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Incline Arcen Games needs your help

Damned Registrations

Furry Weeaboo Nazi Nihilist
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Feb 24, 2007
Messages
15,024
So I've been trying out the Starward Rogue game today- it's actually really good. Barely scratched the surface yet, haven't got past the 3rd floor, and it unlocks longer runs with wins aparently, currently I'd need to clear 5th floor to win, next is 7 floors. Weapons have a good variety, money isn't overly plentiful, it has the max health shop, which is a great mechanic imo, and 6 different characters to play as with their own starter attributes and equipment. One of them has something that stops time except while you move, which turns the game into a sort of real time with pause sort of affair, where you can meticulously move to avoid damage and place super accurate shots. The balance being of course that it's made of paper, but it certainly makes for an interesting way to play. I like the enemy and boss design so far as well, good variety, enemies have different kinds of AI, different weapons, very differing levels of speed and health.

Would seriously recommend to anyone that liked Binding of Isaac or twinstick shooters, or even just roguelite games in general.
 
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jcd

Punished JCD
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Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Bubbles In Memoria
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Last edited:

adrix89

Cipher
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
700
Location
Why are there so many of my country here?
The developers are Fucking Insane.

They should have focused on expansions and sequels more. Things that actually worked for them.

You cannot gamble with new IP for your projects every damn time and expect to win. You will eventually lose, that is inevitable.

Also Kickstarter, where is it? Especially for this company that proved to deliver on many interesting projects.

It is a match made in heaven! They can even gauge what ideas have traction and generate some hype!

GOD DAMMIT! I love this guys but they are fucking outright suicidal!
 

Archibald

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
7,869
They made 6 expansions for AI War and 2 for Last Federation so I'm not sure what the fuck you are talking about.

Are there any plans to release Rogue on GoG? Don't really want to buy it on Steam.
 

Damned Registrations

Furry Weeaboo Nazi Nihilist
Joined
Feb 24, 2007
Messages
15,024
They are planning on doing so. Right now the game is being patched so frequently they don't want to have people getting buggy versions or being forced to manually get the latest version every few days.
 
Unwanted

jcd

Punished JCD
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Joined
Jan 4, 2012
Messages
10,681
Location
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Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Bubbles In Memoria
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Archibald

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Messages
7,869
I'd guess financial reasons. If they can't manage their finances now, they'd probably have gone out of business 5 releases ago if they tried to improve visuals.
 

almondblight

Arcane
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Aug 10, 2004
Messages
2,549
I'd guess financial reasons. If they can't manage their finances now, they'd probably have gone out of business 5 releases ago if they tried to improve visuals.

Eh, they have 2 full time artists on staff (in addition to outside contractors).
 

Beastro

Arcane
Joined
May 11, 2015
Messages
8,089
is last federation any good? worth the 5 quid?

also do they make their games look like dog shit on purpose? gameplay, depth, and amounts of content are usually top notch but the graphic design is always repulsive

Watching it in reviews or short LPs feels like you've seen it all and I haven't heard of anything to dispel that.

It has a good premise and game plays, but the game comes off like a demo where you expect to buy it and get 10 times more content.
 

BLOBERT

FUCKING SLAYINGN IT BROS
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Codex 2012
BROS IVR PLAYED THE SHIT OUT OF BOTH VALLEYS WITHOUT WIND GAMES

GOOD LUCK HOPE THEY PLAN SHIT BETTER NEXT TINE
 

Archibald

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
7,869
Looks a bit like chicken running around with his head chopped off. Probably only a matter of time till they go under.
 

LESS T_T

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Oct 5, 2012
Messages
13,582
Codex 2014
Resorting to 3D Unity asset shovelware to survive: https://www.arcengames.com/forums/index.php/topic,18707.0.html

http://store.steampowered.com/app/471770/

This is likely going to be an Early Access title, but we'll see. Our official forums have more discussion.
  • Be a velociraptor.
  • Feel like a velociraptor -- this is our central design goal.
  • Procedural levels: a pleasing blend of hand-crafted locales and randomization.
  • Fight robots! Tear giant ones limb from limb, pounce on small ones, and try not to die.
Sell Me The Idea In One Sentence
If I have to convince you why being any form of dromaeosaurid is freaking awesome, then I'm not sure we can be friends.

This game is carefully crafted to give you the closest possible feeling of being one of these glorious monsters -- then turning you loose to do fun stuff. That means you don't get (or need) "frickin lasers," health upgrades, or character progression.

That said, as we know from historical documents, it's hard to be a raptor in a futuristic dystopia. Robots have guns, and you don't. Despite the fact that you're an incredible hunting machine, you've got your work cut out for you if you want to master the game.

What’s The Point?
  • 1. For the pure fun of the thing. In 1993, a certain game let you be a raptor. The controls were iffy. The levels were short and static. It's very dated. Yet many of us still dust it off periodically -- just to be a raptor. Release Raptor gives you a far more satisfying, modern, dynamic experience.

  • 2. For the challenge. Brutal Mode approximates what a real theropod might experience when attacked by robots. Aka, if you get shot by a rocket that's the end. You'll need to use all your raptor skills to tear your foes to shreds.

  • 3. To play with kids. I want to be able to play this with my 5 year old son, but still have dismemberment (because that's cool). How to do that without blood or gore? Robots! Little robots = pouncing targets; giant mechs = dismemberment targets.

  • 4. For a power trip. Brutal Mode is only fun for some. So we have Power Trip Mode, where you're on an invincible rampage. It's not about IF you can do it, but how WELL you do it. Speedrunning is encouraged. Your performance is scored and rated (avoiding hits, etc), so mistakes still have consequences.

  • 5. For daily runs — maybe. My hope is to build out some daily leaderboards for both play modes, but no promises on that yet.

  • 6. For the strategy of it — probably. The idea is to make these branching mazes kind of like AI War: Fleet Command maps in terms of how they provide you with opportunities. Each opportunity may increase the heat you take while moving forward, but at the same time net you some good things (thematic secondary goals like blowing up part of the facility, etc). I think I have figured out how to avoid excessive backtracking or frustration with this, but I don't want to state that as a definite feature until I have it prototyped in.

:philosoraptor:
 

insukk

Augur
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Joined
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Messages
327
Codex 2012
And the plan backfired! I'm quoting the whole thing because their site is under heavy load at the moment it seems.

Time for some straight talk: Release Raptor is being pulled and refunded.

In A Nutshell, What’s Up?

I’m going to give all the customers of In Case of Emergency, Release Raptor a full refund and let them keep the game, then take the game off sale. The game is selling extremely poorly, even below what happened with Starward Rogue.

Isn’t Part Of Early Access “Don’t Make A Game You Rely On EA Sales For?”

Yes, this is very true. However, I stated upfront that our reason for doing EA with this game was partly as a market survey of sorts. I felt like that would be a way of determining how big this game could get. With Starward Rogue, and indeed some of our other past commercial failures, we put in everything and the kitchen sink and then there wasn’t a market there.

I never expected that one option even on the table with this one would be “actually don’t do it at all,” because the premise is incredibly exciting to me and seemed like something other people would also be very interested in. But just from the concept alone, we have a lot of pushback from press; and despite some quite positive coverage from some reasonably biggish youtubers, that isn’t moving the needle at all.

We don’t need Release Raptor to be our sole source of income, or even our largest one. However, if it’s going to be our largest expense it also has to vaguely earn its keep or at least show the promise that it will someday do so. That’s what is missing here.


Why Not Just Build Out A Stripped-Down Version 1.0 That Is Worth $5?

I honestly don’t think there’s any way that a lot of people wouldn’t be left grumbling at that. I personally will also lose far more money trying to do that than I already am, and probably some of what little staff we have left would have to be released. It’s just far, far too risky. I’d rather be known for honorably pulling a game than slapping a 1.0 sticker on something — whether or not that experience is worth $5 or not, we both know the perception would be there.

So Are You Untrustworthy, Or What?

The immediate idea is probably to think “wow they delayed it a ton and then are possibly canceling it right after it comes into EA?”

My response to that is that this is exactly how you want a game company to comport itself. I held back the game while I didn’t feel like there was enough there for other people to catch the vision I have for what it would turn into. I’m not going to take anybody’s money and run; in fact, I’m going to eat a big fat loss out of it and you get a free game if you bought it.

You can certainly argue that I have overreached or have at least misjudged the market in several instances, but I’m not going to sell you a turd and call it ice cream.


Is Release Raptor A Bad Game?

I certainly don’t think so, in any form. I play it, and it gives me a feeling of joy. I just love going through and doing things with the raptor. It has an elemental fun factor to it that myself and a number of other people have reacted well to. I thought that it would be enough to provide this, and then the promise of more enemies and tactics and whatnot (sheesh that’s what we’re knownfor, people ought to have some faith in THAT bit if nothing else).

That said, people have different degrees of warm feelings toward the controls. That doesn’t help. People have different reactions to the environments. Etc.


Was This Just Youtuber Bait?

No. This is a project that I freaking love, and that is based around my favorite animal (velociraptors). It’s something I very, very much wanted to see happen.

That said, I won’t deny that the idea of a game that appealed to a larger audience and more easily picked up video views was an attractive one. I even considered calling this “Raptor Simulator,” to the dismay of my staff.

This was never intended to be like Goat Simulator (which I’ve never played, but my understanding is that it’s a silly bug-fest just centered around messing about and not doing anything). I figured we might be able to pick up some of the Goat Simulator crowd since you CAN come in here and just mess about, but what I didn’t realize was that this would create a stigma that would lead people to then to think it’s more vapid than it is.

Which, launching with less content in terms of enemies and tactical situations than I would like, only reinforced that perception I suppose. “There’s not enough to do” is probably the number one complaint, and I thought I had made that clear enough from the start. And we’ve been managing daily updates with substantial new content, which I think is pretty darn impressive.

Then plan was to put out more content in a month than most other EA games put out in a year, and just keep on trucking with it. We’ve done it before with other games, multiple times, and it’s something we were well geared-up to do this time, too.


What Went Wrong?

I… am not entirely sure, honestly. People’s perception of this was not matching up to what it was, partly. Also I suppose I should have made more grandiose claims and been mysterious and vague instead of transparent and clear. It’s way more exciting when you don’t know what’s going on and “it could be anything — it could be EVERYTHING!!”

I’m all for enthusiasm, but hype is not something I really like. We had a lot of hype for A Valley Without Wind, and that burned the company and myself in some fairly profound ways. So I’m really wary of hype; that was our one game that had it, and it was distinctly unpleasant. Well, okay: I guess there’s also hype around Stars Beyond Reach at the moment, which is another project of ours that I refuse to release yet because I don’t think it’s good enough yet.

Ultimately I don’t think it can be blamed on any one thing. I do know that in the past — going back to 2014 with the release of The Last Federation, and then everything before it — we made almost all of our sales via Steam and people finding our stuff on Steam. We’d see a bump in sales for a few hours after a Kotaku piece or a Total Biscuit video, and literally no other website or youtuber made any bump that we could discern.

Being on the front page of Steam was the big thing. We’ve had one title in the past that have reached the #6 top seller spot on Steam as a whole (IIRC it was The Last Federation), and multiple titles that have hit the top 10 sellers on Steam as a whole (even A Valley Without Wind).

It used to be super concerning if we weren’t in the top 20 bestsellers on Steam for at least a day or two, and when we dropped down into the 60s on overall game sales it was basically game over until the next discount promotion. Discount promotions, even as recently as 2015, had more weight behind them, too. The lack of gamification of recent seasonal sales has been bad for the small developers, in my opinion.


Overall the market is more crowded now, and gaining visibility is harder. We tried advertising this time, but we literally spent more money today on advertising than the game made. Win!! So this is some sort of New Market now, anyhow, with something approaching the App Store effect that we’ve seen on Apple devices. I was incredibly paranoid that would happen going all the way back to 2009, and then I gradually got less worried about it, and now here we are. How many indie developers do you know of who have made more than one or two games at this point? That’s a bit scary to think about.

It’s not all doom and gloom in the market, obviously: in some ways, opportunities are larger now than they ever were. And it’s certainly a better market now than in mid-2009 when I first started out with AI War. So it’s certainly not all market forces, and I don’t mean to imply that.

At the end of the day, for whatever combination of reasons, this doesn’t seem to be the right game at the right time. Might we pick this project back up in the future? I’d like to think so. As I said, this is a personal passion of mine (raptors), not some Goat Simulator knockoff to me. But such is life.


What Next, Then?

One of my core conclusions from this, despite how much I have tried to defy this my entire career as a game developer, is that folks pretty much just want strategy games from me/us. This is not all I want to do! I want to make games where you shoot things, and games where you’re a raptor, and all sorts of other things! I have varied interests and tastes, and I don’t want to do one thing for the rest of my life.

That said, given the choice between leaving the industry and making strategy games, the choice there is freaking obvious. I absolutely love making games, despite the many negative sides to it. So that’s what we’ll do: we’ll make you another strategy game.



Specifically, we’ll go back to the game that is still our top seller, AI War: Fleet Command, and we’re going to do a proper updated sequel. But at this point I can’t afford to do half a year or a year of development “on spec” to then find out if you’re interested or not. So we’ll likely run a Kickstarter for this, as much as I’ve avoided Kickstarters and never wanted to do one. And if that doesn’t work out in a way that feels financially safe, then there are some other options on the table, too.

At any rate, people have been clamoring for this for years: an AI War sequel with a better UI, better performance, better networking, better graphics, moddability, and so on. We’re now in a position where we know how to do all those things, and goodness knows we know how to make AI War better than we know how to make anything else under the sun. That’s our freaking bread and butter right there.

I suppose there will be some people who are thinking “yay, end of the stupid raptor game, and we get the AI War sequel that has been quietly talked about for a year or so now!” And if that’s how you feel, fine. But you were going to get that anyway, and I just wish that I also got to make this raptor game to go along with it.


Be Wary Of Knee-Jerk Reactions

It’s very tempting for me to blame the state of the market, or whatever other external forces. Really it was a combination of things. So I have to be pretty careful of not giving in to negative emotions on my side.

On the other end, as an outside observer I hope that you also look at this for what it really is, and not the knee-jerk reaction that you might have. I am the Anti-Sean (cough). I will treat you fairly, communicate clearly and often, release frequent substantial updates (just look at our history), and try to over-deliver. This is what you want.

In an ideal world nobody ever makes a mistake. In the actual world, we have to think about how we want people to behave when mistakes inevitably do happen. I am sorry this had to happen, though. I wish it would magically change, but we’re well past that point I think. I want to take a moment to thank everyone that did support the project, though — it really meant a heck of a lot to me.

Very Best,

Chris

http://arcengames.com/time-for-some-straight-talk-release-raptor-is-being-pulled-and-refunded/
 

Metro

Arcane
Beg Auditor
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
27,792
As I said before, they simply do not make good games. Aping crap like Goat Simulator was laughably desperate.
 

rezaf

Cipher
Joined
Jan 26, 2015
Messages
652
Those idiots are finally doing Kickstarter.

Queue "not sure if serious" gif. Aren't the days in which running a Kickstarter was a sensible thing to bank on just as over as the days when it was much easier to get visibility on Steam?
 

Archibald

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
7,869
It also doesn't help that they have gone complete retard in last few months so it will be much harder to build up interested from people who are becoming more and more sceptical about KS every month.
 

adrix89

Cipher
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Messages
700
Location
Why are there so many of my country here?
Those idiots are finally doing Kickstarter.

Queue "not sure if serious" gif. Aren't the days in which running a Kickstarter was a sensible thing to bank on just as over as the days when it was much easier to get visibility on Steam?
They already have a community behind them so they can get a lot of traction. And they finish their games which is huge rep for kickstarter. But look at the damn games they made recently, they are all over the place! the community they have is useless if they aren't the fucking target market of the game, Stupid! Stupid Stupid!
If stupidity hurt they would be rolling in agony, which seems to be what is happening when they are now hit by reality.
 

adrix89

Cipher
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
700
Location
Why are there so many of my country here?
If you are making youtube bait why aren't you waiting for the pewdepies before you decide if you are successful or not.
That's the whole point of a cash in. You cannot copy Goat Simulator and not consider this.

This guys are suicidal. The clearly don't know what they are doing.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,488
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/...o_sacrifice_Release_Raptor_to_stay_afloat.php

Q&A: Why Arcen Games needed to sacrifice Release Raptor to stay afloat

We got in touch with Arcen Games’ founder, Chris Park, a few weeks ago to discuss the impending launch of their latest game, In Case of Emergency, Release Raptor – which didn’t turn out as expected, to say the least.

Earlier this year, Arcen faced a fair bit of financial trouble. You wrote about having to let go staff and possibly shelving some projects. Did you manage to pull out of this?

We have not reached financial equilibrium yet, but we have pulled out of it well enough that we've been able to work on new things.

Keith LaMothe (our other programmer/designer) has been working on Stars Beyond Reach as his main project since the layoffs, with me having withdrawn from that project after failing to get a design that any of us were truly happy with. That's been a tough road for him as well, but he's come up with some things that seem promising.

Starward Rogue was the game that flopped in January and led to our financial woes (or rather failed to save us from the woes that began with Stars Beyond Reach going waaaay over time and budget, but that's another story).

A lot of the contractors who had been working on that have opted to stay on as volunteers and have made some amazing post-release updates to it. All of them have other jobs or general life circumstances that meant that contracting with Arcen was not remotely their core work anyhow, and they have a passion for the game.

Myself and Blue (Daniette Mann -- but she prefers Blue) have been working on 3D projects since the layoffs. For a lot of reasons, the 3D pipeline is actually more efficient for us to work in, and it's something that just she and I are able to manage between the two of us.

starward.jpg


We built up our 3D skills and toolset quite a bit, and during that period I found an asset on the unity asset store that was a velociraptor you could control. The controls were awkward and slow and really stiff, but I found it really compelling anyhow; there was a real mental throwback to the 1993 Jurassic Park game, which I loved. So we decided to make a game based around that concept.

And so she and I have been working on Release Raptor most of this time, while Keith has been on Stars Beyond Reach, and we've had the "freaking volunteers" (as they like to call themselves) working on Starward Rogue.

I think that people almost expect you to come up with unexpected concepts and. But even so,Release Raptor came as a surprise to a lot of people. Aren't you concerned that this complete change in style and general direction might alienate your core audience?

I think that's definitely the expectation when it comes to us, yes. That can be a blessing and a burden, honestly. Sometimes when we do something that "isn't unique enough," we get slammed for that even when it has a bunch of twists compared to other entries in a given genre. That happened some withStarward Rogue […] and that's happening to a mild degree here, too.

I think that one of the big worries that some people have with Release Raptor is that it's going to be a "stupid person" game. A.k.a., that it's some sort of sellout or that we're trying to appeal to the lowest common denominator or whatever else.

In a lot of respects we're doing now what we've done in a lot of our other games, but it doesn't feel like that because of the perspective switch. We've got procedural action-adventure here, which is what four of our other titles were (and one other of our titles was action-adventure without the procedural bit).

release%20raptor.jpg


But even in our action-adventure games, we tend to blend in some sort of tactical or strategic layer to it. A lot of people don't really think that's possible here I think based on what they see, and to some extent that's because I just need to add more and more content here.

Right now it's early access and so kind of the tip of the iceberg, if you will. I think that some people who are currently feeling alienated by this direction are basically reacting as if this was Goat Simulator: Raptor Edition. I hope that over time as early access progresses those people will have their opinion shifted. I guess time will tell.

What happened next was rather unusual and sudden: after weak initial sales, Arcen completely removed Release Raptor from sale, essentially scrapping development and promising full refunds to all previous buyers.

Was nuking development in case of bad sales ever a possibility you took into account, or did you spontaneously decide to kill off the raptor?

Nuking development of a game we'd already released (even in EA form) is never something I'd considered. This option had not remotely entered my mind prior to about an hour before deciding to do it. I figured that the worst case with this game would be to struggle along for a month, maybe two, spend about about $40k doing so, and then leave people with a good $5 experience.

The problem, looking at the numbers and the early feedback and the early response from much of the press, was that I realized that we were not remotely going to recoup that $40k anytime soon, and that I'd burn a couple of depressing months slogging out something that apparently no-one wanted or understood. Despite my own personal enthusiasm for the project, yesterday was a hard one to be motivated for.

release%20raptor%202.jpg


In general there was a sentiment around a lot of press that "wow they must be hard-up for money to try and make a game like this." This was widely seen as some sort of cash-in. We were getting YouTuber coverage of people having fun with the game and saying how they were hopeful it would grow... but people in general are skeptical of Early Access these days.

With the messaging being so drastically off about what the game even was, and the various YouTuber coverage being what it was in terms of positivity and yet literally zero movement in sales bumps from that... I realized that I was basically condemned in some senses. I have X amount of money, I would have to spend it keeping promises on this game that nobody cared about, and at the end of that term I'd have next to no money, and therefore no options.

This wasn't going to get better. We've been here before, and the optimism that we once had about such things turning around is long, loooong gone. If sales were X now, then they were only going to be X/10 two weeks from now. A.K.A, a copy or two a day. I guarantee it.

If the press hadn't really reacted yet, or YouTubers and Twitch folks hadn't been covering it at all yet, or our advertising campaign hadn't kicked into gear yet, then I would have still had some hope. Once it became clear that all of those things were not making a difference and we were spending more on advertising than the game was even making, and the game was being misunderstood and seen as a cash grab... well, that was the death of hope, I suppose.

a%20valley%20without%20wind.jpg


What the key realization was, though, was that this game had sold so poorly that I could actually withdraw it from the market with minimal financial loss compared to what I'd otherwise lose. Somewhere in the neighborhood of $300 of direct cost in refund bank fees, versus $40,000. Obviously the revenue would be lost on top of that, but that's not money we ever had in our pocket anyway. I'm referring to money out the door that was in a bank account we have.

After realizing that, I realized I wasn't shackled after all. I had had similar opportunities to avoid shackling myself to A Valley Without Wind 2 ($130k loss) and Stars Beyond Reach ($200k+ loss beyond the point where I should have called it off last May, and $420k loss overall). For once I could read the tea leaves early, not be over-optimistic, and make the choice that is painful and yet needed. There is no part of me that wonders "what if."

What’s next for Arcen Games?

I'm biting the bullet and will be doing [a Kickstarter] for an AI War sequel. That's our bread and butter, and we know that backwards and forwards, so if there's any sort of safe bet in terms of something we can deliver on a schedule we understand, it's that. And a lot of people are hungry for it, versus it being some new IP, so that's an added bonus.

At the time of writing, the unfinished build of In Case of Emergency, Release Raptor is available from Steam as a free download. The AI War 2 Kickstarter campaign is supposed to start in a couple of weeks.
 

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