against melee, so 51%
+90 health
+1 CON (which equals 34 bonus HP at level 25 on hard and a bit of fortitude)
20% armor penalty
Those are post-nerf stats of course

Overcoat:
23%/16
200% more DT against bullets, so 48
35% more DT and DR against knives, so 31%/22
45 HP/turn when below 70% HP at the cost of 7 energy, 70 energy total
20% armor penalty

Let's start with mechanical DR/DT. Leather armor has much higher DR, especially against melee. Overcoat has much higher DT, especially against bullets. Even after the nerf I would still prefer the former given that DR tends to be much more meaningful than DT and that energy shields are still more than adequate defense against bullets while not being a good defense against melee and not as effective against single high damage attacks. An overcoat won't protect you from Carnifex, sniper's/crossbowski's Aimed Shot (at least not nearly as well as the leather armor) while both the overcoat and leather armor will do just fine against bullets when we account for shields.

Next is the comparsion between bonus HP from leather armor and HP regen from overcoat. Leather armor ends up giving 124 bonus HP at level 25 on hard, regen vest gives 45 HP per turn when below 70% HP. In other words leather armor will provide a bigger bonus if the player spends less than 3 turns below 70% HP, starting at turn 3 the overcoat will provide a bigger bonus increasing with each turn. Flat HP bonus is definitely much better when it comes to surviving very high burst damage dealt in a single or few turns (Carnifex and sniper's/crossbowski's Aimed Shot are again a good example here, both have the capability of killing the player in a matter of 1-2 turns., flat HP bonus might buy you a bonus turn while the regen vest might not even have the time to activate. Mental Breakdown+Neural Overload crits are another good example) while HP regen is better suited for prolonged fights where the player takes moderate amounts of damage for a lot of turns.

Personally I think high burst damage is a much bigger threat than prolonged fights, but I guess this depends on the build and playstyle. It's also worth noting that regen vest is susceptible to EMP- not only will it stop giving bonus HP, it will actually lower HP by 35. This is even more important now that greater coil spiders exist.

All in all the nerf isn't as bad as it seems, definitely not bad enough to make infused leather armors useless, infused pig would still be my preferred choice for a good all-around light armor. I think it was aimed mostly at 200+ infused ancient rathound leathers.
 

Lhynn

Arcane
Joined
Aug 28, 2013
Messages
9,824
I think it was aimed mostly at 200+ infused ancient rathound leathers.
Yeah, still inane, most threats can already end you in a single round and i imagine this trend will get worse in the expansion. And a new nerf comes with every patch, and a few of those nerfs were actually detrimental to that style of gameplay.
It adds up, im hoping unarmed gets some love soon.
 

Ent

Savant
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Messages
539
The hardest thing about the laser pistol build is probably going to be this awful start up phase which might be worse than a sniper start.
 

ciox

Liturgist
Joined
Feb 9, 2016
Messages
1,278
I don't think I'm going to bother infusing leather for armor anymore, just for tabi boots.
It wasn't nerfed that hard.


Infused leather was already a highly debatable competitor to regenerative overcoats, even before the nerf.
Let's compare an infused pig leather armor made out of 131 infused pig leather (160 super steel fiber and 60 pig leather) and 120 high-density padding to a tactical overcoat made out of 160 quality super steel sheet and 120 regenerative vest.

Personally I think high burst damage is a much bigger threat than prolonged fights, but I guess this depends on the build and playstyle. It's also worth noting that regen vest is susceptible to EMP- not only will it stop giving bonus HP, it will actually lower HP by 35. This is even more important now that greater coil spiders exist.

All in all the nerf isn't as bad as it seems, definitely not bad enough to make infused leather armors useless, infused pig would still be my preferred choice for a good all-around light armor. I think it was aimed mostly at 200+ infused ancient rathound leathers.

Super steel sheet sucks and I don't use it. This is my favorite vest that I can make without too much effort using only components I can comfily get from traders without the super steel roulette. It has higher DR and protects from getting instakilled by the rare sniper enemies through the nano plate, and I don't even use the overcoat slot for more resistance since I don't feel like I need it.
AeE27PD.png


The reason I'm not impressed with infused pig leather is that protecting against getting sniped is all it does, you have some large HP pool but no way to restore it on Hard with hypos healing less and having a 12 turn CD.

Why I went for Ancient Rathound leather, before the nerfs, was because I was hoping that a high quality infusion would give me enough resistance throughout long fights in lategame/DC so I wouldn't need any regeneration, but it didn't do that at all, and in fights I very quickly needed to use my health hypos putting them on a 12 turn cooldown, leaving me without any other way to heal during the rest of the fight and still taking heavy damage from average enemies, eventually leading to death if I wasn't at the top of my game. It was pretty poor as a reward after going through 3-4 steel fibers and using the best ancient rathound leather that dropped in the whole run.

As for the EMP enemies, I've had a run in with the fellows and it didn't end well for them, their emp burst is nice but nothing you can't handle with your basic alpha strike. (napalm bomb was used to ignite and scare only one of the greater coil spider, i killed the other two instantly)
nNXU9Dc.jpg



Anyway, even if you can somehow find a use case where the armors look and feel roughly the same, my point still stands because given the randomized roulette of super steel and the high costs involved it's just not worth the headache when you know that you always have a regenerative nanocomposite overcoat waiting for you.

or hopper for movement speed(invaluable if sneaking)
or rathound for that sweet crit chance.

list goes on...

I don't play high evasion so those armors are no good, and the game now also limits you from shuffling in and out of light stealth gear whenever you feel like.
 

Lhynn

Arcane
Joined
Aug 28, 2013
Messages
9,824
Yep, feels like all these changes are expressely aimed at dodge/evasion builds which are already incredibly vulnerable to everything, especially psionics. Its just inane, more and more RNG dependant with each patch can get kinda stale after a whole year of it.
 

Ent

Savant
Joined
Nov 20, 2015
Messages
539
Does knee cap shot work with energy weapons? I'm in a toss up between that and point shot right now. I already have opportunist because I want to get execute but I know certain ranged abilities are disallowed from energy weapons.
 

Parabalus

Arcane
Joined
Mar 23, 2015
Messages
17,432
I don't think I'm going to bother infusing leather for armor anymore, just for tabi boots.
It wasn't nerfed that hard.


Infused leather was already a highly debatable competitor to regenerative overcoats, even before the nerf.
Let's compare an infused pig leather armor made out of 131 infused pig leather (160 super steel fiber and 60 pig leather) and 120 high-density padding to a tactical overcoat made out of 160 quality super steel sheet and 120 regenerative vest.

Personally I think high burst damage is a much bigger threat than prolonged fights, but I guess this depends on the build and playstyle. It's also worth noting that regen vest is susceptible to EMP- not only will it stop giving bonus HP, it will actually lower HP by 35. This is even more important now that greater coil spiders exist.

All in all the nerf isn't as bad as it seems, definitely not bad enough to make infused leather armors useless, infused pig would still be my preferred choice for a good all-around light armor. I think it was aimed mostly at 200+ infused ancient rathound leathers.

Super steel sheet sucks and I don't use it. This is my favorite vest that I can make without too much effort using only components I can comfily get from traders without the super steel roulette. It has higher DR and protects from getting instakilled by the rare sniper enemies through the nano plate, and I don't even use the overcoat slot for more resistance since I don't feel like I need it.
AeE27PD.png


The reason I'm not impressed with infused pig leather is that protecting against getting sniped is all it does, you have some large HP pool but no way to restore it on Hard with hypos healing less and having a 12 turn CD.

Why I went for Ancient Rathound leather, before the nerfs, was because I was hoping that a high quality infusion would give me enough resistance throughout long fights in lategame/DC so I wouldn't need any regeneration, but it didn't do that at all, and in fights I very quickly needed to use my health hypos putting them on a 12 turn cooldown, leaving me without any other way to heal during the rest of the fight and still taking heavy damage from average enemies, eventually leading to death if I wasn't at the top of my game. It was pretty poor as a reward after going through 3-4 steel fibers and using the best ancient rathound leather that dropped in the whole run.

As for the EMP enemies, I've had a run in with the fellows and it didn't end well for them, their emp burst is nice but nothing you can't handle with your basic alpha strike. (napalm bomb was used to ignite and scare only one of the greater coil spider, i killed the other two instantly)
nNXU9Dc.jpg



Anyway, even if you can somehow find a use case where the armors look and feel roughly the same, my point still stands because given the randomized roulette of super steel and the high costs involved it's just not worth the headache when you know that you always have a regenerative nanocomposite overcoat waiting for you.

or hopper for movement speed(invaluable if sneaking)
or rathound for that sweet crit chance.

list goes on...

I don't play high evasion so those armors are no good, and the game now also limits you from shuffling in and out of light stealth gear whenever you feel like.

I like the nerf because it makes infused leathers other than ancient rathound viable. Before, on light melee, I'd have liked to take normal rathound, but it was Q140ish vs Q190ish ancient rathound, which blew it out of the water, even though I wanted the crit instead of dr/dt.
For creating fist weapons it's also a straight nerf, but that's good since the Q difference between knives and fists made the latter a no brainer, might warrant a buff to the formernow, since they share feats/stats.

I was under the impression that hopper/rathound king armor MS boost didn't stack with boot springs/tabi, that only the higher applied, do they stack additively?
 

epeli

Arcane
Joined
Aug 17, 2014
Messages
719
I was under the impression that hopper/rathound king armor MS boost didn't stack with boot springs/tabi, that only the higher applied, do they stack additively?

Can confirm, speed modifiers stack. Most likely additively, but there's some weirdness in real-time speed buff stacking. I don't think they are covered anywhere in much detail, but here are some numbers:

Sprint: +45%
Adrenaline Shot: +45%
Jumping Bean: +40%
Fatigue: -20%
Stealth: -45%
Stealth with Interloper: -30%
Lightly encumbered: -50%
Heavily encumbered: -70%
Chill: -12(?)% per stack
And of course whatever comes from armor.
Agility, MP/AP, Armor Penalty, etc have no effect on speed.
-90% seems to be the cap. Don't know if there's upper limit.
Stealth appears to stack multiplicatively unlike all others.
 

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