In Progress Decline 20: Dominions 5: Defenders of the Faith

[Chef_Hathaway]

In other news, the most fabulous Greek empire continues to spread ass cheeks the light of civilization to dindus.

 

[Agesilaus]

Well, not THAT bad

What happened, if it's not too much of a spoiler?

Let's just say a couple guarded commanders were still sniped by flyers behind the front and pretty well(it's Mictlan!) blessed Jags routed into a massacre while killing almost nothing. Beware the new flyer targeting, the old positioning tactics do not seem to help.

Yep, I can confirm that. Flyers (and cavalry, to a lesser extent) are much better when scripted to attack rear. Wasn't there a morale check involved in that? Because now even unsupported low morale flyers consistently mess up mage scripting, so much that I had to develop some unconventional formations to counter it. This is worsened by the new limitations to the guard commander script btw.

Of course, everybody assigns bodyguards to their commanders, right? I mean, imagine forgetting to do that!

Such a disaster has never happened in the Kingdom of TianQi.

 

[Matalarata]

Of course, everybody assigns bodyguards to their commanders, right?

Well, no actually, not atm at least. In the early game you lack sufficient resources and units to do that. To be clearer, there are two reasons to use the guard commander script. One is during battles, to deploy in certain formations and to keep your army near your generals and mages, otherwise they'll start advancing towards the enemy.
The other reason is to defend against assassination, up to 5 guards can be assigned and they have a chance to show up during the assassination battle. There are also artifacts and units with the bodyguard perk which influences the % of them being actually present and the number of guards showing up during assassinations.

Up untill Dom4, you had no limit on how many units could be in a company set to guard commander. The only limitation being that, in case of an actual assassination, only up to 5 guards would be present even if you had assigned 99+.
This also meant that during battles you could have huge ass companies defending your officers. In Dom5 you can have a maximum of 5 units with guard commander per officer, everyone else must, in one way or another, advance towards the enemy. This is what makes flyers and cavalry more dangerous (well, this and them being just more responsive in general), before you could just bury your communion deep inside a square set to guard a single commander, now you must be creative with formation to ensure your ass is covered.

Once the initial expansion is over and you know who your enemies are you should start assigning real bodyguards, this is obviously influenced by the amount of resources you have at hand and your particular enemies, some have better access to assassins or assassination rituals than others. If your civ has specialized bodyguards units like this Emerald Guard use them, notice the bodyguard trait!

 

[Dayyālu]

Hi Abysia, Hi Man, I'll stay the fuck out of your lands.

Pliz don't bully.

Yeap, Cav is quite more .... efficient this time around. I lost a single expansion battle thanks to mercs (failed a morale check, cause morale failure cascade) but little loss as I regained the province with 10 velites next turn.

The true problem is that archers are now kinda useless. Troops literally dance through the arrows.

 

[Chef_Hathaway]

Javelins though, those two volleys are great, because then they just advance and fight.

Up untill Dom4, you had no limit to how many units could be in a company set to guard commander. The only limitation being that, in case of an actual assassination, only up to 5 guards would be present even if you had assigned 99+.
This also meant that during battles you could have huge ass companies defending your officers. In Dom5 you can have a maximum of 5 units with guard commander per officer, everyone else must, in one way or another, advance towards the enemy. This is what makes flyers and cavalry more dangerous (well, this and them being just more responsive in general), before you could just bury your communion deep inside a square set to guard a single commander, now you must be creative with formation to ensure your ass is covered.

Once the initial expansion is over and you know who your enemies are you should start assigning real bodyguards, this is obviously influenced by the amount of resources you have at hand and your particular enemies, some have better access to assassins or assassination rituals than others. If your civ has specialized bodyguards units like this Emerald Guard use them, notice the bodyguard trait!

I'm really happy about this change because of the fact people used to do this. Fucking blob of 500 men around a commune.

 

[Matalarata]

All things considered I agree, I like the change. I fear they open the way to numerous exploits though. For example, take an Harbinger, have it cast the usual mistform - air shield - mirror image, then hold and attack rear. By then even your back line will have left your mages.

This vs 10-15 bodyguards?

Spoiler

Don't mind the badly mashed equipment. You can do better or even go minimal equip and use them as light thugs to support armies, a single harbinger is only 25 astral pearls, you can realistically field multiple by mid game

That's why those huge boxes of soldiers were needed, Illwinter removed the quick and dirty solution to flyers but they didn't give us tools to fight them, except for spells obviously!

 

[sqeecoo]

I wouldn't trust that Man guy, my spy stopped by to say hello and they were all "we have revealed your attempt to infiltrate". Seems a bit twitchy.

 

[KoolNoodles]

Just gonna have to use counter thugs(attack large/flyer when necessary) more, dozens of squad deployments, more defensive buff spell casts on your mages, defensive skelly spam type dudes in the BACK line, etc.

Tactics will change, for sure.

 

[Joined on the 4th of July]

I wouldn't trust that Man guy, my spy stopped by to say hello and they were all "we have revealed your attempt to infiltrate". Seems a bit twitchy.

I thought it was a Machakan spy, but it was you!

Enjoy your stay!

 

[Infinitum]

Meanwhile, near Uruk...*

Spoiler

*Artist's impression

 

[Dayyālu]

Many many tactics, particularly mage tactics, will be thrown out of the window. Particularly the first turn advantage, that used to be literally essntial, is now far less important.

Again, it's a trend since Dom3 to give troops and light thugs more focus and to lessen mage spam: the RT combat helps in that regard, and I think even mage phalanxes will be hit hard by both the RT mode and the iffy targeting AI.

It's an age of buffs and placements, I guess. And stacking Fear effects, of course.

Meanwhile, near Uruk...*

You know, many moons ago, that was the only scene I ever saw an audience cheer to. It was eerie. Cheering to a movie?

 

[sqeecoo]

Should we look for subs for Bandar Log? I don't think Berekän will be back...

 

[Dayyālu]

raw will provide.

Or if he stales for the third time Muty gets bandar log, because Revolutionary justice is hard but fair.

And no one will miss Starspawns being AI.

 

[Joined on the 4th of July]

That nation list on game's llama page really is something. sqeecoo misreads it for the second time and now Dayyalu can't read it either.

Or is everyone just drunk?

Spoiler

three stales is nothing

 

[sqeecoo]

I'm joking, I know Berekän plays Man.

 

[mondblut]

Guard commanders? Why would you have commanders who can't singlehandedly cut up an army on their own?

Stronky indypyndy wymmynxyn of Ys disapprove.

 

[mondblut]

(srsly, I started a 1500 province One Age disciple game with Ys/Helheim/TNN/Bandar team with minor WE bless, and Ys knights outperform everyone else BY FAR. they are not glamour ponies, they are glamour fucking mastodons)

 

[Matalarata]

coldcrow check your inbox mate, there's been a little Diplomatic faux pas on my part.

Agesilaus I hope you understood I had mistaken you for another player and trolled me voluntarily. If so



For those interested, I'm an idiot and I mistook Shinuyama's banner for T'ien C'hi. Feel free to rate!

 

[Agesilaus]

coldcrow check your inbox mate, there's been a little Diplomatic faux pas on my part.

Agesilaus I hope you understood I had mistaken you for another player and trolled me voluntarily. If so



For those interested, I'm an idiot and I mistook Shinuyama's banner for T'ien C'hi. Feel free to rate!

Huh, actually I assumed you were sending it to me on purpose, given that we do actually share a border. But perhaps you have not spotted me yet...

 

[Matalarata]

Yes but... I've given you province numbers and all that ! Anyway, I just saw your dominion, probably going to spot you in the next 1-2 turns.

...Ffs I'm surrounded by azns in game ad irl

 

[sqeecoo]

The azns are good i.e. weak neighbors. I'm near Uruk and Man, so just like France and Britain for the German Ulm, very fitting.

By the way, I've heard that communions have been severely nerfed? Can anyone confirm? We don't want Matalarata to kill all his communicants in the first battle!

 

[Matalarata]

If I understand it correctly, damage to health from fatigue is doubled. It doesn't actually change much for Pythium, maybe one less spell or two before being killed but a well made communion never gets that far...
8 slaves means +3 on all paths wich reduces the fatigue cost of any spell you want to spam to manageable levels, even chain casting thunder strike I never ever got any affliction during tests and that's just using theurg comunicants wich can't be equipped, using acolytes should be even less risky.

It's easier to burn them early game, when you usually go for a 2+2 communion (because that's all you have at hand) but if you keep the number of masters about one half of the slaves everything is fine. I went as high as 20 masters and 32 slaves during tests!
On a side note last time I played Pythium comunicants were patched in after the game had started, so I never tried and develop strategies around them, they are neat! An acolyte equipped with a flying carpet can carry exactly 7 communicants. Basically a long range deployable nuclear reactor in an Aladdin package



edit: I just reached evo 2 and have 4 comunicants so, depending on coldcrow 's answer to my PM, we could have field results soon

 

[Dayyālu]

raw has staled again.

Muty , do you want Bandar Log?

 

[Muty]

Or if he stales for the third time Muty gets bandar log, because Revolutionary justice is hard but fair.

 

[Matalarata]

Coldcrow was last seen: thursday.

This means he won't answer my PM and we're officially at war, right?



Does someone have him as a friend on Steam?