Game News Dead State, DoubleBear's Zombie RPG, To Go Kickstarter

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I hate to say it but I'm already getting "Kickstarter Fatigue!" I love the concept behind the Zombie Survival thing and like both Brian M. and Annie but.... now may NOT be the best time. I'm not even sure I'm going to pledge anything to the Banner Saga thing.

I'd be more excited about this if they weren't moving at glacial speed. I appreciate it takes time to make games in your spare time but I'd rather fund a project where it's their primary source of income/job.

Now is definitely not the right time.

Well, aren't they considering Kickstarter precisely because it would enable them to work on this full time?

F7U12 another one on the Watch http://www.indiegogo.com/Malevolence

great timing guys... It's heavan... group them all in the same freaking 3 months period after years of underground development...

I thought about that but read:

Doesn't make it sound like we should expect an uptick in production time.

Banner Saga is at $40k now after twelve hours or so... what are people bitching about?

You could had used 4sec to check the info instead of giving misleading information.

The extreme lack of updates has soured me on this particular videogame product. Why if they let it drag on that long in the first place without going Kickstarter? It pretty much says they thought of it as a profitable hobby instead of something they're invested in. Now it just looks like they're making a last ditch piggyback effort.

In any case I'll need a pretty sweet monoclean gameplay video beyond chained together action footage of zombies being killed to think positively of this again.

yes gameplay video, and character inventory , skill sheet at least .I wouldnt be too surprised if the game has not evolved from a few 3D models and a design doc.

I also think more developers should allow advance preorder/funders to have access to the alpha/developer build/whatever. Look at what Wolfire did with Overgrowth. It arguably isn't even in alpha, it's really just a sandbox now where you can spawn enemies and attack them and such but it's still something tangible someone can play around with. I don't care if it's unpolished or buggy or incomplete... if I'm going to front you money over a year in advance it's nice to get something immediately.

And this is one of the bigger problems. While the lack of a publisher allows for creative freedom it also removes a powerful driving force pushing for the game's completion. Granted you still have the developer's integrity at stake of delivering a quality product in a reasonable time frame but... what's reasonable? And once they have your money... what can you do? Let's say they get $100k and never end up finishing. Not like they're totally screwed professionally speaking. Annie still works for GW2 if I recall correctly. Brian does... whatever Brian does... etc. They still have credentials so it's not like they'd be on the street.

Rule of the thumb: if you aren't an established developer (Double Fine, Brian Fargo) with at least some basic stuff in place to pull a project off or if you don't have anything concrete to show for it (Alpha, Beta, videos, whatever), you just better stay the fuck away from this kind of stuff. At the moment, they have nothing to generate publicity with. I want DS but it's pretty much vapourware atm.

What's worse (I think), even if they raised the money they were aiming at, I wouldn't trust them to be able to manage their finances with any degree of sensibility. The development would lag behind and they would run out of money prematurely. They certainly need to take a cue from the likes of FTL, NEO Scavenger, that 2D isometric Zombie game, Overgrowth and whatnot. Produce something basic and working first, expand on it later instead of starting huge. And apart from their professional experience, they have little to nothing to set them apart from a gazillion delusional indie projects who put together a few photoshopped pictures, a few renders and go daydreaming about jewgolds flowing in.

It's kind of pathetic; Kickstarter and Indiegogo is like a graveyard. Plenty of similar projects with not a single donation, not to mention absolutely zero pitch. They must be thinking people with a lot of money and time browse these domains to find something to throw money at and why, of course, the genius of their project would certainly compel anyone passing by.

Sorry guys but wouldn't all of the logic you are using against Brian Bitsoda work on Banner Saga? Someone announces a cel shaded turn based game based on console jrpg games and you cum all over yourselves. Then a *real* developer who was a lead writer/designer on Torn ffs asks to get his project funded and you start becoming skeptical all of a sudden. Not only did he work at BIS as a lead writer for Torn, he also worked at Troika on Vtm Bloodlines and at Obsidian on NWN2 expansions (MOTB anyone?) and Alpha Brotocol. The guy has a SERIOUS history of work unlike those banner jokers. Both he and Annie are also known to our community. Annie did design and writing for SoZ, Alpha Brotocol, and MOTB ffs. And you guys are all, "I don't know. It might be vaporware. What have they done for us lately.". True enough, but apply that same logic to your cel shaded console jrpg inspired masterpiece which you guys are just throwing your money at. Now I see why everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon ASAP. Brian and Annie have no choice to put their hat in the ring with those 3 unknowns who may or may not have worked for Biowhore, a company which of course is a darling of the codex all of a sudden. How many of you had heard of those 3 guys before yesterday? And who hasn't heard of Brian and Annie?

^^ this

You're talking like the Codex is just one homogenous blob. I don't know if the overlap between people jizzing over Banner Saga and bitching over Dead State is very big. I, for one, have been deriding both of them for jumping on the trend of begging for golds.

I think both kickstarter projects are terrible, but for different reasons.

out of curiosity what did brian and annie add to motb? they worked in the new jersey team and switched to ap later. my impression was that they gave some feedback, as everybody does when you bring teams together, without being really involved.

I think Banner Saga could be a solid title. Nothing as deep as Wasteland 2 (potentially) but a refreshing alternative to the crap out there. Difference between it and Dead State is that Banner Saga looks to be launching in a few months with the Kickstarter just speeding things along whereas Dead State is... who knows where... in the development process.

Bro, no doubt that many codexers will donate, is just that we want *something* to look at besides old screenshots from a game that's been in development for what, 3 years now? Say what you will, I have no idea since when Banner Saga is being developed, if they have anything besides those 2 scenes they showed on the video, but they did a great impression, a great interview and had some great art and PR going on.

If Dead State makes a huge PR move, give out some interviews and show some new content and videos, they might surpass Banner Saga donations, it just that ATM Banner Saga looks better presented, AND is still the third Kickstarter to grab Codex attention (that's already getting burned out)...who knows how many more will be until Dead State start their own? Is better to see how this whole kickstarter fever will play out in the follwing weeks, and meanwhile make a great material for backers to see, perhaps even a demo or gameplay video.

especially since the way it looks like, if DS fails their kickstarter, the project will likely die forever, so it's better to be carefull.

Maybe they didn't work on MotB. I just read that they worked on 'several NWN2 expansions' for Obsidian. Who knows what that means. Maybe they just worked as writer/designers on SoZ and the other stuff I mentioned. No doubt at least Annie will be over here at some point to clarify their experience. Unlike the Bannar Saga guys they have nothing to hide. Even without MoTB it's still a serious fucking track record that anyone could be proud of. Unlike working on some lame MMORPG at the modern biowhore as a concept artist, environmental artist, and some kind of scripter or maybe programmer. None of them were lead anything according to mobygames. So totally different.

I think Dead State is a pretty cool project from two cool people who are well known to our community and we should sure as fuck support them. Well, unless you just hate zombie games or something. But Brian and Annie are on our side for real and for sure and they deserve our support.

There are going to be a lot of these kickstarter projects now and I bet there will be also no shortage of dishonest take-the-money-and-run guys. It's just human nature. Only a matter of time. Why rob a bank or a liquor store when you can just put up some bogus project on kickstarter and walk away with half a million dollars.

If you guys want to donate to every single one that sounds cool, well a fool and his money are soon parted. True enough that $15 is a few starbucks coffees, but I still think there are a lot of gullible people who are going to get burned with this shit. It's one thing for someone who is famous and has a real record of doing what they claim they want to do. That is the case with Brian and Annie, but not with those 3 relatively minor bioworkers.

Yeah that's why they have had zero progress.

Look at it from the other direciton: Was it Urquhart, MCA or Sawyer who admitted that even after several game projects to their belt, their biggest issue with development cycles is still management and efficiency? And you would sooner trust two individual off-shoots of Obsidian who never had any managerial experience to do all of that better* than Obsidian now?

I don't think so.

(*: and they have to do better; you can't have an error margin as individuals with limited budget)

As for Banner Saga, I already think it's most likely to be Bioware Jr. with shitty derptastic romances and whatnot with a simplified TB combat for console kids. Name-dropping TB combat, KoDP, FFT are all dandy but name-dropping is the most common way of bullshitting in the industry and is sort of a delusional wishful thinking. Nonetheless, they have a working prototype of sorts, they have their animations rolling (and why do you keep saying cell-shaded when the game doesn't even have any 3D to it?) and an exquisite Disney style art direction to boot. That's good enough for me to make a humble contribution. If and when they explain how game actually works instead of name-dropping and it turns out to be impressive, I might chip in more.

Yeah, that too. Apart from the demoralising impact on Mitsodas, I don't think anyone would take a second look again if they were uninterested the first time.