KickStarter The Banner Saga 3

[Archibald]

Lol, its playable Dredge.

 

[Infinitron]

Update: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stoic/banner-saga-3/posts/1795282

Fully Funded! And 1st Stretch Goal!
Posted by Zeb L. West

DUNDR’S BEARD! Thanks to you, we reached our funding goal for the development of Banner Saga 3 in less than a week! This game really is the type of project that simply could not get made without the backing of the best community a small team could ever ask for. Your support, and your help spreading the word, have put us well on our way to finishing this epic Saga.

This is just the beginning, though! This is when the fun starts and from here on out it’s cherries on top for everyone! We have lots of great stuff planned that we simply didn’t think we’d get a chance to put in the game. Let’s do it together, shall we?

You’ve been calling out for this a long time, and it hasn’t fallen on deaf ears; We are pleased to announce our very first Stretch Goal: Playable dredge!

Take command of dredge heroes, order them in battle, and train them up through their ranks. Unlock new abilities and discover new strategies when you place these dredge heroes on the battlefield alongside your human, varl, and horseborn allies.

We would love to bring these 3 dredge heroes to life with new stories, abilities, full portraits, and combat animations. Help us reach our Stretch Goal of $250k and make the long awaited Playable dredge a reality!

Stay tuned for a forthcoming update to learn more about the lore and history of the dredge!

And in the meantime, don't forget to:

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[Lurker King]

I wonder if they considered just making an animated series instead ...

Fixed.

 

[Lurker King]

I liked the first game. The combat is fun, the art is great, there is some flavor C&C here and there. I think that what is holding the game down is the rigid narrative structure. You can't make your own character or select a class. They are all handed to you. That sucks. I won't pay more just to have more story if I want more flexibility on the combat system.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stoic/banner-saga-3/posts/1797138

Who Are The Dredge?






"The dredge came from the icy steppes that we now call Valkajokull, and our kingdoms were the first on the butcher’s block." -- Ulfvalgr -- The Gift of Hadrborg

The story of dredge, as told by the skald Gansi:

Deep in the shadows of the Age of Myth, the Loom-Mother discovered how to weave life into her tapestry, the fabric of the universe. She created the beasts of land and sea, and wove the elements of reason into her creations of humans. All of these threads - some short, some long - had a beginning and an end.

Other gods attempted to mimic her, but lacked the skill or patience necessary to master the art. Some gods twisted beasts into new shapes and monsters. Others wove her creations together, making cross-breeds of human and animal, and so were created the varl and the horseborn. One spiteful god took the humans and twisted them wretchedly, hid them away in the depths of the earth, and they became the dredge.

With unending threads of life, the dredge numbers grew along with their need for more space and more food. Their god prodded the dredge into waging war against the other creations. The dredge became hated and feared among the mortals. Some believed them to be the dead returned to the world to punish the living. The dredge, it turned out, could be killed, but only through bloody battle.

Disgusted, the Loom-Mother punished the errant god, but in her anger accidentally killed him. Panic spread among the gods, and thus began the war among the gods which left every god unmade.

The mighty varl pushed away the legions of dredge, driving them farther and farther into the northern territories. As the tide turned, the varl began venturing into the deep north and slaughtering dredge settlements for sport. Eventually, the dredge retaliated with vengeance and hatred, ravaging human and varl lands in a bloody struggle that lasted nearly a decade. This conflict became known as the Second Great War. Ultimately, the Valka took up their enchanted spears and drove the dredge away to a mysterious fate.

As penance for their hubris, the varl established massive forts in the frozen north to remain vigilant against any future return of the dredge. Any re-emergence of the dredge was quickly stamped out, and over time they all but disappeared.

But, soon after the Sun mysteriously stopped in the sky, the dredge have suddenly reappeared, and are swarming the land from the mountains to the sea, threatening all in their path.

------

Spoiler

The story of the dredge is inspired by the Norse concept of draugr or haugbui: undead vikings that return to smite the living. This is what many mortals believe them to be. The more enlightened mortals, however, realize that there is much more to be learned.

The dredge have mastered the use of a volatile and explosive stone, which they fashion into weapons, and even into heavy armor which they permanently fuse onto their bodies.

Many dredge appear on the battlefield as colossal warriors, surpassing even the varl in Strength. These dredge include the Stoneguard, Scourge, Direguard, and Warden.

Acting as shock troops, Grunts rumble into battle and drive back their enemies. The stone armor of a Grunt is among the most volatile, and when struck tends to shatter and damage other nearby Grunts. The Slinger and Hurler provide ranged support with a variety of projectiles, some quite explosive. These dredge avoid mêlée confrontations and will back off quickly whenever threatened.

The dredge are often accompanied by a stealthy and terrible beast known as the Skulker. These creatures are known to hunt in packs, and are able to completely evade detection until they suddenly attack as a group. Their howling shriek haunts the dreams of many human children, not to mention adults.

The appearance of a Stonesinger upon the battlefield is a cause for great terror and alarm. These foes wield powerful magic, channeling the dark energy with their spear-like weapons which seem to function almost like tuning forks. Stonesinger strikes are known to spread a deadly disease to humans and varl, and they have exhibited the ability to explode the armor of other dredge units, sacrificing them and causing massive shrapnel damage to nearby enemies.

The most feared of the dredge are the legendary Sundr. The story of the Sundr will be told in an upcoming update, so please keep watching for that!

You can each really help us reach our full potential by sharing this Kickstarter campaign with your friends.

And don't forget to:

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Finally, we would like to invite you to support a unique project created by some of our friends from Austin. For a mysterious, playful, long-form story told entirely through text messages you get over the course of months, check out Sister of Shattering Glass: A story told via text-messages:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stoic/banner-saga-3/posts/1799003

Two More Stretch Goals Revealed!
Posted by Zeb L. West

By Lauga’s lips! We’re already more than halfway to our first stretch goal, which means Playable Dredge are nearly upon us! So many of you asked us what stretch goals are NEXT, we decided to reveal two more!

We’re excited to announce the next two stretch goals:

• $350k - The return of a character many thought lost - Ubin!
• $300k - Survival Mode for Banner Saga 3!
  

SIDE NOTE!

A big shout out to Megacon Games for sending out the Bellower expansion packs today for Banner Saga: Warbands - look how happy it made John when it came in the mail! (DualShock 4 controller for scale)

ANNOUNCEMENTS

AMA - We’re running a Reddit Ask Me Anything this coming Tuesday, February 7th during the 9-5 PST workday, where the team will be available to answer all your burning questions! The whole team will be answering, so bring all the questions! Keep an eye on the Banner Saga Twitter for official link!

SHOUT OUTS!

We wanted to shout out another great indie project that we immediately backed ourselves - Sunless Skies! This is the follow up to the excellent Sunless Sea, by Failbetter Games, a game that we spent hours enjoying for its unique narrative and atmospheric setting, sailing the dark waters of the Unterzee.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stoic/banner-saga-3/posts/1799369

Who Are The Sundr?

The most feared of the dredge are the legendary Sundr. These dredge often tower above even the greatest Stoneguard, acting as generals and leaders of the stone-clad armies. These demi-god champions of the dredge race can turn the tide of any battle. It is known that there are several such Sundr, each unique. Some of the Sundrs who have been named in legend, history, and recent events are Raze, Bellower, and Eyeless.

Spoiler

Bellower plays a central role in the Banner Saga. After laying waste to the varl capital, he appears with his army at Einartoft. The Sundr laid siege upon the ancient varl city and bridge, which ultimately resulted in the destruction of the city and the extermination of the bulk of the remains of the varl race. During the siege, Bellower engaged in a duel with Iver, who was defeated and barely survived, albeit with the permanent loss of one of his arms.

Bellower pursued the caravan to the fortified human city of Boersgard, threatening it, too, with destruction. Bellower is unique among the Sundr in that he is actually immortal, perhaps as a dark gift left by the spiteful god of dredge creation. The Valka Juno devised a way to fashion an arrow from silver found in the Godstone of Stravhs, a monument to the god that some believe provided the weapons used by the gods in their self-annihilation. This powerful weapon cannot actually kill Bellower, but it can be used in conjunction with Juno's Valka powers to defeat the Sundr and subsequently trap him in a death-like sleep.




Bellower's story continues as Juno enlists the mercenary Ravens to transport a large shipment, which, unbeknownst to the Ravens, contains the sleeping body of Bellower. Juno intends to dump Bellower's body into the deepest part of the sea, hopefully to prevent his return and eliminate his threat. Unfortunately, Bolverk, the Ravens' leader, became twisted, possessed, and entangled in Bellower's dreams by his close proximity to the sleeping Sundr.




During the Ravens' journey through the caves beyond Bindal, another brutal Sundr was encountered, the foe known as Eyeless. Considered by some as the demi-god of Stonesingers, her face is devoid of eyes and covered by a stone mask.




Her fearsome powers include the ability to resurrect fallen warriors, friend and foe alike, and send them in undeath against her enemies.





Prior to the beginning of our Saga, the only Sundr known to have met defeat was a creature named Raze. This Sundr was known for continually destroying the fortifications built by the varl during the Second Great War. A young varl hero known as Yngvar eventually slew the Sundr Raze. However, the conquest of this Sundr resulted in permanent shame, for Yngvar had hunted down Raze in a snowstorm and killed her while she was nursing her baby. Yngvar was unable to look away from the truth that he was killing living, sentient beings. He withdrew from the varl and the War, took up residence among the humans of Skogr, and changed his name to Iver. It is believed by some that Raze was the mate of the Sundr Bellower.

Although the dredge have long represented a deadly threat to the humans and varl alike, the perspective of our heroes has evolved considerably during the course of the Saga. Once considered to be mindless beasts, intent on destruction, it is now clear that the dredge have a civilization of their own, composed of families, just as humans are. The dredge slingers and hurlers have been revealed to be female, and dredge children have been found in the wreckage of the battlefields. A living dredge infant was found with its deceased mother at the godstone of Ingrid. Absent the commanding force of a nearby Sundr, many of the dredge encountered appear to be confused and frightened, refugees in their own right, more concerned with their own survival than with conquest and war. As the spreading darkness drive human, varl, horseborn, and dredge alike before it, we can only imagine what will happen next as all that remains gathers in Arberrang.

We're also pleased to have partnered with Megacon games to produce Banner Saga: Warbands! As mentioned in the last update, the awesome Bellower expansion pack has shipped recently, and as I paint mine in the coming days, I'll share some pictures of the process. Here's a detailed render of the awesome 4 1/2" tall model:

Please feel free to share these lore updates with anyone who might be interested, and encourage your colleagues to support our Kickstarter campaign!

And don't forget to:

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[Ninjerk]

surprised they made it

 

[prodigydancer]

Damn, it's so quiet in here.

I think they picked the worst possible time for this KS. PoE2 and TToN hold all the attention right now. April or May would be much better, probably.

 

[vonAchdorf]

The KS is still more successful than I expected.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I almost backed this one but realised that the price on release will be quite cheap, just like the previous games, so I decided not to in the end. It will get made regardless.

Banner Saga 2 was really good, better than the first game.

 

[Beastro]

Damn that art still looks so pretty

Never played these games but they're making me hate them for reminding me that that kinda animation is no longer done in the West in shows or movies.

 

[Lithium Flower]

My issue with the games is that the entire caravan management aspect seemed pretty pointless. It doesn't matter how much food you get or how many clansmen/warriors/Varl die on the road because it doesn't negatively affect the combat component of the game or the outcome of the narrative. The "buy supplies" button in the store solely exists to steal your money, which is better spent on other things. The same goes for the warfare component of the first game.

The issue with the above is that, once you realize it, you begin to see the vast majority of choices in the game as flavor choices. There is nothing wrong with flavor choices, but I feel like the game would have been much more honest if it was simply something along the lines of a gorgeous visual novel with decent battles and a nice story that didn't trick you into thinking that a seemingly large part of the game that barely has any substance actually matters.

To be fair, the few meaningful choices do matter quite a bit.

The fact that the second game has failed to make choices more meaningful, or at least to focus more on the non-flavor bits of the game, doesn't give me much hope for the next game IMO.

 

[Starwars]

I'm not backing this but I'm glad it's getting made. The previous two games aren't what I'd call great, and like so many has mentioned, the lack of consequences for the caravan system really sucks a lot of oomph out of the gameplay.

Still, I like them both. They feel pretty unique, I love the atmosphere of them and am kinda curious to see the conclusion of the story.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

I didn't even know they made Banner Saga 2.

 

[prodigydancer]

It doesn't matter how much food you get or how many clansmen/warriors/Varl die on the road because it doesn't negatively affect the combat component of the game

Not true. Starving the caravan decreases Morale. The size of the caravan affects the difficulty of war scenarios.

flavor choices

The word you're looking for is "role-playing". Of course, it makes no sense that a role-playing game actually has some role-playing in it.

the lack of consequences

OK, people dying and tougher fights isn't consequence enough. What would be enough? A game over screen?

 

[Parabalus]

If you do every fight by rushing in and pillaging after the combat in Banner Saga 1 is harder than Age of Decadence. The choices which would be mostly "flavour" become extremely important because low morale, injuries or low army numbers are disastrous. I dislike that there isn't an option where losing fights means game over on hard, because combat is genuinely challenging and thoughtful, but most people will miss out on it.

I hope they surpass the funding for Banner Saga 1, it's a shame that 2 failed so miserably in sales, since it was an improvement in almost every way.

 

[Lithium Flower]

It doesn't matter how much food you get or how many clansmen/warriors/Varl die on the road because it doesn't negatively affect the combat component of the game
Not true. Starving the caravan decreases Morale. The size of the caravan affects the difficulty of war scenarios.

I will confess that I do not remember the first game well, so my thoughts only apply to the second one. And thank you, I forgot that there is a negative effect on combat - probably because it is so insignificant that it is very easy to forget.

Low morale does impact battles through a measly -1/-2 malus to willpower, a resource that can be replenished during the battle. Do you think this mechanic conveys or reinforces the consequence of letting dozens of people starve to death? Or justifies the option to piss your money away on supplies at every town, whereas money is better spent purchasing items that give individual units more willpower, not to mention other statistical advantages, than good morale?

The word you're looking for is "role-playing". Of course, it makes no sense that a role-playing game actually has some role-playing in it.

Muh semantics.

Notice how I said that there is nothing wrong with flavor choices. However, when a large component of the game and an entire slew of choices are presented as having weight and consequences that should be reinforced fictionally and mechanically. The fictional reinforcement Banner Saga provides is the slowly diminishing number of your caravan population. The mechanical reinforcement is a small penalty to a replenishable stat. This is not adequate IMO.

Roleplaying is made meaningful by it consequences. "I decided to do a instead of b, therefore x happens instead of y " is infinitely more interesting than "I decided to do a instead of b and the same thing happens but I get an extra line of text". Is the room for the latter in RPGs? Of course. Is it a negative when it constitutes the vast majority of choices in the game, and worse, actively pretends otherwise? I would say so.

OK, people dying and tougher fights isn't consequence enough. What would be enough? A game over screen?

I think it is not a stretch to say that the game would have been made better by either:

1. improving the caravan management (includes morale, supplies, caravan pop, etc.) so that it is actually worth giving a damn about
2. cutting caravan management and focusing on the things that the game already does well: good art, combat, story, and more meaningful C&C

 

[prodigydancer]

1. improving the caravan management (includes morale, supplies, caravan pop, etc.) so that it is actually worth giving a damn about
2. cutting caravan management and focusing on the things that the game already does well: good art, combat, story, and more meaningful C&C

I see your point but it's largely a matter of taste. The first game wasn't about beating the end boss but rather about running from the unknown danger and saving as many people as possible. It was established very early that something very bad was happening, something you couldn't undo even by winning the war against the dredge. The war was just a background event, and starving everyone to death was arguably a failure even if you still managed to beat Bellower.

More importantly, I think it's a bit unfair to judge the Banner Saga games so harshly. For such low budget projects they had many neat features: non-generic setting, great art, great music, good writing, characters you could care about, unforeseen delayed consequences and unique combat system.

It's sad to see that people aren't interested in TBS3 at all.

 

[Infinitron]

It's sad to see that people aren't interested in TBS3 at all.

Well, they're interested enough to successfully fund its Kickstarter. Or are you talking about Codexers

 

[prodigydancer]

Or are you talking about Codexers

Yes, mostly. Although less than 5k backers on KS isn't an encouraging figure either.

 

[duanth123]

Or are you talking about Codexers

Yes, mostly. Although less than 5k backers on KS isn't an encouraging figure either.

Patrticularly if you accept the conventional wisdom that most Kickstarter games cannot realistically be made with the minimum funding amount. And I don't see this studio, impliedly on the verge of closure, as being somehow exempt.

 

[anvi]

They should remove the entire libraries of text these games have and just let me fight shit tactically.

 

[Siobhan]

They should remove the entire libraries of text these games have and just let me fight shit tactically.

That actually goes for every game ever: if fighting games have a story-mode, why can't other games have a no-story mode where you just get teleported from fight to fight or dungeon to dungeon, with level-ups and new gear in between. Guardian Legend on the freaking NES managed to do this (password TGL), so it's not exactly hard to do. Must be the same reason why modern games have no replayability --- we spent tons of money to produce the content, so you're gonna consume it whether you like it or not.

 

[Gangrelrumbler]

They should remove the entire libraries of text these games have and just let me fight shit tactically.

That actually goes for every game ever: if fighting games have a story-mode, why can't other games have a no-story mode where you just get teleported from fight to fight or dungeon to dungeon, with level-ups and new gear in between.

Because I don't think anyone ever wanted that before you mentioned it. Most combatfags are happy with post-game super hard extra dungeons. Fighting games gained story modes because people were actually interested in characters and that shit sells. Meanwhile combat-only RPGs are almost extinct nowadays. Same goes for most combat-only games that are not niche or multiplayer-oriented.

 

[Siobhan]

Well, see the post above mine. But yes, I am perfectly ware that the current market dynamics would not reward what I propose. Feel free to imagine a rage smiley behind my post to indicate that this is me expressing exasperation with the world. It's the same kind of exasperation I feel when I go to the bathroom and see that a certain somebody left the toilet seat up again.