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Fallout Autumn Leaves mod for Fallout: New Vegas

IHaveHugeNick

Arcane
Joined
Apr 5, 2015
Messages
1,870,124
If he used Bethesda's engine he's probably F'ed when it comes to ways to sue. I would imagine that in the LUA there is some fine print that says "anything you create with our tools and using our game are subject to our ownership if need be".
Of course it does. Everything you make in Construction Set is a property of Bethesda. It's the same everywhere - everything you make in mod toolset (forgot the name) for NWN is Bioware's and so on. Otherwise you could make money selling your mods.

The mod is effectively Bethesda's, but the content isn't. The creator can't sell the mod, but he still holds the rights to the content, and Beth can't just reuse it as they please.
 

Mustawd

Guest
Beth can't just reuse it as they please.

Says who?

Guy created a mod with their tools and in their universe (which they own). Why can't they just take his mod? He never owned it in the first place? I mean it's totally douchey. But there's no real legal recourse here.
 
Self-Ejected

Lilura

RPG Codex Dragon Lady
Joined
Feb 13, 2013
Messages
5,274
Of course it does. Everything you make in Construction Set is a property of Bethesda. It's the same everywhere - everything you make in mod toolset (forgot the name) for NWN is Bioware's and so on. Otherwise you could make money selling your mods.

This is tru, yeah. From NWN End User License Agreement:

5. Infogrames' and BioWare's Use of Variations. If you Distribute, or permit others to Distribute, your Variations, you hereby grant back to Infogrames and BioWare an irrevocable royalty-free right to use and distribute such Variations by any means, and to make such modifications thereto as Infogrames and/or BioWare deem are necessary to package, combine, and otherwise distribute such Variations. If you do not wish to grant these rights to Infogrames and BioWare, you must not Distribute your Variations (although you may Serve your Modules). Infogrames and BioWare will make a reasonable effort to provide credit to you in the event it uses or distributes your Variations, but you acknowledge that identifying you and/or other Variation creators may be difficult, and any failure by Infogrames and/or BioWare to provide credit to any person shall not be a breach of this License and shall not limit Infogrames' or BioWare's rights to use and distribute any Variation.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
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Messages
24,924
" I would imagine that in the LUA there is some fine print that says "anything you create with our tools and using our game are subject to our ownership if need be"."

The LUA would not neccesarily hold up in court espicialyl in regards to 'fine print' and fair use. Definitely plagerism could be key here since palgerism is passing someone else's ideas off as your own. That said, it would likely take someone with money, resources, and stone willo to actually take Bethesda to court and go all the way to end to even get a verdict.

Either way, law aside, this is a very evil Nazi scumbag piece of crap thing to do if true.
 

DosBuster

Arcane
Patron
The Real Fanboy
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Messages
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Location
God's Dumpster
Codex USB, 2014
Bethesda own a license to all mods created that they may use how they see fit.

If anyone here bothered to read the post you'd notice that they didn't just grab the esp file and throw it into fallout 4, conceptually, the two quests are very similar.

However, these two quest are also murder-mystery whodunnit quests, borrowing from a wide variety of tropes present within the genre, the characters & story are just the usual genre archetypes, so it's entirely possible two different people got the same idea from the same source.
All these characters the mod author points out are archetypes common throughout murder mystery stories, so again, this is more and more just looking like a case of two authors applying the same transformation.

Even if some inspiration were to be taken from this mod, the author seems to be totally fine with it:

Now, now, truth be said, I honestly thought Bethesda’s staff played Autumn Leaves, had a blast with it (I hope) took some things out of it and made their own thing for Far Harbor. And I seriously think this is perfectly okay. After all, Autumn Leaves’ inspirations are countless (Asimov’s, Cluedo, Planescape : Torment, Arcanum, older Fallouts, etc.) and being influenced is a natural part of the writing process.

TL;DR: It's a fucking generic murder mystery quest.
 

Severian Silk

Guest
" I would imagine that in the LUA there is some fine print that says "anything you create with our tools and using our game are subject to our ownership if need be"."

The LUA would not neccesarily hold up in court espicialyl in regards to 'fine print' and fair use. Definitely plagerism could be key here since palgerism is passing someone else's ideas off as your own. That said, it would likely take someone with money, resources, and stone willo to actually take Bethesda to court and go all the way to end to even get a verdict.

Either way, law aside, this is a very evil Nazi scumbag piece of crap thing to do if true.
lua.gif
 

Black

Arcane
Joined
May 8, 2007
Messages
1,872,592
Holy shit.
:updatedmytxt:
Can those fuckers sink any lower?

Edit (not really): talking about bethesda, not modders.
 

Chateaubryan

Cipher
Joined
Nov 28, 2008
Messages
369
All these characters the mod author points out are archetypes common throughout murder mystery stories, so again, this is more and more just looking like a case of two authors applying the same transformation.
TL;DR: It's a fucking generic murder mystery quest.

Though I agree on the reasoning, the common inspirations and all that, the archetypes in Autumn Leaves are subverted compared to the genre. For instance, the closest thing to what would be the Noir's "Femme Fatale" in Autumn Leaves is Helena, which is typically the opposite of what a "Femme Fatale" typically is.
Which leads to my question : did you play Autumn Leaves at all? :'D

Modders own copyright to the plot of any mods they create, even if they use bethesda tools, so i believe this is a valid case of plagiarism. It's going to take a court case to settle things though, which is why I'd like the modder to sue.
Rather the modder get hired by bethsoft, then we wont have 1, but 2 guys that know what the hell they are doing there.

I'd rather spend all my life writing for RPGs than going for a one-shot slam-dunk trial to get monies and recognition.
 

Durandal

Arcane
Joined
May 13, 2015
Messages
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Location
New Eden
My team has the sexiest and deadliest waifus you can recruit.
Maybe if I make a mod for Fallout 4 which has Pulitzer-worthy dialogue and story, meaningful choice & consequences, breathtaking graphics, an entirely new setting to explore possibilities of a post-post-apocalyptic society, challenging level/world design and enemies, large build variety which allows for a lot of roleplaying possibilities and replay value, extensive character model customization, gunplay which allows for a lot of variation in encounter design and character building, a world which allows for a lot of exploration, multiple ways to approach one situation, lots of varying sex scenes, well-written and interesting companions, multiple endings which change based on my actions, and the ability to interact with everything, then perhaps Betheftda will steal all of that and use it to turn Fallout 5 into GOTYAY.
 
Joined
Jul 27, 2013
Messages
1,567
TL;DR: It's a fucking generic murder mystery quest.
It's a murder mystery involving a group of sentient machines that have murdered the human founder of their underground vault, it's a bit more than coincidental similarity. The only real difference is that Autumn leaves is great and this looks like shit.
 

DosBuster

Arcane
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Messages
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God's Dumpster
Codex USB, 2014
All these characters the mod author points out are archetypes common throughout murder mystery stories, so again, this is more and more just looking like a case of two authors applying the same transformation.
TL;DR: It's a fucking generic murder mystery quest.

Though I agree on the reasoning, the common inspirations and all that, the archetypes in Autumn Leaves are subverted compared to the genre. For instance, the closest thing to what would be the Noir's "Femme Fatale" in Autumn Leaves is Helena, which is typically the opposite of what a "Femme Fatale" typically is.
Which leads to my question : did you play Autumn Leaves at all? :'D

Hey!

No, I sadly have not played your mod, it does look good though. I wasn't saying your characters were overtly generic or bad in any way, rather I was simply suggesting the possibility that both parties could have simply gotten a similar idea from the same source material.

Also, I wasn't calling your mod a generic murder mystery quest, that was directed towards Bethesda.

It's a murder mystery involving a group of sentient machines that have murdered the human founder of their underground vault, it's a bit more than coincidental similarity. The only real difference is that Autumn leaves is great and this looks like shit.

While I can't speak in terms of Autumn leaves, the quest in fallout is more a bunch of humans immortalized into robots one of which kills the owner of the hotel the vault is located under.
 

Black

Arcane
Joined
May 8, 2007
Messages
1,872,592
Obviously legally it's ok, it's USA, peasants have no power over corporations.
 

Doktor Best

Arcane
Joined
Feb 2, 2015
Messages
2,849
Bethesda own a license to all mods created that they may use how they see fit.

If anyone here bothered to read the post you'd notice that they didn't just grab the esp file and throw it into fallout 4, conceptually, the two quests are very similar.

However, these two quest are also murder-mystery whodunnit quests, borrowing from a wide variety of tropes present within the genre, the characters & story are just the usual genre archetypes, so it's entirely possible two different people got the same idea from the same source.
All these characters the mod author points out are archetypes common throughout murder mystery stories, so again, this is more and more just looking like a case of two authors applying the same transformation.

Even if some inspiration were to be taken from this mod, the author seems to be totally fine with it:

Now, now, truth be said, I honestly thought Bethesda’s staff played Autumn Leaves, had a blast with it (I hope) took some things out of it and made their own thing for Far Harbor. And I seriously think this is perfectly okay. After all, Autumn Leaves’ inspirations are countless (Asimov’s, Cluedo, Planescape : Torment, Arcanum, older Fallouts, etc.) and being influenced is a natural part of the writing process.

TL;DR: It's a fucking generic murder mystery quest.


Short story: I had a study colleague once who was a bit on the autist side. He was a really strange fellow and pretty isolated, but i thought he was okay to talk to and he knew his shit about the subject, so i was always friendly towards him. He also was quite entertaining because he flirted with every single female colleague and his flirting skills were like 0,0000000, as was his success rate. Anyways, i needed a script for an exam and he was known for making the best. I asked him if i could copy it and he said yes he will bring it to the university. The next day he "forgot to bring it" though, but he said he lived only a few blocks from the university so i could walk with him home and he would give me the script there. I was a bit worried about the embarassement of becoming a male rape victim, but i desperately needed the script, so i followed him. When we entered his flat, the script was neatly lieing on his living room table, conveniently placed right next to another script. He was like "oh, i forgot this here, its a novel im currently writing", and i suddently understood why he made me go to his place. He wanted me to "stumble upon his novel", and he wanted to make it look like coincidence rather than him running around showing it. Well, he told me to go over a few pages and out of goodwill i read some of it. It was mostly some vague super cool secret agent style badass conversation between two guys, not well written, and i couldnt make much out of it, so i had to ask him: Uhm cool stuff, what is the plot about? Then he told me:

It was about a professional hitman, a lonely guy who doesnt talk really much and who lives in a flat whos only companion is a cactus. The second protagonist is a little girl who's family was murdered by a corrupt cop who wanted to cover up evidence. She then walks into this hitman guy and he trains her to become a hitman herself. First hes reluctant because he doesnt like company, but he warms up as he becomes sort of like a father figure for her, but she also develops a romantic interest in him which he has to refuse because shes way too young. He then helps her take revenge for her family on that corrupt cop.

I was looking at him like this:hmmm:. I then asked him if he knew about the movie "Leon the professional" and told him about the plot of the movie. He absolutely definitely assured me that he never heard of this movie and that all similarities are pure coincidence.

Point of my story: If there are that many similarities and somebody claims its pure coincidence, then somebody is bullshitting somebody. And we all know who likes to bullshit people and defend Bethesda.

Hello Todd!
 
Last edited:

Mozg

Arcane
Joined
Oct 20, 2015
Messages
2,033
Is there not some respected long time Codexer that isn't the modder in question that can give an authoritative comparison of the mod and the FO4 expansion bit?
 

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